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Gentleman
06-24-2017, 03:46 PM
Everything else on my FTDNA "myOrigins" results looked about right, more or less:
West and Central Europe
51%

British Isles
47%

Trace Results:

Finland
< 2%

Oceania
< 1%

_________________________________

My FTDNA ancientOrigins results show 0% non-European.

Because I and my parents were born in Australia I can't dismiss the Oceania immediately as just background noise. (If it brought up a percentage like that of African or Native American I would dismiss it as I don't live near those places, and nor have my known forebears.)

I'm curious how much less than 1% it is, but I think FTDNA doesn't use decimal points with its percentages, so <1% is lowest possible above 0%.

Should I be searching for an Oceanian (presumably, Aboriginal?) ancestor? Is it possible that FTDNA assigned me that trace as they did not know how to interpret something and just noticed I was from Australia? Could the sample of "Oceanians" be infiltrated by some British Isles ancestry?

I have no known Oceanian ancestry, nor family legends about it. A couple of my lines have been in Australia a long time, but I'm not sure precisely how long.

I'm not even completely sure how you can have a <1% result. Assuming they used 46 chromosomes (I think actually they used less as it excludes Y chromosome I believe), a single chromosome from a forebear would equate to no less than 2.17%. I suppose genetic recombination could allow a chromosome to partially be Oceanian and partially not, though.

BalkanKiwi
06-25-2017, 02:13 AM
Everything else on my FTDNA "myOrigins" results looked about right, more or less:
West and Central Europe
51%

British Isles
47%

Trace Results:

Finland
< 2%

Oceania
< 1%

_________________________________

My FTDNA ancientOrigins results show 0% non-European.

Because I and my parents were born in Australia I can't dismiss the Oceania immediately as just background noise. (If it brought up a percentage like that of African or Native American I would dismiss it as I don't live near those places, and nor have my known forebears.)

I'm curious how much less than 1% it is, but I think FTDNA doesn't use decimal points with its percentages, so <1% is lowest possible above 0%.

Should I be searching for an Oceanian (presumably, Aboriginal?) ancestor? Is it possible that FTDNA assigned me that trace as they did not know how to interpret something and just noticed I was from Australia? Could the sample of "Oceanians" be infiltrated by some British Isles ancestry?

I have no known Oceanian ancestry, nor family legends about it. A couple of my lines have been in Australia a long time, but I'm not sure precisely how long.

I'm not even completely sure how you can have a <1% result. Assuming they used 46 chromosomes (I think actually they used less as it excludes Y chromosome I believe), a single chromosome from a forebear would equate to no less than 2.17%. I suppose genetic recombination could allow a chromosome to partially be Oceanian and partially not, though.

Welcome to the forum!

Do you score any Oceanian and/or Papuan on any of the calculators on GEDMatch?

Gentleman
06-25-2017, 11:56 AM
Thanks for the welcome! I just went on GEDmatch tonight - first time. All of those calculators seem very different! It's a bit confusing. Many conflicting results. Yes, I score Oceanian, always very low. However I also score a lot of other trace things on there that FTDNA leaves out. Is there any calculator in particular you'd suggest I should regard as more authoritative?

I'll only paste one, for amusement. "puntDNAL K13 Global" says I have something from every global region except Siberia!


Population
West_Asia 9.49
NE_Europe 51.03
Americas 0.12
Siberia -
Oceania 0.79
South_Asia 0.69
NE_Asia 0.90
East_Africa 0.43
SE_Asia 0.69
SW_Europe 33.54
SW_Asia 0.95
West_Africa 0.67
South_Africa 0.70

Strange, I always knew I was a "Euromutt". I'm coming to understand what I've read others say - that the small trace elements are not always meaningful. Eg, I am apparently more North East Asian than Oceanian on that calculator. Why didn't FTDNA mention that? I guess the type of trace admixture it mentions in that puntDNAL K13 Global table is likely from a long time ago. (Assuming it's not simply "noise".) Two of my grandparents were born in Europe - the other two I met and they simply were not that "exotic" looking.

NewAlbion
06-25-2017, 03:32 PM
Thanks for the welcome! I just went on GEDmatch tonight - first time. All of those calculators seem very different! It's a bit confusing. Many conflicting results. Yes, I score Oceanian, always very low. However I also score a lot of other trace things on there that FTDNA leaves out. Is there any calculator in particular you'd suggest I should regard as more authoritative?

I'll only paste one, for amusement. "puntDNAL K13 Global" says I have something from every global region except Siberia!


Population
West_Asia 9.49
NE_Europe 51.03
Americas 0.12
Siberia -
Oceania 0.79
South_Asia 0.69
NE_Asia 0.90
East_Africa 0.43
SE_Asia 0.69
SW_Europe 33.54
SW_Asia 0.95
West_Africa 0.67
South_Africa 0.70

Strange, I always knew I was a "Euromutt". I'm coming to understand what I've read others say - that the small trace elements are not always meaningful. Eg, I am apparently more North East Asian than Oceanian on that calculator. Why didn't FTDNA mention that? I guess the type of trace admixture it mentions in that puntDNAL K13 Global table is likely from a long time ago. (Assuming it's not simply "noise".) Two of my grandparents were born in Europe - the other two I met and they simply were not that "exotic" looking.

