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Censored
10-05-2018, 01:42 AM
Hey guys, Xcode is releasing a beta update for the ancestry report. Follow the link to learn more:

https://www.xcode.life/product/ftdna-ancestry-dna-23andme-updated-ancestry-results/?utm_source=newsletter&utm_campaign=crick

Lollybolly
10-05-2018, 10:29 AM
I hope my results are going to be more accurate than their first report LOL

Censored
10-05-2018, 11:10 AM
Updated results:

2647326474

Censored
10-05-2018, 11:11 AM
I hope my results are going to be more accurate than their first report LOL

Did you sign up for it? Mine says I am more bengali than telgu, so my hopes are already crushed.

Lollybolly
10-05-2018, 11:32 AM
My results are VERY VERY strange. So, it says I am 100% Punjabi... what?
264752647626477

Plus, they uploaded my mtDNA, which is now W (that makes more sense). mtDNA W is widely spread in the region of Caucasus and presents high frequency in Northern Pakistan.

Censored
10-05-2018, 11:50 AM
My results are VERY VERY strange. So, it says I am 100% Punjabi... what?
264752647626477

Plus, they uploaded my mtDNA, which is now W (that makes more sense). mtDNA W is widely spread in the region of Caucasus and presents high frequency in Northern Pakistan.

LOL I can’t even...100% Punjabi and you’re not that at all? A split between multiple SA ethnicities might make sense but that’s too much...at least we got 100% South Asian this time. :confused:

Lollybolly
10-05-2018, 12:29 PM
LOL I can’t even...100% Punjabi and you’re not that at all? A split between multiple SA ethnicities might make sense but that’s too much...at least we got 100% South Asian this time. :confused:

It doesn't make any sense. In terms of admixture, I score near 50% Sindhi and only 5% Punjabi (under the 50% South Asia). But in terms of the ML calculator, I score 100% Punjabi and 0% Sindhi even though my punjabi admixture is literally 1% of my entire genetics.

agent_lime
10-05-2018, 12:36 PM
It doesn't make any sense. In terms of admixture, I score near 50% Sindhi and only 5% Punjabi (under the 50% South Asia). But in terms of the ML calculator, I score 100% Punjabi and 0% Sindhi even though my punjabi admixture is literally 1% of my entire genetics.

They are starting to sound like 23 and me and Ancestry. Mostly just useless.

26284729292
10-06-2018, 04:49 AM
I scored 54% tamil and 46% telugu. Lit. Not sure what that means, or the reference groups, lolol.

Censored
10-06-2018, 04:51 AM
I scored 54% tamil and 46% telugu. Lit. Not sure what that means, or the reference groups, lolol.

Hey, at least you didn't come out 37% Bengali. Seriously, what? Most random thing ever.

26284729292
10-06-2018, 04:54 AM
Hey, at least you didn't come out 37% Bengali. Seriously, what? Most random thing ever.

Ya it's a joke. If poi, khana, and bmoney started an ancestry testing service, I'd pay for it (don't get any ideas guys).

jortita
10-06-2018, 05:15 AM
According to them I am 100% Bengali

Censored
10-06-2018, 05:35 AM
According to them I am 100% Bengali

It's still nice that they got us all as 100% South Asian. Other testing companies have not been able to do that-we often get trace amounts which are just noise.

bored
10-06-2018, 05:37 AM
Wrong thread lol

misanthropy
10-06-2018, 07:27 AM
We have to share the update on facebook and take a screenshot? Cringe.

Censored
10-06-2018, 10:44 AM
We have to share the update on facebook and take a screenshot? Cringe.

Or here. That’s what I did.

shazou
10-06-2018, 11:44 AM
Cool I'm pretty satisfied with my results! :D

https://i.imgur.com/UMyYc0j.jpg

Amber29
10-06-2018, 11:52 AM
265182651926520

Amber29
10-06-2018, 11:53 AM
My results are VERY VERY strange. So, it says I am 100% Punjabi... what?
264752647626477

Plus, they uploaded my mtDNA, which is now W (that makes more sense). mtDNA W is widely spread in the region of Caucasus and presents high frequency in Northern Pakistan.

You are a W? I am w1c? what area are you from?

Lollybolly
10-06-2018, 11:56 AM
You are a W? I am w1c? what area are you from?

Khoja who are supposed to have their origins in Sindh. What are your Harappa results?

Amber29
10-06-2018, 12:00 PM
Khoja who are supposed to have their origins in Sindh. What are your Harappa results?

