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callie714
04-26-2018, 03:32 PM
Hello everyone,

My DNA results came back with some surprising trace regions that helped me hypothesize about a mystery ancestor on my mothers side of the family...

My mother comes from Hungarian ancestry. My Great-Great Grandmother was born in Visk, Maramarous, Hungary (currently Vyshkovo, Ukraine) and was considered to be an 'illegitimate child'. My grandmother told me that no one knew the name of my Great-Great Grandmothers father and it has been impossible to locate who this man is in my paper trail. However, after taking my AncestryDNA test, my trace regions of Asia South, Middle East, Caucasus, and European Jewish lead me to believe that this man may have been part of the Roma community in northeastern Hungary?

Based on my results, would anyone like to challenge this hypothesis or help me better understand these results? I know that the Romani migrated from northern India and traveled through the Middle East, then the Caucasus, and up to Southern Europe, so to me this seems like the best guess. SIDE NOTE: I have Irish and Baltic ancestry from my Father, so the Irish, British, Scandinavian and Finnish are all from his side.

MY ANCESTRYDNA ADMIXTURE:
Ireland: 31%
Europe East: 30%
Great Britain: 14%
Iberian: 6%
Finnish 6%

TRACE REGIONS:
Europe South: 5%
Caucasus: 2%
Scandinavia: 2%
Europe West: 2%
Middle East: 1%
European Jewish: 1%
Asia South: <1%


I look forward to hearing your opinions Thank you in advance!
Callie

daragon39
04-27-2018, 02:20 AM
Hello everyone,

My DNA results came back with some surprising trace regions that helped me hypothesize about a mystery ancestor on my mothers side of the family...

My mother comes from Hungarian ancestry. My Great-Great Grandmother was born in Visk, Maramarous, Hungary (currently Vyshkovo, Ukraine) and was considered to be an 'illegitimate child'. My grandmother told me that no one knew the name of my Great-Great Grandmothers father and it has been impossible to locate who this man is in my paper trail. However, after taking my AncestryDNA test, my trace regions of Asia South, Middle East, Caucasus, and European Jewish lead me to believe that this man may have been part of the Roma community in northeastern Hungary?

Based on my results, would anyone like to challenge this hypothesis or help me better understand these results? I know that the Romani migrated from northern India and traveled through the Middle East, then the Caucasus, and up to Southern Europe, so to me this seems like the best guess. SIDE NOTE: I have Irish and Baltic ancestry from my Father, so the Irish, British, Scandinavian and Finnish are all from his side.

MY ANCESTRYDNA ADMIXTURE:
Ireland: 31%
Europe East: 30%
Great Britain: 14%
Iberian: 6%
Finnish 6%

TRACE REGIONS:
Europe South: 5%
Caucasus: 2%
Scandinavia: 2%
Europe West: 2%
Middle East: 1%
European Jewish: 1%
Asia South: <1%


I look forward to hearing your opinions Thank you in advance!
Callie

It's funny you mention that cause I also get trace amounts of South Asian about 1-2% on Ancestry and My Heritage and my mother also has trace amounts of South Asian with Caucasus trace amounts on Ancestry as well, on Family Tree DNA though it doesn't show but we do get about 5-8% Asia Minor. I have found at least one name on my mother's side that is usually associated with Roma which is Sauder, but from what I can tell this family line were Amish/Mennonites that originated in the Palatinate, unless some Roma converted to the Anabaptist religions. I also find other people's family tree with shared ancestry that trace our Platz line to Pakistan, but these trees have no documentation or proof that this line actually originated in Pakistan and as far as I can tell they are just a German line. I do have a picture of my 2x Great Grandmother though which was a Platz and she does look like she has South Asian Features or could have been a Roma.

JerryS.
04-27-2018, 04:21 AM
what do the various GEDmatch calculator models show?

ianz91
04-27-2018, 05:40 AM
You are not part Romani, period. White people always take these "exotic" trace regions way too seriously and believe it's actually a part of their ancestry

msmarjoribanks
04-27-2018, 03:15 PM
Not enough information to make that leap. Trace regions are often not meaningful/just noise, and there are multiple explanations even if yours are not mere noise.

