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razyn
10-20-2013, 05:03 PM
There have been significant threads, and lists of the people testing, for U106 and L21, maybe others; but I haven't seen anything of similar substance regarding DF27. Maybe I've just missed it. There was this one thread, on which Corner (DF27+ and Z196-) mentions that he ordered Chromo2 in mid-July:

http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?98-New-SNPs-for-R-P312

And separately I've mentioned that some British L165 guys are getting ten new SNPs out of that test. I have no idea who they are, though. I think the Bonesetter Project may have ongoing research interest in this area. Has anybody else ordered Chromo2, from our DF27 haplogroup? Probably we should have a thread for it, now that results are coming in.

Also, they're saying the Chromo2 turnaround time now is 6-8 weeks (probably, from the time they have your sample). So those of us who think of DNA tests as a Christmas present to ourselves (possibly because FTDNA runs a sale at that time of year) might order now, and get a bunch of new SNPs from Santa Claus. Just a suggestion, not really a recommendation. [I'm also interested in the FTDNA winter sale; announcements to be made at their annual admin conference next month; the hints of new (and less expensive) tests from Full Genomes -- and other fast-moving events.] But if your spouse only lets you depart from budget once or twice a year, for this hobby, now is a good time to think about it.

corner
10-20-2013, 07:08 PM
I'm still waiting for Chromo2 results, the schedule for the first batch was going to be the end of September but this has been delayed by a few weeks. I got an email from BritainsDNA saying results from the first batch should start to be delivered between 21st of October (tomorrow) and the 8th of November.

It's interesting that L165 are getting results from Chromo2 now. I think L165 are DF27/Z196+, but the bone setter is DF27/Z196-.

The STR cluster who's off-modal markers I match over 111 markers is looking DF27+ and negative for Z196 and all other presently known SNPs under DF27. BritainsDNA have the 13 novel SNPs under S250/DF27 from the Anglesey bone setter project in their Chromo2 test, so if we match any of them it should show up. The bone setter project report (2012) stated that those SNPs are very rare in the British Isles and weren't found in anyone else in BritainsDNA's database, so I'm not sure of our chances.

There have been no definite high resolution matches to our cluster from outside the British Isles and Ireland until a recent 111 marker match from Sweden. Last week another new 60/67 marker match from Sweden appeared on my FTDNA 67 marker homepage too. There was also a new 111 marker Rox2 match with origins in Normandy recently. I don't know if any other DF27* people have ordered Chromo2. A fellow cluster match has Full Genomes results due any time as well so fingers crossed we should know more soon one way or the other.

TigerMW
10-29-2013, 03:18 AM
Any other DF27 people with Chromo 2 orders pending or results in?

We need to keep a list and collect/share the raw results as they come in

jcorden
12-13-2013, 09:21 PM
I have ordered the Chromo2 test - Corden B3990 - Z214+ Z279-

GabeGibeau
01-17-2014, 10:09 AM
Any other DF27 people with Chromo 2 orders pending or results in?

We need to keep a list and collect/share the raw results as they come in

Mike, I just uploaded my Chromo2 Raw YDNA test results data file (fB2323 Gibault) into the Yahoo Chromo2 DF27/S250 results folder yesterday...

- Roger -

DavidCar
01-19-2014, 04:29 AM
Mike, I just uploaded my Chromo2 Raw YDNA test results data file (fB2323 Gibault) into the Yahoo Chromo2 DF27/S250 results folder yesterday...

- Roger -

Looks like you've got all of Mikol Ryon's SNPs in the Z220 area. But he's got PF6780 / F411 and you've got S21184 and S334 / L277. I had an L277 come up in U106, so I don't know if it is an unstable SNP or an unreliable test. L277 is testable at FTDNA.

DavidCar
01-19-2014, 01:52 PM
Looks like you've got all of Mikol Ryon's SNPs in the Z220 area. But he's got PF6780 / F411 and you've got S21184 and S334 / L277. I had an L277 come up in U106, so I don't know if it is an unstable SNP or an unreliable test. L277 is testable at FTDNA.

