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Kurd
05-21-2017, 04:22 PM
Here is a new admixture test I have put together, where the W Asian component is split between Kurds and Caucasian to see which one various samples prefer.

These are the results for the rarer alleles test consistent with my latest algorithm so the results are pretty solid. MAF is restricted to <12%.

Since various population sources such Kurds and Caucasians are used who are themselves C /N/ E Asian admixed, those respective scores will be depressed for the test subjects.

Here are the component sources



Component
Component descriptions


Kurd
Kurds from Turkey, Iraq, W Iran



NW European
British, German, NW France


Caucasus
Abkhazians, Armenians, Georgians, N Ossetians



SE European
Albanians, Macedonians, Montenegrans


Altaian-Mongol
Altaians, Mongols


Arabian
Jordanians, Saudis


NE European
Belarusians, Estonians, Latvians, Lithuanians


SE Asian
Burmese


SSA
SSA


Finno-Ugric
Finns, Karelians, Saami


Indian
C and S Indian tribals


Siberian
T Nenets, Nganasans, Selkups


Papuan
Papuans


C Asian
Kazakh, Turkmen, Uzbek



The table is sorted with highest Kurd score on top. Unsurprisingly, Iranian Baloch and other Iranians were top scorers. The 99% score should not be taken literally as this is an artifact of ADMIXTURE, whenever the test subject allele frequencies are very similar to the population source. In reality, it could be 60%+.




SAMPLE
W / SW ASIAN
C ASIAN
INDIAN
EUROPEAN
N / E ASIAN
PAPUAN
SSA


Sample
Kurd
Caucasus
Arabian
C Asian
Indian
NW European
NE European
SE European
Finno-Ugric
Siberian
Altaian-Mongol
SE Asian
Papuan
SSA


Baloch-IR1
99.99%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Iranian-S1
99.99%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Iranian-S2
99.99%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Iranian-N
47.99%
52.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Pashtun-Pak2
44.94%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
43.55%
0.00%
11.50%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Baloch-IR2
44.56%
29.30%
0.00%
0.00%
26.14%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Pashtun-Afg2
43.45%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
34.35%
7.88%
0.00%
0.00%
13.29%
0.00%
1.02%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Assyrian1
40.27%
40.66%
19.06%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Pashtun-Afghan4
39.54%
14.25%
0.00%
0.00%
30.19%
0.00%
15.35%
0.00%
0.00%
0.66%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Pashtun-Afghan6
38.15%
14.13%
0.00%
0.00%
29.03%
9.24%
0.00%
0.00%
6.88%
0.00%
0.00%
2.56%
0.00%
0.00%


Iranian-S3
35.56%
26.09%
17.14%
10.79%
7.15%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
3.26%


Balq
34.52%
0.00%
0.00%
18.01%
27.29%
0.00%
12.45%
0.00%
4.68%
3.04%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Pashtun-Afghan5
34.46%
12.46%
0.00%
12.68%
28.47%
0.00%
5.54%
0.00%
6.38%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Pashtun-Afghan3
33.28%
18.96%
0.00%
4.07%
26.99%
7.64%
0.13%
0.00%
8.93%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Pashtun-Pak1
32.29%
16.94%
0.00%
0.00%
33.70%
0.00%
10.90%
0.00%
0.00%
5.19%
0.00%
0.00%
0.97%
0.00%


Pashtun Afg1
30.24%
25.47%
0.00%
9.29%
24.57%
10.43%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Gujrati-Marathi
25.69%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
74.29%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Indian Brahmin-S
25.21%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
74.78%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Punjabi-Gujjar
22.86%
21.87%
0.00%
0.00%
55.26%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Azerbaijani 2
22.86%
77.13%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Tajik_Rushan 2
21.82%
20.45%
0.00%
0.00%
25.12%
0.00%
19.57%
0.00%
10.67%
2.36%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Jam
21.58%
22.21%
0.00%
13.79%
42.41%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Tajik Shugnan1
20.66%
16.35%
0.00%
15.71%
22.03%
0.00%
24.49%
0.00%
0.00%
0.74%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Punjabi-M
20.11%
17.87%
0.00%
10.30%
41.83%
0.00%
9.88%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Tajik Yaghnobi 1
19.14%
29.83%
0.00%
0.00%
11.87%
8.14%
23.62%
0.00%
0.00%
7.39%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Khana
19.00%
17.95%
0.00%
13.31%
41.02%
0.00%
8.71%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Punjabi-Sikh
18.27%
26.48%
0.00%
0.00%
48.33%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
6.91%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Punjabi-Jatt
18.03%
16.70%
0.00%
0.00%
51.39%
0.00%
13.55%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.33%
0.00%


