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Missouri1455
08-12-2018, 04:35 AM
Any new information on E-V1515*?

WADIGAJI
09-01-2018, 11:22 AM
Nevgen says i am E-V1515....i am getting my snp results pertinent to E-Z827 from ftdna any time soon. I am fking nervous .....tantamount to opening a pandora box.

NetNomad
09-10-2018, 05:04 AM
Nevgen says i am E-V1515....i am getting my snp results pertinent to E-Z827 from ftdna any time soon. I am fking nervous .....tantamount to opening a pandora box.

https://yfull.com/arch-4.09/tree/E-V1515/

It connects V6, V42, and the famous Southeast African E-M293.

According to researchers it originated in the Northern part of the Horn of Africa.

We observed the highest frequency and diversity of this haplogroup in the northern part of the Horn of Africa (present day Eritrea and northern Ethiopia), where the majority of the deepest E-V1515 subhaplogroups and paragroups were found. In the southern part of the Horn (southern Ethiopia, Somalia and northern Kenya), haplogroup E-V1515 is almost exclusively represented by the recent (3.5 ka; 95% CI: 1.7–5.9 ka) subhaplogroup E-V1486. Further south, in southern Kenya and southern Africa, a single E-V1486 terminal clade, known as E-M293 (Henn et al. 2008), was found (fig. 3). This phylogeographic pattern is strongly suggestive of human movements from the northern part of the Horn to the Ethiopian/Kenyan borders between 12 ka (the coalescence of E-V1515) and 3.5 ka (the coalescence of E-V1486), and from here toward southern Africa across the equatorial belt in more recent times.[2]

It may prove that Cushites originated further North and that the South Cushites like the Iraqw could have origins from all the way in Eritrea thousands of years ago.

WADIGAJI
09-14-2018, 08:01 AM
Thanks NetNomad ….I just received my subclade from ftdna , and discovered I am indeed E-V6. A complete shock when I discovered I was an E and not J , since my autosomal admixture was 60 % middle eastern ,but now I am glad and at peace with being E-V6. Now on to dig even more for further analysis of this group.

Missouri1455
09-16-2018, 05:17 PM
Thanks NetNomad ….I just received my subclade from ftdna , and discovered I am indeed E-V6. A complete shock when I discovered I was an E and not J , since my autosomal admixture was 60 % middle eastern ,but now I am glad and at peace with being E-V6. Now on to dig even more for further analysis of this group.

Not surprising at all; most somalis, horn african brethrens, and some arabians tend to belong to the downstreams of E-V1515 such as E-V6, E-V42 and other more recent subclades; it seems to me the older these haplogroups get such as E-V1515* or E-M123 they tend to be found in areas like the Levant/Iraq, remnants of old natufians proved to belong to E-M123 and I assume similar cases would also be found for E-V1515*, up to now most subclades of E-V1515 that pop up in the Horn of Africa seem too recent; beside E-M298 which seems a purely African downstream; origination of E-V1515 seems more plausible in the Middle East rather than East Africa because Paternal lineages of E-Z827, E-Z830 and its downstreams of E-M123 seem to have more connection to the Middle East rather than East Africa; so if anything E-V1515* will eventually side with its Paternal lineages in terms of origin.

WADIGAJI
09-17-2018, 11:44 AM
Missouri , I am assuming you are a confirmed E-V1515*...and since E-V1515* is only found in Tigres of Eritrea , well, according to ethiohelix at least, can we assume you are Tigre? And as for the prevalence of E-V1515, doubt that is the case outside Eritrea and northern Ethiopia. Somalis are mostly E-V32 and not a whole of E-V1515 , especially E-V6 , E-V1785 and E-V42. Anyway, this results are from an awfully few samples , and thus any claim is to be consumed with a grain of salt. Too bad many Eritreans who underwent dna test want to remain anonymous ...even those with dna matches .

Missouri1455
02-18-2019, 01:30 PM
Missouri , I am assuming you are a confirmed E-V1515*...and since E-V1515* is only found in Tigres of Eritrea , well, according to ethiohelix at least, can we assume you are Tigre? And as for the prevalence of E-V1515, doubt that is the case outside Eritrea and northern Ethiopia. Somalis are mostly E-V32 and not a whole of E-V1515 , especially E-V6 , E-V1785 and E-V42. Anyway, this results are from an awfully few samples , and thus any claim is to be consumed with a grain of salt. Too bad many Eritreans who underwent dna test want to remain anonymous ...even those with dna matches .