Anything less than 1% could very likely be statistical noise. I score 1.8% oceanian at DNA.land and 1.7 central Asian at myheritage ( which is probably the same thing they just lack the oceanian sample). Anyone with Oceanian plus British isles ancestry probably got it from the British empire days via Australia or New Zealand etc.. or in your case you have Australian ancestry which is more direct. PuntDNAL k13 global has it at 1.32 so it probably isn't noise in my case. I suggest you try dna.land to sort this out.

Gentleman
06-26-2017, 12:13 PM
Thanks, NewAlbion. The big disclosure thing at the sign-up for DNA.Land made me nervous at this point and I didn't upload:(

HOWEVER, I learnt something interesting about the Oceanian category in PuntDNAL k13 global. The Population Spreadsheet for puntDNAL K13 Global gives the breakdown of different ethnicities' averages. "Oceanian" is actually far from exclusive to Australasia and surrounds. It's at a low level in Indian-type populations, among others. It states average 1% average for Romani. The relevance of that is that there actually is a family legend about a "real gypsy" looking woman, but that was in England. We had dismissed it as I believe that was on my great grandmother's side and she herself was I think a strawberry blonde.

Furthermore, I'm a quarter Czech and historically Central Europe had a fair few Roma.

There are various groups near outskirts of Europe who register some "Oceanian" - eg, Tadjiks (average 1%), Afghan Pashtun (0.5%), Balochi (0.5%), Turkish Kayseri (0.5%). Not to mention many Indians and various Asian groupings with much higher elements.

I think the term "Oceanian" can mislead - there was such DNA in Europe long before Captain Cook found Australia. In relation to myself, I think IF it's not background noise its more likely to be Roma type contribution. My two grandparents who were born in Australia are pretty much that paper white, with no unusual features. The short length of white settlement in Australia is such that even very white-looking Aborigines ordinarily have living family who clearly look mixed. Things like Papuan would make even less sense to me. (I am darker than paper white from my Czech side.)

Gentleman
06-26-2017, 12:48 PM
The below is highly amusing - on MDLP K16 Modern Admixture Proportions calculator I score 0.20% for Australian. See how much more "Australian" the average Norwegian, eg, is than me at 0.34%. (I just sorted in descending order those with any "Australian".)

