PDA

View Full Version : My Geno 2.0 Next Generation Helix Results



jpb
04-22-2017, 05:21 PM
I find that there are not many results posted on the internet from Helix, so here are mine.

I am a plain old white American. Based on the paper trail, I am about 55% British Isles, and 40% German, with the rest being Dutch, French, Ashkenazi, Swedish, and unknown.

Here are my results:

Regional Ancestry
Northwestern Europe 40%
Eastern Europe 32%
Southwestern Europe 22%
Asia Minor 3%
Northeastern Europe 2%

Continental Ancestry
Europe 97%
Asia 3%

Closest Reference Population: German (53% Northwestern Europe, 29% Eastern Europe, 16% Jewish Diaspora, 2% Northeastern Europe)
2nd Closest Reference Population: French (53% Northwestern Europe, 27% Southwestern Europe, 9% West Mediterranean, 5% Eastern Europe, 4% Jewish Diaspora, 2% North Africa)

Maternal Line: I1a1d (Shared by 0.1% of other participants)
Paternal Line: C-F3320 (Shared by <0.1% of other participants)

You: 1.5% Neanderthal/Average: 1.3% Neanderthal

In Comparison:

Ancestry:
Europe 98%
Europe West 51%
Ireland 24%
Scandinavia 7%
Great Britain 5%
Low Confidence Regions
Europe East 6%
Italy/Greece 4%
Iberian Peninsula <1%
West Asia 2%
Low Confidence Regions
Middle East 2%

23andme:
European
100.0%
Northwestern European
92.5%
British & Irish
33.6%
French & German
15.3%
Scandinavian
6.0%
Broadly Northwestern European
37.5%
Ashkenazi Jewish
1.3%
Eastern European
1.1%
Southern European
0.8%
Broadly Southern European
0.8%
Broadly European
4.3%

FTDNA:
MyOrigins 1.0:
71% Western and Central Europe
29% Scandinavia
MyOrigins 2.0:
72% British Isles
18% East Europe
3% West and Central Europe
5% West Middle East
<2% Sephardic
<2% Southeast Europe

Hope this is helpful!

wombatofthenorth
04-22-2017, 07:25 PM
Interesting, you do have a really tricky UK+German mix though so none of them quite reads it out directly.

I guess 23 comes the closest. Maybe Ancestry sorta second. (with a careful reading and knowing how the tests tend to react)

Geno 2.0 NG Helix at first glance doesn't seem quite so on point but I guess if you read it taking into account how much German the new tests seem to put into Eastern European and then take all of the Eastern European as eastern learning German ancestry and then add in 10% Northwestern Europe for the more UK leaning type German ancestry you get 40% German and then you are left with 30% Northwestern Europe which all goes to UK and then add in 20% of the Southwestern Europe to sort of form all of the UK. Maybe osme of the Southwestern Europe could go to the German ancestry as well actually as if you have ancestry from all over Germany you might have both UK, southern French and Eastern European leaning regional ancestry from within Germany. A bit trickier read. Depends upon how stable it is.

MyOrigins 1.0 could be read as all UK+German but that is a lot of reading into it and not making much clear at all and you could be lead to think you are almost all German with a touch of Scanindavian or maybe a little UK. MyOrigins 2.0 you have to read the Eastern European all as eastern leaning German but then they make more of the German as the UK leaning type and it would be very easy to mistake this result for all UK plus some real Eastern European.

I guess MyOrigins 2.0 maybe seems the worst

Your ancestry is so tricky though as tests really struggle vs UK vs German vs French and even bits of Scandinavian can get confused and bits of Eastern European with the German, etc. And Germany itself is said to have southern French looking parts, English looking parts, Scandinavian looking parts and Eastern European looking parts. And you have the perfect near 50:50 mix to confused them.

None of the tests directly read out for you, reading the tea leaves the 23 and Ancestry results might be a bit easier to parse out if you came in knowing nothing, but could still not be read directly.

jpb
04-22-2017, 07:35 PM
Interesting, you do have a really tricky UK+German mix though so none of them quite reads it out directly.