There's many Saudis who pop on E-V1515; I believe it descended from the North similar to E-M123; most of the downstream in East Africa is too recent; for now the subclades appear mostly in Saudi Arabia; check the results below:
https://www.yfull.com/arch-4.03/tree/E-V1515/

Megalophias
02-18-2019, 08:32 PM
There's many Saudis who pop on E-V1515; I believe it descended from the North similar to E-M123; most of the downstream in East Africa is too recent; for now the subclades appear mostly in Saudi Arabia; check the results below:
https://www.yfull.com/arch-4.03/tree/E-V1515/
There are a bajillion Saudis (and other oil-rich Arabians) on YFull and very few East Africans, so it is a really bad source for such comparisons.

The study Ethiohelix was referring to is Trombetta et al (2015), "Phylogeographic Refinement and Large Scale Genotyping of Human Y Chromosome Haplogroup E Provide New Insights into the Dispersal of Early Pastoralists in the African Continent" (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4524485/). In this study the Eritrean sample had 37/166 (22%) E-V1515, belonging to all main branches except E-M293. Ethiopia had 35/197 (18%), Djibouti 14/57 (25%), and Somalia 1/5 (mind you these are not representative of overall populations). It's maybe a few percent in Saudi Arabia, but there are 31 Saudi samples on the YF tree and no Horners at all. The only East Africans are 4 E-M293 Kenyans from academic studies. (Neither has any Sudanese samples, unfortunately.)

Trombetta et al did not test all the SNPs to distinguish the subclades now known, but in Eritrea there are E-Y5919/V2881, E-V42, and E-V6, all the main clades full of Arabians on YF. There is E-GG24/V1785*(xV6), represented by a single Saudi on YF, in 2/20 Kunama and 10/32 Tigrai. On YF three members belong to E-Y29601, sister to E-M293; in Eritrea there is E-CTS1177/V1486*(xY5919, M293) which may or may not be the same thing, in 1/15 Nara and 1/32 Tigrai. Finally, on YF there are a Moroccan Jew, a Saudi, and an unidentified member in E-Y139639, most basal in E-V1515. In Eritrea there is E-V1515*(xCTS1177, V42, GG24) in 1/5 Tigre, 2/15 Nara, and 1/99 Portuguese (!), which again may or may not be the same thing.

E-V1515 is sister to E-PF1962, the most Asian branch of E-M35. But it doesn't follow that E-Z830 went to Asia and E-V1515 returned to Africa, rather than E-PF1962 having gone to Asia while E-V1515 remained in Africa.

Missouri1455
02-19-2019, 01:50 AM
There are a bajillion Saudis (and other oil-rich Arabians) on YFull and very few East Africans, so it is a really bad source for such comparisons.

The study Ethiohelix was referring to is Trombetta et al (2015), "Phylogeographic Refinement and Large Scale Genotyping of Human Y Chromosome Haplogroup E Provide New Insights into the Dispersal of Early Pastoralists in the African Continent" (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4524485/). In this study the Eritrean sample had 37/166 (22%) E-V1515, belonging to all main branches except E-M293. Ethiopia had 35/197 (18%), Djibouti 14/57 (25%), and Somalia 1/5 (mind you these are not representative of overall populations). It's maybe a few percent in Saudi Arabia, but there are 31 Saudi samples on the YF tree and no Horners at all. The only East Africans are 4 E-M293 Kenyans from academic studies. (Neither has any Sudanese samples, unfortunately.)

Trombetta et al did not test all the SNPs to distinguish the subclades now known, but in Eritrea there are E-Y5919/V2881, E-V42, and E-V6, all the main clades full of Arabians on YF. There is E-GG24/V1785*(xV6), represented by a single Saudi on YF, in 2/20 Kunama and 10/32 Tigrai. On YF three members belong to E-Y29601, sister to E-M293; in Eritrea there is E-CTS1177/V1486*(xY5919, M293) which may or may not be the same thing, in 1/15 Nara and 1/32 Tigrai. Finally, on YF there are a Moroccan Jew, a Saudi, and an unidentified member in E-Y139639, most basal in E-V1515. In Eritrea there is E-V1515*(xCTS1177, V42, GG24) in 1/5 Tigre, 2/15 Nara, and 1/99 Portuguese (!), which again may or may not be the same thing.