Population Australian
Papuan 86.29
Koinanbe 73.17
Kosipe 69.63
Australian 42.33
Bajo 9.92
Onge 9.88
Batak 8.3
Aeta 7.88
Melanesian 7
Great_Andamanese 6.33
Mawasi 6.03
Juang 5.69
Gadaba 5.32
Bhunjia 5.22
Paniya 5.21
Kharia 5.02
Ho 4.97
Asur 4.78
Dhurwa 4.73
Bonda 4.71
Munda 4.61
Orissa 4.51
Malayan 4.4
Sahariya 4.4
Pulliyar 4.27
Sakilli 4.22
Vysya 4.19
Nihali 4.17
Santhal 4.17
Gond 4.13
Kapu 4.13
Brahmin 4.07
Kurumba 3.94
Hakkipikki 3.93
Bhil 3.87
Gupta 3.69
Madiga 3.64
North_Kannadi 3.61
Kol 3.57
Chenchu 3.55
Satnami 3.53
Chamar 3.47
Savara 3.47
Srivastava 3.45
Scheduled_Caste 3.4
Kamsali 3.35
Marwadi 3.35
Khasi 3.28
Hallaki 3.25
Lebbo 3.24
Balija 3.21
Lodi 3.17
Piramalai_Kallars 3.09
Dhaka 3.04
Dusadh 3.03
Scheduled_Caste 3
Thakur 2.93
Punjabi 2.82
Vizayan 2.79
Velama 2.71
Kusunda 2.69
Bengali 2.63
Lambadi 2.6
Dharkar 2.58
Naidu 2.5
Tharu 2.36
Muslim 2.35
Tamang 2.32
Kanjars 2.24
Meghawal 2.16
Burmese 2.05
Vaish 2.02
Jew 1.99
Kshatriya 1.93
GujaratiD 1.92
Naga 1.86
Brahmin 1.84
Cambodian 1.82
Lahu 1.82
Garo 1.77
Mizo 1.77
Punjabi 1.75
Kashmiri_Pandit 1.73
Kuki 1.73
Aonaga 1.71
Jatt 1.69
Brahmin 1.62
Brahmin 1.59
GujaratiC 1.59
Kurmi 1.53
Jatt 1.43
Naxi 1.41
Thai 1.39
Ukrainians_north 1.32
Jew 1.28
Yi 1.27
Uygur 1.26
Kazakh 1.21
Luzon 1.19
Vietnamese 1.14
GujaratiB 1.08
Meena 0.98
Forest_Yukaghir 0.97
Nyishi 0.95
Sindhi 0.95
Burusho 0.87
Roma 0.87
Belarusian 0.85
Gujjar 0.82
Assyrian 0.81
Hezhen 0.81
Tu 0.8
Eskimo_Sireniki 0.77
GujaratiA 0.77
Siddi 0.77
Yakut 0.75
Karakalpak 0.74
Pashtun 0.73
Jew 0.71
Georgian 0.71
Kazakh 0.7
Kumyk 0.7
Bashkir 0.69
Pole 0.69
Arab_Israel 0.68
Latvian_Dobele 0.68
Pathan 0.68
Azerbaijani_Dagestan 0.67
Croat 0.67
Vietnamese 0.67
Bolivian 0.66
Jew 0.66
Kyrgyz 0.65
Algerian 0.64
Azerbaijani 0.64
Ethiopian 0.64
Pashtun 0.64
Tajik 0.64
Turk 0.64
Latvian 0.63
Druze 0.61
German_Lipsian 0.6
Brahmin 0.59
Jew 0.58
Egyptian 0.58
Uygur 0.58
Vietnamese 0.58
Yemeni 0.58
Kinh 0.57
Assyrian 0.56
Iranian 0.56
Japanese 0.56
Lebanese 0.56
Quechua 0.56
Avar 0.55
Eskimo 0.55
Mayan 0.55
Russians-West 0.54
Surui 0.54
Jew 0.53
Kazakh 0.53
Tundra_Yukaghir 0.53
Colla 0.52
Armenian 0.51
Armenian 0.51
Georgian 0.51
Iranian 0.51
Italian 0.51
Kumyk 0.51
Russian 0.51
Yaghnobi 0.51
Dutch 0.5
Greek 0.5
Scottish 0.5
Turk 0.5
Finn 0.49
Hungarian 0.49
Iranian 0.49
Vepsa 0.49
Berber 0.48
Cachi 0.48
Egyptian 0.48
Irish 0.48
Ava 0.47
BedouinA 0.47
Romanian 0.47
Spanish 0.47
Jew 0.46
Hazara 0.46
Palestinian 0.46
Tujia 0.46
Georgian 0.45
Tabasaran 0.45
Altaian 0.44
Bulgarian 0.44
Dargin 0.44
Dai 0.43
Irish 0.43
Jew 0.42
Irish 0.42
Lebanese_Christian 0.42
Mongolian 0.42
Moroccan 0.42
Wichi 0.42
Daur 0.41
Eskimo 0.41
Khomani 0.41
Russian 0.41
Saami 0.41
Samaritan 0.41
Turk 0.41
Abhkasian 0.4
Bantu 0.4
Ju_hoan_North 0.4
Xibo 0.4
Armenian 0.39
Greenlander 0.39
Ishkasim 0.39
Romanian 0.39
Turk 0.39
Armenian 0.38
Armenian 0.38
Athabask 0.38
English 0.38
Gambian 0.38
Ket 0.38
Serbian 0.38
Biaka 0.37
Kurd 0.37
She 0.37
Slovak 0.37
Spanish 0.37
Turk 0.37
Maltese 0.36
Saami_WGA 0.36
Adygei 0.35
Afa 0.35
Georgian 0.35
Hakas 0.35
Hazara 0.35
Iranian 0.35
Iran_Lor 0.35
Mongol 0.35
Nivkh 0.35
Oroqen 0.35
Somali 0.35
Jew 0.35
Uzbek 0.35
Armenian 0.34
Filipino 0.34
French 0.34
Greek 0.34
Mandenka 0.34
Norwegian 0.34
Saudi 0.34
Spanish 0.34
Dusun 0.33
French 0.33
Italian 0.33
Libyan 0.33
Saharawi 0.33
Jew 0.33
Welsh 0.33
Basque 0.32
Egyptian 0.32
French 0.32
Gagauz 0.32
Jew 0.32
Tajiks 0.32
Zapotec 0.32
Adjar 0.31
Jew 0.31
Zoroastrian 0.31
Jew 0.31
Kalmyk 0.31
Tunisian 0.31
Yukaghir 0.31
Buryat 0.3
Chechen 0.3
Greek 0.3
Mixtec 0.3
Romanian 0.3
Scottish 0.3
Swiss 0.3
Turk 0.3
Greenlander 0.3
Armenian 0.29
Estonian 0.29
Hadza 0.29
Kyrgyz 0.29
Macedonian 0.29
Moldavian 0.29
Russian 0.29
Turkmen 0.29
Albanian 0.28
Jew 0.28
Balkar 0.28
Brahui 0.28
English 0.28
Finn 0.28
Finn 0.28
Jew 0.28
Georgians 0.28
Iran_Mazandrani 0.28
Mozabite 0.28
Pole 0.28
Russian 0.28
Serbian 0.28
Spanish 0.28
Armenian 0.27
Armenian 0.27
Czech 0.27
Georgian 0.27
Han 0.27
Jew 0.27
Italian 0.27
Mongola 0.27
Turk 0.27
Azeri 0.26
Bashkir 0.26
German 0.26
Greek 0.26
Syrian 0.26
Lipka_Tatar 0.26
Austrian 0.25
Georgian 0.25
Han 0.25
Italian 0.25
Lebanese_Muslim 0.25
Makrani 0.25
Russian 0.25
Jew 0.25
Spanish 0.25
Ulchi 0.25
Afroamerican 0.24
Esan 0.24
Pima 0.24
Yoruba 0.24
Chuvash 0.23
Corsican 0.23
Hungarian 0.23
Korean 0.23
Jew 0.23
Nogai 0.23
Spanish 0.23
Spanish 0.23
Arab_Israel 0.22
Assyrian 0.22
Jew 0.22
Cossack 0.22
French 0.22
Irish 0.22
Luo 0.22
Tajik 0.22
Cypriot 0.21
Finn 0.21
German 0.21
Itelmen 0.21
Turkmens 0.21
Assyrian 0.2
Bolivian 0.2
Bulgarian 0.2
Mansi 0.2
Mende 0.2
Miao 0.2
Jew 0.2
Sardinian 0.2
Spanish 0.2
Tubalar 0.2
Even 0.19
Orcadian 0.19
Shetlandic 0.19
Spanish 0.19
Mari 0.18
Scottish 0.18
Azerbaijani_Agdzhabedi 0.17
Eskimo 0.17
German 0.17
Greek 0.17
Irish 0.17
Italian 0.17
Lak 0.17
Maasai 0.17
Avar 0.16
Balochi 0.16
Piapoco 0.16
Jew 0.16
Bosnian 0.15
Jordanian 0.15
Kyrgyz 0.15
Ukrainian 0.15
Armenian 0.14
Bashkir 0.14
Belarusian_East 0.14
Circassian 0.14
Congo 0.14
Jew 0.14
Luhya 0.14
Ossetian 0.14
Pole 0.14
Slovenian 0.14
Sorb 0.14
Uzbek 0.14
Bantu 0.13
Bantu 0.13
BedouinB 0.13
Lithuanian 0.13
Mbuti 0.13
Sicilian 0.13
Spanish 0.13
Basque 0.12
Chukchi 0.12
Kikuyu 0.12
Russian 0.12
Sakha 0.12
Spanish 0.12
Finn 0.11
Irish 0.11
Kalash 0.11
Koryak 0.11
Armenian 0.1
Armenian 0.1
Belarusian 0.1
Croat 0.1
Italian 0.1
Karelian 0.1
Jew 0.1
Dane 0.09
Evenk 0.09
Greek 0.09
Shor 0.09
Spanish 0.09
Bantu 0.08
Erzya_Moksha 0.08
Icelandic 0.08
Nenets 0.08
Swede 0.08
Tajik 0.08
Ukrainians_west 0.08
Armenian 0.07
French 0.07
Portuguese 0.07
Bolivian 0.06
Datog 0.06
Murut 0.05
Russian_cossack 0.05
Scottish 0.05
Selkup 0.05
Udmurd 0.05
Jew 0.05
Azerbaijani_Khachmaz 0.04
Kosovar 0.04
Montenegrian 0.04
Scottish 0.04
Kryashen 0.03
Mixe 0.03
Spanish 0.03
Ukrainians_east 0.03
Ami 0.02
Atajal 0.02
Russian 0.02
Kabardin 0.01
Komi 0.01
Provencal 0.01
Spanish 0.01