Punjabi-Rajput
16.04%
11.31%
0.00%
0.00%
59.50%
0.00%
13.14%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Tajik_Ishkasim 2
15.36%
20.23%
0.00%
5.64%
20.39%
15.06%
15.52%
0.00%
0.00%
4.36%
2.73%
0.00%
0.71%
0.00%


Azerbaijani 1
15.15%
52.66%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
32.18%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Turk Hanna
14.99%
42.50%
31.13%
0.00%
0.00%
11.37%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Punjabi_Rangh
12.27%
22.68%
0.00%
0.00%
56.42%
0.00%
8.63%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Bengali
10.16%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
76.25%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
2.15%
0.00%
0.00%
11.42%
0.00%
0.00%


Tajik_Rushan 1
9.17%
29.79%
0.00%
0.00%
19.61%
5.83%
11.06%
13.50%
5.63%
5.41%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Italian-N
0.00%
25.53%
11.07%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
63.39%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Romanian
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
30.43%
0.00%
69.56%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Sadia
0.00%
39.05%
0.00%
0.00%
60.94%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%

Kurd
05-21-2017, 05:17 PM
Italian-N - Passa
Romanian- Dorkymon
Bengali- Reza
Assyrian 1 -Zeph
Pashtun Pak1- Kaido
Pashtun Pak2- Sein
Iranian N- NK1919
Baloch IR1- Zarafshaan
Baloch IR2- Farid

Dorkymon
05-21-2017, 05:43 PM
Thanks for your work.

Kind of strange that my non-SE European part has been absorbed by NW Euro. I'd expect NE Euro. Maybe some of your Germans are more Central European shifted, like from Bavaria or Austria?

Kurd
05-21-2017, 06:43 PM
Thanks for your work.

Kind of strange that my non-SE European part has been absorbed by NW Euro. I'd expect NE Euro. Maybe some of your Germans are more Central European shifted, like from Bavaria or Austria?

Yes, some of my NW European references are from that area and NE Germany. That will change when more subjects from Britain or NW France join. The public ones I have don't have enough marker overlaps for these types of tests.

Kurd
05-21-2017, 07:01 PM
Italian-N - Passa
Romanian- Dorkymon
Bengali- Reza
Assyrian 1 -Zeph
Pashtun Pak1- Kaido
Pashtun Pak2- Sein
Iranian N- NK1919
Baloch IR1- Zarafshaan
Baloch IR2- Farid

Sorry, a little mix up. Kaido and Sein are switched. Also some of the results from the common alleles test got intermingled with the rarer alleles test. Will fix tonight

jortita
05-22-2017, 02:01 AM
Thank you Kurd,

MAF < 15% - 67K SNPs Jortita F

Kurd 14.20%
NW European 0.00%
Caucasus 0.00%
SE European 0.00%
Altaian-Mongol 0.00%
Arabian 0.00%
NE European 0.00%
SE Asian 14.49%
Finno-Ugric 0.00%
Indian 53.91%
Siberian 0.00%
Papuan 0.00%
C Asian 17.39%
SSA 0.00%

MonkeyDLuffy
05-24-2017, 02:43 PM
Looks Great kurd! Punjabi Ramgharia is my sample, right? :)

Kurd
05-24-2017, 03:17 PM
Looks Great kurd! Punjabi Ramgharia is my sample, right? :)

Yes. I'll be updating the table by tomorrow

Hanna
05-30-2017, 09:09 AM
My results look weird. I have more Arabian than Zeph, in fact the highest Arabian score and I also scored no Asian.

Kurd
05-30-2017, 01:48 PM
My results look weird. I have more Arabian than Zeph, in fact the highest Arabian score and I also scored no Asian.

Hi Hanna,

Thanks for bringing to my attention. I re-ran, and am posting your corrected results. You still score substantial Arabian, although slightly less than Zeph.

With the common alleles tests, both Zeph and Passa score higher Arabian than you, 41% and 26%, respectively, but that is due to distant connections they have with SW Asians, perhaps related to the neolithic. On a more recent time scale, Zeph scores high Kurdish.

