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View Full Version : Some Punjabi Ramgarhia/Tarkhan results and Halogroups



MonkeyDLuffy
12-11-2017, 06:11 PM
I thought I should make a thread since lots of Tarkhan kits have started popping up on Gedmatch.

Mine (Punjabi Tarkhan, Nangal/hoshiyarpur)

1 Baloch 36.49
2 S-Indian 35.15
3 NE-Euro 12.79
4 Caucasian 10.81
5 Siberian 1.72
6 SW-Asian 0.82
7 Beringian 0.75
8 American 0.71
9 NE-Asian 0.62
10 Papuan 0.15

Rip Sohan (Punjabi Tarkhan, Ludhiana)

1 Baloch 40.64
2 S-Indian 31.82
3 Caucasian 12.49
4 NE-Euro 9
5 Mediterranean 1.71
6 SE-Asian 1.57
7 Beringian 1.14
8 American 0.79
9 SW-Asian 0.36
10 San 0.22
11 Papuan 0.17
12 W-African 0.05
13 NE-Asian 0.02
14 E-African 0.01


Punjabi Tarkhan: Amritsar

1 Baloch 38.16
2 S-Indian 32.89
3 NE-Euro 11.48
4 Caucasian 11.2
5 Siberian 1.8
6 NE-Asian 1.28
7 SW-Asian 1.05
8 American 0.94
9 Beringian 0.39
10 Mediterranean 0.32
11 SE-Asian 0.28
12 San 0.19

Punjabi Tarkhan : Amritsar/Jalandhar

1 Baloch 40.14
2 S-Indian 31.51
3 Caucasian 12.78
4 NE-Euro 10.13
5 NE-Asian 2.2
6 Mediterranean 0.99
7 W-African 0.71
8 SW-Asian 0.55
9 American 0.52
10 Beringian 0.26
11 E-African 0.17
12 San 0.04

Punjabi Tarkhan Amritsar/Jalandhar

1 Baloch 40.33
2 S-Indian 32.16
3 Caucasian 11.61
4 NE-Euro 8.62
5 NE-Asian 2.32
6 Mediterranean 1.87
7 Papuan 1.09
8 SW-Asian 1.05
9 Beringian 0.41
10 American 0.38
11 E-African 0.17
12 Siberian 0.01

Punjabi Tarkhan Ambala (Haryana)

1 Baloch 39.77
2 S-Indian 33.32
3 Caucasian 12.55
4 NE-Euro 7.94
5 Mediterranean 1.99
6 NE-Asian 1.44
7 SW-Asian 1.23
8 Beringian 0.84
9 American 0.77
10 San 0.15

Punjabi Tarkhan Hoshiyarpur

1 Baloch 38.67
2 S-Indian 33.1
3 NE-Euro 12.26
4 Caucasian 9.43
5 Mediterranean 1.72
6 American 1.6
7 Beringian 1.32
8 NE-Asian 0.94
9 SE-Asian 0.75
10 E-African 0.19



Some Y-Halogroups I gathered from my DNA relatives on 23andme:

J-M172 (Highest)
J-M241 (Second Highest)
R-M417(Third Highest)
R-M207
T-M70
R-L266
R-M479
C-M356

Xehanort
12-11-2017, 09:50 PM
Thanks for sharing bro, appreciate it! Have they done Davidski's latest test?

MonkeyDLuffy
12-11-2017, 11:51 PM
Thanks for sharing bro, appreciate it! Have they done Davidski's latest test?

Not that I know of, some of them I had to actually convince to upload data on gedmatch. Maybe some people don't want to go too deep like us.

Xehanort
12-12-2017, 12:03 AM
Not that I know of, some of them I had to actually convince to upload data on gedmatch. Maybe some people don't want to go too deep like us.

Alright, I understand. Thanks for letting me know. Have you done David's tests? Would you post your results? Thanks mate.

MonkeyDLuffy
12-12-2017, 12:14 AM
Alright, I understand. Thanks for letting me know. Have you done David's tests? Would you post your results? Thanks mate.

Which one?

Xehanort
12-12-2017, 12:22 AM
Which one?

Fst4 and Steppe EBA K7, here are my results:

David's fst4, for me:

Reference Populations:
Dai
Iran_N
Yamnaya_Samara

Results:
Dai: 0.182 (18.2%)
Iran_N: 0.455 (45.5%)
Yamnaya_Samara 0.362 (36.2%)

David's Admixture Steppe EBA_K7:

Reference Populations:
Steppe_EBA
Southeast_Asian
Anatolia_N
Sub-Saharan
Northeast_Asian
Euro_HG
Iran_N

Results:
Steppe_EBA: 0.239658 (24%)
Southeast_Asian: 0.099714 (10%)
Anatolia_N: 0.078884 (7.9%)
Sub-Saharan: 0.020627 (2.1%)
Northeast_Asian: 0.076556 (7.7%)
Euro_HG: 0.026345 (2.6%)
Iran_N: 0.458216 (45.8%)