I guess 23 comes the closest. Maybe Ancestry sorta second. (with a careful reading and knowing how the tests tend to react)

Geno 2.0 NG Helix at first glance doesn't seem quite so on point but I guess if you read it taking into account how much German the new tests seem to put into Eastern European and then take all of the Eastern European as eastern learning German ancestry and then add in 10% Northwestern Europe for the more UK leaning type German ancestry you get 40% German and then you are left with 30% Northwestern Europe which all goes to UK and then add in 20% of the Southwestern Europe to sort of form all of the UK. Maybe osme of the Southwestern Europe could go to the German ancestry as well actually as if you have ancestry from all over Germany you might have both UK, southern French and Eastern European leaning regional ancestry from within Germany. A bit trickier read. Depends upon how stable it is.

MyOrigins 1.0 could be read as all UK+German but that is a lot of reading into it and not making much clear at all and you could be lead to think you are almost all German with a touch of Scanindavian or maybe a little UK. MyOrigins 2.0 you have to read the Eastern European all as eastern leaning German but then they make more of the German as the UK leaning type and it would be very easy to mistake this result for all UK plus some real Eastern European.

I guess MyOrigins 2.0 maybe seems the worst

Your ancestry is so tricky though as tests really struggle vs UK vs German vs French and even bits of Scandinavian can get confused and bits of Eastern European with the German, etc. And Germany itself is said to have southern French looking parts, English looking parts, Scandinavian looking parts and Eastern European looking parts. And you have the perfect near 50:50 mix to confused them.

None of the tests directly read out for you, reading the tea leaves the 23 and Ancestry results might be a bit easier to parse out if you came in knowing nothing, but could still not be read directly.

Thank you! That is what I have been thinking. The problem also is how diverse my German heritage is in Germany! I have ancestors from what is now eastern Poland that were supposedly German, then some from Alsace-Lorraine.

Recently, I did my exact paper trail percentages with subregions in Germany and Ireland:
39.1% German (9.4% Pomerania, 8.6% Baden, 6.25% Bavaria, 6.25% Saxony, 3.5% Alsace, 3.1% Lower Saxony, 1.2% Rhineland, 0.4% Switzerland)
32.4% English
14.9% Scottish
7.9% Irish (6.3% County Down, 1.6% County Antrim, unsure if it is Ulster Scots or Irish)
2.4% Welsh
1.5% Dutch
0.5% French
0.4% Italian
0.3% Native American
0.1% Swedish
<0.1% Moroccan

jpb
04-22-2017, 07:39 PM
My Eurogenes K13 Oracle-4 results are actually fairly interesting and somewhat similar to Geno.

Here are my top 5:
1 Belorussian + French + Southeast_English + West_German @ 2.024510
2 Belorussian + North_Dutch + North_German + Spanish_Murcia @ 2.048676
3 Belorussian + Danish + North_German + Spanish_Murcia @ 2.142366
4 Belorussian + North_Dutch + North_Dutch + Portuguese @ 2.157412
5 Belorussian + Danish + North_Dutch + Portuguese @ 2.164811

They all show pretty much (except the top one) 50% Northwest European, 25% Southwest European, 25% East European.

jpb
04-22-2017, 08:19 PM
Wombatofthenorth, I just looked in the descriptions and apparently Eastern European includes German. It says it is acutally Central and Eastern European. Terrible labeling, but this makes the results make more sense.

wombatofthenorth
04-22-2017, 11:37 PM
My Eurogenes K13 Oracle-4 results are actually fairly interesting and somewhat similar to Geno.

Here are my top 5:
1 Belorussian + French + Southeast_English + West_German @ 2.024510
2 Belorussian + North_Dutch + North_German + Spanish_Murcia @ 2.048676
3 Belorussian + Danish + North_German + Spanish_Murcia @ 2.142366
4 Belorussian + North_Dutch + North_Dutch + Portuguese @ 2.157412
5 Belorussian + Danish + North_Dutch + Portuguese @ 2.164811

They all show pretty much (except the top one) 50% Northwest European, 25% Southwest European, 25% East European.

