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Loderingo
08-21-2017, 11:51 AM
Can't be too long now.

ollie444
08-21-2017, 02:01 PM
Can't be too long now.

I hope not! ;)

sktibo
08-21-2017, 05:18 PM
My money is on a good while yet. I'm doubtful we'll see it this year

FionnSneachta
08-21-2017, 05:57 PM
My money is on a good while yet. I'm doubtful we'll see it this year

What I don't understand though is how did they possibly think that the update could have been rolled out in 8 weeks' time on the 20th of April? That wasn't that long a time frame. I mean I could understand it if the deadline was something like a year because something unexpected might have come up during that year or it became more difficult than expected. At 8 weeks' you'd get the impression that they were far into the process and getting near to the end. I emailed them yesterday just to ask about it and I'll let ye know if I hear anything back. It's been so long since we've heard anything.

sktibo
08-21-2017, 08:30 PM
What I don't understand though is how did they possibly think that the update could have been rolled out in 8 weeks' time on the 20th of April? That wasn't that long a time frame. I mean I could understand it if the deadline was something like a year because something unexpected might have come up during that year or it became more difficult than expected. At 8 weeks' you'd get the impression that they were far into the process and getting near to the end. I emailed them yesterday just to ask about it and I'll let ye know if I hear anything back. It's been so long since we've heard anything.

That would be fantastic, thank you

DillonResearcher
08-21-2017, 08:43 PM
I wonder if the Irish DNA Atlas is keen to see the LivingDNA Irish research before publishing their own and vice versa which is making them both delay thinking that the other will publish first?

MacEochaidh
08-21-2017, 10:07 PM
My guess is September 25, 2017, at 1:30 am PDT.

Judith
08-22-2017, 10:26 AM
My guess is September 25, 2017, at 1:30 am PDT.

WHY??!

MacEochaidh
08-22-2017, 01:51 PM
WHY??!

Well, just because I wanted to guess to something! Suppose I'm correct; I'll look like a psychic :)

Amerijoe
08-22-2017, 02:57 PM
Well, just because I wanted to guess to something! Suppose I'm correct; I'll look like a psychic :)

I'm pulling for you! :) Joe

AntG
08-22-2017, 05:18 PM
OK, I'll put in a guess... it will be announced on Oct 20... As LivingDNA will be at Back to Our Past in Dublin (Oct 20-22).
http://backtoourpast.ie/

Interestingly, Genetic Genealogy Ireland 2017 will have a speaker from the Irish DNA Atlas Project...
"...much anticipated presentation of the (almost?) final results of the Irish DNA Atlas project. This is a joint collaboration between the Royal College of Surgeons of Ireland and the Genealogical Society of Ireland. Over 200 subjects have been recruited from all over Ireland and their autosomal DNA sampled. Each participant must have 8 great grandparents born within a relatively strictly defined geographic area. As a result, the study gives us a snapshot of autosomal DNA in Ireland from about 1850, just after the Great Famine. Ed Gilbert has tantalised us with snippets of information and updates on the projects progress over the past 2 years and we look forward to welcoming him back for this exciting climax."
http://ggi2013.blogspot.co.uk/

ollie444
08-22-2017, 05:41 PM
My guess is September 25, 2017, at 1:30 am PDT.


Well, just because I wanted to guess to something! Suppose I'm correct; I'll look like a psychic :)

Well you've hit my brother's birthday perfectly there!

deadly77
08-22-2017, 10:35 PM
My meaningless prediction (based on no knowledge or facts whatsoever): December 17th.

DillonResearcher
08-23-2017, 09:58 AM
I'm going to guess/hope that we get the autosomal results on October 20th at Genetic Genealogy Ireland but that they will continue data gathering and that we will then see some Y-DNA and mtDNA analysis.