I am just going to give you a copy of all three LOL! Reason why I am asking because you are the second person i have come across and I dont know the proper details of where it is based. I even made a thread no one seems to know lol
26521

Lollybolly
10-06-2018, 12:03 PM
I am just going to give you a copy of all three LOL! Reason why I am asking because you are the second person i have come across and I dont know the proper details of where it is based. I even made a thread no one seems to know lol
26521

I guess W has its origins in West Asia. In terms of your GEDmatch results, we score slightly different. In particular, you score much more SI, a bit more baloch and much less caucasus than me. Same level of NE Europe and SW Asian. Interesting!

Amber29
10-06-2018, 12:16 PM
I guess W has its origins in West Asia. In terms of your GEDmatch results, we score slightly different. In particular, you score much more SI, a bit more baloch and much less caucasus than me. Same level of NE Europe and SW Asian. Interesting!

Are you pashtun/baloch/punjabi?

Sorry Guys I know its the XCODE.LIFE THREAD forgive me! lol

SWAHILLI_PRINCE16
10-06-2018, 04:23 PM
African 90.59
West Asian and Middle
Eastern 4.70
European 2.73
South Asian 0.88
East Asian 0.78
American 0.31
Oceanian 0.00
Southeast Asian 0.00

Population Composition

Yoruba 33.86
Luhya 25.99
Maasai 18.41
Mandenka 6.97
Nonspecific African 6.89
Biaka Pygmy 3.65
Mbuti Pygmy 2.65
San 1.59

Censored
10-06-2018, 04:45 PM
Are you pashtun/baloch/punjabi?

Sorry Guys I know its the XCODE.LIFE THREAD forgive me! lol

He mentioned in an earlier comment that he is Gujarati Lohana with origins in Sindh.


African 90.59
West Asian and Middle
Eastern 4.70
European 2.73
South Asian 0.88
East Asian 0.78
American 0.31
Oceanian 0.00
Southeast Asian 0.00

Population Composition

Yoruba 33.86
Luhya 25.99
Maasai 18.41
Mandenka 6.97
Nonspecific African 6.89
Biaka Pygmy 3.65
Mbuti Pygmy 2.65
San 1.59

Interesting. So not everyone got 100% of the region that they're from with this update.

ssamlal
10-07-2018, 03:10 PM
My results (derived from 23andme.v5)

Admixture:

Global (unchanged from previous version)
South Asian: 99.79
W Asian + ME: 0.15
Oceanian: 0.05

South Asian (2.48% moved from Sindhi to Gujarati)

26532

ML Calculator

Looks like I'm Tamil, Telugu & and a dash of Punjabi LOL. Don't think it's correct but happy to own it if it is :)

26533

jortita
10-08-2018, 01:41 AM
ML BASED

South Asian: 100%; Bengali: 100%



ADMIXTURE BASED

Global

South Asian 54.08%
East Asian 14.72%
Southeast Asian 11.85%
European 8.43%
African 4.18%
West Asian and Middle Eastern 3.68%
Oceanian 3.05%
American 0.01%


South Asian
ANI Sindhi 21.28
ANI Chamar 19.68
ATB Burmese 17.23
ANI Gujarati 10.11
ASI Velamas 8.33
ANI Punjabi 6.42
AAA Naga 5.07
ASI Telugu 2.95
ANI Dharkars 2.40
ANI Kol 2.20
ANI Dusadh 1.65
ASI Pulliyar 1.43
ASI Sri Lankan Tamils 1.24

East Asian
Uygur 54.23
Dai 17.99
Yi 10.82
Hezhen 9.97
Lahu 2.71
Japanese 2.60
Nonspecific Chinese 1.18
Naxi 0.50

Southeast Asian
Malay 53.10
Vietnamese 33.24
Cambodian 5.21
Dusun 4.31
Murut 2.77
Kankaney 1.37

European
Russian 84.69
Georgian 8.15
Finnish 7.16

Saad2016
10-09-2018, 11:19 PM
https://i.gyazo.com/1ec9d34619a2d2f0d8c170af512f9185.png
https://i.gyazo.com/ebf5f4928ff99f1b95f1d09a278ad262.png

I find the ML based calculator to be very accurate for south Asians. I came 100 percent Punjabi. I can understand that most of us would not like this calculator because we get more thrilled if we get 10 % European, 15 percent middle eastern....and so on......common guys give this calculator a high five for being the best South Asian Admixture calculator.