E-V1515 is sister to E-PF1962, the most Asian branch of E-M35. But it doesn't follow that E-Z830 went to Asia and E-V1515 returned to Africa, rather than E-PF1962 having gone to Asia while E-V1515 remained in Africa.

They need to do more testing for sure on Eritrea, Arabia, Levant, Eastern Sudan; but do you know when they'll update the testings with brand new results?

NetNomad
02-19-2019, 09:31 PM
They need to do more testing for sure on Eritrea, Arabia, Levant, Eastern Sudan; but do you know when they'll update the testings with brand new results?

Whole Y studies are still not that common due to the costs. They periodically update whenever they get new samples from scientific studies. Most samples on yfull are from private individuals from generally richer regions like Westerners and Gulf Arabs are overrepresented.

Missouri1455
02-27-2019, 03:12 PM
Whole Y studies are still not that common due to the costs. They periodically update whenever they get new samples from scientific studies. Most samples on yfull are from private individuals from generally richer regions like Westerners and Gulf Arabs are overrepresented.

Lets hope for more testings soon; most of the MENAs that do their testing are interested in knowing their Y-DNA; Y haplogroup studies are taken seriously in MENA; that even people with lower incomes will pass in their results; so most of these Y-Dna results that popup in the gulf has more to do with people wanting to know their tribal background than their determined social income; for example Y-dna testing is also common in areas like Yemen, Libya, Palestine, Syria, Morocco, Algeria, etc.

hmmit
03-24-2020, 07:51 PM
Hi All I have noticed your interest in the Eritrean Results under E-V1515 (E-GG24 or what is used to be E-V1785) and for your information I am from Eritrea origin as per ancestors is Tigray (Jabarti) and my results is under E-V1515 E-GG24 and my final result in YFULL is E-FGC85624*
https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-FGC85624/

what is interesting that I am away of 950 years of two Saudi cousins from Al-Dawaser Najd Area

If any one interested to get more details please email me at [email protected]

Lank
03-24-2020, 08:51 PM
It's notable that with just 2 Eritrean V1515 YFull samples (yours and a V6 sample), both share fairly recent ancestors with clades found in the Arabian samples.

Most of the Saudi V1515 YFull samples belong to V42, which Trombetta 2015 found at higher frequencies in Eritrean Nara and Kunama (Nilo-Saharan speakers).

hmmit
03-24-2020, 10:00 PM
It's notable that with just 2 Eritrean V1515 YFull samples (yours and a V6 sample), both share fairly recent ancestors with clades found in the Arabian samples.

Most of the Saudi V1515 YFull samples belong to V42, which Trombetta 2015 found at higher frequencies in Eritrean Nara and Kunama (Nilo-Saharan speakers).


Just FYI the other E-V6 result listed in YFULL is related to a person named Yemane Gebreselassie and he is an active member in FamilyTreeDNA Project E-M35_Project in case someone want to contact him

Espoir
04-18-2020, 08:57 PM
Since we are talking about E-V1515. It’s worth sharing that we got three Tutsis from Rwanda on YF. Link below
https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-M293/

WADIGAJI
08-29-2020, 11:53 AM
Since we are talking about E-V1515. Itís worth sharing that we got three Tutsis from Rwanda on YF. Link below
https://www.yfull.com/tree/E-M293/

This is getting interesting , Espoir . I am on yfull now , under E-V6---> E-Y178503. Anyway, I wonder how long ago those fellas in Tutsis migrated from Eritrea to Rwanda.....possibly over 10,000 years ago

Espoir
08-30-2020, 03:40 AM
This is getting interesting , Espoir . I am on yfull now , under E-V6---> E-Y178503. Anyway, I wonder how long ago those fellas in Tutsis migrated from Eritrea to Rwanda.....possibly over 10,000 years ago
E-M293 is strikingly the single most dominant in a sample of about 70 Tutsi men.

I think North-East Africans like Eritreans are key to understanding when these men migrated South. But, so far, we have ancient samples from the pastoral Neolithic that carry lots of E-M293.

