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View Full Version : Morley predictor from Ancestry DNA R1B-U106 /Z8(s515) / Z346(s512) + possible K-M9?



jselwa
11-27-2017, 07:10 PM
I'm a little new at this. I plugged my father's DNA into Morley's Y-DNA Haplogroup predictor, and it came back with most likely subclade predictor as R1B-Z346/S512. Underneath that, second choice was R1B-Z8/S515. I figured with the strong predictor followed up with Promethease that he's definitely in the R1B group, most likely M405/U106. However, I don't know what to make of these subclades because when I click on the second choice of Z8, it shows two negatives under that expanded screen, so I don't know if the first choice of Z346 is valid or a false positive. Also, the predictor came back with a K-M9 and I read that this is a very ancient haplogroup not commonly found. Is this a false positive as well (due to the likelihood that group I1-L64 that is very apparently negative)?

I know this is just a basic estimator but I'd like to know what the next step I should take. I've been stuck on my maiden name (dad's surname) ancestry for years and cannot document before 1820 in Lancaster, PA and have found several different variant spellings of the name. From some research and feedback, we presume it's German, but so unusual that I don't know if spending the money for a Y-DNA test will open up any answers for me.

Any assistance is appreciated. I have copied dad's Morley predictor results below for the Z346, Z8, and K-M9. Colors of red noted where uptakes results are and remainder is green or not tested. *** Highlighted prediction per Morley. Posted breakdowns are from the ISOGG tree. (The experimental tree gives me the following predictions):

(most likely) R1b1a2a1a1c2b2a1a2b
R1b-Z346

R1b1a2a1a1
R1b-M405

R1b1a2a
R1b-L150 (R1b-L23, R1b-L49)

R1b1a2a1a1c2b2a1a
R1b-Z24 (R1b-Z20, R1b-Z23)

R1b1a2a1a2b1a1~3
R1b-CTS358 (R1b-CTS7275, R1b-CTS8127)

Z346

Root (Y-Adam) ROOT (Y-ADAM)
A0-T AF3, L1085, L1089, L1090, L1093, L1095, L1098, L1099, L1101, L1105, L1116, L1118, L1120, L1121, L1123, L1124, L1125, L1127, L1128, L1129, L1130, L1132, L1135, L1136, L1137, L1142, L1143, L1145, L1150, L1155, L1235
A1 L985, L986, L989, L1002, L1003, L1004, L1005, L1009, L1013, L1053, L1084, L1112, L1153, P305, V161R, V168, V171, V174, V238, V241, V250
A1b P108, V221
BT L413/PF1409/V31, L418, L438, L440, L604/PF1243, L957, L962, L969, L970/PF1065, L971, L977, L1060/PF1021, L1061/PF1101, L1062/PF302, M42, M91, M94/PF1081, M139, M299, P97, PK1, PAGE65/SRY1532/SRY10831R, PF1407/V29, PF1411/V59, PF1412/V64, PF1406/V102, V187, PF1403, V202, PF1410/V235
CT M168/PF1416, M294, P9R
CF P143
F L132R, M89/PF2746, M213/P137/PAGE38, M235/PAGE80/PF2665, PF2704/P14, P133, P134, PF2741/P135, PF2762/P136, PF2655/P138, P139, P140, PF2602/P141, P142, PF2617/P145, PF2623/P146, PF2734/P148, P149, PF2625/P151, P157, PF2706/P158, PF2717/P159, PF2618/P160, P161, P163, PF2702/P166, PF2632/P187, P316
IJK M523/L15/PF3492/S137, M522/L16/PF3493/S138, L69/S163
K M9, PF5504/P128, PF5493/P131, PF5480/P132
K(xLT) M526/PF5979
P 92R7R, L138, L268, L405, L471/PF5989, L536/PF5860, L721/PF6020, L741, L768/PF5976/YSC0000274, L779/PF5907/YSC0000251, L781/PF5875/YSC0000255, M45/PF5962, M74/N12, P207/P27, P69, PF5879/P226, PF5927/P228, PF5925/P230, PF5946/P235, PF5873/P237, P239, PF5897/P240, PF5874/P243, P244, PF5941/P281, PF5932/P282, PF5966/P283, P284, PF5866/P295/S8, PAGE83, V231
R M207/PAGE37/PF6038/UTY2, P224, P227, PF6019/P229, P232, PF6068/P280, PF6059/P285, S4, S9
R1 M173/P241/PAGE29, M306/S1, PF6128/P225, P231, PF6142/P233, P234, PF6137/P236, PF6115/P328, PF6113/P242, PF6117/P245, PF6136/P286, P294
R1b M343/PF6242
R1b1 L278, M415/PF6251, P25R
R1b1a PF6398/P297, L320
R1b1a2 L265/PF6431, M269, M520, PF6485/S3, PF6399/S10, S13, S17
R1b1a2a L23/PF6534/S141, L49/S349R, L150/PF6274R
R1b1a2a1 M412/L51/PF6536/S167
R1b1a2a1a L11/PF6539/S127, L52/PF6541, L151/PF6542, PF6546/P310/S129, P311/S128
R1b1a2a1a1 M405/S21/U106
R1b1a2a1a1c Z381/S263
R1b1a2a1a1c2 Z301
R1b1a2a1a1c2b L48/S162
R1b1a2a1a1c2b2 Z9/S268, Z10
R1b1a2a1a1c2b2a Z2
R1b1a2a1a1c2b2a1 Z7/S272
R1b1a2a1a1c2b2a1a Z5, Z8/S515
R1b1a2a1a1c2b2a1a2 Z1
R1b1a2a1a1c2b2a1a2a Z6/S276
R1b1a2a1a1c2b2a1a2b Z346/S512 ***
R1b1a2a1a1c2b2a1a2b1 Z343/S387