MacEochaidh
08-23-2017, 12:30 PM
OK, I'll put in a guess... it will be announced on Oct 20... As LivingDNA will be at Back to Our Past in Dublin (Oct 20-22).
http://backtoourpast.ie/

Interestingly, Genetic Genealogy Ireland 2017 will have a speaker from the Irish DNA Atlas Project...
"...much anticipated presentation of the (almost?) final results of the Irish DNA Atlas project. This is a joint collaboration between the Royal College of Surgeons of Ireland and the Genealogical Society of Ireland. Over 200 subjects have been recruited from all over Ireland and their autosomal DNA sampled. Each participant must have 8 great grandparents born within a relatively strictly defined geographic area. As a result, the study gives us a snapshot of autosomal DNA in Ireland from about 1850, just after the Great Famine. Ed Gilbert has tantalised us with snippets of information and updates on the projects progress over the past 2 years and we look forward to welcoming him back for this exciting climax."
http://ggi2013.blogspot.co.uk/

I'd say this guess is the best. It's a long time off, but it makes perfect sense.

FionnSneachta
08-23-2017, 03:07 PM
I'd say this guess is the best. It's a long time off, but it makes perfect sense.

I wouldn't mind waiting that long. It's only two months. Hopefully now we won't be left disappointed if it's not released then but at least since they'll be at an event in Dublin, they'll have to give some sort of update on the project. If they're planning to release it then, I doubt that they'll give me a date for release date since it will probably be a surprise on the day.

ollie444
08-23-2017, 04:55 PM
I wouldn't mind waiting that long. It's only two months. Hopefully now we won't be left disappointed if it's not released then but at least since they'll be at an event in Dublin, they'll have to give some sort of update on the project. If they're planning to release it then, I doubt that they'll give me a date for release date since it will probably be a surprise on the day.

It occurred to me that they'll have to create cautious groupings as well. I wouldn't be surprised if this takes them some time, given that it took several months longer than expected for the complete/cautious modes. I also wouldn't be surprised if we see some bizarre cautious groupings such as Lincolnshire with Leinster! :P

FionnSneachta
08-26-2017, 03:08 PM
I got a response from Living DNA:


In terms of completing the Irish project, this may well take a number of years. To be able to subdivide Ireland into 13 distinct regions we would need enough samples from all the required regions, then analyse them and process them. There will however be intermittent results in that time.

That doesn't sound too promising. They mention intermittent results but who knows when they will be. I hope that they at least update the overall Irish reference samples soon though since that at the very least needs to be accurate. I'm still 19.6% Irish and I should be a lot higher. It does lead to confusion for people that for example may be a quarter Irish and show up with small percentages that on other genetic tests could be called noise. I think that Debbie Kennett must have misunderstood them when she said that the Irish update would be rolled out in eight weeks' time because I don't see how they could have said that when they must have known they wouldn't.

I sent a reply asking about an update to the general or overall Irish sample since people with Irish ancestry are getting low percentages. More than likely I won't get much information but it's worth a shot.

MacEochaidh
08-26-2017, 04:31 PM
I got a response from Living DNA:



That doesn't sound too promising. They mention intermittent results but who knows when they will be. I hope that they at least update the overall Irish reference samples soon though since that at the very least needs to be accurate. I'm still 19.6% Irish and I should be a lot higher. It does lead to confusion for people that for example may be a quarter Irish and show up with small percentages that on other genetic tests could be called noise. I think that Debbie Kennett must have misunderstood them when she said that the Irish update would be rolled out in eight weeks' time because I don't see how they could have said that when they must have known they wouldn't.

I sent a reply asking about an update to the general or overall Irish sample since people with Irish ancestry are getting low percentages. More than likely I won't get much information but it's worth a shot.

If they're going to do an "intermittent" roll out, they could start with the four Provinces. That shouldn't be too hard to come by.

sktibo
08-26-2017, 05:10 PM
I got a response from Living DNA:



That doesn't sound too promising. They mention intermittent results but who knows when they will be. I hope that they at least update the overall Irish reference samples soon though since that at the very least needs to be accurate. I'm still 19.6% Irish and I should be a lot higher. It does lead to confusion for people that for example may be a quarter Irish and show up with small percentages that on other genetic tests could be called noise. I think that Debbie Kennett must have misunderstood them when she said that the Irish update would be rolled out in eight weeks' time because I don't see how they could have said that when they must have known they wouldn't.

I sent a reply asking about an update to the general or overall Irish sample since people with Irish ancestry are getting low percentages. More than likely I won't get much information but it's worth a shot.