Hmm those EG K13 are interesting. For me EG K13 Oracles work the best of all. They are super similar to Geno 2.0 NG Helix, interesting.
Maybe your Germans in Poland picked up a lot more Polish and eastern genes than imagined.

jpb
04-22-2017, 11:42 PM
Yeah, that's what I am guessing, especially since there's some Ashkenazi ancestry from there too. They were from pretty far-eastern Poland and they all are brick walls, so I bet there's some Polish ancestry.

wombatofthenorth
04-22-2017, 11:42 PM
Ancestry and 23 do quite well for you still though taking into account that 23 tries and manages to keep Germans testing much more as part of Western Europe than those two newest tests do where they try to send of all of the non-UK, non-French like German to Eastern Europe as much as possible (which is actually kind of a pain for those in Eastern Europe trying to trace back actual German and other such roots since it just comes out as yet tons more Eastern European).

MyOrigins 2.0 tends to go wild forcing German to UK-like or Eastern European-like, oddly for you it went totally the UK-like way.

Some of the other have trouble trying to specifically call the UK stuff as being UK and just dump it into maybe a mix of UK's ancient components.

jpb
04-22-2017, 11:43 PM
My dad (who has more of the German Polish ancestry) gets the Belorussian too and then both of them get the Iberian clusters.

jpb
04-22-2017, 11:50 PM
Here is the info for the Eastern European cluster:
"The Eastern and Central European component is predominantly associated with cultures from Poland, Germany, the former Austria-Hungarian Empire and the former Soviet republics of Belarus and Ukraine, and Western Russia. The same migration of hunter-gatherers who moved north to Finland and northern Russia are at the core of the earliest Eastern Europeans. Eventually, these groups met and mixed with the farmers who pushed in from southern Europe and the Near East, giving rise to the modern Eastern and Central Europeans. Thus this part of your ancestry has deep ties with and influences from multiple sources. They are a combination of Middle Eastern farmer, early European hunters, and Central Asian nomads. Today, this component is seen across various Eurasian groups, with the highest percentage found in Polish, Czech, Slovaks, Russians, Hungarians, Ukranians, as well as some German, Austrian and Balkan populations."

And the Northeast European:
"Hunter-gatherers were the first peoples to settle in Northeastern Europe, initiating an unique ancestry that would be traced back to this region. The region stretches from Lappland to parts of Siberia to the east, and although this cluster is genetically diverse, the root of many of these populations is a genetic signature found most often in Finnish, Northern Russian, and some Baltic peoples. The first humans in the regions pushed into the deep north only around 30,000 years ago, migrating to where no other Neanderthal had dared. The northerners maintained long-term lateral connections and developed a coherence as the ice retreated, all while keeping in touch with populations in the south. Today, this ancestry is seen in Saami hunters and fishers, as well as Uralic, Russian, Finnish, and some Scandinavian peoples."

wombatofthenorth
04-23-2017, 05:55 AM
[QUOTE=jpb;228381]Here is the info for the Eastern European cluster:
"The Eastern and Central European component is predominantly associated with cultures from Poland, Germany, the former Austria-Hungarian Empire and the former Soviet republics of Belarus and Ukraine, and Western Russia. The same migration of hunter-gatherers who moved north to Finland and northern Russia are at the core of the earliest Eastern Europeans. Eventually, these groups met and mixed with the farmers who pushed in from southern Europe and the Near East, giving rise to the modern Eastern and Central Europeans. Thus this part of your ancestry has deep ties with and influences from multiple sources. They are a combination of Middle Eastern farmer, early European hunters, and Central Asian nomads. Today, this component is seen across various Eurasian groups, with the highest percentage found in Polish, Czech, Slovaks, Russians, Hungarians, Ukranians, as well as some German, Austrian and Balkan populations."