Now the evidence suggests you don't have S344, and that all raw data before last week had GG-negative, and all raw data after last week will have AG-negative.

razyn
02-06-2014, 02:23 PM
I'm looking at what I think is a newly posted Chromo2 file for B2323 Gibault, who already had a Geno2 test posted in our R1b-DF27 project -- so it's the first side by side comparison I've seen (of the positive results only, from Geno2). Anyway it's hard enough finding the parallel nomenclature for these SNPs (of some interest for the phylogeny of the old North/South cluster), and I thought it might be useful to list them somewhere. Geno2 (FTDNA) name on the left, Chromo2 name on the right:
Z220 S356
Z295 S1217
CTS4065 S1221
Z270 Z270
Z210 *
CTS12074 S8070
Z216 Z216
Z278 *

The asterisks indicate a couple of SNPs I didn't find on the Chromo2 list, though that may only mean I still don't know what else they are called. The Notes section of the ISOGG R tree is very helpful, especially for SNPs not yet placed on the tree -- but only if somebody has told them the alternate name(s). The ones I have listed here apparently work, on Chromo2. Not all of them are found/working on Geno2, but most are.

razyn
02-20-2014, 08:54 PM
There is a new thread on this topic more broadly, that links to a large spreadsheet of data just released: http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?2210-Chromo2-Results-Data

I have been trying to mine it for information pertinent to DF27. This is to some extent an update of the previous two posts, above, but it will contain a lot more detail.

The format of the Chromo2 results spreadsheet only lends itself to one name for a SNP, in most (but not all) cases the S-series used by that lab, BISDNA. There are over 14,000 SNPs listed, with a row for each; and there are 2,000 columns, each representing a unique sample with some SNP called for it. This isn't necessarily the "terminal" SNP for the sample in question, though it's a good hint to it. Anyway, I want to include known subclades of DF27 in the total for that level, and then break down the numbers as possible for several of its identified subclades. I'll use two or more names for most SNPs.

R1b S116/P312: DF27/S250 Columns AHF through AJO, (62) samples not broken down further
Z214/S348: AJP (1)
Z196/S355: AJQ-AKH (18)
Z209/S230 = Z220/S356: AKI-ALE (23), plus some grouped elsewhere: AJP, AFV, AFW (3) = total (26)
[Z295 has not been found on the Chromo2 chip, but is below Z220 and above the next two]
CTS4065/S1221 (under Z220): AKM, AKQ, AKS, AKX, AKZ, ALA, ALC (7)
Z270 (under Z220): AKI, AJP, AFV, AFW (4)
Z278/S181: AFV, AFW (2)
DF17/S455: not found [edit: I am informed that S229 may substitute for DF17: AGD-AGJ (7)]
L165/S68: BWJ-BWU (12)
SRY2627/S251: BWV-BXL (17)

Counting only the totals in bold (because the listed subclade members are included in them) that makes 142 known DF27 samples, out of 2,000 -- or 7.10% of the not especially random, mostly Isles-origin population represented in this Chromo2-tested sample. Of the 80 examples identified more specifically than DF27/S250, there are 26 on the Z220 side, 29 on the L176.2 side, 7 presumed DF17, and 18 elsewhere (unspecified) in the Z196 branch. That leaves 62 more, 44% of the DF27 total, not yet accounted for more specifically. It may just be a matter of my not yet knowing what else BISDNA calls them; or perhaps they are hiding in places I haven't looked. Anyway, this is a start. It will get more complex before it gets simpler.

razyn
02-24-2014, 05:21 AM
Attempting to delete duplicate content.