Any thoughts?

jortita
12-12-2017, 02:45 AM
Fst4 and Steppe EBA K7, here are my results:

David's fst4, for me:

Reference Populations:
Dai
Iran_N
Yamnaya_Samara

Results:
Dai: 0.182 (18.2%)
Iran_N: 0.455 (45.5%)
Yamnaya_Samara 0.362 (36.2%)

David's Admixture Steppe EBA_K7:

Reference Populations:
Steppe_EBA
Southeast_Asian
Anatolia_N
Sub-Saharan
Northeast_Asian
Euro_HG
Iran_N

Results:
Steppe_EBA: 0.239658 (24%)
Southeast_Asian: 0.099714 (10%)
Anatolia_N: 0.078884 (7.9%)
Sub-Saharan: 0.020627 (2.1%)
Northeast_Asian: 0.076556 (7.7%)
Euro_HG: 0.026345 (2.6%)
Iran_N: 0.458216 (45.8%)

Any thoughts?

Would really appreciate if you could please let me know on how I can contact Davidski about these two calculators.

Xehanort
12-12-2017, 06:40 AM
Would really appreciate if you could please let me know on how I can contact Davidski about these two calculators.

His email is: [email protected]

The store's closed for December, i.e. he's not doing any DNA analyses for December. :)

jortita
12-12-2017, 06:41 AM
His email is: [email protected]

The store's closed for December, i.e. he's not doing any DNA analyses for December. :)

Ok thanks, will request in January

bmoney
12-12-2017, 07:04 AM
I thought I should make a thread since lots of Tarkhan kits have started popping up on Gedmatch.

Interesting dude - much more of a cluster than I thought - I cannot tell a Ramgarhia from a regular non-chamar Sikh but it seems they are a genetic group, what do Jatt samples look like im comparison?

MonkeyDLuffy
12-16-2017, 06:40 PM
Interesting dude - much more of a cluster than I thought - I cannot tell a Ramgarhia from a regular non-chamar Sikh but it seems they are a genetic group, what do Jatt samples look like im comparison?

Punjabi Jatts and Punjabi Ramgarhia only have few points SI difference, during my conversation with sapporo, Punjabi jatts seems to be falling between 29-32% SI range, while Tarkhans seems to be 31-34% so far. I dont have any Jatt gedmatch kits, I'll take a look in my matches if I can find any.

About them clustering together, I'd agree, especially on 23andme. My top matches are Tarkhans/Ramgarhias exclusively with some jatts, and 2-3 Afghans. So Tarkhans do make a cluster.

Xehanort
12-16-2017, 10:50 PM
Punjabi Jatts and Punjabi Ramgarhia only have few points SI difference, during my conversation with sapporo, Punjabi jatts seems to be falling between 29-32% SI range, while Tarkhans seems to be 31-34% so far. I dont have any Jatt gedmatch kits, I'll take a look in my matches if I can find any.

About them clustering together, I'd agree, especially on 23andme. My top matches are Tarkhans/Ramgarhias exclusively with some jatts, and 2-3 Afghans. So Tarkhans do make a cluster.

Yeah, I agree. Tarkhans are similar to Gujjars, very much actually. Our average of ASI is between 30 and 33. Yours is a bit high on Harappa, though, I don't think it has to do with actual higher South Indian component, it's just the way in which the calculator was created. I suggest you do David's latest F4 test.

MonkeyDLuffy
12-16-2017, 11:31 PM
Yeah, I agree. Tarkhans are similar to Gujjars, very much actually. Our average of ASI is between 30 and 33. Yours is a bit high on Harappa, though, I don't think it has to do with actual higher South Indian component, it's just the way in which the calculator was created. I suggest you do David's latest F4 test.

My SI is couple of points more but I score less East asian/Siberian, which other Tarkhans do. So it balances it out I believe. David's tests are usually expensive, around $20 I believe.

Xehanort
12-17-2017, 01:24 AM
My SI is couple of points more but I score less East asian/Siberian, which other Tarkhans do. So it balances it out I believe. David's tests are usually expensive, around $20 I believe.

Yes, they are, and yeah I agree with you, you are correct. David charges 20 USD for us in North America.

Heir of Gandhara
12-17-2017, 11:39 AM
MonkeyDLuffy, do all Sikh Tarkhans self-identify as Ramgarhias? If yes, are all Sikh Tarkhans related to the Misl commander or the fort he rebuilt? If no, why was this identity adopted en masse?

MonkeyDLuffy
12-17-2017, 02:27 PM
MonkeyDLuffy, do all Sikh Tarkhans self-identify as Ramgarhias? If yes, are all Sikh Tarkhans related to the Misl commander or the fort he rebuilt? If no, why was this identity adopted en masse?

Yes Sikh Tarkhans identify as Ramgarhias. But Ramgarhia title does not only covers Tarkhans. There were people of every biradari in the misl, even the founder was a jatt. That differentiates Ramgarhias and Hindu/Muslim tarkhans. That’s why Ramgarhias have lots of same lastnames as Jatts, Rajputs and Khatris.

