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View Full Version : Does Ancestry use DNA or Trees to form your Communities?



McGowan
10-07-2017, 08:42 PM
Just wondering? I have seen indication one way or the other on blogs, etc. and even with family members.

Amerijoe
10-07-2017, 09:04 PM
Being a member of FTDNA's Adopted Project, I would definitely go with DNA.

greerpalmer
10-09-2017, 04:50 PM
Just wondering? I have seen indication one way or the other on blogs, etc. and even with family members.

Supposedly it uses a combination of trees and DNA to form genetic communities. I've been curious because my community (Ulster Irish/North Midlands) would definitely be more indicative of DNA. My tree is rich in colonial American (Jamestown/Virginia trading company, Early MD, Mayflower, Dutch PA) and Palatinate/Bavarian/Swiss back hundreds of years but my Irish lines only go back a few generations.

AntG
10-19-2017, 06:39 PM
Your allocation to an existing Genetic Community is purely based on your DNA (and matching to others in those GCs) and not based on your tree.

That said, when Ancestry identify new clusters and thus a new Genetic Community, they do review trees of those in that cluster to help form a name for it...

LarryMc
12-30-2017, 11:11 PM
Looks to me like heavier emphasis on trees!!

Kathlingram
01-01-2018, 04:59 PM
I have 556 Welsh cousin matches to North Wales.. not one is in a tree..
Mike Mulligan at AncestryDNA said that certain areas do get looked at.. I have 664 DNA matches for Donegal East and have one known great grandmother from there.. It is a Gaeltacht area which remains inbred.. I do have a Tyrone ancestral 2nd great couple ( Sweeney) who may overlap there..
The North Wales specifically Caernarvonshire was a mystery to me but I am forced to consider that as a source for my father's bio father ( was supposed to be his stepfather or an uncle) Very early on at 23andme I got Wales matches which I blew off

RobinBMc
01-02-2018, 04:37 PM
Looks to me like heavier emphasis on trees!!

They have to use the trees to determine shared ancestral locations to create the Genetic Communities but that doesn't mean there's a heavier emphasis on trees. Equally, without the DNA, there would be no Genetic Communities. Essentially, what they do is take a group of people who share DNA and look for common ancestral locations among them. This wouldn't be possible without either the DNA or the trees. Once a GC is established, they can provide GCs for people who don't even have trees (if you share DNA with a certain GC, it will show up, tree or no tree) so if anything, there is more emphasis on the DNA than the trees.

Sizzles
04-19-2018, 07:27 PM
I expected to see communities such as pa german dutch and Irish as my relatives are all settlers of the early 1800s and some in the 1700s. All settled in Ohio, western pa and wva. I also have extensive family tree on line and my ancestry DNA results showed no German only 1% western european and only 5% Irish however 24% great Britain. My ancestry dna results 36% Sicilian and 26% east Europe includes north Italy, Croatia,Bosnia, 24% great Britain, 5% Irish, 1% Scandinavian, 2 % middle east , 4% caucasas, 1% Africa north

selectivememri
04-19-2018, 11:24 PM
i have no family tree info filled out and it assigned me a genetic community, likewise with my mom, who has the same community as me + an additional one neither i nor her mother have, so i assume it was able to infer some kind of connection from her father's side.

Saetro
04-19-2018, 11:54 PM
I expected to see communities such as pa german dutch and Irish as my relatives are all settlers of the early 1800s and some in the 1700s. All settled in Ohio, western pa and wva. I also have extensive family tree on line and my ancestry DNA results showed no German only 1% western european and only 5% Irish however 24% great Britain. My ancestry dna results 36% Sicilian and 26% east Europe includes north Italy, Croatia,Bosnia, 24% great Britain, 5% Irish, 1% Scandinavian, 2 % middle east , 4% caucasas, 1% Africa north

Why?
Does the test lab you used offer pa german dutch as an ethnic category?

If you know where your great grandparents came from, you are already ahead of nearly all of the test labs in specificity.
If you can trace your great great grandparents back to Europe and specific regions within European countries, you are way ahead of what they can do.
You do understand that much of the time they confuse Scandinavian with British and German?
And Iberian/Sicilian with some Celtic?

Half of my ancestry is German. AncestryDNA has some wonderful maps of where your ancestors came from, but this comes from other DNA subscribers.
AncestryDNA does not sell in Germany. That part of my map is entirely blank on their emigration maps.
And the one for English seems to have been blinded by their subscribers from London.
None of my people are from London or Kent or Surrey or Sussex, but that is where the migration diagrams say most of them came from.

Sizzles
04-20-2018, 09:51 AM
I have traced back to 8th and 9th great grandparents in Germany. They are from the Baden area. Gencove picked up on my German roots It appears as follows.

Gencove
31% east Mediterranean sicily
29% northern & central Europe British, Irish and German
18% northern Italy Tuscan
12% Scandinavian
4% British isles
3% findland
3% northeast Europe

My mothers side is German, Irish and Sicilian. As I mentioned her German ancestors back to 8th and 9th. My Irish roots back to my 6th great grandparents. I know where in ireland they came from too. My Sicilian roots stop with my great grandparents who I did not know. They immigrated here in early 1900s.
My maternal grandmother's maiden name was Holsinger. Her mothers maiden name McKenna.

