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Gwydion
04-23-2018, 10:31 PM
So I heard that you could predict Y-DNA through Ancestry.com/23andMe autosomal tests using some tools, such as MorleyDNA which seems to be down for me. So I tried another option, namely WeGene. The result I got back was R1b1a1a2a1a2b1, which apparently is U512 L2. Through searching I saw on an old post by the user "Ravai" that searching and finding:

rs2566671 Y 5755550 T

in the RAW DNA data confirms that one is L2, which indeed was there.

Does this mean I am U152 L2? Is there a way I can learn more or confirm further without testing?

Finally, my paternal line is Scottish, surname of Kerr/Carr/Ker. What does such a haplogroup entail for a Scottish descendant? It seems through some brief searching likely answers are La Tene Celts, Belgae, Franks/Flemish, etc. That said my surname is typically attributed a Norse origin and I noticed on some U152 map of Britain some people from Orkney and the Shetlands who are U152 positive. Does this mean my ancestor still could potentially be a Norse settler?

Thanks in advance for any help.

Acque agitate
04-24-2018, 11:26 AM
As I have already said in another discussion, I think this is the best solution. At the lowest price you can identify the sub-group to which you belong:

https://www.yseq.net/product_info.php?cPath=27&products_id=38288&osCsid=c68148a83d92578f8a8b5b5a4a4ea97d



So I heard that you could predict Y-DNA through Ancestry.com/23andMe autosomal tests using some tools, such as MorleyDNA which seems to be down for me. So I tried another option, namely WeGene. The result I got back was R1b1a1a2a1a2b1, which apparently is U512 L2. Through searching I saw on an old post by the user "Ravai" that searching and finding:

rs2566671 Y 5755550 T

in the RAW DNA data confirms that one is L2, which indeed was there.

Does this mean I am U152 L2? Is there a way I can learn more or confirm further without testing?

Finally, my paternal line is Scottish, surname of Kerr/Carr/Ker. What does such a haplogroup entail for a Scottish descendant? It seems through some brief searching likely answers are La Tene Celts, Belgae, Franks/Flemish, etc. That said my surname is typically attributed a Norse origin and I noticed on some U152 map of Britain some people from Orkney and the Shetlands who are U152 positive. Does this mean my ancestor still could potentially be a Norse settler?

Thanks in advance for any help.

MitchellSince1893
04-24-2018, 12:01 PM
So I heard that you could predict Y-DNA through Ancestry.com/23andMe autosomal tests using some tools, such as MorleyDNA which seems to be down for me. So I tried another option, namely WeGene. The result I got back was R1b1a1a2a1a2b1, which apparently is U512 L2. Through searching I saw on an old post by the user "Ravai" that searching and finding:

rs2566671 Y 5755550 T

in the RAW DNA data confirms that one is L2, which indeed was there.

Does this mean I am U152 L2? Is there a way I can learn more or confirm further without testing?

Finally, my paternal line is Scottish, surname of Kerr/Carr/Ker. What does such a haplogroup entail for a Scottish descendant? It seems through some brief searching likely answers are La Tene Celts, Belgae, Franks/Flemish, etc. That said my surname is typically attributed a Norse origin and I noticed on some U152 map of Britain some people from Orkney and the Shetlands who are U152 positive. Does this mean my ancestor still could potentially be a Norse settler?

Thanks in advance for any help.
L2 is around 4500 years old and found in every Western and Central European country. The FTDNA U152 project has no Kerr or Carr members at present. If you take a FTDNA STR test I would encourage you to join the project.

There is one L2 member of the FTDNA Kerr/Carr project https://www.familytreedna.com/public/carr?iframe=yresults

Without further testing you just don't have enough info to draw any conclusions.

Gwydion
04-24-2018, 12:25 PM
Thanks for the replies, it seems I will have to look into further testing. That said does it seem based on the WeGene report and the presence of "rs2566671 Y 5755550 T" in my RAW data that I can have confidence that I am indeed U152 and L2?