I’d say the reason Sikh Tarkhans started using the Ramgarhia title was for their new position in newly formed Sikh society. In Hinduism they’re mid tier, in Muslims they’re seen as kaami. But because of Sikhism they flourished and were able to stand at the top with Jatts. Hence Sikh Tarkhans took the title of Ramgarhia after Maharaj Jassa Singh Thoka (Ramgarhia), since he played a big role in changing the status of community.

The Wikipedia article seems to be recently edited and seems to be very biased. So I won’t look at it for information. There is a tension between jat historians who’re trying to show all misls as jatts, and sometimes try to show other biradaris less significant.

Heir of Gandhara
12-17-2017, 11:44 PM
Yes Sikh Tarkhans identify as Ramgarhias. But Ramgarhia title does not only covers Tarkhans. There were people of every biradari in the misl, even the founder was a jatt. That differentiates Ramgarhias and Hindu/Muslim tarkhans. That’s why Ramgarhias have lots of same lastnames as Jatts, Rajputs and Khatris.

I’d say the reason Sikh Tarkhans started using the Ramgarhia title was for their new position in newly formed Sikh society. In Hinduism they’re mid tier, in Muslims they’re seen as kaami. But because of Sikhism they flourished and were able to stand at the top with Jatts. Hence Sikh Tarkhans took the title of Ramgarhia after Maharaj Jassa Singh Thoka (Ramgarhia), since he played a big role in changing the status of community.

The Wikipedia article seems to be recently edited and seems to be very biased. So I won’t look at it for information. There is a tension between jat historians who’re trying to show all misls as jatts, and sometimes try to show other biradaris less significant.

Thanks for the reply. And yes, I am aware that Punjab related topics evoke impassioned, albeit mostly inaccurate, responses from these 'Jat historians' from East Punjab and North America. It almost seems like as if a concerted effort is underway to Jattify the entire online discourse.

MonkeyDLuffy
12-18-2017, 01:20 AM
Thanks for the reply. And yes, I am aware that Punjab related topics evoke impassioned, albeit mostly inaccurate, responses from these 'Jat historians' from East Punjab and North America. It almost seems like as if a concerted effort is underway to Jattify the entire online discourse.

Yea Sikh Era was a very important part of Punjab's history, afterall Maharaja Ranjit singh united and extended Punjab to its full glory by winning Peshawar. The two strongest misls were Ramgarhia and Ahluwalia misls, both led by non jatts. But in past recent years there has been an agenda being pushed to change the history. Even Maharaja Ranjit singh's family history is not confirmed and kinda sketchy yet he is labelled a jatt. Jassa Singh Ramgarhia is stripped from his title of Maharaja in modern history while it is obvious he led the misl and gained control of present day haryana.

This tension for power is the reason which led to different gurudwaras run by different biradaris e.g. Ramgarhia gurudwara, Singh Sabha and Ravidassia gurudwara.

bmoney
12-18-2017, 02:55 AM
Yea Sikh Era was a very important part of Punjab's history, afterall Maharaja Ranjit singh united and extended Punjab to its full glory by winning Peshawar. The two strongest misls were Ramgarhia and Ahluwalia misls, both led by non jatts. But in past recent years there has been an agenda being pushed to change the history. Even Maharaja Ranjit singh's family history is not confirmed and kinda sketchy yet he is labelled a jatt. Jassa Singh Ramgarhia is stripped from his title of Maharaja in modern history while it is obvious he led the misl and gained control of present day haryana.

This tension for power is the reason which led to different gurudwaras run by different biradaris e.g. Ramgarhia gurudwara, Singh Sabha and Ravidassia gurudwara.

I've read Maharaja Ranjit Singh could have been of the Sansi/nomad caste

beemax
12-18-2017, 11:50 AM
lol at the Jatt bashing in some posts above.

beemax
12-18-2017, 12:10 PM
I've read Maharaja Ranjit Singh could have been of the Sansi/nomad caste

He was almost certainly a Jatt. Sansi are a very poor and marginalized group. It is unlikely that a Sansi or Sansi family would have been able to gather a large number of Jatt fighters (and Khatris etc) to operate under them as a Misl leader (i.e. before he was anointed as a Maharajah).

There are some descendents of Ranjit Singh from his daughters, and they state themselves to be Jatts. Also descendents of his relatives all claim to be Jatts. What they say is that his side of the family were poorer than the rest and were therefore nicknamed as "sansi" by other sides of the family. Its also possible his forefathers might have been engaged in dacoity and robbery at some point which could be another possible reason for them to be nicknamed "sansi".

Another possibility (though I would guess less likely) is that his ancesters originally really were from the Sansi group who had moved from another area and over time they might have been able to merge into Jatts after improving their situation, and with their Sansi past ignored by everyone over the course of time.

