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Trojet
06-12-2018, 12:32 PM
We recently got an interesting I2a-M423 haplotype in Albania from YSEQ. Nevgen predictor says I2a-L621. I wonder if it can confidently be classified into the Dinaric subclade (CTS10228>Y3120) or downstream, as I noticed there is some interesting off modal values, particularly DYS459=10-10 (instead of 8-10), and YCA=21-21 (instead of 19-21), DYS464a=14 (instead of 12).

Any input from the I2a experts would be greatly appreciated! Here is the STRs:

13 24 16 11 14-14 11 13 12 13 11 32 17 10-10 11 11 25 15 20 33 14-14-15-15 10 10 19-21 15 13 18 18 35-35 11 10

Pribislav
06-12-2018, 07:49 PM
We recently got an interesting I2a-M423 haplotype in Albania from YSEQ. Nevgen predictor says I2a-L621. I wonder if it can confidently be classified into the Dinaric subclade (CTS10228>Y3120) or downstream, as I noticed there is some interesting off modal values, particularly DYS459=10-10 (instead of 8-10), and YCA=21-21 (instead of 19-21), DYS464a=14 (instead of 12).

Any input from the I2a experts would be greatly appreciated! Here is the STRs:

13 24 16 11 14-14 11 13 12 13 11 32 17 10-10 11 11 25 15 20 33 14-14-15-15 10 10 19-21 15 13 18 18 35-35 11 10

He certainly belongs to Dinaric subclade Y3120, somewhat "weird" values are the result of recLOH event on palindromic region P1, which affects multicopy markers DYS459, DYS464 and CDY (red). The other recLOH event could possibly happened on region P4 (DYS385), but value 14-14 could also be the result of "ordinary" mutation. You said YCAII is 21-21, but it seems to be 19-21.

Trojet
06-13-2018, 01:39 AM
He certainly belongs to Dinaric subclade Y3120, somewhat "weird" values are the result of recLOH event on palindromic region P1, which affects multicopy markers DYS459, DYS464 and CDY (red). The other recLOH event could possibly happened on region P4 (DYS385), but value 14-14 could also be the result of "ordinary" mutation. You said YCAII is 21-21, but it seems to be 19-21.

Thank you, Pribislav!

Oops. Yeah, I obviously meant to write it the other way around, that he has YCAII=19-21 instead of the modal 21-21.

eastara
06-15-2018, 06:29 AM
If he is really Y3120, he must be the first non Greek found with it on the Balkans. But still this branch is missing from the South Slavs, the rest of the known cases being Ashkenazi Jews.

Pribislav
06-15-2018, 09:34 PM
If he is really Y3120, he must be the first non Greek found with it on the Balkans. But still this branch is missing from the South Slavs, the rest of the known cases being Ashkenazi Jews.

You are talking about A2512, not Y3120.

reignman
06-16-2018, 08:26 PM
There are some haplotypes in Balkans with DYS385=14-14, except DYS459=10-10, DYS464a=14 and YCAII=19-21 he also has DYS607 13 instead of 12.
I did a quick research among Balkan haplotypes and did not found anyone who matches all these values.
There is a haplotype of one Bulgarian Z17855+ from Aegean Macedonia who matches him 12/12, unfortunately, he has only first 12 STR markers.

In scientific studies, there are two DYS385=14-14 from Albania:
13 24 17 11 14-14 12 14 11 32 17 15 21 32 10 15 17 19 10
13 24 16 11 14-14 12 13 11 31 17 15 20 32 10 15 19 17 10
13 24 16 11 14-14 11 13 12 13 11 32 17 10-10 11 11 25 15 20 33 14-14-15-15 10 10 19-21 15 13 18 18 35-35 11 10

First one has combination DYS385=14-14 and DYS448=21, the same combination is found in the scientific study of Aegean Macedonian population, and also in Herzegovinan Z17855>>PH3414 who believe their paternal origin was from Western Macedonia.
The second one might be closely related to him, but we need more STR markers to be sure, especially those that are out of modal.

This is not much, for now, I cannot say more.