With regards to E Asian, keep in mind that most non-Turk W Asians score 0, because considerable E Asian alleles are accounted for under the Kurdish and Caucasian components.



227K SNPs – Common Alleles
Hanna
Zeph-227K
Passa-227K


Kurd
16.53%
0.00%
0.00%


Arabian
19.06%
41.42%
25.61%


Caucasian
50.75%
58.57%
4.38%


SE_European
0.00%
0.00%
59.76%


NW_European
9.46%
0.00%
8.15%


NE_European
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Altaian_Mongol
4.18%
0.00%
0.00%


SE_Asian
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


SSA
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Finno_Ugric
0.00%
0.00%
2.09%


Indian
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Siberian
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Papuan
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Central_Asian
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%








MAF < 12% - 48K SNPs – Rarer Alleles
Hanna
Zeph
Passa


Kurd
30.94%
40.27%
0.00%


Arabian
17.77%
19.06%
11.07%


Caucasus
36.84%
40.66%
25.53%


SE European
0.00%
0.00%
63.39%


NW European
10.62%
0.00%
0.00%


NE European
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Altaian-Mongol
3.82%
0.00%
0.00%


SE Asian
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


SSA
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Finno-Ugric
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Indian
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Siberian
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


Papuan
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%


C Asian
0.00%
0.00%
0.00%

basmaci
05-30-2017, 01:56 PM
My results look weird. I have more Arabian than Zeph, in fact the highest Arabian score and I also scored no Asian.

Of course they look weird. You score less SW Asian than Kurds in all calculators, but on Kurd's calculators you come out as even more SW Asian shifted than Assyrians. Do you remember this thread?
http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?6502-500K-SNP-Member-IBS-Comparisons&p=142468&viewfull=1#post142468

It is also no coincidence that your results are always painted in light green.


A few months ago I said this:
"Well, with all due respect I don't take anything posted by Kurd seriously and this is my personal decision."
http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?9874-Ancestry-and-demography-and-descendants-of-Iron-Age-nomads-of-the-Eurasian-Steppe&p=219310&viewfull=1#post219310




Let me elaborate this a bit further:[/B]

In 2014, he was pretending to be a Kurd from North Iraq, his results were also typical for a Kurd. But turned out he was posting someone else's results as his own, in 2015 he began posting a very South Asian shifted individual's results (probably his real results) and some members realized that there was something fishy in his story and questions were raised. He pretended as if nothing happened, and kept posting his very objective and scientific works.

I'm sure many members are aware of this situtation, but they probably don't really care.



In 2014, he was a Kurd from North Iraq and his results were typical for a North Iraqi Kurd
"Here are my results for comparison. I am Kurmanji from N. Iraq."
http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?3159-Post-your-MDLP-K23b-calculator-Oracle-ancestry-here&p=59840&viewfull=1#post59840
https://i.hizliresim.com/1L90YD.png (https://hizliresim.com/1L90YD)


His Dodecad k12b results in 2014
http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?3520-Post-your-Dodecad-K12b-Results&p=60033&viewfull=1#post60033
https://i.hizliresim.com/7qOdzl.png (https://hizliresim.com/7qOdzl)


http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?4543-Post-your-Eurogenes-K12b-Results&p=85350&viewfull=1#post85350
https://i.hizliresim.com/M0z46Q.png (https://hizliresim.com/M0z46Q)


http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?3520-Post-your-Dodecad-K12b-Results&p=60061&viewfull=1#post60061
https://i.hizliresim.com/M0z2qk.png (https://hizliresim.com/M0z2qk)



Then in 2015, he mutated(?) into a South Asian and his results became Balochi-like
http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?6112-Post-Eurasia-9-ASI-CHG-results&p=129520&viewfull=1#post129520https://i.hizliresim.com/7qOp4v.png (https://hizliresim.com/7qOp4v)



He removed most of his old posts in order to cleanse his past, because there was something fishy about his story, and other members had started raising questions.
http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?4543-Post-your-Eurogenes-K12b-Results&p=85338&viewfull=1#post85338



For example:
http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?4543-Post-your-Eurogenes-K12b-Results&p=85353&viewfull=1#post85353
https://i.hizliresim.com/M0z4Dk.png (https://hizliresim.com/M0z4Dk)



He was also criticized by others for his biased methods
http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?7560-Lazaridis-et-al-(2016)-A-look-at-various-methods-including-qpAdm-Dstats-f3&p=202333&viewfull=1#post202333
https://i.hizliresim.com/694G6N.png (https://hizliresim.com/694G6N)


He who manipulates his own results can easily manipulate others' results.
Not to mention he always manages to estimate the steppe ancestry in Kurds as something like 40-50%, which condraticts all other data. When some members start questioning, he says it is "hidden" in Kurds' CHG ancestry or something, he is good at finding hidden ancestries that others fail to see.