The bottom line is his descendents and relatives today, and in the past, stated they were Jatts, so I dont see how it can be argued against without concrete evidence they were Sansi. Personally I think it is just more Jatt bashing by some historians from certain groups, and then it gets propogated on the internet.

MonkeyDLuffy
12-18-2017, 02:59 PM
lol at the Jatt bashing in some posts above.

Well the Jat historians are providing enough reasons for them, as noticed by couple of other users as well. If youíd like to talk about history, we can create a separate thread for it.

Heir of Gandhara
12-19-2017, 01:59 AM
lol at the Jatt bashing in some posts above.

General statements contribute nothing to this ongoing discussion. If you think the supposed 'Jatt bashing' is 'lol'-worthy, please put in some effort, start a detailed thread and I will respond. However this thread, imho, should mostly focus on Ramgarhia/Tarkhan genetic results and maybe some background information on that community.

beemax
12-19-2017, 11:30 AM
Thanks for the reply. And yes, I am aware that Punjab related topics evoke impassioned, albeit mostly inaccurate, responses from these 'Jat historians' from East Punjab and North America. It almost seems like as if a concerted effort is underway to Jattify the entire online discourse.

Did I, or any other Jatt member, bring Jatts into this thread?? MDL brought Jatts into it, and then you replied as above without any details to what you said. Who are these "Jatt historians" making a "concerted effort is underway to Jattify the entire online discourse"? You also showed your bias too, just mentioning "East Punjab" in order to omit your own side of Punjab.


General statements contribute nothing to this ongoing discussion. If you think the supposed 'Jatt bashing' is 'lol'-worthy, please put in some effort, start a detailed thread and I will respond[b]. However [B]this thread, imho, should mostly focus on Ramgarhia/Tarkhan genetic results and maybe some background information on that community.

No, its not up to me to start a detailed thread. It is up to person making the point in first place to give some evidence to support what they said.

I have limited time and just registered here to get some genetics info. Also I am not a historian, neither is MDL, but I dont know about you.
Personally I dont want to go into such subjects here and rake up nonsense stuff, but if you feel the need then go ahead. Give proof of what you say, and make a similar thread on Janjua stuff?

MonkeyDLuffy
12-19-2017, 01:20 PM
Did I, or any other Jatt member, bring Jatts into this thread?? MDL brought Jatts into it, and then you replied as above without any details to what you said. Who are these "Jatt historians" making a "concerted effort is underway to Jattify the entire online discourse"? You also showed your bias too, just mentioning "East Punjab" in order to omit your own side of Punjab.



No, its not up to me to start a detailed thread. It is up to person making the point in first place to give some evidence to support what they said.

I have limited time and just registered here to get some genetics info. Also I am not a historian, neither is MDL, but I dont know about you.
Personally I dont want to go into such subjects here and rake up nonsense stuff, but if you feel the need then go ahead. Give proof of what you say, and make a similar thread on Janjua stuff?

My OP is simply stopping people from reading some nonsense written on Wikipedia article. In talk section you can read multiple people with "Jat" surname have tried to edit it. About the history, Jatland can give a nice insight of what these jat historians think, and what's more amazing is that lots of people actually read it and believe it.

I'm not denying the contribution of any Biradari to Sikh empire, but there has been a continuous effort to magnify one community's achievements and killing the other community's achievement. I've been very active on anthrogenica for a good amount of time, and you can go through my post history if I'm biased or not. I accept what we are, and what our history is.

Again if you'd like to talk about history of Punjab, I'd love to discuss either in a separate thread or PM if you'd like.

MonkeyDLuffy
12-19-2017, 01:42 PM
On the thread:

Here is another Tarkhan showed up whom I match with on 23andme. Her gedmatch is M635716

# Population Percent
1 Baloch 39.22
2 S-Indian 33.16
3 Caucasian 14.22
4 NE-Euro 7.73
5 Mediterranean 2.84
6 NE-Asian 1.04
7 Siberian 0.74
8 American 0.64
9 SW-Asian 0.41


Here's another, he is Sohal, which is common among both Jats and Tarkhans, so he could be either of them. M317791

1 Baloch 37.27
2 S-Indian 32.75
3 NE-Euro 10.41
4 Caucasian 8.66
5 NE-Asian 3.31
6 SW-Asian 1.83
7 American 1.5
8 Papuan 1.44
9 Mediterranean 1.17
10 Siberian 0.95
11 SE-Asian 0.61
12 Beringian 0.11

Another match from both 23andme, she is one of my top matches and has the same name lol. Since she is my 4th top match on 23andme, I'd assume she is Tarkhan. If I'm wrong please correct me. M212759

1 Baloch 38.84
2 S-Indian 29.23
3 NE-Euro 13.54
4 Caucasian 12.15
5 Mediterranean 1.63
6 NE-Asian 1.37
7 Siberian 1.14
8 Beringian 0.89
9 American 0.83
10 Pygmy 0.31
11 Papuan 0.08



I'm just fascinated by how much variation is among the community.