This thread is a great source if you wanted to learn about Romani ancestry and the signs of it. The main question would be whether you got Romani matches.

https://anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?13431-101-Guide-to-Romani-ancestry

greerpalmer
04-27-2018, 03:31 PM
I don't know if I can convince myself there is any indication of Romani based on your results.
Most Europeans have smaller trace amounts from asia that is a result of random remixture of very very ancient dna.
Looking through your results I would guess this is standard for a central Eastern European such as someone from Ukraine.
Many ancient migrations into Europe tended to come through the Caucasus region north toward the Baltics then south and west into Europe.

I am predominately German, Irish and English and I get 10% Europe South, 7% Europe East, 1% Caucasus, 1% Iberian, <1% European Jewish on ancestry. It makes sense that someone with ancestry from somewhere geographically half way to South Asia versus me would also show some Middle East and Asia South.
Other commercial products show me with as high as 5% South Asian, Central Asian or North African percentages but you always need to proceed with healthy skepticism. I would recommend using GEDmatch, but the only way to truly feel more confident that something is "real" is by finding matches from that particular region.

Have fun exploring!

callie714
04-27-2018, 05:53 PM
xtest

Osiris
04-27-2018, 06:39 PM
. The main question would be whether you got Romani matches.

This I think is a very important line. I imagine Romani are quite endogenous like the Polynesians. My daughter's 1/16 and that's enough to take up a large part of her matches with many full blooded testers with over 70 cM matching DNA. If you find a full blooded match then you know it's something.

callie714
04-27-2018, 08:32 PM
You are not part Romani, period. White people always take these "exotic" trace regions way too seriously and believe it's actually a part of their ancestry

Hey! Thanks for your comment- I have no plans to wrongfully claim any type of ethnicity, I'm jusy trying to learn more so I can better direct my genealogical research. They have shown up on 5 different tests, so I figured I might as well throw it out there!

JosephK
04-27-2018, 10:07 PM
You are not part Romani, period. White people always take these "exotic" trace regions way too seriously and believe it's actually a part of their ancestry

Without doing GEDMatch, I don't think you can tell. If South Asian is coming up on Ancestry, that says alot; it usually ignores small bits and throws them into "Iberian" or "Balkan" etc.

On almost every GEDMatch analysis I come up with close to 3% North African and 1.5-2.7% South Asian or Indian, but Ancestry calls it Iberian, 23andme calls it Balkan.

JerryS.
04-27-2018, 10:45 PM
You are not part Romani, period. White people always take these "exotic" trace regions way too seriously and believe it's actually a part of their ancestry

Aren't Romani "white" too?

Angriff
04-27-2018, 11:02 PM
Those types of trace ancestry will likely have come from later steppe invasions like the Huns and Magyars. I wouldn't find them odd in that small amount fo someone with major ancestry from Hungary/Ukraine area.

I'd also not put a huge amount of faith in Ancestry's results and see what you get on GEDmatch before making it a serious inquiry.

ianz91
04-28-2018, 05:27 AM
Aren't Romani "white" too?


I don't want to get into the sensitive and often heated discussion of race on here, but Romani people are not White since they are not of European descent. My definition of "White" is "of European descent".

JerryS.
04-29-2018, 12:46 AM
I don't want to get into the sensitive and often heated discussion of race on here, but Romani people are not White since they are not of European descent. My definition of "White" is "of European descent".

I see. I was thinking Caucasian which is more than just Europe.

ianz91
04-30-2018, 01:13 AM
I see. I was thinking Caucasian which is more than just Europe.

My definition is narrow, others is more broad. Depends

ianz91
04-30-2018, 01:16 AM
To bring it back to the OP. I am also guilty of having interest in my trace regions (1% Middle East, <2% West middle East, <0.1% Yakut) so I didn't mean to come across as harsh or anything. It is extremely frustrating, following your trace regions, looking for answers but getting more questions than anything.