I guess when asking we need to change the question to something along the lines of : "When will we see the first release of new DNA result from Ireland added live to our DNA test results?"

FionnSneachta
08-26-2017, 05:11 PM
If they're going to do an "intermittent" roll out, they could start with the four Provinces. That shouldn't be to hard to come by.

Yeah I sort of wish they weren't quite so ambitious starting off. At least get Ireland as a country right and then work on refining it down to smaller regions. I'd be delighted if they could even get it down to the provinces.

FionnSneachta
08-26-2017, 05:11 PM
I guess when asking we need to change the question to something along the lines of : "When will we see the first release of new DNA result from Ireland added live to our DNA test results?"

I'll give it a go!

sktibo
08-26-2017, 06:41 PM
Yeah I sort of wish they weren't quite so ambitious starting off. At least get Ireland as a country right and then work on refining it down to smaller regions. I'd be delighted if they could even get it down to the provinces.

I really wish they weren't so ambitious also, and i think in the case of ireland 13 regions is truly overkill. I'd love to see connacht, leinster, munster, and Ulster divided into something like donegal and northern ireland

08-26-2017, 06:54 PM
I suppose geopolitically would make sense, but does that how the fine scale genetic structure algorithm will break them down? Probably not I suppose, maybe 13 was the number of groupings which popped out of their early testing?

ollie444
08-26-2017, 08:03 PM
I agree. You'd think that they could use all the samples collected for individual regions and try to find something in there just to improve Ireland as a whole.

FionnSneachta
08-27-2017, 03:42 PM
I've gotten a reply from Living DNA:


My colleagues have informed me that they are hoping for the first Irish update, that will make a change to people's results to happen early to mid-next year. Unfortunately development can at times be unpredictable, so this may change and is not set in stone.

Well done to sktibo who had the closest prediction for an update! So we still have a long wait but at least we're not waiting for something that we think will be coming any week now when in reality it's not.

cilldara
08-27-2017, 04:00 PM
I submitted my DNA to the Living DNA Irish Research Project in December. I emailed them at the start of July asking them when will I be receiving my results. They said I should be able to access the first version of my results in the next 8 weeks. So hopefully I will receive them soon.

MacEochaidh
08-27-2017, 04:04 PM
"...early to mid-next year..."?! What in God's name makes it so hard to get Irish DNA samples?! You'd think Ireland was the most remote and exotic place on earth!

cilldara
08-27-2017, 04:13 PM
"...early to mid-next year..."?! What in God's name makes it so hard to get Irish DNA samples?! You'd think Ireland was the most remote and exotic place on earth!

In fairness it would be hard to find an Irishman in Ireland since they are all in Vegas for the Conor McGregor fight. :)

MacEochaidh
08-27-2017, 04:16 PM
In fairness it would be hard to find an Irishman in Ireland since they are all in Vegas for the Conor McGregor fight. :)

Good point! Nice to see you here, AB. :)

sktibo
08-27-2017, 07:33 PM
I've gotten a reply from Living DNA:



Well done to sktibo who had the closest prediction for an update! So we still have a long wait but at least we're not waiting for something that we think will be coming any week now when in reality it's not.

Knew they would take forever. My official bet is summer 2018, probably June-July. Unfortunately this was a bet I was hoping to lose, and I seriously hope that they will change their minds and simply update their plain Irish region with what they already have before then, because right now this just just ridiculous. We've got Irish testers scoring ~20% Irish, and even ancestry is beating Living DNA at the British Isles game at the moment for Irish individuals. That shouldn't happen!

Living DNA, if you're reading, update your darn Ireland region! You really need to throw some more samples into that category, and we know that you have collected those!

Robert1
08-27-2017, 09:48 PM
Yes! As Sir Paul says, Give Ireland Back To The Irish! I want my missing 10% Irish.

Oh well, I already know about that and my missing 5% German/Dutch, otherwise Living DNA has truly helped me sort out my UK roots.

AntG
08-30-2017, 09:16 AM
They may be looking to license the Irish Atlas DNA data too, so this may be a factor? If it is a case of developer time availability, I'd personally rather they'd focus on launching their DNA Matching...