Heir of Gandhara
12-19-2017, 01:52 PM
Did I, or any other Jatt member, bring Jatts into this thread?? MDL brought Jatts into it, and then you replied as above without any details to what you said. Who are these "Jatt historians" making a "concerted effort is underway to Jattify the entire online discourse"? You also showed your bias too, just mentioning "East Punjab" in order to omit your own side of Punjab.

Now that you have gotten a bit more specific, I can respond better. Let me first point out my use of quotation marks with the term you found problematic. I deliberately used quotes, in lieu of the phrase so-called, just so that the term does not sound universal; thereby limiting its application to the agenda peddlers in question.

Anyway, so who are the so-called Jat Historians I am talking about? They are people who contribute to the misinformation wikis such as the Jatland wiki. To keep my argument tighter, I am only naming one such wiki or forum for now. On the said wiki, contributors deliberately invent histories of many clans of note and start calling them Jatts. They give long, often disconnected and falsified information just to make these articles appear legitimate to amateurs. The Punjabi script they use is usually Gurmukhi and this makes me think that most of these frauds belong to Eastern Punjab; for that is where the script is more common. Some of these IPs are Canadian so I threw in North American too.

To what end are such people trying to spread fabricated and revisionist 'histories?' I know not. But the scale of such endeavors is so substantial, often spilling into mainstream domains like the Wikipedia, that a pattern emerges and it starts appearing to me as if these efforts are concerted.




No, its not up to me to start a detailed thread. It is up to the person making the point in first place to give some evidence to support what they said.

I have limited time and just registered here to get some genetics info. Also I am not a historian, neither is MDL, but I dont know about you.
Personally I don't want to go into such subjects here and rake up nonsense stuff, but if you feel the need then go ahead. Give proof of what you say, and make a similar thread on Janjua stuff?

Disclosure: I am not a Historian. But because I am blood proud, generally inquisitive and a regular book reader, I know my tribal lore and history well; in addition to knowing some general history of course. I don't think I completely understand your last sentence, but there already is a thread on at least some of the 'Janjua stuff' that you mention. If you have any specific questions you can raise them in that thread and I will try my best to answer. I do not mind questions as long as they are specific, not loaded and sarcasm free.

Sapporo
12-19-2017, 02:40 PM
Punjabi Jatts and Punjabi Ramgarhia only have few points SI difference, during my conversation with sapporo, Punjabi jatts seems to be falling between 29-32% SI range, while Tarkhans seems to be 31-34% so far. I dont have any Jatt gedmatch kits, I'll take a look in my matches if I can find any.

About them clustering together, I'd agree, especially on 23andme. My top matches are Tarkhans/Ramgarhias exclusively with some jatts, and 2-3 Afghans. So Tarkhans do make a cluster.

Depends on the version of Harappa. On Gedmatch Jatt Sikhs mostly score between 28-31% SI. On Zack's Project official runs, they average around 28% with the range being 27-30%. I get 29% on his official run. Based on the results you've collected, on Gedmatch Tarkhans are mostly in the 31-33% range. Not sure if Zack has any Tarkhans on his official runs (besides you?).

MonkeyDLuffy
12-19-2017, 02:45 PM
Depends on the version of Harappa. On Gedmatch Jatt Sikhs mostly score between 28-31% SI. On Zack's Project official runs, they average around 28% with the range being 27-30%. I get 29% on his official run. Based on the results you've collected, on Gedmatch Tarkhans are mostly in the 31-33% range. Not sure if Zack has any Tarkhans on his official runs (besides you?).

He had only two Ramgarhias in his run with high Baloch, I was not part of it. I got tested way after that.

Sapporo
12-19-2017, 02:50 PM
He had only two Ramgarhias in his run with high Baloch, I was not part of it. I got tested way after that.


Thanks for the clarification. I don't remember much about his sample base. Do you know their project ID's? I wonder if it was before his "update" to the sample base with all the new participants. Project Members prior to around HRP240 (or somewhere around there) had slightly different results to those who came after.

MonkeyDLuffy
12-19-2017, 03:18 PM
Thanks for the clarification. I don't remember much about his sample base. Do you know their project ID's? I wonder if it was before his "update" to the sample base with all the new participants. Project Members prior to around HRP240 (or somewhere around there) had slightly different results to those who came after.

I actually don't, I looked into the Harappa website, but seems like the sheets are not loading up anymore. Also Zack recently updated he has dropped Harappa project. Razib is going to pick from where he left.

Here's a list Razib posted. I'm not sure how he came to average of 35% for Ramgarhias, might be because of only two individual results.

http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/gnxp/2013/08/what-the-harappa-ancestry-project-has-resolved/#.Wjkqy1WnGCg

MonkeyDLuffy
01-03-2018, 04:38 PM
Mixed Punjabi Ramgarhia (Khatri mixed I believe, since on 23&me she mentions arora as one of the surnames) M111406

1 Baloch 37.14
2 S-Indian 29.73
3 Caucasian 14.97
4 NE-Euro 10.32
5 NE-Asian 2.02
6 Mediterranean 1.79
7 American 1.2
8 SW-Asian 1.08
9 Beringian 0.98
10 Siberian 0.78

EDIT: The other sample has too many muslim matches, it is someone else's sample.