I tend to ignore his threads but his agenda has no limits, just so you know.

Kurd
05-30-2017, 02:13 PM
Of course they look weird. You score less SW Asian than Kurds in all calculators, but on Kurd's calculators you come out as even more SW Asian shifted than Assyrians. Do you remember this thread?
http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?6502-500K-SNP-Member-IBS-Comparisons&p=142468&viewfull=1#post142468

It is also no coincidence that your results are always painted in light green.




You should think and read more before blabbering and making personal attacks, because if you had seen my last post on the previous page perhaps you may have understood...


Not to mention he always manages to estimate the steppe ancestry in Kurds as something like 40-50%, which condraticts all other data. When some members start questioning, he says it is "hidden" in Kurds' CHG ancestry or something, he is good at finding hidden ancestries that others fail to see.


My results are replicable by those who are knowledgeable on bioinformatics and how to conduct these tests (obviously not you otherwise you wouldn't be saying these things). Also, I have received enough endorsements from actual scientists for the work I do, so frankly I could care less of whether you approve or disapprove of my work.....


Edit: Some of the older results you are referring to are in fact for a kit that I manage for one of my very old very close relatives

Edit2: It is also not unusual for other scientists or bloggers to occasionally disagree with each other. I have disagreed on occasion with Davidski and others, and frankly considering some of the cutting-edge or innovative tests I conduct, the disagreements from others have been extremely few and far between.

basmaci
05-30-2017, 09:26 PM
Edit: Some of the older results you are referring to are in fact for a kit that I manage for one of my very old very close relatives

Cool, was he/she aware that you were using his/her results and pretending to be something you were not?

Kurd
05-30-2017, 10:33 PM
Cool, was he/she aware that you were using his/her results and pretending to be something you were not?

You really know how to be annoying. Of course he was. I'm the one who had him tested and paid for the test, and if you must know he was my grandpa from Kurdistan Iraq whom I wanted tested before he passed.

randwulf
05-30-2017, 10:48 PM
To try to get the thread back on course, here are some Western European results from this particular test:


MAF < 15% - 67K SNPs

Population Dad Mom FIL
SE_European 50.52% 42.93% 58.34%
NE_European 25.80% 29.70% 21.73%
NW_European 23.67% 16.29% 19.92%
Kurd 0.00% 6.23% 0.00%
Finno-Ugric 0.00% 4.83% 0.00%


Given the exchange between Kurd and Dorkymon above in this thread with regards to the meaning of the NW_European component, I am thinking the three European components may stand for some things that may not be immediately apparent given their names. Given a simple "line" from South Germany (Dad) to England (Father In Law) with my Mom about halfway in between the two (because of being half South German/half English) it is interesting what this test does with the results. I think the NW_European component is pretty central European as Dorkymon noticed, the SE_European must cover from the southeast to the southwest of Europe and the NE_European is maybe fighting with the NW_European a bit for some admixture that usually is split other ways in other tests. These are low-K results from an older test for these three that happens to be pretty low on noise, I think, and the split fits the paper ancestry pretty well from a more "traditional" test that uses a lot of common SNPs:


Population Dad Mom FIL
Northwestern 46.04% 45.50% 49.12%
Northeastern 17.99% 21.26% 18.92%
Southwestern 14.53% 16.04% 16.52%
Southeastern 14.66% 12.40% 7.86%
Caucasus 4.91% 4.79% 6.04%
African 0.35% 0.00% 0.94%
Far Asian 1.53% 0.00% 0.60%

My Dad is the most "southeastern" and least "western", my Father in law is the most "northern" and the most "western", and my Mom leads only the "northeastern" category and has the least minor ancestry flavor. These are very typical results in low-K form that show up one way or another, including in Kurd's other similar minor alleles test, for these three. Kurd may have some other thoughts on this.