Hmm I wonder why they chose to make the Eastern European category even more extending to the west when the old one was already grabbing too much west. It really makes it hard for Eastern Europeans to pick out those western components they might have. Also, from everything I have seen the old component peaked in the Baltics and the new one actually still peaks there, although now it also can hit peak in other countries as well, which seems to actually make it less useful in a sense. I could see how they could try to expand to make it more stable, but places like Germany were such a mish-mash and taking in their eastern component just seems to have maken MyOrigins 2.0 more unstable (and maybe same for this Helix) in some cases.

jpb
04-23-2017, 01:56 PM
Yeah. Also, a fully Scandinavian person got 25% East Euro, http://www.businessinsider.com/what-the-national-geographic-geno-20-ancestry-test-with-helix-is-like-2017-3?sf60584067=1/#once-i-hovered-i-got-a-different-picture-of-my-results-with-sweden-and-norway-highlighted-but-the-mediterranean-results-were-still-throwing-me-off-it-wasnt-something-id-seen-in-either-23andmes-or-ancestrydnas-tests-11. This person got 90% Scandinavian on Ancestry and 70 or 80 something percent on 23. Strange.

wombatofthenorth
04-23-2017, 09:33 PM
Yeah. Also, a fully Scandinavian person got 25% East Euro, http://www.businessinsider.com/what-the-national-geographic-geno-20-ancestry-test-with-helix-is-like-2017-3?sf60584067=1/#once-i-hovered-i-got-a-different-picture-of-my-results-with-sweden-and-norway-highlighted-but-the-mediterranean-results-were-still-throwing-me-off-it-wasnt-something-id-seen-in-either-23andmes-or-ancestrydnas-tests-11. This person got 90% Scandinavian on Ancestry and 70 or 80 something percent on 23. Strange.

It seems like as with MyOrigins 2.0 (and I'd bet a lot of the work was based off that until Geno decided to split from FTDNA) the Eastern European tries to grab in lots of from surrounding areas. I think they wanted to make say someone from Poland or Hungary and so on be able to score almost 100% Eastern European if all of their ancestry was from there instead of just Baltic people able to do that, but to make that happen they had to add in so many extra things to key on that EE grabs in so much now and it also makes it harder to distinguish within the giant region.

wombatofthenorth
04-23-2017, 09:35 PM
Tentatively Geno 2.0 NG Helix at least seems to do it a bit more stably though. And I guess you just have to see it as a semi-ancient set of components where it keys in on old hunter gatherer from all over the region and some steppe I guess and what you score of it is maybe saying that you say on 30% of your genome matched Eastern European type patterns a few thousand years ago.

jpb
04-23-2017, 10:32 PM
What about the 3% Asia Minor?

Dumidre
08-16-2017, 03:23 PM
Did anybody try or managed to get the raw analytical date from NatGeo or Helix so far?
I did mine in June and I got 53% Italy and Southern Europe, 44% Eastern Europe and 3% Jewish Diaspora (I am originally from Romania).
I would like to find out more precise info (like everybody else, I find Eastern Europe definition a very vast area).
Thank you.

Mixed
10-08-2017, 07:22 PM
My Eurogenes K13 Oracle-4 results are actually fairly interesting and somewhat similar to Geno.

Here are my top 5:
1 Belorussian + French + Southeast_English + West_German @ 2.024510
2 Belorussian + North_Dutch + North_German + Spanish_Murcia @ 2.048676
3 Belorussian + Danish + North_German + Spanish_Murcia @ 2.142366
4 Belorussian + North_Dutch + North_Dutch + Portuguese @ 2.157412
5 Belorussian + Danish + North_Dutch + Portuguese @ 2.164811

They all show pretty much (except the top one) 50% Northwest European, 25% Southwest European, 25% East European.

Same deal.
1 East_Sicilian + Southeast_English + Southwest_Russian + West_German @ 1.373149
2 Estonian_Polish + South_Italian + Southeast_English + West_German @ 1.455244
3 Danish + East_Sicilian + Ukrainian + West_German @ 1.478027
4 Ashkenazi + Irish + Ukrainian + West_German @ 1.503964
5 East_Sicilian + Russian_Smolensk + Southeast_English + West_German @ 1.509618