MonkeyDLuffy
02-01-2018, 03:49 AM
Punjabi Ramgarhia (Bachhu)

Kit: A265215

# Population Percent
1 Baloch 35.99
2 S-Indian 35.56
3 Caucasian 11.96
4 NE-Euro 10.59
5 Siberian 2.02
6 Mediterranean 1.15
7 American 1.1
8 NE-Asian 0.8
9 Beringian 0.64
10 Papuan 0.19

__________________________________

Punjabi Ramgarhia (Ghatore) M455455

1 Baloch 35.19
2 S-Indian 32.93
3 Caucasian 13.82
4 NE-Euro 9.78
5 Siberian 2.67
6 American 1.58
7 Beringian 1.2
8 SW-Asian 1.14
9 Papuan 0.94
10 Mediterranean 0.62
11 NE-Asian 0.13
12 W-African 0.01

_________________________________

Punjabi Ramgarhia (Virdee)

# Population Percent
1 Baloch 37.29
2 S-Indian 34.14
3 Caucasian 11.12
4 NE-Euro 10.68
5 NE-Asian 1.33
6 Mediterranean 1.32
7 SW-Asian 1.2
8 Siberian 0.99
9 Beringian 0.69
10 Papuan 0.5
11 American 0.38
12 San 0.35

______________________________

Punjabi Ramgarhia (Nagra) A342154

1 Baloch 37.55
2 S-Indian 31.4
3 NE-Euro 14.66
4 Caucasian 11.64
5 Beringian 1.77
6 Siberian 1.66
7 NE-Asian 0.68
8 SW-Asian 0.64

___________________________________

Punjabi Ramgarhia (Sondh) M366475

1 Baloch 37.94
2 S-Indian 34.13
3 Caucasian 12.52
4 NE-Euro 8.85
5 Mediterranean 2.13
6 American 1.48
7 NE-Asian 1.45
8 SW-Asian 0.95
9 Siberian 0.55

__________________________________

Punjabi Ramgarhia (Unknown) M250741

# Population Percent
1 Baloch 36.4
2 S-Indian 35.09
3 NE-Euro 11.87
4 Caucasian 10.37
5 Mediterranean 1.72
6 Siberian 1.53
7 Beringian 1.4
8 Papuan 0.58
9 American 0.57
10 SW-Asian 0.22
11 Pygmy 0.14
12 NE-Asian 0.12

__________________________________

Punjabi Ramgarhia (Rooprai) mixed with Baniya (agarwal): A531477

1 S-Indian 40.03
2 Baloch 39.13
3 Caucasian 7.01
4 NE-Euro 5.55
5 SW-Asian 1.84
6 Siberian 1.84
7 Mediterranean 1.3
8 American 1.24
9 SE-Asian 1
10 Papuan 0.7
11 Beringian 0.33
12 NE-Asian 0.02

_________________________________

Sapporo
02-01-2018, 05:32 AM
Punjabi Ramgarhia (Nagra) A342154

1 Baloch 37.55
2 S-Indian 31.4
3 NE-Euro 14.66
4 Caucasian 11.64
5 Beringian 1.77
6 Siberian 1.66
7 NE-Asian 0.68
8 SW-Asian 0.64


Nagra is Jatt too. Did you confirm their other surnames to verify they're full Ramgarhia? Different biradaris rarely marry with one another but it happens from time to time. One of the members on here has a 1/2 Jatt 1/2 Khatri wife. First, I've come across personally though.

MonkeyDLuffy
02-01-2018, 05:36 AM
Nagra is Jatt too. Did you confirm their other surnames of if they're full Ramgarhia?

I’m sending them an email to confirm. All their top matches are Ramgarhias. Let’s see what they reply.

MonkeyDLuffy
02-14-2019, 10:29 AM
Riyat:


Population Percent
1 Baloch 37.92
2 S-Indian 33.73
3 Caucasian 11.94
4 NE-Euro 10.47
5 Beringian 2.44
6 American 1.36
7 NE-Asian 0.79
8 Siberian 0.72
9 Papuan 0.63

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 kashmiri-pandit (reich) 2.81
2 punjabi-brahmin (harappa) 3.01
3 punjabi (harappa) 3.58
4 singapore-indian-c (sgvp) 4.35
5 punjabi-jatt-muslim (harappa) 4.54
6 kashmiri-pahari (harappa) 5.31
7 kashmiri (harappa) 5.37
8 punjabi-khatri (harappa) 5.53
9 punjabi-ramgarhia (harappa) 5.74
10 up-muslim (harappa) 5.79
11 punjabi-jatt-sikh (harappa) 6.79
12 gujarati-muslim (harappa) 7.17
13 nepalese-a (xing) 7.45
14 up-brahmin (harappa) 7.88
15 punjabi-arain (xing) 7.94
16 sindhi (harappa) 8.2
17 haryana-jatt (harappa) 10.13
18 sindhi (hgdp) 10.51
19 brahmin-uttar-pradesh (metspalu) 10.52
20 pathan (hgdp) 11.08