Two Bests for South Asians are : 23andMe and Xcode !

Censored
10-09-2018, 11:30 PM
https://i.gyazo.com/1ec9d34619a2d2f0d8c170af512f9185.png
https://i.gyazo.com/ebf5f4928ff99f1b95f1d09a278ad262.png

I find the ML based calculator to be very accurate for south Asians. I came 100 percent Punjabi. I can understand that most of us would not like this calculator because we get more thrilled if we get 10 % European, 15 percent middle eastern....and so on......common guys give this calculator a high five for being the best South Asian Admixture calculator.

Two Bests for South Asians are : 23andMe and Xcode !

Ridiculous, we are talking about the shitty internal breakdown of South Asia. It's not accurate for everybody. Some South Asians may have the sentiments you described, but you should know that no one on this forum is that naive.

Saad2016
10-10-2018, 12:20 AM
Ridiculous, we are talking about the shitty internal breakdown of South Asia. It's not accurate for everybody. Some South Asians may have the sentiments you described, but you should know that no one on this forum is that naive.

Ok my question : they don't get alarmed when the come out to be 10 percent Finnish....or 9 percent Asia minor but get offended when they see 20 percent Bengali or 7 percent Punjabi? doesn't make sense to me but then again its my personal opinion and not compelling anybody to be on board with me.

Thank you.

poi
10-10-2018, 02:20 AM
Ok my question : they don't get alarmed when the come out to be 10 percent Finnish....or 9 percent Asia minor but get offended when they see 20 percent Bengali or 7 percent Punjabi? doesn't make sense to me but then again its my personal opinion and not compelling anybody to be on board with me.

Thank you.

Finns have Yamna ancestry at high levels, so, in an absence of other steppe groups, South Asians scoring 10% "Finn" isn't too crazy. But what does 10% Punjabi mean? Punjab, afaik, has PJL-A that are almost Kalash to PJL-D that overlap with Tamils, so a very broad genetic ethnicity-wise.

BTW, I think Bengali as a component is fine, as it captures that much needed Eastern gene flow for most South Asians.

26284729292
10-11-2018, 02:06 AM
Ok my question : they don't get alarmed when the come out to be 10 percent Finnish....or 9 percent Asia minor but get offended when they see 20 percent Bengali or 7 percent Punjabi? doesn't make sense to me but then again its my personal opinion and not compelling anybody to be on board with me.

Thank you.

I don't know who their tamil samples and telugu samples are, but i score about 50% of each, and I guarantee you that I score nothing like them genetically on average, especially considering in the south (for everyone from the north, this is not the same thing so don't take offense), backward castes with high ASI make up the majority of the population.

For example, if you wanted to model me with a Kallar from Tamil Nadu, an oracle on Gedmatch had me as 60% kallar, 40% uzbek afghan. That's because we're so different as sub populations, that it's useless to group everyone from a state the same way. So if you want to model me using hte "average" tamilian sample, that's totally fine. But the fit will be awful.

I score much like Gujarati "B" on most calculators, but do I score any Gujarati in this calc? I score closer to Punjabi Lahore on NMonte than to velamas or kallars. Where's my punjabi?

I'm offended because this calc sucks for a lot of us. Not because i'm not proud to be Indian or anything like that.

I do despise people lumping in all south indians as a common pool. I'm frequently discriminated against by indian people I meet, who say "oh you don't look like those south indians" and expect me to take no offense, and I wasn't even brought up there.

Censored
10-11-2018, 02:21 AM
I don't know who their tamil samples and telugu samples are, but i score about 50% of each, and I guarantee you that I score nothing like them genetically on average, especially considering in the south (for everyone from the north, this is not the same thing so don't take offense), backward castes with high ASI make up the majority of the population.

For example, if you wanted to model me with a Kallar from Tamil Nadu, an oracle on Gedmatch had me as 60% kallar, 40% uzbek afghan. That's because we're so different as sub populations, that it's useless to group everyone from a state the same way. So if you want to model me using hte "average" tamilian sample, that's totally fine. But the fit will be awful.

I score much like Gujarati "B" on most calculators, but do I score any Gujarati in this calc? I score closer to Punjabi Lahore on NMonte than to velamas or kallars. Where's my punjabi?

I'm offended because this calc sucks for a lot of us. Not because i'm not proud to be Indian or anything like that.

I do despise people lumping in all south indians as a common pool. I'm frequently discriminated against by indian people I meet, who say "oh you don't look like those south indians" and expect me to take no offense, and I wasn't even brought up there.

