DNA results of my Kurdish father

[Hawrê Mahmoud]

Hello my name is Ariyan, I am half Kurdish half Dutch and I am posting this on behalf of my father. I have the results of my fathers DNA, and would like to ask the people on this forum to help me to interpet it.

My father is from Silêmanî, and we have lived there for about 7 generations. But our family story recalls that we are originally from Sherwan-e Mezin village, near Barzan, Behdînan. Maybe from Sherwani tribe? Some of the names in my paternal line aren't (according to my own knowlegde) very common amongst Kurds. Such as, Mikail and Êlyas. The furthest grandparent we can recall was called Eziz Axa,the father of Mikail.

According to what I observe myself, it seems that my father has some Arab admixture?

I hope you people can help me determine whether we are Kurdish, something else, which type of Kurds we are close to or what special admixture we have. See the information below:


Gedrosia K3 admixture

Population
E_Eurasian 8.89 Pct
SSA 3.93 Pct
W_Eurasian 87.19 Pct

Dodecad

# Population Percent
1 Caucasus 37.73
2 Gedrosia 25.48
3 Southwest_Asian 14.9
4 North_European 7.1
5 Atlantic_Med 6.91
6 South_Asian 3.6
7 Northwest_African 1.76
8 East_African 1.5
9 Siberian 1.02
10 East_Asian 0.01

Eurogenes K13

# Population Percent
1 West_Asian 40.97
2 East_Med 28.78
3 Red_Sea 7.9
4 South_Asian 6.81
5 Baltic 5.37
6 West_Med 4.73
7 North_Atlantic 2.07
8 Northeast_African 1.73
9 Oceanian 0.81
10 Siberian 0.69
11 Amerindian 0.13

Eurogenes K36

Population
Amerindian -
Arabian 4.77 Pct
Armenian 8.18 Pct
Basque -
Central_African -
Central_Euro 0.56 Pct
East_African -
East_Asian -
East_Balkan 0.65 Pct
East_Central_Asian -
East_Central_Euro -
East_Med 16.75 Pct
Eastern_Euro -
Fennoscandian -
French -
Iberian -
Indo-Chinese -
Italian 6.11 Pct
Malayan -
Near_Eastern 17.59 Pct
North_African -
North_Atlantic -
North_Caucasian 16.89 Pct
North_Sea 0.76 Pct
Northeast_African 0.46 Pct
Oceanian -
Omotic -
Pygmy -
Siberian -
South_Asian -
South_Central_Asian 20.41 Pct
South_Chinese -
Volga-Ural 0.69 Pct
West_African -
West_Caucasian 6.16 Pct
West_Med -

MDLP K23b

# Population Percent
1 Caucasian 37.31
2 South_Central_Asian 26.36
3 Near_East 14.48
4 North_African 6.16
5 South_Indian 4.47
6 European_Hunters_Gatherers 3.93
7 European_Early_Farmers 2.52
8 East_African 2.17
9 Amerindian 1.36
10 Ancestral_Altaic 1.12
11 Tungus-Altaic 0.11

MDLP World-22

# Population Percent
1 West-Asian 45.78
2 Atlantic_Mediterranean_Neolithic 19.98
3 Near_East 17.86
4 Indian 5.57
5 Indo-Iranian 3.27
6 North-East-European 2.74
7 North-Amerind 1.72
8 Sub-Saharian 1.16
9 Samoedic 0.77
10 North-European-Mesolithic 0.67
11 Austronesian 0.24
12 Arctic-Amerind 0.24

puntDNAL K10

# Population Percent
1 CHG 41.53
2 ENF 34.55
3 ASI 11.68
4 WHG 6.92
5 Sub-Saharan 3.01
6 Siberian 1.69
7 Amerindian 0.62

[StarDS9]

Thanks for the results, your father seems similar to other Kurds, but he seems to have some African ancestry, probably due maybe some Arab ancestry?

[Hawrê Mahmoud]

Yeah my guess is that this has been carried via the Arab admixture? But it still seems tiny?

[Lupus82]

Can you post the ancestry results of your father in the genetic company tested? I wonder how it is.

[Hawrê Mahmoud]

This is from 23andme

Western Asian 93.7%
North African & Arabian 2.7%
Broadly Western Asian & North African 2.1%

Sub-Saharan African 0.5%
Sudanese 0.2%
Broadly Northern East African 0.3%

East Asian & Native American 0.3%
Broadly East Asian & Native American 0.3%

European 0.2%
Broadly Southern European 0.1%
Broadly European 0.1%

Unassigned 0.5%

[Lupus82]

I think your father has both Turkmen/Turkish and Arab ancestors among his bloodline a few generations back. It is a few centuries back that their genes have diluted.

[Hawrê Mahmoud]

His mother (my grandmother) had a Turkish mother from Instanbul, could that explain your conclusion?

[Targum]

The names "Mikail and Êlyas" sound possibly Assyrian, more remotely Jewish (Mikhael and Eliyahu).

[Hawrê Mahmoud]

Targum I think the DNA results already disproved that he could be Assyrian..