razyn
02-24-2014, 05:31 AM
I've spent some more time visually scanning the relevant columns in the new Chromo2 results, and have added only a few such columns (DF27 people not picked up earlier), but a good many rows of interest, or potentially so. It might prove helpful to somebody who plans to play with this spreadsheet but hasn't yet gotten around to it; so this is my current update. I have listed the SNPs in phylogenetic tree order, usually with the more familiar FTDNA name first, although this chip normally uses the S-series name. The SNP name is followed in brackets by the number of the row in which it is found -- or a brief note, e.g. to explain that it is not found. Letters after the semicolon are the column headings for the samples in which that SNP is derived -- or in several cases (especially under Z295 and Z198), assumed to be derived on the basis of their subclades, although the posted Chromo2 result is a no-call. [I think column designations are preferable to the sample numbers, because the latter are not sequential on the spreadsheet, and the "search" function seems to hang up, rather than actually finding anything within the document.]

All DF27 results should be found under R1b-P312/S116, somewhere. Most had already been counted, in my previous post. DF17 (S229) results that I had initially missed brought the total to 142 (and I corrected that in edit). Seven new ones that I've just run across are grouped together, in columns AGD through AGJ; they were separated from the Z196 results by DF19/S232 (which is not under DF27), and I hadn't seen them because I wasn't scanning that widely. My screen won't allow it, at a font size I can read. The new ones are Z274+ (S229), and raise the DF27 total to 149/1,999, or 7.45% of the current, Chromo2 tested sample. My formatting (with tabs, etc.) is not retained in standard posting, so I have taken a screen shot of a formatted version to post it as a picture.

I haven't yet tried to look up unique S-series SNP positions in David Reynolds' Compendium, nor in GBrowse, nor in Chris Morley's experimental haplotree. This is strictly an eyeball exercise, and my eyeballs are tired. I hope there aren't too many errors or omissions; we have to start somewhere, and I just hope this kicks the can down the road a bit.

1489

razyn
02-24-2014, 05:34 AM
Attempting to delete duplicate content.

EastAnglian
02-24-2014, 09:58 AM
Does anyone know if the Chromo2 test has yielded any results for Z2552?, this is the SNP above L617 and there are some in Iberia that are Z2552* so L617-, see the tree below:

http://www.yfull.com/tree/R1b1a2a1a2/

Not sure what the S name for this SNP is though, I should add that according the tree there is an SNP below called Z2571 , found in England and Scotland.

Rathna
02-24-2014, 12:10 PM
Does anyone know if the Chromo2 test has yielded any results for Z2552?, this is the SNP above L617 and there are some in Iberia that are Z2552* so L617-, see the tree below:

http://www.yfull.com/tree/R1b1a2a1a2/

Not sure what the S name for this SNP is though, I should add that according the tree there is an SNP below called Z2571 , found in England and Scotland.

From the 1KGP it seems that Z2552 is under R-DF27 and that L617 is under Z2552:
R-Z2552
R1b1a2a1a2a2 L617
HG01606 IBS
R-Z2552*
HG02002 PEL
HG01121 CLM
HG01506 IBS
HG01395 PUR
HG01182 PUR
but from Geno 2.0 it seems not:
2525 R1b1a2a1a2a2 L617 [1/2]
2526 5928GB-E (Duplicate call: Z274. Presumed PF3236-, Z210-, Z215-, Z220- and Z274-.)
2527 R1b1a2a1a2a21 125 CTS11556 R3 [1/1], F2125 R3 [1/1], Z24 R2 [1/1]
2528 N113736 (Unexpected negative calls: L617- [1 level above, at R1b1a2a1a2a2], DF27- [2 levels above, at R1b1a2a1a2a]. Duplicate call: L617 [1 level above, at R1b1a2a1a2a2].)

razyn
02-24-2014, 03:53 PM
I have added Z225/S225, overlooked on my previous attempt. Also, the DF17 placement is amended, based on ISOGG "Notes" statement that CTS7768/S1307 "is located under Z195 and Z196, mutually exclusive with Z209, Z220, and L176.2, and is approximately equivalent to DF17. Listed 19 March 2013."

Last night I found it very difficult to deal with the edit and deletion functions, especially with respect to an illustration. So I am posting this improved version separately.