Tomenable
06-29-2017, 10:20 PM
Do you get any Oceanian in Eurogenes K36 as well?

Tomenable
06-29-2017, 10:43 PM
Here is an example of Ecuadorian person with some Oceanian ancestry (probably due to contacts between Polynesians from Easter Island and Andean populations?). Every single DNA test "caught" Oceanian admixture, but in different amounts:

23andMe* ---------- 0.1% Oceanian
AncestryDNA ------- 1% Oceanian
FTDNA -------------- 2% Oceanian
DNA.Land ---------- 1.5% Oceanian
WeGene ------------ 1.41% Oceanian
DNA Tribes --------- 1.2% Oceanian
MyHeritage --------- 0.9% Oceanian
Eurogenes K36 ---- 1.88% Oceanian

*23andMe tends to underestimate the amount of minor components.

Tomenable
06-29-2017, 11:03 PM
Because I and my parents were born in Australia I can't dismiss the Oceania immediately as just background noise.

Indeed. I have seen many results of South African Boers / Afrikaners (both results from GEDmatch calculators and results from commercial tests), and literally all of them (or nearly all) score some minor Sub-Saharan admixtures. This is mostly from the 1600s and the 1700s, when they absorbed some local South African as well as imported (slaves from West Africa) Sub-Saharan blood. I can imagine that colonial White Australian ancestry also includes some Aboriginal blood.

Do you have colonial Australian ancestry?