EDIT: The father of Mikail was called Eziz Axa, Assyrians dont have Aghas, rather maliks. Also Shirwan-e Mazin had no Assyrian presence.

[Lupus82]

His mother (my grandmother) had a Turkish mother from Instanbul, could that explain your conclusion?

Yes, this confirms my conclusion.


The names "Mikail and Êlyas" sound possibly Assyrian, more remotely Jewish (Mikhael and Eliyahu).

Such names are common among Muslim populations as well. It is due to Islam. They just pronounce them a little differently.

[Targum]

Yes, this confirms my conclusion.



Such names are common among Muslim populations as well. It is due to Islam. They just pronounce them a little differently.

True; but at least based on my experience with Arabs and Circassian in Israel, both names are rare. Maybe other Muslim populations use them more

[Lupus82]

These names are extremely common in Turkey, both among Kurds and Turks. In fact, up to the recent past, the most common names were of Abrahamic origin. Only recently authentic names have been appearing.

[Tomasso29]

Targum I think the DNA results already disproved that he could be Assyrian..

EDIT: The father of Mikail was called Eziz Axa, Assyrians dont have Aghas, rather maliks. Also Shirwan-e Mazin had no Assyrian presence.

It's really hard disproving Assyrian admixture in Kurds or vice versa given that both populations lived in the same area and may have a little of one another.

As far as Agha and Malik goes, what you're describing is a little inaccurate. For starters, the Assyrian people in general were never tribal like the neighboring Kurds. They had families and clans but their structure was very different. There was however some tribal Assyrians that lived in the western parts of Hakkari that did have a similar tribal system as the Kurdish tribes, notably they were known as Tiyari (This was the biggest one and divided into two, north and south), Jeelu, Baz, and Tkhooma. There may have been smaller tribes around the same region but these were the 4 well known ones. The term Malik mostly existed among them, and it means land owner in Arabic. This was a title given to the head of the tribe. Outside of these tribes the term Malik was not used that much, but there might have been some Assyrians that did use the title if they owned land. The same applies to the term Agha, sometimes an elder in the village may be given the title, other times it may be a folk hero (Agha Petros is a good example).

Back to the names you mentioned, all of them are very common among Assyrians, and your Y-DNA is actually the same haplogroup as my mother's family (Tested my maternal uncle). It's very fascinating because the names Elias and Mikhail show up in their family tree I believe which traces back around 12 generations. But they trace their background to the region of Simel which is in the western part of Dohuk province, and they apparently migrated to the village of Alqosh about 150-250 years ago (Alqosh is where my grandfather and great grandfather were born).

[Magnetic]

from where exactly are you from ? there are some differences (not much though) to usual kurdish results

[Tomasso29]

from where exactly are you from ? there are some differences (not much though) to usual kurdish results

Are you asking me? I'm from Iraq, but I have ancestry from Iraq, Iran, and Turkey across all my lines. I'm just saying that it's hard disproving Assyrian ancestry in Kurds or Kurdish ancestry in Assyrians if we're talking about many generations ago. For all intends and purposes, if he had an Assyrian ancestor hundreds of years ago, I doubt it would be detectable given that Assyrians and Kurds aren't that different in DNA.

[Magnetic]

Are you asking me? I'm from Iraq, but I have ancestry from Iraq, Iran, and Turkey across all my lines. I'm just saying that it's hard disproving Assyrian ancestry in Kurds or Kurdish ancestry in Assyrians if we're talking about many generations ago. For all intends and purposes, if he had an Assyrian ancestor hundreds of years ago, I doubt it would be detectable given that Assyrians and Kurds aren't that different in DNA.

no I meant OP :)

well all northern west asian people have overlaps and at least partly same ancestors . Assyrian - Kurdish is like German-Hungarian , Italian-Spanish , Korean-Chinese etc. I guess . if you know what I mean

I am surprised by your view though because in my experience from these forums most Assyrians dont like us Kurds much

[Tomasso29]

no I meant OP :)

well all northern west asian people have overlaps and at least partly same ancestors . Assyrian - Kurdish is like German-Hungarian , Italian-Spanish , Korean-Chinese etc. I guess . if you know what I mean

Yea that's a good way to look at it, they're both pretty much Western Asians.


I am surprised by your view though because in my experience from these forums most Assyrians dont like us Kurds much

Not sure which Assyrians you're referring to on here, but the Assyrians that don't like Kurds are usually a diaspora vocal minority. In real life Assyrians and Kurds get along just fine, and back home they generally share the same struggles. We do have a history, but history is history, and people need to move on and treat others based on their actions, not based on their ancestors.

[Magnetic]

Yea that's a good way to look at it, they're both pretty much Western Asians.



Not sure which Assyrians you're referring to on here, but the Assyrians that don't like Kurds are usually a diaspora vocal minority. In real life Assyrians and Kurds get along just fine, and back home they generally share the same struggles. We do have a history, but history is history, and people need to move on and treat others based on their actions, not based on their ancestors.

well me personally I dont have anything against assyrians at all . I actually cant remember to ever met an assyrian in real life either . I view assyrians as fellow west asian people and dont feel any hatred or anything