RobinBMc
04-20-2018, 10:06 PM
Why?

Probably because there's a lot of endogamy among the PA Dutch/German.


Does the test lab you used offer pa german dutch as an ethnic category?

According to this list here: https://thegeneticgenealogist.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/AncestryDNA_Genetic_Communities.pdf - AncestryDNA does have a Genetic Community for "Settlers of Pennsylvania Dutch Country". It doesn't really have anything to do with the lab - the lab just provides the raw DNA data, it's AncestyDNA who do the analyses on it.


If you know where your great grandparents came from, you are already ahead of nearly all of the test labs in specificity.
If you can trace your great great grandparents back to Europe and specific regions within European countries, you are way ahead of what they can do.
You do understand that much of the time they confuse Scandinavian with British and German?
And Iberian/Sicilian with some Celtic?

Genetic Communities are different - they are more specific and by all reports, very accurate, but there is no assurance of getting a GC even if you have known ancestry in those groups. I have PA Dutch ancestry, but no GC in that group.

kostoffj
04-21-2018, 05:44 AM
Probably because there's a lot of endogamy among the PA Dutch/German.

I am sure that is it - Penna Germans have been there for a long time, I have ancestors who are Pennsylvania Germans and all of them immigrated in the early 18th century, just about 300 years ago/ 10 generations ago and while the names have remained in some lines they are all admixed. I am not sure what the threshold is to get a positive result for Settlers of Pennsylvania Dutch Country but with the amount of admixture I can see a lot of people with some of that ancestry not being identified in that group. I am not a member at any rate. However, I also have a lot more recent German ancestry, but from Ohio, Missouri and Illinois, and who emigrated less than 150 years ago, and I am identified in the GC "Germany and the Midwestern United States." However, that particular group has 7 sub-groups, that are very specific about the regions in Germany the Midwestern immigrants came from, and I am not in any of those. All of my ancestors from that bunch come from a variety of regions (Pfalz, Hesse, Westfalen) so not enough of a signal to make a clear ID for any of the subgroups, it seems to me.

Also sometimes one's genes might be telling a different story than one thinks. I have fairly recent and (I thought) significant Irish ancestry yet I don't come up in any of those groups. Well, in the meantime since the debut of the GCs, further research by me revealed there was a non-paternal event in my family on that side a couple of generations ago so a presumed Irish ancestor was not my ancestor and a mystery person is instead (from Netherlands it appears). It may be that some people who are sure they should be in a particular GC might not have the actual ancestry their pedigree claims.

RobinBMc
04-21-2018, 03:45 PM
My Mennonite ancestors remained Mennonite, marrying within their small group from their arrival at the founding of Germantown, Philadelphia to the late 19th century. It was my 2nd great grandfather who broke away from the Mennonites, my mom's great grandfather, yet even she does not have a match to the PA Dutch County Genetic Community. Whenever I have a DNA match from my Mennonite branch, we almost always inevitably share more than one set of ancestors. There's a ridiculous amount of endogamy.

Even more recent - my grandmother was Italian, but I don't have a GC for anywhere in Italy. My half Italian dad does, but I don't. I think you need to have a LOT of DNA matching a GC for one to show up. I do have a "Pennsylvania Settlers" GC but I have colonial PA ancestry on both my mom's and dad's side so I guess it adds up.

ianz91
04-24-2018, 11:22 PM
I am sure that is it - Penna Germans have been there for a long time, I have ancestors who are Pennsylvania Germans and all of them immigrated in the early 18th century, just about 300 years ago/ 10 generations ago and while the names have remained in some lines they are all admixed. I am not sure what the threshold is to get a positive result for Settlers of Pennsylvania Dutch Country but with the amount of admixture I can see a lot of people with some of that ancestry not being identified in that group. I am not a member at any rate. However, I also have a lot more recent German ancestry, but from Ohio, Missouri and Illinois, and who emigrated less than 150 years ago, and I am identified in the GC "Germany and the Midwestern United States." However, that particular group has 7 sub-groups, that are very specific about the regions in Germany the Midwestern immigrants came from, and I am not in any of those. All of my ancestors from that bunch come from a variety of regions (Pfalz, Hesse, Westfalen) so not enough of a signal to make a clear ID for any of the subgroups, it seems to me.

Also sometimes one's genes might be telling a different story than one thinks. I have fairly recent and (I thought) significant Irish ancestry yet I don't come up in any of those groups. Well, in the meantime since the debut of the GCs, further research by me revealed there was a non-paternal event in my family on that side a couple of generations ago so a presumed Irish ancestor was not my ancestor and a mystery person is instead (from Netherlands it appears). It may be that some people who are sure they should be in a particular GC might not have the actual ancestry their pedigree claims.


My German ancestors (Eisenhart) settled in the Lehigh valley region of Pennsylvania during the 1700s, they came from Dachtel, a small village located in southwestern Germany :)