Mudhan/Riyat (This one scores very much like me, probably more steppe)


# Population Percent
1 Baloch 36.31
2 S-Indian 33.09
3 NE-Euro 12.91
4 Caucasian 10
5 Mediterranean 2.2
6 SW-Asian 1.46
7 American 1.45
8 Siberian 1.22
9 Beringian 1.07
10 SE-Asian 0.31

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 punjabi-brahmin (harappa) 4.59
2 singapore-indian-c (sgvp) 5.3
3 punjabi (harappa) 5.36
4 kashmiri-pandit (reich) 5.37
5 up-muslim (harappa) 5.59
6 punjabi-jatt-sikh (harappa) 5.88
7 nepalese-a (xing) 6.08
8 punjabi-jatt-muslim (harappa) 6.3
9 punjabi-ramgarhia (harappa) 6.49
10 punjabi-khatri (harappa) 6.57
11 kashmiri (harappa) 6.88
12 kashmiri-pahari (harappa) 6.92
13 up-brahmin (harappa) 7.29
14 haryana-jatt (harappa) 7.61
15 gujarati-muslim (harappa) 8.61
16 punjabi-arain (xing) 9.21
17 sindhi (harappa) 9.26
18 brahmin-uttar-pradesh (metspalu) 9.66
19 bengali-brahmin (harappa) 10.5
20 pathan (hgdp) 11.57



Sian:


Population Percent
1 Baloch 39.29
2 S-Indian 34.56
3 Caucasian 12.5
4 NE-Euro 9.38
5 Mediterranean 1.56
6 Siberian 1.41
7 American 0.61
8 Beringian 0.56
9 San 0.11

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 kashmiri-pandit (reich) 2.63
2 punjabi-brahmin (harappa) 2.81
3 punjabi (harappa) 3.67
4 singapore-indian-c (sgvp) 3.77
5 kashmiri-pahari (harappa) 4.14
6 punjabi-ramgarhia (harappa) 4.33
7 punjabi-jatt-muslim (harappa) 5.39
8 kashmiri (harappa) 5.93
9 up-muslim (harappa) 6.23
10 punjabi-khatri (harappa) 6.36
11 punjabi-arain (xing) 6.74
12 gujarati-muslim (harappa) 6.93
13 punjabi-jatt-sikh (harappa) 7.29
14 up-brahmin (harappa) 8.04
15 nepalese-a (xing) 8.18
16 sindhi (harappa) 8.33
17 sindhi (hgdp) 9.5
18 brahmin-uttar-pradesh (metspalu) 10.46
19 bhatia (harappa) 11.12
20 pathan (hgdp) 11.26


Pm me for kit numbers.

MonkeyDLuffy
02-14-2019, 10:53 AM
Sembhi:


Population Percent
1 Baloch 38.76
2 S-Indian 34.02
3 Caucasian 10.75
4 NE-Euro 9.32
5 Mediterranean 2.98
6 Siberian 2.56
7 American 0.64
8 NE-Asian 0.59
9 W-African 0.38

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 punjabi-brahmin (harappa) 3.53
2 kashmiri-pandit (reich) 3.55
3 punjabi-ramgarhia (harappa) 3.67
4 singapore-indian-c (sgvp) 3.78
5 punjabi (harappa) 3.97
6 kashmiri-pahari (harappa) 4.16
7 up-muslim (harappa) 5.68
8 punjabi-jatt-muslim (harappa) 5.89
9 kashmiri (harappa) 6.32
10 punjabi-arain (xing) 6.72
11 nepalese-a (xing) 6.88
12 punjabi-jatt-sikh (harappa) 6.9
13 gujarati-muslim (harappa) 7.25
14 punjabi-khatri (harappa) 7.29
15 up-brahmin (harappa) 7.64
16 sindhi (harappa) 8.79
17 sindhi (hgdp) 9.51
18 brahmin-uttar-pradesh (metspalu) 9.98
19 haryana-jatt (harappa) 10.67
20 bengali-brahmin (harappa) 10.8


Another Riyat (most likely related to the first riyat)


Population Percent
1 Baloch 37.88
2 S-Indian 33.45
3 Caucasian 11.84
4 NE-Euro 11.71
5 NE-Asian 2.31
6 Siberian 1.39
7 American 1.05
8 Beringian 0.37

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 kashmiri-pandit (reich) 3.44
2 punjabi-brahmin (harappa) 3.57
3 punjabi (harappa) 4.38
4 singapore-indian-c (sgvp) 4.46
5 kashmiri (harappa) 5.21
6 kashmiri-pahari (harappa) 5.56
7 punjabi-khatri (harappa) 5.91
8 punjabi-ramgarhia (harappa) 5.94
9 punjabi-jatt-muslim (harappa) 5.94
10 nepalese-a (xing) 6.2
11 up-muslim (harappa) 6.3
12 punjabi-jatt-sikh (harappa) 6.63
13 gujarati-muslim (harappa) 8.08
14 sindhi (harappa) 8.14
15 up-brahmin (harappa) 8.21
16 punjabi-arain (xing) 8.33
17 haryana-jatt (harappa) 9.47
18 brahmin-uttar-pradesh (metspalu) 10.59
19 pathan (hgdp) 10.76
20 bhatia (harappa) 10.9

laltota
02-14-2019, 11:22 AM
Iím sending them an email to confirm. All their top matches are Ramgarhias. Letís see what they reply.