1491

EastAnglian
02-25-2014, 09:11 AM
From the 1KGP it seems that Z2552 is under R-DF27 and that L617 is under Z2552:
R-Z2552
R1b1a2a1a2a2 L617
HG01606 IBS
R-Z2552*
HG02002 PEL
HG01121 CLM
HG01506 IBS
HG01395 PUR
HG01182 PUR
but from Geno 2.0 it seems not:
2525 R1b1a2a1a2a2 L617 [1/2]
2526 5928GB-E (Duplicate call: Z274. Presumed PF3236-, Z210-, Z215-, Z220- and Z274-.)
2527 R1b1a2a1a2a21 125 CTS11556 R3 [1/1], F2125 R3 [1/1], Z24 R2 [1/1]
2528 N113736 (Unexpected negative calls: L617- [1 level above, at R1b1a2a1a2a2], DF27- [2 levels above, at R1b1a2a1a2a]. Duplicate call: L617 [1 level above, at R1b1a2a1a2a2].)

So how do we work out which is correct?, more data required?

razyn
02-25-2014, 03:59 PM
So how do we work out which is correct?, more data required?

I don't think one is correct and the other incorrect, broadly speaking. The Chromo2 results only included three people from the Iberian branch under Z220, whereas the 1000 Genomes project (which had 18 of them) apparently didn't find, or name, several SNPs the rest of us Z220 guys have. What one finds is clearly a function of whom one samples -- as well as some of the other criteria (whether it's one pass or many, Affy or Illumina, Sanger or NextGen, etc.). Chromo2 didn't test Z2552 by that name; but I have no idea whether it tests that mutation by some other name -- such as S with four or more digits after it. The sources I have for decoding BISDNA names currently only include a small fraction of the several thousand on their chip. But I still think the spreadsheet under discussion is useful for sorting the people it includes... whoever they are.

corner
03-05-2014, 01:28 PM
No SNPs were found downstream of DF27/S250 for me (DF27** 'Rox2' cluster match) from Chromo2. This is the same outcome as other cluster matches found with Geno 2.0, although Geno 2.0 didn't test for DF27 itself and Chromo2 did.

I think 60 other DF27+/Z196- tests, out of the 149 DF27/S250 Chromo2 tests noted by razyn above, appear to be in the same boat, negative for all currently known SNPs downstream of DF27. That seems a lot of undefined DF27.

Rainyone
04-21-2014, 02:31 PM
I've had Chromo 2 results back recently which technically placed me under the R1b 250 subtype. However I don't have any of the seven downstream markers.

Does anyone have advise for a beginner on what the next step is narrowing down my terminal SNP.