Z8

Root (Y-Adam) ROOT (Y-ADAM)
A0-T AF3, L1085, L1089, L1090, L1093, L1095, L1098, L1099, L1101, L1105, L1116, L1118, L1120, L1121, L1123, L1124, L1125, L1127, L1128, L1129, L1130, L1132, L1135, L1136, L1137, L1142, L1143, L1145, L1150, L1155, L1235
A1 L985, L986, L989, L1002, L1003, L1004, L1005, L1009, L1013, L1053, L1084, L1112, L1153, P305, V161R, V168, V171, V174, V238, V241, V250
A1b P108, V221
BT L413/PF1409/V31, L418, L438, L440, L604/PF1243, L957, L962, L969, L970/PF1065, L971, L977, L1060/PF1021, L1061/PF1101, L1062/PF302, M42, M91, M94/PF1081, M139, M299, P97, PK1, PAGE65/SRY1532/SRY10831R, PF1407/V29, PF1411/V59, PF1412/V64, PF1406/V102, V187, PF1403, V202, PF1410/V235
CT M168/PF1416, M294, P9R
CF P143
F L132R, M89/PF2746, M213/P137/PAGE38, M235/PAGE80/PF2665, PF2704/P14, P133, P134, PF2741/P135, PF2762/P136, PF2655/P138, P139, P140, PF2602/P141, P142, PF2617/P145, PF2623/P146, PF2734/P148, P149, PF2625/P151, P157, PF2706/P158, PF2717/P159, PF2618/P160, P161, P163, PF2702/P166, PF2632/P187, P316
IJK M523/L15/PF3492/S137, M522/L16/PF3493/S138, L69/S163
K M9, PF5504/P128, PF5493/P131, PF5480/P132
K(xLT) M526/PF5979
P 92R7R, L138, L268, L405, L471/PF5989, L536/PF5860, L721/PF6020, L741, L768/PF5976/YSC0000274, L779/PF5907/YSC0000251, L781/PF5875/YSC0000255, M45/PF5962, M74/N12, P207/P27, P69, PF5879/P226, PF5927/P228, PF5925/P230, PF5946/P235, PF5873/P237, P239, PF5897/P240, PF5874/P243, P244, PF5941/P281, PF5932/P282, PF5966/P283, P284, PF5866/P295/S8, PAGE83, V231
R M207/PAGE37/PF6038/UTY2, P224, P227, PF6019/P229, P232, PF6068/P280, PF6059/P285, S4, S9
R1 M173/P241/PAGE29, M306/S1, PF6128/P225, P231, PF6142/P233, P234, PF6137/P236, PF6115/P328, PF6113/P242, PF6117/P245, PF6136/P286, P294
R1b M343/PF6242
R1b1 L278, M415/PF6251, P25R
R1b1a PF6398/P297, L320
R1b1a2 L265/PF6431, M269, M520, PF6485/S3, PF6399/S10, S13, S17
R1b1a2a L23/PF6534/S141, L49/S349R, L150/PF6274R
R1b1a2a1 M412/L51/PF6536/S167
R1b1a2a1a L11/PF6539/S127, L52/PF6541, L151/PF6542, PF6546/P310/S129, P311/S128
R1b1a2a1a1 M405/S21/U106
R1b1a2a1a1c Z381/S263
R1b1a2a1a1c2 Z301
R1b1a2a1a1c2b L48/S162
R1b1a2a1a1c2b2 Z9/S268, Z10
R1b1a2a1a1c2b2a Z2
R1b1a2a1a1c2b2a1 Z7/S272
R1b1a2a1a1c2b2a1a Z5, Z8/S515 ***
R1b1a2a1a1c2b2a1a1 Z11/S274
R1b1a2a1a1c2b2a1a1a Z12/S385
R1b1a2a1a1c2b2a1a2 Z1
R1b1a2a1a1c2b2a1a2a Z6/S276
R1b1a2a1a1c2b2a1a2b Z346/S512
R1b1a2a1a1c2b2a1a3 M365R