Couldn't have said it better myself. And in fact you appear to be NW shifted compared to me, so I would expect you to get Punjabi if anything, but you didn't. Also have no idea what's going on with that Bengali I scored-Jortita got 100% which makes more sense but I don't show any noticeable E/SE Asian so it's strange for me to get almost 40%. I'm guessing the Tamil/Telgu samples included upper and middle castes, but not low castes which means they weren't able to properly capture my tribal shift-hence the Bengali.

Overall I'd say my results were one of the most extraneous since others at least got neighboring ethnicities, but that wasn't the case for me.

bmoney
10-11-2018, 03:19 AM
yeah its pretty bad. they likely have 1 or 2 samples per state that they are using as reference pops

Saad2016
10-11-2018, 10:15 AM
very accurate for punjabies though. I came up 100 Punjabi which is true to my roots!

jortita
10-12-2018, 01:04 AM
Couldn't have said it better myself. And in fact you appear to be NW shifted compared to me, so I would expect you to get Punjabi if anything, but you didn't. Also have no idea what's going on with that Bengali I scored-Jortita got 100% which makes more sense but I don't show any noticeable E/SE Asian so it's strange for me to get almost 40%. I'm guessing the Tamil/Telgu samples included upper and middle castes, but not low castes which means they weren't able to properly capture my tribal shift-hence the Bengali.

Overall I'd say my results were one of the most extraneous since others at least got neighboring ethnicities, but that wasn't the case for me.

Censored, scoring 100% Bengali does not make sense for me, please never in your life call an Assamese Bengali, even though there are some who look like Bengali. I do not at all resemble Bengalis as I have hundreds of Bengali and Bangladeshi friends, so it does not make sense for me to score 100% Bengali, Bengal was part of Mughal India while my ancestors were part of the Ahom kingdom and the military, so culturally and historically we are very different. All of you people from the rest of India need to visit Assam to understand how different it is from Bengal or Bangladesh

Censored
10-12-2018, 01:31 AM
Censored, scoring 100% Bengali does not make sense for me, please never in your life call an Assamese Bengali, even though there are some who look like Bengali. I do not at all resemble Bengalis as I have hundreds of Bengali and Bangladeshi friends, so it does not make sense for me to score 100% Bengali, Bengal was part of Mughal India while my ancestors were part of the Ahom kingdom and the military, so culturally and historically we are very different. All of you people from the rest of India need to visit Assam to understand how different it is from Bengal or Bangladesh

This discussion is not about phenotype.

jortita
10-12-2018, 01:58 AM
This discussion is not about phenotype.

Censored, its not about phenotype but culture and history, we have nothing in coming with Bengalis and as culturally we are not as aggressive as the rest of South Asia and more like Southeast Asia, we stay silent, this has nothing to do with phenotype. You are still too young and seem to agree with the generalisations in life including the smoothing process of the MLD calculator which does not work for somebody like me with mixed ancestry, all the smoothing calculators have got my ancestry wrong. Its not just phenotype, please dont be arrogant at all, this is what we detest from the rest of India as you seem to know better who we are than us, when we did not actually have a shared culture. I am voicing on behalf of nearly 45 million people who would agree with me

Censored
10-12-2018, 04:22 AM
Censored, its not about phenotype but culture and history, we have nothing in coming with Bengalis and as culturally we are not as aggressive as the rest of South Asia and more like Southeast Asia, we stay silent, this has nothing to do with phenotype. You are still too young and seem to agree with the generalisations in life including the smoothing process of the MLD calculator which does not work for somebody like me with mixed ancestry, all the smoothing calculators have got my ancestry wrong. Its not just phenotype, please dont be arrogant at all, this is what we detest from the rest of India as you seem to know better who we are than us, when we did not actually have a shared culture. I am voicing on behalf of nearly 45 million people who would agree with me

I am just approaching this from a genetics point of view. Politically/culturally, I have no dog in this fight, I am born and raised in the States and to me it does not matter who identifies with or does not identify with India. I am neutral in all of this and if you and people of your region feel you don't have a connection to the rest of the nation, who am I to say anything. I am perfectly fine with it. All the best brother.

jortita
10-12-2018, 06:45 AM
I am just approaching this from a genetics point of view. Politically/culturally, I have no dog in this fight, I am born and raised in the States and to me it does not matter who identifies with or does not identify with India. I am neutral in all of this and if you and people of your region feel you don't have a connection to the rest of the nation, who am I to say anything. I am perfectly fine with it. All the best brother.