E-V1515 is a fascinating haplogroup.

drobbah
08-30-2020, 04:07 AM
This is getting interesting , Espoir . I am on yfull now , under E-V6---> E-Y178503. Anyway, I wonder how long ago those fellas in Tutsis migrated from Eritrea to Rwanda.....possibly over 10,000 years ago
One of my top Somali matches who autosomally seems pure Somali is also E-V6.Perhaps Afar men were sometimes assimilated by nearby ethnic groups.

farjanomar
09-03-2020, 02:58 AM
Guys, when do you think, the price of deep Y is going to come down, so more People can get tested. The price is still too high.

Remember, also of the thousands of Horners/East Africans who tested 23andme Majority of them are New to Genealogy testing, so they do Not know

about the benefits of deep Y. Its Not only the Money! Almost all live in the West, 5-10% can afford it deep Y testing. We should convince Horners/East Africans

that They will Know their Clan/Tribe Heritage, then some of them might start taking the deep Y tests.

NetNomad
09-04-2020, 10:04 AM
Remember, also of the thousands of Horners/East Africans who tested 23andme Majority of them are New to Genealogy testing, so they do Not know

about the benefits of deep Y. Its Not only the Money! Almost all live in the West, 5-10% can afford it deep Y testing. We should convince Horners/East Africans.

A lot of East African Y diversity is being discovered by Gulf Arabs taking these tests. So that's a little bit of a benefit.

Sometimes it is difficult to tell whether a particular E lineage is ancient to Arabia or recently introduced, especially with E-M35 variants it can get tricky.

WADIGAJI
09-11-2020, 03:35 PM
I doubt Afar has a monopoly on E-V6. Information about Afar being predominantly E-V6 was from long ago and very few samples. And no Afar has been tested positive for E-V6 on Yfull or Ftdna.

WADIGAJI
09-11-2020, 03:35 PM
I doubt Afar has a monopoly on E-V6. Information about Afar being predominantly E-V6 was from long ago and very few samples. And no Afar has been tested positive for E-V6 on Yfull or Ftdna.

WADIGAJI
09-11-2020, 03:39 PM
ironically E-M293 is almost non-existent in Eritrea but is sporadically found in saudi arabia. ...as is evident on yfull and ftdna . I engaged a a saudi in a conversation and he was horrified he is related to tutsi .....his phenotype is clearly arab.

drobbah
09-11-2020, 06:01 PM
I doubt Afar has a monopoly on E-V6. Information about Afar being predominantly E-V6 was from long ago and very few samples. And no Afar has been tested positive for E-V6 on Yfull or Ftdna.
Never said they had a monopoly but they probably have a founder effect similar to Somalis with E-V32 &T-M70 due to being nomadic.If you are Eritrean it is still a possibility that you carry the Afar E-V6 but we will never know until the Afars start taking the BigY

WADIGAJI
09-11-2020, 08:59 PM
Never said they had a monopoly but they probably have a founder effect similar to Somalis with E-V32 &T-M70 due to being nomadic.If you are Eritrean it is still a possibility that you carry the Afar E-V6 but we will never know until the Afars start taking the BigY

You calling it '"the Afar E-V6" is precisely why i said about the monopoly. I am Eritrean and am not afar. All of my E-V6 matches on 23andme,ftdna, and yfull are all non-afar. Afar are not a monolithic society like somali who are predominantly E-V32. Afars a mix bag of 3 or 4 haplogroups, with no particular haplogroup to stand out .

drobbah
09-11-2020, 09:08 PM
You calling it '"the Afar E-V6" is precisely why i said about the monopoly. I am Eritrean and am not afar. All of my E-V6 matches on 23andme,ftdna, and yfull are all non-afar. Afar are not a monolithic society like somali who are predominantly E-V32. Afars a mix bag of 3 or 4 haplogroups, with no particular haplogroup to stand out .
Afars are Eritrean too... and when I said Afar V6 I meant the subclade of V6 that Afar probably belong too.Somalis for example belong to our own subclade of E-V32 and T-M70.This is why I said we need Afar Big-Y testers to see which subclade they fall under, it is a possibility you might fall under the same recent branch as them or a totaly different divergent one.Plus Eritrean isn't an ethnicity, your ethnicity is Tigray