GROUP K

Root (Y-Adam) ROOT (Y-ADAM)
A0-T AF3, L1085, L1089, L1090, L1093, L1095, L1098, L1099, L1101, L1105, L1116, L1118, L1120, L1121, L1123, L1124, L1125, L1127, L1128, L1129, L1130, L1132, L1135, L1136, L1137, L1142, L1143, L1145, L1150, L1155, L1235
A1 L985, L986, L989, L1002, L1003, L1004, L1005, L1009, L1013, L1053, L1084, L1112, L1153, P305, V161R, V168, V171, V174, V238, V241, V250
A1b P108, V221
BT L413/PF1409/V31, L418, L438, L440, L604/PF1243, L957, L962, L969, L970/PF1065, L971, L977, L1060/PF1021, L1061/PF1101, L1062/PF302, M42, M91, M94/PF1081, M139, M299, P97, PK1, PAGE65/SRY1532/SRY10831R, PF1407/V29, PF1411/V59, PF1412/V64, PF1406/V102, V187, PF1403, V202, PF1410/V235
CT M168/PF1416, M294, P9R
CF P143
F L132R, M89/PF2746, M213/P137/PAGE38, M235/PAGE80/PF2665, PF2704/P14, P133, P134, PF2741/P135, PF2762/P136, PF2655/P138, P139, P140, PF2602/P141, P142, PF2617/P145, PF2623/P146, PF2734/P148, P149, PF2625/P151, P157, PF2706/P158, PF2717/P159, PF2618/P160, P161, P163, PF2702/P166, PF2632/P187, P316
IJK M523/L15/PF3492/S137, M522/L16/PF3493/S138, L69/S163
IJ M429/P125, PF3554/P123, PF3553/P124, PF3558/P126, PF3526/P127, P129, PF3525/P130/S22, S2
I L41/PF3787, M170/PF3715, M258/PF3721, P19R, P38, P212, U179
I1 L64, L75, L80, L81, L118, L121/S62, L123, L124/S64, L125/S65, L157R, L186, L187, L840, M253, M307/P203R, M450/S109, P30, P40, S63, S66, S107, S108, S110, S111
I2 L68/S329, PF3781, M438/P215/PF3853/S31
J 12F2R, L134/PF4539, M304/PAGE16/PF4609, PF4584/P209, L60/S6, S34, S35
J1 L255, L321/PF4646, M267/PF4782
J2 M172/PAGE28/PF4908, L228/PF4895/S321
K M9, PF5504/P128, PF5493/P131, PF5480/P132 ***
LT L298/P326, L811
L L855, L863, L878, L879, M11, M20/PF5570, M61/PAGE43, M185/PF5755
T L206, L445, L452, L455/PF5670, L810, M184/PAGE34/USP9Y+3178, M193, M272/PF5667, PAGE129, PR4091
K(xLT) M526/PF5979
K1 P60, P304, P308
K2 P79, P299, P307
K3 P261, P263
M P256, PAGE93/S322
NO M214/PAGE39, P188, P192, P193, P194, P195
P 92R7R, L138, L268, L405, L471/PF5989, L536/PF5860, L721/PF6020, L741, L768/PF5976/YSC0000274, L779/PF5907/YSC0000251, L781/PF5875/YSC0000255, M45/PF5962, M74/N12, P207/P27, P69, PF5879/P226, PF5927/P228, PF5925/P230, PF5946/P235, PF5873/P237, P239, PF5897/P240, PF5874/P243, P244, PF5941/P281, PF5932/P282, PF5966/P283, P284, PF5866/P295/S8, PAGE83, V231
S M230, P202, P204