CTS10149+, CTS11150+, CTS11468+, CTS11575+, CTS11948+, CTS11991+, CTS12057+, CTS12633+, CTS12773+, CTS1738+, CTS2134+, CTS2254+, CTS2480+, CTS2569+, CTS2664+, CTS3229+, CTS3315+, CTS3316+, CTS3358+, CTS3654+, CTS3818+, CTS3844+, CTS4293+, CTS4437+, CTS4740+, CTS4944+, CTS5139(+), CTS5248+, CTS543+, CTS6327+, CTS6376+, CTS6383+, CTS6445+, CTS7206+, CTS7301+, CTS7604+, CTS7659+, CTS7922+, CTS7941+, CTS8627+, CTS8728+, CTS9200+, CTS9556+, CTS9760+, F1794+, L1002+, L1013+, L1053+, L1084+, L1098+, L1105+, L1118+, L1123+, L1129+, L1130+, L1137+, L1143+, L1145+, L1150+, L1179+, L1220+, L132+, L1345+, L1350+, L1352+, L265+, L278+, L320+, L352+, L438+, L440+, L468+, L470+, L479+, L498+, L508+, L543+, L58+, L604+, L741+, L752+, L757+, L768+, L773+, L822+, L82+, L875+, L882+, L969+, M213+, M235+, M294+, M299+, M415+, M42+, M523+, M526+, M74+, P128+, P131+, P135+, P139+, P140+, P141+, P142+, P143+, P151+, P158+, P159+, P160+, P163+, P224+, P225+, P226+, P229+, P230+, P232+, P233+, P234+, P236+, P239+, P242+, P244+, P245+, P280+, P282+, P284+, P285+, P294+, P295+, P297+, P305+, P310+, PAGE081+, PAGE083+, PF1030+, PF1067+, PF1081+, PF1252+, PF1253+, PF1416+, PF1695+, PF1911+, PF256+, PF2590+, PF2592+, PF2615+, PF2617+, PF2619+, PF2621+, PF2622+, PF2624+, PF2626+, PF2629+, PF2651+, PF2653+, PF2655+, PF2658+, PF2660+, PF2677+, PF2679+, PF2683+, PF2684+, PF2685+, PF2688+, PF2690+, PF2700+, PF2702+, PF2704+, PF2709+, PF2716+, PF2718+, PF2722+, PF2734+, PF2736+, PF2737+, PF2739+, PF2742+, PF2747+, PF2748+, PF2760+, PF2762+, PF2775+, PF3495+, PF3500+, PF5459+, PF5461+, PF5480+, PF5495+, PF5857+, PF5861+, PF5865+, PF5869+, PF5870+, PF5872+, PF5873+, PF5885+, PF5887+, PF5893+, PF5898+, PF5908+, PF5912+, PF5914+, PF5917+, PF5918+, PF5923+, PF5927+, PF5936+, PF5940+, PF5941+, PF5945+, PF5949+, PF5953+, PF5957+, PF5958+, PF5964+, PF5966+, PF5977+, PF5980+, PF5981+, PF5982+, PF6016+, PF6040+, PF6047+, PF6055+, PF6056+, PF6063+, PF6065+, PF6079+, PF6082+, PF6114+, PF6115+, PF6116+, PF6129+, PF6136+, PF6143+, PF6145+, PF6242+, PF6246+, PF6249+, PF6252+, PF6258+, PF6263+, PF6265+, PF6267+, PF6269+, PF626+, PF6271+, PF6272+, PF6399+, PF6409+, PF6410+, PF6419+, PF6429+, PF6430+, PF6432+, PF6434+, PF6435+, PF643+, PF6443+, PF6451+, PF6463+, PF6467+, PF6469+, PF6471+, PF6475+, PF6481+, PF6484+, PF6487+, PF6495+, PF6497+, PF6506+, PF6507+, PF6524+, PF6528+, PF653+, PF6541+, PF679+, PF733+, PF744+, PF825(+), PF834+, PF869+, PF948+, S11330(+), S1159+, S11638+, S116+, S12547(+), S128+, S138+, S1572+, S163(+), S1984(+), S19862(+), S1+, S2003+, S2017+, S20246+, S20315+, S250+, S26361+, S26903+, S349+, S351+, S3848+, S3+, S4888+, S4+, S6378+, S8235+, S8709+, S9158+, S959+, SRY10831(+), V102+, V104+, V126+, V168+, V186+, V187+, V221+, V226+, V231+, V241+, V29+, V41+, V52+, V9+, YSC0167+, YSC0186+, YSC0203+, YSC0227+, YSC1297+, Z1244+

JLRevilla
07-29-2014, 10:47 PM
Hello all!

Rainyone, as you mentioned, I also took the test and ended up negative for all seven current downstream markers. So I'm also stuck until someone with more knowledge of the matter chimes in.
=)

My signature on the Chromo2 is, I believe, identical to yours at first sight:

CTS10149+, CTS11150+, CTS11468+, CTS11575+, CTS11948+, CTS11991+, CTS12057+, CTS12633+, CTS12773+, CTS1738+, CTS2134+, CTS2254+, CTS2480+, CTS2569+, CTS2664+, CTS3229+, CTS3315+, CTS3316+, CTS3358+, CTS3654+, CTS3818+, CTS3844+, CTS4293+, CTS4437+, CTS4740+, CTS4944+, CTS5139(+), CTS5248+, CTS543+, CTS6327+, CTS6376+, CTS6383+, CTS6445+, CTS7301+, CTS7604+, CTS7659+, CTS7922+, CTS7941+, CTS8627+, CTS8728+, CTS9200+, CTS9556+, CTS9760+, F1794+, L1002+, L1013+, L1053+, L1084+, L1098+, L1105+, L1118+, L1123+, L1129+, L1130+, L1137+, L1143+, L1145+, L1150+, L1179+, L1220+, L132+, L1345+, L1350+, L1352+, L265+, L278+, L320+, L352+, L438+, L440+, L468+, L470+, L479+, L498+, L508+, L543+, L58+, L604+, L741+, L752+, L757+, L768+, L773+, L822+, L82+, L875+, L882+, L969+, M213+, M235+, M294+, M299+, M415+, M42+, M523+, M526+, M74+, P128+, P131+, P135+, P139+, P140+, P141+, P142+, P143+, P151+, P158+, P159+, P160+, P163+, P224+, P225+, P226+, P229+, P230+, P232+, P233+, P234+, P236+, P239+, P242+, P244+, P245+, P280+, P282+, P284+, P285+, P294+, P295+, P297+, P305+, P310+, PAGE081+, PAGE083+, PF1030+, PF1067+, PF1081+, PF1252+, PF1253+, PF1416+, PF1695+, PF1911+, PF256+, PF2590+, PF2592+, PF2615+, PF2617+, PF2619+, PF2621+, PF2622+, PF2624+, PF2626+, PF2629+, PF2640+, PF2651+, PF2653+, PF2655+, PF2658+, PF2660+, PF2677+, PF2679+, PF2683+, PF2684+, PF2685+, PF2688+, PF2690+, PF2700+, PF2702+, PF2704+, PF2709+, PF2716+, PF2718+, PF2722+, PF2734+, PF2736+, PF2737+, PF2739+, PF2742+, PF2747+, PF2748+, PF2760+, PF2762+, PF2775+, PF3495+, PF3500+, PF5459+, PF5461+, PF5480+, PF5495+, PF5857+, PF5861+, PF5865+, PF5869+, PF5870+, PF5872+, PF5873+, PF5885+, PF5887+, PF5893+, PF5898+, PF5908+, PF5912+, PF5914+, PF5917+, PF5918+, PF5923+, PF5927+, PF5936+, PF5940+, PF5941+, PF5945+, PF5949+, PF5953+, PF5957+, PF5958+, PF5964+, PF5966+, PF5977+, PF5980+, PF5981+, PF5982+, PF6016+, PF6040+, PF6047+, PF6055+, PF6056+, PF6063+, PF6065+, PF6079+, PF6082+, PF6114+, PF6115+, PF6116+, PF6129+, PF6136+, PF6143+, PF6145+, PF6242+, PF6246+, PF6249+, PF6252+, PF6258+, PF6263+, PF6265+, PF6267+, PF6269+, PF626+, PF6271+, PF6272+, PF6399+, PF6409+, PF6410+, PF6419+, PF6429+, PF6430+, PF6432+, PF6434+, PF6435+, PF643+, PF6443+, PF6451+, PF6463+, PF6467+, PF6469+, PF6471+, PF6475+, PF6481+, PF6484+, PF6487+, PF6495+, PF6497+, PF6506+, PF6507+, PF6524+, PF6528+, PF653+, PF6541+, PF679+, PF733+, PF744+, PF825(+), PF834+, PF869+, PF948+, S11330(+), S1159+, S11638+, S116+, S12547(+), S128+, S138+, S1572+, S163(+), S1984(+), S19862(+), S1+, S2003+, S2017+, S20246+, S20315+, S250+, S26903+, S349+, S351+, S3848+, S3+, S4888+, S4+, S6378+, S8235+, S8709+, S9158+, S959+, SRY10831(+), V102+, V104+, V126+, V168+, V186+, V187+, V221+, V226+, V231+, V241+, V29+, V41+, V52+, V9+, YSC0167+, YSC0186+, YSC0203+, YSC0227+, YSC1297+, Z1244+