Did they (Nagra) reply to your email by any chance?

MonkeyDLuffy
02-14-2019, 11:28 AM
Did they (Nagra) reply to your email by any chance?

Nope, but she's jatt, Sapporo confirmed it. It was a mistake of surname, Tarkhans have surname *Nagi, Nagri*, so I confused it for Nagra.

Jatt1
02-14-2019, 08:33 PM
Nope, but she's jatt, Sapporo confirmed it. It was a mistake of surname, Tarkhans have surname *Nagi, Nagri*, so I confused it for Nagra.

Do you have a list of Ramgariya yDNA and mtDNA haplogroups?

MonkeyDLuffy
02-14-2019, 11:26 PM
Do you have a list of Ramgariya yDNA and mtDNA haplogroups?

I do, and it's bigger than when I originally started this thread. I'll add those to online sheet, and can PM you.

MonkeyDLuffy
05-15-2019, 10:35 AM
Distant maternal relative, Sembhi:

1 Baloch 35.75
2 S-Indian 32.36
3 Caucasian 14.63
4 NE-Euro 10.95
5 American 1.88
6 Mediterranean 1.4
7 E-African 1.01
8 Siberian 0.98
9 NE-Asian 0.74
10 San 0.31

Single Population Sharing:

# Population (source) Distance
1 kashmiri (harappa) 4.23
2 kashmiri-pandit (reich) 4.71
3 punjabi-khatri (harappa) 5.13
4 punjabi (harappa) 5.98
5 punjabi-brahmin (harappa) 6.02
6 punjabi-jatt-muslim (harappa) 6.13
7 up-muslim (harappa) 6.27
8 singapore-indian-c (sgvp) 7.1
9 gujarati-muslim (harappa) 7.24
10 punjabi-jatt-sikh (harappa) 7.52
11 kashmiri-pahari (harappa) 7.84
12 sindhi (harappa) 8.25
13 punjabi-ramgarhia (harappa) 8.37
14 nepalese-a (xing) 9.39
15 punjabi-arain (xing) 9.8
16 haryana-jatt (harappa) 9.8
17 pathan (hgdp) 10.29
18 up-brahmin (harappa) 10.53
19 bhatia (harappa) 11.77
20 burusho (hgdp) 12.12

Mixed Mode Population Sharing:

# Primary Population (source) Secondary Population (source) Distance
1 71.7% gujarati (harappa) + 28.3% urkarah (xing) @ 2.15
2 73.8% gujarati-b (hapmap) + 26.2% urkarah (xing) @ 2.15
3 73.3% gujarati-b (hapmap) + 26.7% stalskoe (xing) @ 2.2
4 74.4% gujarati-b (hapmap) + 25.6% lezgin (behar) @ 2.29
5 73.7% up-kshatriya (metspalu) + 26.3% lezgin (behar) @ 2.35
6 72.4% gujarati (harappa) + 27.6% lezgin (behar) @ 2.56
7 76% gujarati-b (hapmap) + 24% chechen (yunusbayev) @ 2.58
8 73.1% up-kshatriya (metspalu) + 26.9% urkarah (xing) @ 2.62
9 72.7% meghawal (reich) + 27.3% urkarah (xing) @ 2.72
10 71.3% gujarati (harappa) + 28.7% stalskoe (xing) @ 2.76
11 85.2% pathan (hgdp) + 14.8% irula (xing) @ 2.87
12 70.5% iyer-brahmin (harappa) + 29.5% urkarah (xing) @ 2.91
13 85.3% pathan (hgdp) + 14.7% pulliyar (metspalu) @ 2.93
14 75.1% gujarati-b (hapmap) + 24.9% kumyk (yunusbayev) @ 2.93
15 69% kerala-nair (harappa) + 31% urkarah (xing) @ 2.94
16 88.6% kashmiri-pandit (reich) + 11.4% romanian-b (behar) @ 2.97
17 71.4% tn-brahmin (xing) + 28.6% urkarah (xing) @ 3
18 93.2% punjabi-khatri (harappa) + 6.8% irula (xing) @ 3.02
19 93.3% punjabi-khatri (harappa) + 6.7% pulliyar (metspalu) @ 3.02
20 61.7% gujarati-a (hapmap) + 38.3% urkarah (xing) @ 3.07