MacUalraig
08-30-2017, 11:44 AM
Yes! As Sir Paul says, Give Ireland Back To The Irish! I want my missing 10% Irish.

Wasn't he the geezer who sang 'Mull of Kintyre'? ;-)

cilldara
09-14-2017, 08:25 AM
Has anyone who's uploaded their data (and have not paid for the test) to the Living DNA 'Irish DNA Research Project' received any results?

Jessie
09-15-2017, 03:31 AM
Has anyone who's uploaded their data (and have not paid for the test) to the Living DNA 'Irish DNA Research Project' received any results?

I uploaded my mother's results but haven't heard anything. I might contact them.

chelle
09-21-2017, 09:38 AM
I uploaded my mother's results but haven't heard anything. I might contact them.

Have you heard anything back yet? I am curious to start seeing the results.

Jessie
09-24-2017, 01:00 AM
Have you heard anything back yet? I am curious to start seeing the results.

Sorry chelle no I haven't. I'll have another go at contacting them.

Jessie
10-05-2017, 11:06 AM
This is the reply I got from LivingDNA re my mother's sample.

Thank you for your interest in the Irish DNA Research Project by Living DNA and filling in our online survey. As all 4 of your grandparents were born in a 80 km radius within Ireland you qualify to take part in our groundbreaking research.

We will continue to review your information as we continue our research. Once our research is completed, we will contact you in the new year regarding your results.

Thank you very much for your patience as we continue with our groundbreaking research project.

Many thanks,

I'll post once I get any further information.

MacEochaidh
10-22-2017, 10:23 PM
I just heard on a Genetic Genealogy Ireland video that LivingDna is now taking Irish transfers for free from FTDNA and "other companies". This will help build their Irish database. Pass it on.... could help!

ollie444
10-23-2017, 10:50 AM
I just heard on a Genetic Genealogy Ireland video that LivingDna is now taking Irish transfers for free from FTDNA and "other companies". This will help build their Irish database. Pass it on.... could help!

As long as it doesn't compromise the quality...

Nqp15hhu
11-11-2017, 03:36 AM
How do I transfer my dna?

slievenamon
11-11-2017, 07:47 AM
How do I transfer my dna?

www.livingdna.com Scroll down to One Family One World Project. There's an application. Results will be available mid 2018.

FionnSneachta
02-20-2018, 11:13 PM
It sounds like the prediction of early to mid 2018 has changed. In response to a tweet asking about the Irish Research project Living DNA said, 'We're still currently collecting some more samples for this! Hopefully, the project will be launched by the end of the year!'
https://twitter.com/Living_DNA/status/964178399861362689

I'm not expecting anything any time soon if that's the case. The way it's phrased makes it sound like it could be released in 2019 even. It won't stop me logging in everyday hoping for an update though!

timberwolf
02-20-2018, 11:21 PM
Well considering that its original launch date was something like April last year, I would not place, any worth on anything that this company says.

I have asked multiple times for my uploaded data to be removed from their one world project , it never happened.

It would not surprise me if the Irish update and the other related one world regional projects do not happen until 2020-21, if at all.

greerpalmer
02-21-2018, 08:24 PM
Since Irish results are so intertwined with English and Scottish anyone have any thoughts about whether the results from the Scottish Project will be released along side the Irish project?

Capitalis
02-23-2018, 04:19 PM
Well considering that its original launch date was something like April last year, I would not place, any worth on anything that this company says.

I have asked multiple times for my uploaded data to be removed from their one world project , it never happened.

It would not surprise me if the Irish update and the other related one world regional projects do not happen until 2020-21, if at all.

On their website 'One World' is described as a five year project dependant on reaching a critical number of samples for each region, so starting in late 2017 would mean completion in late 2022. So you're almost right!

fostert
02-24-2018, 07:51 PM
It sounds like the prediction of early to mid 2018 has changed. In response to a tweet asking about the Irish Research project Living DNA said, 'We're still currently collecting some more samples for this! Hopefully, the project will be launched by the end of the year!'
https://twitter.com/Living_DNA/status/964178399861362689

I'm not expecting anything any time soon if that's the case. The way it's phrased makes it sound like it could be released in 2019 even. It won't stop me logging in everyday hoping for an update though!