===========================

South African Boer in DNA.Land, with 2.4% of Sub-Saharan:

https://i.imgur.com/i64S1Gv.png

Boers also tend to have some Asian ancestry:

http://www.geographiapolonica.pl/article/item/7562.html

http://rcin.org.pl/Content/29182/WA51_49371_r2012-t85-no3_G-Polonica-Kowalski.pdf

Excerpt:

"In seeking to build the foundations of its rule in
South Africa, the Dutch East India Company took
on people from various different countries. One
indication of this is provided by the established
origins of today’s Afrikaaners. Calculations by
Heese (1971) suggest that 36.8% of these people’s
ancestors derived from The Netherlands, 35.7%
from Germany, 14.4% from France, 2.7% from the
British Isles, 2.9% from other European countries
(Poland included) and 7.5% from countries outside
Europe. In turn, work on the origin of the ancestors
of contemporary Afrikaaner Jaco M. Greeff
would seem to suggest that Heese exaggerated
the role played by immigrants of German origin,
at the expense of the French. The largest group
of Greeff ancestors – accounting for a 37.5%
share very close to that given by Heese – came
from The Netherlands, while Germans and French
accounted for similar (respectively 27.4 and 26.4%)
shares. 1.9% of the ancestors were from the British
Isles, while other European countries (mainly Denmark,
Norway and Portugal) accounted for 0.8%.
The non-European ancestors (mainly from India)
accounted for as much as 6.1% of the total."

Tomenable
06-29-2017, 11:48 PM
Here is what a 100% Aboriginal Australian scores in Eurogenes K36:

Oceanian 74.17
South_Asian 11.13
Malayan 6.06
Siberian 3.05
Omotic 1.80
East_Central_Asian 1.78
Pygmy 1.72
East_Asian 0.28

Gentleman
06-30-2017, 10:52 AM
Do you get any Oceanian in Eurogenes K36 as well?

Lol synchronicity! No, none at all. I actually posted my own Eurogenes K36 results in a different thread on this site where someone raised a similar oceanian enquiry. I shall reproduce it below in bold:):

LOL. This is so much reminiscent of my thread "Oceanian <1%???" in Oceanian section.

I think the Oceanian result can be a bit of a WTF moment for those of us who are pretty sure we have no ancestry from "Oceania". I have less than the OP but possibly took it more seriously as I'm Australian by birth with two grandparents born here.

On FTDNA I was gobsmacked to see my expected heatmaps in Europe...and then a trace <1% heat map assigned to Australia/PNG zone.

If it's not just background noise, in my case the heatmap is far more appropriate around say India (assuming a Gypsy-type source.)

While on most it gives me some level of Oceanian, on the big Eurogenes K36 Admixture Proportions it gives me none and gives me 100% European groups:



Population

Amerindian -
Arabian -
Armenian -
Basque 1.68
Central_African -
Central_Euro 5.81
East_African -
East_Asian -
East_Balkan 6.10
East_Central_Asian -
East_Central_Euro 12.00
East_Med -
Eastern_Euro 6.92
Fennoscandian 9.09
French 7.30
Iberian 13.20
Indo-Chinese -
Italian 5.94
Malayan -
Near_Eastern -
North_African -
North_Atlantic 9.15
North_Caucasian 2.58
North_Sea 20.23
Northeast_African -
Oceanian -
Omotic -
Pygmy -
Siberian -
South_Asian -
South_Central_Asian -
South_Chinese -
Volga-Ural -
West_African -
West_Caucasian -
West_Med -

Gentleman
06-30-2017, 11:33 AM
Indeed. I have seen many results of South African Boers / Afrikaners (both results from GEDmatch calculators and results from commercial tests), and literally all of them (or nearly all) score some minor Sub-Saharan admixtures. This is mostly from the 1600s and the 1700s, when they absorbed some local South African as well as imported (slaves from West Africa) Sub-Saharan blood. I can imagine that colonial White Australian ancestry also includes some Aboriginal blood.

Do you have colonial Australian ancestry?

===========================

South African Boer in DNA.Land, with 2.4% of Sub-Saharan:


Boers also tend to have some Asian ancestry:





Excerpt:

"In seeking to build the foundations of its rule in
South Africa, the Dutch East India Company took
on people from various different countries. One
indication of this is provided by the established
origins of today’s Afrikaaners. Calculations by
Heese (1971) suggest that 36.8% of these people’s
ancestors derived from The Netherlands, 35.7%
from Germany, 14.4% from France, 2.7% from the
British Isles, 2.9% from other European countries
(Poland included) and 7.5% from countries outside
Europe. In turn, work on the origin of the ancestors
of contemporary Afrikaaner Jaco M. Greeff
would seem to suggest that Heese exaggerated
the role played by immigrants of German origin,
at the expense of the French. The largest group
of Greeff ancestors – accounting for a 37.5%
share very close to that given by Heese – came
from The Netherlands, while Germans and French
accounted for similar (respectively 27.4 and 26.4%)
shares. 1.9% of the ancestors were from the British
Isles, while other European countries (mainly Denmark,
Norway and Portugal) accounted for 0.8%.
The non-European ancestors (mainly from India)
accounted for as much as 6.1% of the total."