I never said we dont have a connection, we are Indian for sure and proud of it increasingly in the Northeast but not South Asian culturally, thats all I wanted to clarify. We dont have caste system, dowry, patriarchal societal norms that you see elsewhere

jortita
10-12-2018, 06:49 AM
I am just approaching this from a genetics point of view. Politically/culturally, I have no dog in this fight, I am born and raised in the States and to me it does not matter who identifies with or does not identify with India. I am neutral in all of this and if you and people of your region feel you don't have a connection to the rest of the nation, who am I to say anything. I am perfectly fine with it. All the best brother.

The division of Asia into South and Southeast Asia strictly speaking only started in the post colonial period. I identify myself as being Indian and Asian, not the US definition of Asian which is only East Asian, Asia is a complex place, you cannot artificially generalise and bracket India as only South Asian, India spans South Asia, Southeast Asia and Northeast Asia culturally

Censored
10-12-2018, 08:08 AM
The division of Asia into South and Southeast Asia strictly speaking only started in the post colonial period. I identify myself as being Indian and Asian, not the US definition of Asian which is only East Asian, Asia is a complex place, you cannot artificially generalise and bracket India as only South Asian, India spans South Asia, Southeast Asia and Northeast Asia culturally

Absolutely, no one should force an identity on others. I hate when people do that to me also.

Varun R
10-13-2018, 06:54 PM
It looks like I lucked out. Here are the results.

Global
S Asian 99.79
European 0.14
SE Asian 0.08

ANI Sindhi 28.10
ASI Velamas 18.38
ANI Chamar 16.41
ANI Gujarati 15.21
ASI Telugu 5.39
ANI Punjabi 4.39
ATB Burmese 2.35
ANI Kol 2.27
ASI SriLankan Tamils 2.21
ANI Dusadh 1.66
AAA Naga 1.60.
Dharkars 1.32
Pulliyar 0.83

Machine Learning
Punjabi 75%
Telugu 14%
Tamils 9%
Gujarati 2%

jortita
10-14-2018, 08:26 AM
It looks like I lucked out. Here are the results.

Global
S Asian 99.79
European 0.14
SE Asian 0.08

ANI Sindhi 28.10
ASI Velamas 18.38
ANI Chamar 16.41
ANI Gujarati 15.21
ASI Telugu 5.39
ANI Punjabi 4.39
ATB Burmese 2.35
ANI Kol 2.27
ASI SriLankan Tamils 2.21
ANI Dusadh 1.66
AAA Naga 1.60.
Dharkars 1.32
Pulliyar 0.83

Machine Learning
Punjabi 75%
Telugu 14%
Tamils 9%
Gujarati 2%

Their machine learning results are from practically a different universe, a Tamil person like you scoring 3/4ths Punjabi!

Stix
10-15-2018, 05:58 PM
How accurate do you guys find the results?

My ancestors are from Northern India (present-day Uttar Pradesh and Bihar) and moved to South America in the 19th century as contract labourers. As far as I know they never mixed with other races or ethnicities. Even in India they married within their own social class.

Admixture calculator
South Asian: 71,31
African: 8,39
Oceanian: 7,79
European: 6,73
Southeast Asian: 5,78

South Asian
ANI Chamar: 26,04
ANI Gujarati: 19,12
ANI Sindhi: 15,63
ASI Velamas: 13,52
ANI Punjabi: 6,49
ASI Telugu: 6,02
ANI Dusadh: 4,21
ANI Kol: 2,37
AAA Naga: 1,87
ATB Burmese: 1,73
ASI Pulliyar: 1,25
ASI Srilankan Tamils: 1,14
ANI Dharkars: 0,60

ML Calculator
South Asian: 100

South Asian
Telugu: 51
Tamils: 47
Bengali: 2

I think the ML calculator is very wrong :\

midichlorian
10-16-2018, 03:36 PM
Damn I missed the window of opportunity to do it for free, and XCode is definitely not worth 40 bucks :(

Stix
10-18-2018, 08:46 AM
Damn I missed the window of opportunity to do it for free, and XCode is definitely not worth 40 bucks :(

I think Xcode is bullshit. It says I'm 100% South Indian or heavily South Indian, while my ancestors are from Northern India. I don't even look like most South Indians (I often get mistaken for Pakistani, Middle Eastern or Hispanic). There is something wrong with their algorithm or their reference groups are not correct.

agent_lime
10-18-2018, 10:19 AM
I think Xcode is bullshit. It says I'm 100% South Indian or heavily South Indian, while my ancestors are from Northern India. I don't even look like most South Indians (I often get mistaken for Pakistani, Middle Eastern or Hispanic). There is something wrong with their algorithm or their reference groups are not correct.