Me too - despite the delays, I think LivingDNA are doing a fantastic service for the money....their biogeographical analysis is right up there with 23andme (10,000 people in reference panel; tops in my book), and leaves AncestryDNA far, far behind with its woefully inadequate panel of <3000 people. That said though, Ancestry does have Genetic Communities going for it, which are eerily correct for almost everyone I have heard from. I wonder if Living will ever be able to compete with these with its fine-scale BG population studies? Also, it would be nice to see Living sharpen up their non-european components.

timberwolf
02-24-2018, 08:26 PM
On their website 'One World' is described as a five year project dependant on reaching a critical number of samples for each region, so starting in late 2017 would mean completion in late 2022. So you're almost right!

The Irish update was originally slated for the end of March, then June last year. That did not happen. They also said that they would have a matching system for those who had had already tested with them at the end of last year.

My suggestion would be, don't take, their stated time frames too seriously, and wait and see what happens.

fostert
02-25-2018, 04:50 AM
For interests sake here, I refer to Leah Larkin's Blog at thednageek.com. It refers to LivingDNAs project to provide a finer regional breakdown for both Germany and Ireland, though at the recent i4GG conference in December the company did not say when this will happen. However, Living are working hard on other things too - I quote here from that blog:

"Living DNA does not currently offer relative matching. That feature will be rolled out in a private beta test soon. Paying customers are expected to receive the matching feature early in 2018, with transfer customers gaining access in mid-2018. Initially, matching will be autosomal only, although Living DNA is considering yDNA and mtDNA matching at a later date. Katie Welka did not say how large their database is at the moment.

Hardcore genetic genealogists will be pleased to hear that Living DNA has a chromosome browser in the works. Not only that, it will include regional painting, so you can see which segments of DNA you inherited from which regions of the world. I am very excited about that!

Finally, the company is working to incorporate family trees into their system. They have not yet decided whether this will take the form of links to family trees hosted elsewhere on the internet or trees that are integrated within their system."

timberwolf
02-25-2018, 05:01 AM
For interests sake here, I refer to Leah Larkin's Blog at thednageek.com. It refers to LivingDNAs project to provide a finer regional breakdown for both Germany and Ireland, though at the recent i4GG conference in December the company did not say when this will happen. However, Living are working hard on other things too - I quote here from that blog:

"Living DNA does not currently offer relative matching. That feature will be rolled out in a private beta test soon. Paying customers are expected to receive the matching feature early in 2018, with transfer customers gaining access in mid-2018. Initially, matching will be autosomal only, although Living DNA is considering yDNA and mtDNA matching at a later date. Katie Welka did not say how large their database is at the moment.

Hardcore genetic genealogists will be pleased to hear that Living DNA has a chromosome browser in the works. Not only that, it will include regional painting, so you can see which segments of DNA you inherited from which regions of the world. I am very excited about that!

Finally, the company is working to incorporate family trees into their system. They have not yet decided whether this will take the form of links to family trees hosted elsewhere on the internet or trees that are integrated within their system."

Thanks for the link.

Hopefully this will be soon.

AntG
02-28-2018, 08:27 PM
Interesting news released at Rootstech about DNA matching (Family Networks)...
http://www.geneamusings.com/2018/02/living-dna-previews-new-family-networks.html

02-28-2018, 08:56 PM
Interesting news released at Rootstech about DNA matching (Family Networks)...
http://www.geneamusings.com/2018/02/living-dna-previews-new-family-networks.html

Wow, looks interesting

timberwolf
02-28-2018, 09:02 PM
Interesting news released at Rootstech about DNA matching (Family Networks)...
http://www.geneamusings.com/2018/02/living-dna-previews-new-family-networks.html

Potentially very exciting, also probably more useful then any other update.

I have come to the conclusion that is your matches that reflect truly your recent ancestry, not any ancestry estimate.

Lets hope it is as good as it sounds.

Thanks for posting that.

Fungene
02-28-2018, 10:29 PM
Potentially very exciting, also probably more useful then any other update.