Colonial? Not sure how far back my earliest Australian born ancestor is, but I don't think we were here VERY early on in European colonisation. I think it's about context. If I was American I would be curious to know whether the minute Native American I showed in puntDNAL K13 Global calculator is evidence of a Pocahontas event:P As it is I know I have no Native American, unless perhaps the Vikings brought same back.

Like I said Australia is a young country, people with mixed Aboriginal ancestry still have a distinctive look - if the don't they have family who does.

Gentleman
07-04-2017, 01:57 PM
Thanks for the welcome! I just went on GEDmatch tonight - first time. All of those calculators seem very different! It's a bit confusing. Many conflicting results. Yes, I score Oceanian, always very low. However I also score a lot of other trace things on there that FTDNA leaves out. Is there any calculator in particular you'd suggest I should regard as more authoritative?

I'll only paste one, for amusement. "puntDNAL K13 Global" says I have something from every global region except Siberia!


Population
West_Asia 9.49
NE_Europe 51.03
Americas 0.12
Siberia -
Oceania 0.79
South_Asia 0.69
NE_Asia 0.90
East_Africa 0.43
SE_Asia 0.69
SW_Europe 33.54
SW_Asia 0.95
West_Africa 0.67
South_Africa 0.70

Strange, I always knew I was a "Euromutt". I'm coming to understand what I've read others say - that the small trace elements are not always meaningful. Eg, I am apparently more North East Asian than Oceanian on that calculator. Why didn't FTDNA mention that? I guess the type of trace admixture it mentions in that puntDNAL K13 Global table is likely from a long time ago. (Assuming it's not simply "noise".) Two of my grandparents were born in Europe - the other two I met and they simply were not that "exotic" looking.

Sorry this thread is becoming a tad self-indulgent:P

It was interesting also looking at chromosomal detail on puntDNAL K13 Global. On every single one of my 22 chromosomes (I know there's 2 of each of these), the biggest 2 components are always NE_Europe and SW_Europe. Interestingly my Chromosome 21 has most NE_Europe (68.3%) AND most Oceania (4.3%). Just over half of my chromosome pairs have some Oceanian percent on that calculator. Not sure, but I'd guess with genuine modern ethnic admixture you'd typically find a fewer number of chromosomes with a much higher number percent of Oceania (or West_Africa or Americas etc, as they case may be, depending on what admixture is suspected)?

Gentleman
07-04-2017, 02:32 PM
Thanks, NewAlbion. The big disclosure thing at the sign-up for DNA.Land made me nervous at this point and I didn't upload:(

HOWEVER, I learnt something interesting about the Oceanian category in PuntDNAL k13 global. The Population Spreadsheet for puntDNAL K13 Global gives the breakdown of different ethnicities' averages. "Oceanian" is actually far from exclusive to Australasia and surrounds. It's at a low level in Indian-type populations, among others. It states average 1% average for Romani. The relevance of that is that there actually is a family legend about a "real gypsy" looking woman, but that was in England. We had dismissed it as I believe that was on my great grandmother's side and she herself was I think a strawberry blonde.

Furthermore, I'm a quarter Czech and historically Central Europe had a fair few Roma.

There are various groups near outskirts of Europe who register some "Oceanian" - eg, Tadjiks (average 1%), Afghan Pashtun (0.5%), Balochi (0.5%), Turkish Kayseri (0.5%). Not to mention many Indians and various Asian groupings with much higher elements.

I think the term "Oceanian" can mislead - there was such DNA in Europe long before Captain Cook found Australia. In relation to myself, I think IF it's not background noise its more likely to be Roma type contribution. My two grandparents who were born in Australia are pretty much that paper white, with no unusual features. The short length of white settlement in Australia is such that even very white-looking Aborigines ordinarily have living family who clearly look mixed. Things like Papuan would make even less sense to me. (I am darker than paper white from my Czech side.)

While properly European groups have 0% in that spreadsheet for PuntDNAL k13 global, that is only because the spreadsheet apparently rounds to the nearest half percent. I suspect many (not sure about most?) Europeans would show a percentage of Oceanian on PuntDNAL k13 global, but presumably they would average as less than 0.25%.

mamoahina
07-06-2017, 12:48 PM
Here is an example of Ecuadorian person with some Oceanian ancestry (probably due to contacts between Polynesians from Easter Island and Andean populations?). Every single DNA test "caught" Oceanian admixture, but in different amounts:

23andMe* ---------- 0.1% Oceanian
AncestryDNA ------- 1% Oceanian
FTDNA -------------- 2% Oceanian
DNA.Land ---------- 1.5% Oceanian
WeGene ------------ 1.41% Oceanian
DNA Tribes --------- 1.2% Oceanian
MyHeritage --------- 0.9% Oceanian
Eurogenes K36 ---- 1.88% Oceanian

*23andMe tends to underestimate the amount of minor components.
Interesting! Those results are pretty high for what should be considered noise. Even MyHeritage picked up some for you while FTDNA has 2%. So there is no known recent Polynesian ancestry? Have this person had their haplogroups tested?