WADIGAJI
09-11-2020, 10:14 PM
Afars are Eritrean too... and when I said Afar V6 I meant the subclade of V6 that Afar probably belong too.Somalis for example belong to our own subclade of E-V32 and T-M70.This is why I said we need Afar Big-Y testers to see which subclade they fall under, it is a possibility you might fall under the same recent branch as them or a totaly different divergent one.Plus Eritrean isn't an ethnicity, your ethnicity is Tigray

Yes, Afars are Eritreans. Afars are Ethiopians. Afars are Djoubitians. No dispute there. The question is if Afars are mainly E-V6. I doubt it. I have yet to see a single Afar test positive for E-V6. Most E-V6 on Yfull and ftdna and 23andme are Saudis and Tigrigna and Jeberti. By the way , most Eritreans are either J or E-V32.....this is my opinion based on the number of my matches on 23andme and has to be taken with a grain of salt. p/s my yfull matches(5 of them) are all from saudi...my terminal is E-Y178503*

NetNomad
09-15-2020, 11:12 PM
Yes, Afars are Eritreans. Afars are Ethiopians. Afars are Djoubitians. No dispute there. The question is if Afars are mainly E-V6. I doubt it. I have yet to see a single Afar test positive for E-V6. Most E-V6 on Yfull and ftdna and 23andme are Saudis and Tigrigna and Jeberti. By the way , most Eritreans are either J or E-V32.....this is my opinion based on the number of my matches on 23andme and has to be taken with a grain of salt. p/s my yfull matches(5 of them) are all from saudi...my terminal is E-Y178503*

Afars don't have a big diaspora. Most people who do these DNA tests live in Western countries or the Gulf countries.

Most of the Horner diaspora in the West is usually Tigray/Tigrinya, Amhara, Oromo or Somali.

Alfa
09-16-2020, 01:31 AM
ironically E-M293 is almost non-existent in Eritrea but is sporadically found in saudi arabia. ...as is evident on yfull and ftdna . I engaged a a saudi in a conversation and he was horrified he is related to tutsi .....his phenotype is clearly arab.

I have seen arabs with E-M293 who look llike modern semites, but they were not horrified to be related to subsaharians, they seemed more open minded to find about the origin of E-M293. Regarding E-M293 mutation origin, all available evidences point to modern day Kenya or Southern Ethiopia. Hopefully, Ancient dna in the Horn will tell us more about the missing link.

NetNomad
09-16-2020, 09:23 AM
I have seen arabs with E-M293 who look llike modern semites, but they were not horrified to be related to subsaharians, they seemed more open minded to find about the origin of E-M293. Regarding E-M293 mutation origin, all available evidences point to modern day Kenya or Southern Ethiopia. Hopefully, Ancient dna in the Horn will tell us more about the missing link.

I think only the ignorant ones are shocked. The more educated peninsular Arabians who studied the history of their countries should know about the various populations that were brought over to Arabia and the history of trading and empire that occurred. Only Bedouin stock 'rural/desert' origin Arabians should expect to have only 'Semite' lineages.

The ones from historic trading hubs like Jeddah, Makkah, Basra/Kuwait, Aden, Muscat etc are foolish if they assume that they are 100% Semitic/Arabian.

WADIGAJI
09-29-2020, 08:42 AM
I think only the ignorant ones are shocked. The more educated peninsular Arabians who studied the history of their countries should know about the various populations that were brought over to Arabia and the history of trading and empire that occurred. Only Bedouin stock 'rural/desert' origin Arabians should expect to have only 'Semite' lineages.

The ones from historic trading hubs like Jeddah, Makkah, Basra/Kuwait, Aden, Muscat etc are foolish if they assume that they are 100% Semitic/Arabian.

How do we know who migrated where first. Given the origin of E-M35 ,and the route most of its subclades took, say E-v3 or E-M34, it is quite possible the the E-M293 in arabia are indigenous to peninsula and also possible some of their homies somehow crossed the redsea and kept moving all the way to Ruwanda. 3000 years of mixing can change the color and features of a a society

WADIGAJI
09-29-2020, 09:58 AM
True .....so till we see a significant number of Afar's dna results , we should refrain from speculation.