I have come to the conclusion that is your matches that reflect truly your recent ancestry, not any ancestry estimate.

Lets hope it is as good as it sounds.

Thanks for posting that.

LivingDNA claims that Family Networks "will be able to find and connect people to DNA matches going back up to 13 generations."
Looking forward to that.

timberwolf
02-28-2018, 11:17 PM
LivingDNA claims that Family Networks "will be able to find and connect people to DNA matches going back up to 13 generations."
Looking forward to that.

Thirteen generations would take you back to about 1600 at a rough guess. Maybe 1550 is some cases.

As I said, this is potentially very exciting. I just hope it delivers what is promised.

timberwolf
03-01-2018, 02:04 AM
OK from horses mouth as they would say.

First roll out of DNA matching by the end of April.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qeAQ5waOKU4

The rest of it in Summer UK time.

AntG
03-01-2018, 09:14 AM
There is a short promo vid here on Family Networks: https://youtu.be/80btOTYEElY and a number of screenshots on their Press Release here: https://www.livingdna.com/en-gb/press-releases/305/living-dna-preview-unique-new-family-networks-capability-rootstech-2018

timberwolf
03-01-2018, 06:57 PM
There is a short promo vid here on Family Networks: https://youtu.be/80btOTYEElY and a number of screenshots on their Press Release here: https://www.livingdna.com/en-gb/press-releases/305/living-dna-preview-unique-new-family-networks-capability-rootstech-2018

Looks really good.

03-28-2018, 08:03 AM
I decided to ask the question again about when the new Irish data-sets will be integrated into our results. Here is LivingDNA's answer to my Tweet:-
22368

timberwolf
03-28-2018, 08:16 AM
I decided to ask the question again about when the new Irish data-sets will be integrated into our results. Here is LivingDNA's answer to my Tweet:-
22368

Could be quite awhile I'm afraid

MacEochaidh
03-28-2018, 08:49 PM
I decided to ask the question again about when the new Irish data-sets will be integrated into our results. Here is LivingDNA's answer to my Tweet:-
22368

Another question is why they ever produced a test with a "British Isles Focus" while having a ridiculously small Irish database. And, they continue to act as if Irish testers should test with them to find out their Irish ancestry. Why does Living DNA have such a small Irish database?

Capitalis
03-28-2018, 11:14 PM
Another question is why they ever produced a test with a "British Isles Focus" while having a ridiculously small Irish database. And, they continue to act as if Irish testers should test with them to find out their Irish ancestry. Why does Living DNA have such a small Irish database?

I can't offer a quote source but from memory I read somewhere that the POBI study didn't have the funding to cover Ireland, which given that many British peole have recent Irish ancestry is a weak excuse. Like you I also noticed that Living DNA twitter just offer stock replies to questions of missing Irish ancestry.

Jessie
03-29-2018, 07:58 AM
I can't offer a quote source but from memory I read somewhere that the POBI study didn't have the funding to cover Ireland, which given that many British peole have recent Irish ancestry is a weak excuse. Like you I also noticed that Living DNA twitter just offer stock replies to questions of missing Irish ancestry.

PoBI and LivingDNA are not the same thing even though LivingDNA now use the PoBI dataset. People of the British Isles (PoBI) did in fact have Irish samples and they were used in some of their initial results. They decided to not use Ireland in their final analysis because Ireland was "both a source and a sink" for the same type of ancestry. When Ireland was used initially e.g. places like the Highlands in Scotland ended up with over 63% Irish in their admixture so Ireland was masking the admixture from the continent.

Ireland was covered by the Irish DNA Atlas and the two studies are affiliated somewhat.

LivingDNA just don't have many Irish samples. From memory I think they only have 7 samples so it is no wonder that a lot of people aren't getting much Irish including fully Irish testers. :) They are presently doing their own study on Ireland.

MacEochaidh
03-29-2018, 02:19 PM
PoBI and LivingDNA are not the same thing even though LivingDNA now use the PoBI dataset. People of the British Isles (PoBI) did in fact have Irish samples and they were used in some of their initial results. They decided to not use Ireland in their final analysis because Ireland was "both a source and a sink" for the same type of ancestry. When Ireland was used initially e.g. places like the Highlands in Scotland ended up with over 63% Irish in their admixture so Ireland was masking the admixture from the continent.