But Ancestry has not OCEANIAN category. So you either got 1% Melanesia or 1% Polynesia.

mamoahina
07-06-2017, 12:50 PM
Everything else on my FTDNA "myOrigins" results looked about right, more or less:
West and Central Europe
51%

British Isles
47%

Trace Results:

Finland
< 2%

Oceania
< 1%

_________________________________

My FTDNA ancientOrigins results show 0% non-European.

Because I and my parents were born in Australia I can't dismiss the Oceania immediately as just background noise. (If it brought up a percentage like that of African or Native American I would dismiss it as I don't live near those places, and nor have my known forebears.)

I'm curious how much less than 1% it is, but I think FTDNA doesn't use decimal points with its percentages, so <1% is lowest possible above 0%.

Should I be searching for an Oceanian (presumably, Aboriginal?) ancestor? Is it possible that FTDNA assigned me that trace as they did not know how to interpret something and just noticed I was from Australia? Could the sample of "Oceanians" be infiltrated by some British Isles ancestry?

I have no known Oceanian ancestry, nor family legends about it. A couple of my lines have been in Australia a long time, but I'm not sure precisely how long.

I'm not even completely sure how you can have a <1% result. Assuming they used 46 chromosomes (I think actually they used less as it excludes Y chromosome I believe), a single chromosome from a forebear would equate to no less than 2.17%. I suppose genetic recombination could allow a chromosome to partially be Oceanian and partially not, though.

You should upload to MyHeritage and see what they score since they seemed to have refined somewhat the Polynesian category and possibly the Melanesian category as well.

ashstar
07-07-2017, 01:47 AM
On paper I am 6.25% Aboriginal. I score around 2% Oceanian on most calculators.

Trixster
08-19-2017, 09:16 PM
I am wondering what other ethnicities may cause Oceanian (noise) to drop into our mix. I mean I would love it to have some truth as it intrigues me.
My daughter scores 1.32 Oceanian

I score .99 (noise)?!? And 1.68 SE Asian on the same calculator.

We have a few other things going on ethnicity wise. For the most part the others make sense, this was as someone else said it a "wtf?" But in a good way :)

okarinaofsteiner
04-11-2018, 04:29 AM
I got 1.2% "Native Oceanian" on DNA.Land, along with 3.9% Cambodian/Thai, 1.8% Siberian, 4.6% Mongolic/Tungusic, and 5.6% Korean/Japanese. The rest of my ancestry is "Central Chinese".

Jan_Noack
04-12-2018, 11:09 AM
all you need is for ONE person in Oceanica to declare they have solid 100% all grandparents or all eight great grandparents etc from the same area of Oceanica...just ONE slipup they don't know about where a European may have landed and maybe had sex with one of the local women (raped or vaoluntary)(just an example) and she kept it quiet..maybe during WW2 ?(I heard it was fairly common then by all sides). So this ONE slipup means that some European genes may be taken as normal in Oceanica genes..and it is not a lot for "< 1%" to be registered. I have "<1% Oceanica on all my tests (5 of them out of 5 people). I just thought EVERYONE had "<1% Oceanica due to just one (perhaps more) people thinking they were 100% Oceanica when they were in fact not...one gr grandparent not..but unknown to all. Please reply if you Do NOT HAVe "<1% Oceanica" on you origins with FTDNA or ancestry. So far everyone I know has it!

JFWinstone
04-17-2018, 07:26 AM
My mum has some Oceanian coming up on all tests so far

Ancestry - 3% Polynesia and 1% Melanesia
DNA.Land - 2% Native Oceanian
MyHeritage - 1.1% Oceanian
DNAtribes - 2% Pacific
GenePlaza K29 - 1.6% Oceanian
GenePlaza Ancestry - 1.3% Oceanian
Wegene - 1.53% Oceanian

Currently waiting on 23andme.

Messier 67
04-18-2018, 07:14 PM
And it is not a slip up, there are probably loads of SNPs skipped over than are shared by east and west Eurasians, but not to "confuse" people because everyone wants everything neat and tidy, so there are less cases of 1% Oceanian than there should be. The world is not Euro-centric. And there must be Pacific SNPs for those in the Pacific Islands, even though it might inconvenience some.

Lei_VA
04-26-2018, 03:14 AM
Hi !

In my FTDNA results I also <1% Oceanian.
And on Gedmatch in the tests too:

puntDNAL K13 Global: 1.11%
puntDNAL K15: 1.44%
puntDNAL K12 Modern / Old: 0.99%

HarappaWorld: 0.74% Papuan
World9: 0.74% Australasian
Eurogenes K36: 0.51% Oceanian
MDLP World: 0.21% Melanesian
MDLP K23b: 1.17% Austronesian & 0.53 Melano_Polynesian


I often have 4 to 6% of South Asian, there is a report?

Hurricane
04-27-2018, 07:40 PM
Hi !