corner
07-30-2014, 01:01 PM
My signature on the Chromo2 is, I believe, identical to yours at first sight
Same here. I got the S250 'without any of the 7 downstream markers' result with Chromo2 - being negative for Z195/Z196, L617, Z215 (S357), Z225 (S225), Z229 (S359), L194, L1231, DF79, DF81, DF83, DF84, L221, L86, L1245 (S1264), L1246 (S1285), L881, S400.

The cluster I match only made progress later, when Z2571 and the 'missing' block of dozens of SNPs tracing back to the DF27 founder were found in recent FGC tests taken by two fellow cluster matches and a Big Y test taken by another.

Through so called 'next generation' testing, some of the above DF27+/Z196- relevant SNPs appear to be beginning to be found under newly identified, early subclades (parallel to Z196) downstream of DF27/S250, called Z2571 and Z2552.

It is possible that some currently DF27** people might find they're positive for, and downstream of, one of these more recently identified deep subclades of DF27, like we did. These are just the ones I know of there may well be more:

Z2552. DF81, Z15001 and L617 are parallel and thought to be below, or downstream of, Z2552.

Z2571. DF84 is parallel with 'Rox2' (FGC11395) and both are downstream of Z2571.

Z2571 is available for testing at YSEQ.net and FTDNA, I don't think Z2552 is offered for testing anywhere yet but SNPs can be 'wished' for at YSEQ.net

razyn
07-30-2014, 05:11 PM
I got the S250 'without any of the 7 downstream markers' result with Chromo2

Idly wonder which "seven" are the ones BISDNA is counting (just those with an S prefix?); but anyway this post (which I saw elsewhere today, in a Yahoo group) is an important summation of the roughly 20 SNP tests one could take to resolve one's questions about the meaning of "DF27+, Z195-" (or Z196-). And if a person takes them all at FTDNA (assuming that someday soon they will all be available there), that's $780. Even taking them in the right order would only cut it down a little; e.g. with Z2571- you could skip the DF84 test, etc. So, for someone just beginning this quest, Chromo2 is a pretty cost-effective route... although results from there don't post to FTDNA projects. And a person needs to be some sort of wizard to find some of these in Chromo2 results.

[Edit: I'm not at all sure that Chromo2 does test for the ones Chris has listed; clearly it tests for something more than the ones I found, but they may not be these. Anyway, a longer list is a better list -- and I think it's helpful to show how many possibilities there might be, outside of Z195/Z196. Testing for all of them (and more are being discovered) one at a time may take years, rather than weeks -- and could cost much more than currently available Big Y or Y Prime tests.]

I think S400 has some subclades, too. Or at least there are more SNPs in that series, maybe they are "equivalent."

corner
07-30-2014, 11:46 PM
[Edit: I'm not at all sure that Chromo2 does test for the ones Chris has listed
I am, they're in my Chromo2 Raw results file..

JLRevilla
08-06-2014, 06:24 PM
Finally got my Raw Data, I'm negative for all Z196, Z215, Z229, S400, L617, L194, L1231, DF79, DF81, DF83, DF84, L221, L86, L881.
I'll post my data to the Yahoo Group.

JLRevilla
08-28-2014, 08:47 PM
I just realized I'm positive for S1984 which appears to be below L165 if I'm reading the tree on the Yahoo Group correctly...
Since I've been wrong before, I'll wait until someone more experienced can confirm that being AA (positive) for S1984 is significant.
=)

razyn
08-29-2014, 04:55 AM
I replied to your Yahoo email (not to the group, it contained a more or less confidential document). Looks to me as if S1984 is multiply recurrent, and therefore not very useful. Your example, though real, would be a different (back-) mutation from the one found in some L165 guys.