In the meantime before I test further and get my results, are there any other known means by which I can confirm or find out more about the Y-DNA prediction? As noted the Morley DNA site seems down, but I saw other tools such as Nevgen, etc. in my search. I (or rather my father) tested with Ancestry.com's DNA and I have the RAW data converted to 23andMe format if that helps.

kw5368
04-24-2018, 01:00 PM
You can't use Nevgen without STR results, which you will receive with a Y-DNA test. FTDNA currently has a decent sale going on until the 28th. I would recommend at least the Y-67 test which is on sale for $209 plus shipping. That's $59 off. For 80 more dollars, you can do the Y-111 test. There are better sales sometimes, but you may have to wait till Christmas.

Once you receive your results, you can join the U152 project and they will place you with your closest matches in the project. You will also be able to see your matches on FTDNA. You will then be able to use Nevgen to help you decide what other testing you might want to do to find your terminal SNP. Be aware that you are not going to find your terminal SNP with the Y-67 or Y-111 tests. That is only a start.

When I tested at 23andme, I received the same prediction using the tool 23andme to YSNPs.

Acque agitate
04-24-2018, 05:44 PM
Personally I think it is much more useful to run the "R1b-U152 Superclade Panel" that Yseq proposes at the modest sum of € 90 ($ 99). Once this test is performed, a person knows exactly the position he occupies in the U152 tree without needing any forecaster.
If this person wants to know their STR, Yseq offers the same test at a lower cost than the one proposed by FtDna.
The Y 37 test costs $ 85 with Yseq ("YSEQ-Alpha-Beta"), while FtDna normally charges $ 169, so it's about double (until April 28th the price is reduced to $ 139 which is always higher than 64% to that of Yseq).
What FtDna has in addition to Yseq is the possibility to participate in the Project R1b-U152, but this possibility is not free, as it is easy to infer from the comparison of the prices that I have highlighted above.
The choice is not automatic because each person has different needs. Anyone who prefers to participate in FtDna's projects is right to perform the test at this company. The important thing is to make a conscious choice ....



You can't use Nevgen without STR results, which you will receive with a Y-DNA test. FTDNA currently has a decent sale going on until the 28th. I would recommend at least the Y-67 test which is on sale for $209 plus shipping. That's $59 off. For 80 more dollars, you can do the Y-111 test. There are better sales sometimes, but you may have to wait till Christmas.

Once you receive your results, you can join the U152 project and they will place you with your closest matches in the project. You will also be able to see your matches on FTDNA. You will then be able to use Nevgen to help you decide what other testing you might want to do to find your terminal SNP. Be aware that you are not going to find your terminal SNP with the Y-67 or Y-111 tests. That is only a start.

When I tested at 23andme, I received the same prediction using the tool 23andme to YSNPs.

Gwydion
04-24-2018, 08:35 PM
I would probably rather choose the most economical option at this time, though I've been interested in the Carr FTDNA project so testing there will likely be in the future as well. I assume then based on the readings on my data and posts by others that it is at least certain that I am U152 L2+? I suppose I would like to be sure before testing at Yseq for the "R1b-U152 Superclade Panel."

That aside, I realize this may be an amateur question but in regards to Scandinavian L2 and its possible connection to Scotland, would its presence in Scandinavia likely predate or postdate the Hallstat/La Tene periods? In other words is it known whether U152 was already present in Scandinavia during say the Nordic Bronze Age or is it more likely the result of U152 entering from further south at a later date? Perhaps both?

Thanks again.

ArmandoR1b
04-24-2018, 10:45 PM
I assume then based on the readings on my data and posts by others that it is at least certain that I am U152 L2+? I suppose I would like to be sure before testing at Yseq for the "R1b-U152 Superclade Panel."