Also, I found it interesting that my mom, usually the most "vanilla" European, picks up a Kurd percentage. This is maybe a nod to whatever it is in her ancestry that causes a tribal South Asian percentage of 1%-2% in many admixture tests. I am guessing that the minor ancestry of my Dad and Father in Law is subsumed in the broader categories of the three European components.

Gandhara
05-30-2017, 11:19 PM
May be his great great great great grandfather was a Kurd but myself being a Pakistani who is well aware of the ethnic breakdown of the region, I doubt that migration from Kurdistan to Pakistan happened in the last 100 years.

Gandhara
05-30-2017, 11:27 PM
In the XIth century, for example, Farsistan, a Persian province par excellence, was governed by a Kurdish dynasty; from 1242 to 1378 Khorassan an Iranian province in the North-East also had a Kurdish dynasty, and from 1747 to 1859 this was the case for distant Baluchistan, which is to day part of Pakistan

Source :
http://www.institutkurde.org/en/institute/who_are_the_kurds.php

Kurd
05-31-2017, 12:02 AM
@ Randwulf

I'll give you my take when I get home tonight

@Gandhara

I am also not aware of any notable migration from Kurdistan to Pakistan within the last 100 years , but my connection to Kurdistan on the paternal side has nothing to do with a mass migration. On the maternal side, I have ancestry from the Kurds that migrated to Iranian Balochistan in the 16th century (Shah Abbas), but in the meantime I have posted quite a bit under the Kurdish thread with links to resources on the Kurds of Khorasan and Balochistan.

Gandhara
05-31-2017, 12:12 AM
@ Randwulf

I'll give you my take when I get home tonight

@Gandhara

I am also not aware of any notable migration from Kurdistan to Pakistan within the last 100 years , but my connection to Kurdistan on the paternal side has nothing to do with a mass migration. On the maternal side, I have ancestry from the Kurds that migrated to Iranian Balochistan in the 16th century (Shah Abbas), but in the meantime I have posted quite a bit under the Kurdish thread with links to resources on the Kurds of Khorasan and Balochistan.

That is true that there were migrations during the time of your great great great grandfather as Balochistan back then was part of Iran. There is a small size kurd minority in Balochistan.

Kurd
05-31-2017, 12:32 AM
That is true that there were migrations during the time of your great great great grandfather as Balochistan back then was part of Iran. There is a small size kurd minority in Balochistan.

Indeed, on my paternal side though my grandpa was one of those kurds from Iraq that went to study at the University of Punjab Lahore where he met his wife who was from NW Pakistan . For some reason many Kurds from Iraq go to Pakistan and India for college. This post by an Iraqi Kurd sums up the sentiments of why Iraqi Kurds go to India to study

http://kurdistantribune.com/kurdistan-forgotten-nation-of-million-people/

There are over a million Kurds in Khorasan. They speak Kurmanji Kurdish. Here are details about them
http://cskk.org/

Kurd
05-31-2017, 03:42 AM
To try to get the thread back on course, here are some Western European results from this particular test:


MAF < 15% - 67K SNPs

Population Dad Mom FIL
SE_European 50.52% 42.93% 58.34%
NE_European 25.80% 29.70% 21.73%
NW_European 23.67% 16.29% 19.92%
Kurd 0.00% 6.23% 0.00%
Finno-Ugric 0.00% 4.83% 0.00%


Given the exchange between Kurd and Dorkymon above in this thread with regards to the meaning of the NW_European component, I am thinking the three European components may stand for some things that may not be immediately apparent given their names. Given a simple "line" from South Germany (Dad) to England (Father In Law) with my Mom about halfway in between the two (because of being half South German/half English) it is interesting what this test does with the results. I think the NW_European component is pretty central European as Dorkymon noticed, the SE_European must cover from the southeast to the southwest of Europe and the NE_European is maybe fighting with the NW_European a bit for some admixture that usually is split other ways in other tests. These are low-K results from an older test for these three that happens to be pretty low on noise, I think, and the split fits the paper ancestry pretty well from a more "traditional" test that uses a lot of common SNPs:


Population Dad Mom FIL
Northwestern 46.04% 45.50% 49.12%
Northeastern 17.99% 21.26% 18.92%
Southwestern 14.53% 16.04% 16.52%
Southeastern 14.66% 12.40% 7.86%
Caucasus 4.91% 4.79% 6.04%
African 0.35% 0.00% 0.94%
Far Asian 1.53% 0.00% 0.60%

My Dad is the most "southeastern" and least "western", my Father in law is the most "northern" and the most "western", and my Mom leads only the "northeastern" category and has the least minor ancestry flavor. These are very typical results in low-K form that show up one way or another, including in Kurd's other similar minor alleles test, for these three. Kurd may have some other thoughts on this.