Wing Genealogist
11-27-2017, 10:10 PM
First of all, what test was you using (23andMe, Genographic Project, FTDNA, or what)? Each company has their own strengths/weaknesses.

The R-U106 Haplogroup team has posted a Google Document showing the U106 tree at:
Published read-only link (Google account not required): https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/e/2PACX-1vQhEo8_IfiZjGP_WLl01aL1IV939Drm26HIMb20mQE16mFBbk FO72xCn2mEa3Argekny5MGrbIQZXLU/pubhtml
Shared read-only link (Google account not required, allows downloads): https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1rpJP0Bt4qUQb9wWBFA7i1tLPV75ie_qS0iplwvvlVmQ/edit?usp=sharing


I help maintain this tree along with the other members of the admin team. I note some of the formatting appears wonky, but I am unsure why it is so. I would be happy to answer any questions you may have to the best of my ability.

If your father had any Y-STR testing, the Z8 STR haplotype is fairly distinctive at 37 STRs and beyond. Ideally, we would like to see at least 67 STRs, as one of the STRs in the 38-67 panel (DYS392) is a fairly reliable indicator of U106+ (392=13) or U106- (392=12).

The U106 group does have a discussion forum. It is currently hosted by Yahoo Groups, but recently there have been some major issues with Yahoo Groups in general, which is of real concern. I can proide you with more information if you are interested.

jselwa
11-27-2017, 11:01 PM
First of all, what test was you using (23andMe, Genographic Project, FTDNA, or what)? Each company has their own strengths/weaknesses.

I used Ancestry Autosomal DNA with the Morley Y-DNA Haplogroup predictor. Google for link.



I help maintain this tree along with the other members of the admin team. I note some of the formatting appears wonky, but I am unsure why it is so. I would be happy to answer any questions you may have to the best of my ability.

If your father had any Y-STR testing, the Z8 STR haplotype is fairly distinctive at 37 STRs and beyond. Ideally, we would like to see at least 67 STRs, as one of the STRs in the 38-67 panel (DYS392) is a fairly reliable indicator of U106+ (392=13) or U106- (392=12).

The U106 group does have a discussion forum. It is currently hosted by Yahoo Groups, but recently there have been some major issues with Yahoo Groups in general, which is of real concern. I can proide you with more information if you are interested.

Thank you, I will be sure to check these resources out!

projectuk
01-25-2018, 10:07 PM
I think I may be a little newer to this than you! Like yourself I am looking for confirmation of a fathers surname/paternal line.
I have just visited Morley Dna and have the exact predictions as yours above.
Is this normal....totally new to this!
(most likely) R1b1a2a1a1c2b2a1a2b
R1b-Z346

R1b1a2a1a1
R1b-M405

R1b1a2a
R1b-L150 (R1b-L23, R1b-L49)

R1b1a2a1a1c2b2a1a
R1b-Z24 (R1b-Z20, R1b-Z23)

R1b1a2a1a2b1a1~3
R1b-CTS358 (R1b-CTS7275, R1b-CTS8127)