You could always get an individual test of U152 at https://www.yseq.net/product_info.php?products_id=4871 or L2 at https://www.yseq.net/product_info.php?products_id=10945

They are only $18 each

kw5368
04-25-2018, 12:39 AM
Personally I think it is much more useful to run the "R1b-U152 Superclade Panel" that Yseq proposes at the modest sum of € 90 ($ 99). Once this test is performed, a person knows exactly the position he occupies in the U152 tree without needing any forecaster.
If this person wants to know their STR, Yseq offers the same test at a lower cost than the one proposed by FtDna.
The Y 37 test costs $ 85 with Yseq ("YSEQ-Alpha-Beta"), while FtDna normally charges $ 169, so it's about double (until April 28th the price is reduced to $ 139 which is always higher than 64% to that of Yseq).
What FtDna has in addition to Yseq is the possibility to participate in the Project R1b-U152, but this possibility is not free, as it is easy to infer from the comparison of the prices that I have highlighted above.
The choice is not automatic because each person has different needs. Anyone who prefers to participate in FtDna's projects is right to perform the test at this company. The important thing is to make a conscious choice ....

I agree with Acque agitate. If you are wanting to find your terminal SNP, Yseq is the way to go for less money. I used them to find my terminal SNP, but I had prior knowledge of what I was looking for. If you go for the STR test at Yseq, you still might be able to add your results to the U152 project. I would ask the admins prior to testing though. This might be something that MitchellSince1893 can answer.

As I said before, Y-DNA testing at FTDNA will not give you your terminal SNP. Most likely, they will not even assign you as being L2. This forces you to buy more sub panels. When I was trying to confirm my relationship to a living descendent of an ancient ancestor, I opted for the Y37 test for him at FTDNA and then purchased the sub panel that I was sure he would be included in. Total cost about $300, but it was worth it to me to confirm our relationship. Your cost could be much less by purchasing the Superclad Panel, then purchasing individual SNPs if needed. You might not be able to join the projects at FTDNA though.

Ravai
04-25-2018, 05:06 AM
With yseq the cost is lower but it will not be able to sign part of the FTDNA projects, nor will it contribute anything to the finding of new terminal SNPs, but it will benefit the investment of others without contributing anything new to the cause. The best option for me is BigY from FTDNA. A payment and to wait for your tree to grow little by little.

Regards

Gwydion
04-25-2018, 01:59 PM
I saw that Morley's Y-SNP Terminal Subclade Predictor was back up today so I tried it out. Anyone know if there's anything more I can learn based on the following? I got R1b1a2a1a
R1b-L11 (R1b-L151, R1b-YSC0000082) with U152 in green, others below P312 in red. I tried to post a screenshot of my results, but I am not allowed so I will just describe them. The only one further down from U152 is R1b1a2a1a~4 V43 in red.

If I click the third option(R1b1a2a1a2b1a1~3
R1b-CTS358) , it also has L2 in green but there is some further information below, such as CTS7275 in green. Here's the final line:

R1b1a2a1a2b1a1~3 CTS358/YSC0001270R, CTS7275, CTS8127/YSC0001289R, L303, L763, L98, PF121R, YSC0000081R

As noted CTS7275 is green but L303, L763 are both red. Does this tell me anything?

Thanks again for the help and recommendations guys, I appreciate it.

Edit: Just doing some basic searching I imagine the green CTS7275 can't tell me anything because further up Z367 is red.

theImmortal
04-28-2018, 07:13 PM
Looks like you've got a pretty solid chance of being L2.

I'd buy the 37-marker kit from FTDNA before the sale is over. Then you can see if you have any exact matches and be in a good position to do specific SNP testing.

Gwydion
05-24-2018, 06:41 PM
Well now that I can post images, before I take any further testing is there any educated guesses that can be made beyond U152 L2+ from Morley's Y-DNA predictor results as shown below?

Experimental Tree:

https://i.imgur.com/DadCxQ2.png

ISOGG tree:

http://i.imgur.com/SaDHXjr.jpg