Also, I found it interesting that my mom, usually the most "vanilla" European, picks up a Kurd percentage. This is maybe a nod to whatever it is in her ancestry that causes a tribal South Asian percentage of 1%-2% in many admixture tests. I am guessing that the minor ancestry of my Dad and Father in Law is subsumed in the broader categories of the three European components.

I am much more comfortable with the results from my test vs ones from calculators that use a ton of test subjects and a relatively few references for a couple of reasons:

1- The other calculators source on common alleles which are not as population specific, and generally correlate with more distant interactions between populations. You can see this in the results for Hanna, Zeph, and Passa on the previous page

2- Depending on the test subjects used the NW European component can end up being a NW European/C European entangled mish mash, and worst of all I don't know any way you can actually measure how C European/NE European /NW European weighted the conglomerate comp is. That is why I keep it simple and designate what samples I want the comp to represent, and I don't throw in a bunch of non-references to skew the allele frequencies. This problem has been recognized in other papers
http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?10487-An-Accurate-ADMIXTURE-Ancients-Test

3- Geographically, your parents are closer to the Adriatic coast where SE European peaks, than to the British Isles. This coupled with likely more recent geneflow from those areas, and your results make sense

With my test you know where you stand because the component allele frequencies have been clearly defined by the samples I have designated. With other calculators it is murky and ambigous, as there is no way to tell exactly what the contribution of the component peaking various test samples is to the component 's allele frequencies, which means you can't even accurately define the component.

edit: added link

randwulf
05-31-2017, 08:21 PM
I am much more comfortable with the results from my test ...

With reference to the results for my parents, everything more or less adds up between the three test results that you have sent and I can see a case for their ancestry being reported as it is. It is this third test for my father in law that is making me search for an explanation. So, maybe you could explain within your own two rare alleles test results for him to increase my understanding. Here are the results from the earlier test:

SE European 40.28%
NE Caucasus 22.78%
NE Europe 20.12%
Finno-Ugric 16.81%

These are the results from the later test:

SE_European 58.34%
NE_European 21.73%
NW_European 19.92%

How do the results relate to each other? I could have an ancestor or two that are incorrect, I guess, but most of his ancestry is England, Ireland, Wales, and very North Germany with a significant West German minority. My first thought is that he would be a classic NW European. I don't question the integrity of the results, I just wonder about the name with regards to the meaning of the NW_European component. It may become plainer if more NW Europeans are run through the test. Has Firemonkey been run through this one, yet? He has similar ancestry to my Father in Law in some respects.

Kurd
06-01-2017, 04:38 AM
With reference to the results for my parents, everything more or less adds up between the three test results that you have sent and I can see a case for their ancestry being reported as it is. It is this third test for my father in law that is making me search for an explanation. So, maybe you could explain within your own two rare alleles test results for him to increase my understanding. Here are the results from the earlier test:

SE European 40.28%
NE Caucasus 22.78%
NE Europe 20.12%
Finno-Ugric 16.81%

These are the results from the later test:

SE_European 58.34%
NE_European 21.73%
NW_European 19.92%

How do the results relate to each other? I could have an ancestor or two that are incorrect, I guess, but most of his ancestry is England, Ireland, Wales, and very North Germany with a significant West German minority. My first thought is that he would be a classic NW European. I don't question the integrity of the results, I just wonder about the name with regards to the meaning of the NW_European component. It may become plainer if more NW Europeans are run through the test. Has Firemonkey been run through this one, yet? He has similar ancestry to my Father in Law in some respects.


These are different tests with different component references.

The Caucasus references from the 1st one are:

Kumyks
Lezgins
Mordvins
North-Ossetians

From the 2nd one:

Abkhazians
Armenians
Georgians
North-Ossetians


So it is clear that your FIL prefers the NE set. In the absence of the NE set as in the 2nd test, he prefers SE European to S Caucasus.