Ireland was covered by the Irish DNA Atlas and the two studies are affiliated somewhat.

LivingDNA just don't have many Irish samples. From memory I think they only have 7 samples so it is no wonder that a lot of people aren't getting much Irish including fully Irish testers. :) They are presently doing their own study on Ireland.

Living DNA has the smallest Irish database simply because they do not care about Irish testers. Actually, Living DNA doesn't want to offend its "British testers" with nasty bits of Irish ancestry. Racism starts at home for Living DNA. Living DNA's "we are the world" campaign means "we are the world" except Ireland.

Jessie
03-29-2018, 03:22 PM
Living DNA has the smallest Irish database simply because they do not care about Irish testers. Actually, Living DNA doesn't want to offend its "British testers" with nasty bits of Irish ancestry. Racism starts at home for Living DNA. Living DNA's "we are the world" campaign means "we are the world" except Ireland.

They do have an Irish project though so are in the process of increasing their Irish database and want to break down Irish regions. I don't think they have any bias against the Irish. :)

Saetro
03-29-2018, 03:35 PM
Really? Then why have they had the smallest Irish database of all the large testing companies from their beginning? Why can't they identify Irish ancestry to the degree that FTDNA, AncestryDNA, 23andMe, MyHeritage, and others can? Why was Ireland left off of their "British Isles" testing from the start? Why do they now have to play catch-up? What was behind their decision to enter into the field with such a small Irish database? Please offer answers.

1) Ask them
2) From post #64 above, the flipside of Scots being told they are Irish is Irish being told they are Scots, and so on
3) Can you please tell me why you signed up for a service not understanding this?

I constantly advise people to read up on DNA testing and actively ask questions of the test labs before they spend their money, but they dive in regardless only to come back later and tell me it wasn't what they expected, and I could have shown them in the FAQs where their expectation was never going to be met.
I fail to understand this behaviour but I would like to advise people better, so I would appreciate an insight.

MacEochaidh
03-29-2018, 04:34 PM
They do have an Irish project though so are in the process of increasing their Irish database and want to break down Irish regions. I don't think they have any bias against the Irish. :)

Really? Then why have they had the smallest Irish database of all the large testing companies from their beginning? Why can't they identify Irish ancestry to the degree that FTDNA, AncestryDNA, 23andMe, MyHeritage, and others can? Why was Ireland left off of their "British Isles" testing from the start? Why do they now have to play catch-up? What was behind their decision to enter into the field with such a small Irish database? Please offer answers.

greerpalmer
03-29-2018, 07:03 PM
Really? Then why have they had the smallest Irish database of all the large testing companies from their beginning? Why can't they identify Irish ancestry to the degree that FTDNA, AncestryDNA, 23andMe, MyHeritage, and others can? Why was Ireland left off of their "British Isles" testing from the start? Why do they now have to play catch-up? What was behind their decision to enter into the field with such a small Irish database? Please offer answers.

Technically, FTDNA does not have Irish in their current results--they only have "British Isles" and they're notorious for poorly differentiating West/Central Europe and B.I. I've done the test twice, once I got 80% BI, 12%WCE and once 47% BI, 40%WCE.
AncestryDNA's results are equally as confusing by the way they clump Scottish and Welsh into Irish group. Based on my results I believe much of my Scottish is going to Scandinavian and my Cornish is going into Ireland/Scotland/Wales. Genetic communities is a unique and awesome tool but it has little to do with your ethnicity estimate. 23andMe just (re)launched a feature that tries to give some differentiation between Irish and British, I have not received this update, but I'm fairly confident being about 1/3 Irish, 1/8 Cornish and 1/8 Scottish I'll get dots for both without receiving a better understanding of how much of each. MyHeritage is good at identifying 100% Irish people as such, but is very inconsistent--my mother is almost half Irish and she receives zero, whereas my dad has 1 Irish line 4 generations up and he gets 20%.