In my FTDNA results I also <1% Oceanian.
And on Gedmatch in the tests too:

puntDNAL K13 Global: 1.11%
puntDNAL K15: 1.44%
puntDNAL K12 Modern / Old: 0.99%

HarappaWorld: 0.74% Papuan
World9: 0.74% Australasian
Eurogenes K36: 0.51% Oceanian
MDLP World: 0.21% Melanesian
MDLP K23b: 1.17% Austronesian & 0.53 Melano_Polynesian


I often have 4 to 6% of South Asian, there is a report?

Indonésie?

Lei_VA
04-28-2018, 04:29 AM
Indonésie?

maybe, in my FTDNA results I got <1% "Southeast Asia"

" The Southeast Asia cluster is primarily comprised of present day populations from Southeast China, Burma, Vietnam, Cambodia, and Laos. However, this cluster extends for densely representative populations to the islands of Taiwan, the Philippines, Brunei, Sumatra, and the Malaysian Peninsula. "

I do not have known ancestors who were Asian, do you know if a test on Gedmatch would be appropriate to know more?

Hurricane
04-28-2018, 10:48 AM
maybe, in my FTDNA results I got <1% "Southeast Asia"

" The Southeast Asia cluster is primarily comprised of present day populations from Southeast China, Burma, Vietnam, Cambodia, and Laos. However, this cluster extends for densely representative populations to the islands of Taiwan, the Philippines, Brunei, Sumatra, and the Malaysian Peninsula. "

I do not have known ancestors who were Asian, do you know if a test on Gedmatch would be appropriate to know more?

The Southeast Asia associated with Oceania could be from Indonesia or Polynesia.

The K47 test (on the forum), DNA tribes SNP analysis and the Eurogenes K36 report done by lukaszM can be helpful.
Finally, there is 24genetics which is a little expensive.

Lei_VA
04-29-2018, 12:26 AM
thank you very much for your answer, I will inquire then.
I am very interested in understanding this better.

Hurricane
04-29-2018, 06:55 PM
thank you very much for your answer, I will inquire then.
I am very interested in understanding this better.

I also forgot to mention MyHeritage which gave me "Filipino, Indonesian, and Malaysian" instead of my usual Oceanian

Lei_VA
04-29-2018, 10:42 PM
The Southeast Asia associated with Oceania could be from Indonesia or Polynesia.

The K47 test (on the forum), DNA tribes SNP analysis and the Eurogenes K36 report done by lukaszM can be helpful.
Finally, there is 24genetics which is a little expensive.

thank you very much Hurricane!
I will learn about the K47 if it can be conclusive it's great.

What is the 24genetics test?

Lei_VA
04-29-2018, 10:47 PM
I also forgot to mention MyHeritage which gave me "Filipino, Indonesian, and Malaysian" instead of my usual Oceanian

This is complicated then to find one more precisely.
I will follow your advice, and continue to learn more, that interests me.

On one side with Spanish origins, I tell myself that it is not necessarily incomprehensible to find a link with this region, as for the Philippines in relation to the history of "conquest".

But I do not know if it is in that time or before.

Hurricane
05-01-2018, 05:27 PM
thank you very much Hurricane!
I will learn about the K47 if it can be conclusive it's great.

What is the 24genetics test?

K47 has multiple East asian and Oceanian components. The nmonte extension, is also helpful.


Proto-Austronesian
Indo-Chinese
NE-Asian
Mongolian
East-Asian
Amuro-Manchurian
Malay
South-Chinese
Papuan



24genetics can generate ancestry reports based on your raw data. DNA Tribes is similar, but better in my opinion.

mike86
05-21-2018, 03:47 PM
24genetics is a very complete ancestry test, they have more than 400 populations..in my case it was really worthy, I really recommend it

Gentleman
04-19-2021, 09:31 AM
LOL my old thread. Got no Oceanian / Oceanic with the newer FTDNA Version 3 update, which is what I would expect (I also never got anything like that category on 23andMe). Anyone else find themselves more or less "Oceanian" with the update?

JFWinstone
06-19-2021, 11:54 AM
With the updates since I last posted my mum has lost most of her Oceanian percentages. Ancestry her Oceanian changed to Southeast Asia. 23andme it changed to Indonesian, Thai, Khmer & Myanmar. FTDNA it changed to Malaysia & Western Indonesia. Myheritage she still has some Oceanian specifically 1.3% Papuan.

Kalysto
10-12-2021, 11:54 AM
Hello,
I'm french and i often get <1% oceanian on gedmatch and other calculators but not with Myheritage.
I only found europeans ancestors in my family tree (mostly from France, Belgium, Germany).
MDLP World : 0.75 melanesian
MDLP k23b : 1.93 melano polynesian, 0.37 australoid
puntDNAL 10 : 3 oceanian
puntDNAL 13 : 0.75 oceanian
puntDNAL k12 ancient : 2.96 oceanian
K36 : 0.31 oceanian
Eurogenes K13 : 1.39 oceanian
And on the mixed mode of Illustrative DNA I got french at 99 and 0.9 papuan :
47002
Do you think it is just noise ?

CuriousOne
11-20-2021, 07:48 AM
Probably just noise