So the tests are not contradictory. NE Europe is constant at about 20%. In the 2nd test, since NE Caucasus is missing , most of that admixture defaults to SE European increasing it from about 40% to 60%

So based on both tests, I would say that your FIL breaks down as follows:

SE European - ~40%
NE Caucasus- ~ 22%
NE European - ~ 20%
Finno-Ugric - ~18%



If I had a large number of NW European references he could conceivably come out majority NW European, but I personally don't see any value in this.


Edit: Its all about what we would like to accomplish. If the goal is seeing how similar he is to NW Europeans, we would use a very large number of NW European references, and in theory if we used enough NW Euro samples, he could conceivably end up close to 100% NW European, but if we are more interested in modeling him with populations outside of NW Europe, then the above model would be a reasonable one.

ZephyrousMandaru
06-01-2017, 05:43 AM
Kurd, are there any future prospect of incoporating the five ancient Levantine samples to your dataset? Given that modern Mesopotamian ethnic groups (Assyrians, Iraqi Jews, Iranian Jews and Iraqi Mandaeans) are genetically drifted towards Sidon, I'd be interested in seeing the results.

Kurd
06-01-2017, 07:55 AM
Kurd, are there any future prospect of incoporating the five ancient Levantine samples to your dataset? Given that modern Mesopotamian ethnic groups (Assyrians, Iraqi Jews, Iranian Jews and Iraqi Mandaeans) are genetically drifted towards Sidon, I'd be interested in seeing the results.

Sure, Haber has assured me that they will be made available once the paper is published. Those, and of course the multitude of European ones once that paper is published. Assuming good marker overlap with current datasets, they should allow us to more accurately portray population histories of Eurasians, and make for more accurate calculators.

Anabasis
06-01-2017, 03:39 PM
Well tring to understand similarities and diverse between populations is very meanfull on the other hand using ethnic identity as a component name just makes oppurtinities of manupulating the test results. Thats why people who makes such test have also responsibility to avoid this type tests. Naming components as ethnic identity just harming genetic studies. Thats why i avoid interpreting commercial ethnic make up results just becaouse they insist naming components as irish or jewish. That was a friendly advise dont take offanse.

randwulf
06-01-2017, 09:19 PM
These are different tests with different component references........

Thanks, that is what I was looking to understand and explains the results. I believe it also helps a little with my parents' results, too.

Saba123
06-02-2017, 02:36 AM
Hey how can I get my results tested?

Kurd
06-02-2017, 12:13 PM
Hey how can I get my results tested?

You would have to send your 23andMe file to [email protected]

Saba123
06-03-2017, 04:51 AM
Will an AncestryDNA file work?

technetium
06-03-2017, 07:09 PM
Could you run my ftdna data through this calculator? If yes, what format would you need?

Kurd
06-03-2017, 07:27 PM
Sorry, but I'm not accepting FTDNA or AncestryDNA at the moment as there is not enough overlap with 23andMe for some of the tests I conduct. I'll make an announcement if that changes in the future.

Kurd
06-14-2017, 11:33 AM
I will be incorporating about 1000 more samples into my admixture based tests and other tests that require 400K+ marker overlap with 23andMe as I just finished remapping some of my hg18 human reference based samples to hg19 human reference, which is a tricky affair that requires quite a bit of improvising. This includes many SC, S, W, E Asian and European samples.

What this means for ADMIXTURE is the possibility of more components with a higher number of references. Also useful for IBD , admixture dating , f3s, f4s, and rare alleles tests


Edit: and African samples. PCA indicates that the alignment to hg19 was successful. Outliers were removed. The only thing left is to fish for related samples for removal

nuplix
06-23-2017, 06:28 AM
You would have to send your 23andMe file to [email protected]

I just did mine. Thank you!

dheujjak24
07-05-2017, 11:16 PM
Im new to this, my mothers dna is U3b and fathers is L2*

This is from 23andme.

95.3% Middle Eastern & North African
95.2% Middle Eastern
0.1% Broadly Middle Eastern & North African
-
2.3% European
1.5% Southern European
0.2% Northwestern European
0.2% Ashkenazi Jewish
0.4% Broadly European
-
1.4% South Asian
0.4% East Asian & Native American

0.5% Unassigned

Familytreedna gave me 90% Asia minor and 10% Central/South Asian (India area)

My origin is kurdish.

What should i do?