A lot of the questions being asked go back to the fact that livingDNA is such a new service, and privately owned/financed--they do not profit over the genetic data they collect. Their global data sets come from some of the largest studies that have been done and are supplemented by their own. The POBI project was the first deep dive of its kind. A caveat to People of the British Isles project was participants data would not be licensed to any DNA testing services. Living DNA worked with a university to shadow the study as it was happening so it would have data it could use. In a similar fashion they're using other Universities as partners for deep dives elsewhere. The Irish DNA Atlas was the second study of its type, and sure enough livingDNA is close behind with a shadow study.

Saetro
03-29-2018, 09:34 PM
A caveat to People of the British Isles project was participants data would not be licensed to any DNA testing services. Living DNA worked with a university to shadow the study as it was happening so it would have data it could use. In a similar fashion they're using other Universities as partners for deep dives elsewhere. The Irish DNA Atlas was the second study of its type, and sure enough livingDNA is close behind with a shadow study.

By "shadow study" do you mean that separate permission was obtained from each individual to use their input by LivingDNA?
Or are you indicating some sort of legal loophole?

Jessie
03-30-2018, 01:23 AM
Really? Then why have they had the smallest Irish database of all the large testing companies from their beginning? Why can't they identify Irish ancestry to the degree that FTDNA, AncestryDNA, 23andMe, MyHeritage, and others can? Why was Ireland left off of their "British Isles" testing from the start? Why do they now have to play catch-up? What was behind their decision to enter into the field with such a small Irish database? Please offer answers.

Why don't you ask them? :) These are not questions I can answer. All I'm saying is that they are gathering an Irish database. I have got one of the highest Irish amounts on LivingDNA of Irish at 47% and my brother got 49% so they are picking up Irish but they are obviously missing a lot of Irish as well. The rest of my results went mostly into Northwest Scotland and then to other British areas. Brother also got Northwest Scotland, small amount of Southwest Scotland and a reasonable amount of Scandinavian.

sktibo
03-30-2018, 01:38 AM
My opinion on the topic of Living DNA and their Irish regions is that I think they're trying to take their time, gather their data, and release it all once they think they have a really great analysis of the island ready to go. While normally I think this is the best way to go, in this case I don't think it is. I know they've already collected a good number of samples for Ireland and I don't think it would take much to organize those samples into simple categories such as Connacht, Munster, Leinster, and Ulster. Heck, even just adding samples into the generic Ireland category would be huge for many people who take their test and get a far too low Ireland percentage. They can always re-run / update test results after they have their more complex regional analysis of Ireland completed later on, my test has been re-run twice so far and there hasn't been any updates to the reference populations.
Genealogy is very popular both with European descended North Americans (trying to find one of us without any Scottish or Irish ancestry at all is a rare thing.. and more often than not we are most attached to these parts of our heritage) and with the Irish themselves, so this category is so essential to what I suspect is a large part if not most of their customer base.

MacEochaidh
03-30-2018, 04:28 PM
1) Ask them
2) From post #64 above, the flipside of Scots being told they are Irish is Irish being told they are Scots, and so on
3) Can you please tell me why you signed up for a service not understanding this?

I constantly advise people to read up on DNA testing and actively ask questions of the test labs before they spend their money, but they dive in regardless only to come back later and tell me it wasn't what they expected, and I could have shown them in the FAQs where their expectation was never going to be met.
I fail to understand this behaviour but I would like to advise people better, so I would appreciate an insight.

I signed up because I was lied to.

greerpalmer
03-30-2018, 06:31 PM
By "shadow study" do you mean that separate permission was obtained from each individual to use their input by LivingDNA?
Or are you indicating some sort of legal loophole?

Sorry I mean they're repeating the study with similar parameters--following close behind like a shadow, not shadow in the "shady" sense. Hints the solicitation for volunteers. I'm honestly not aware on how the Irish Atlas recruited data sources.

Saetro
03-31-2018, 01:29 AM
I signed up because I was lied to.

Probably not applicable to general advertising but here is a real case.
One of my friends who signed up for ethnicity results at another of the test labs asked before testing whether a particularly rare ethnicity was covered.
It was their sole reason for testing. They were told it was included.
Once the results arrived it was evident they were misinformed.
Faced with the evidence of misinformation, the lab refunded the test cost.