Post your harappa results. However, some UP, Bihar castes aren't that different from South Indians. They phenotypically don't look the same as South Indians.

Stix
10-18-2018, 05:37 PM
Post your harappa results. However, some UP, Bihar castes aren't that different from South Indians. They phenotypically don't look the same as South Indians.

According to harappa I also have a lot of 'South Indian' genes. So I guess it's true that people from UP and Bihar have a lot of ASI, even though they live in the most northern parts of India.

My ancestors are roughly from the area between New Delhi and Calcutta. They migrated to South America in the 19th century as contract labourers.

I'm not sure what to think of my results. Maybe some of my ancestors migrated from South India to UP/Bihar? The only thing I know is that these people were farmers.


26779

agent_lime
10-18-2018, 08:19 PM
According to harappa I also have a lot of 'South Indian' genes. So I guess it's true that people from UP and Bihar have a lot of ASI, even though they live in the most northern parts of India.

My ancestors are roughly from the area between New Delhi and Calcutta. They migrated to South America in the 19th century as contract labourers.

I'm not sure what to think of my results. Maybe some of my ancestors migrated from South India to UP/Bihar? The only thing I know is that these people were farmers.


26779

Harappa is incredibly efficient in getting Indian castes down. If your ancestors were actually nearer New Delhi they were outliers. As for Calcutta, your levels are very low East Asian for someone from that region. Perhaps they were lower castes from UP or Bihar? Or they were mixed UP mid castes with someone tribal heavy. Regardless, on the genetic calculators you look to be similar to Southern Indian folks. If you really show traits similar to NW or N Indians then either we are seeing some Founder effects or selection for features that happens in India often as well. Another example would be folks that fall in the Gujarat D category, they have similar genetics to mid caste South Indians but don't look like them often. (less rounded features, more Caucasian like features)

bol_nat
10-18-2018, 08:52 PM
According to harappa I also have a lot of 'South Indian' genes. So I guess it's true that people from UP and Bihar have a lot of ASI, even though they live in the most northern parts of India.

My ancestors are roughly from the area between New Delhi and Calcutta. They migrated to South America in the 19th century as contract labourers.

I'm not sure what to think of my results. Maybe some of my ancestors migrated from South India to UP/Bihar? The only thing I know is that these people were farmers.


26779

What is your caste? Agarwals score similar to you and they are north Indians.

Stix
10-18-2018, 11:53 PM
Harappa is incredibly efficient in getting Indian castes down. If your ancestors were actually nearer New Delhi they were outliers. As for Calcutta, your levels are very low East Asian for someone from that region. Perhaps they were lower castes from UP or Bihar? Or they were mixed UP mid castes with someone tribal heavy. Regardless, on the genetic calculators you look to be similar to Southern Indian folks. If you really show traits similar to NW or N Indians then either we are seeing some Founder effects or selection for features that happens in India often as well. Another example would be folks that fall in the Gujarat D category, they have similar genetics to mid caste South Indians but don't look like them often. (less rounded features, more Caucasian like features)

I have a light brown skin and sharp facial features. I have never been to India, so I don't know if my looks are common in Southern India. I have personally met Indian expats from Bangalore and they thought I was from Pakistan. I even had random Pakistani dudes talking Urdu to me.

My ancestors were 100% sure from Northern India (the area between New Delhi and Calcutta), but most likely present-day UP/Bihar. They were people from the rural part and did agricultural work. The language they spoke was Bhojpuri.

My paternal haplogroup is H, which is indigenous to India. My maternal haplogroup is A, which is common among East Asians and Native Americans. It's weird, because the female ancestors of my mother look 100% Indian to me. According to 23andme I'm 99% South Asian!


What is your caste? Agarwals score similar to you and they are north Indians.

I don't know much about caste. My ancestors migrated to a small country in South America where caste became irrelevant, because they were forced to live and work with each other. They were also marrying with each other regardless of caste.

I do know that most of them were lower caste or untouchable. I know some of my ancestors were Pasi and Chamar, which are untouchable castes. I also know some were Kurmi and Kohar, which are probably lower castes too.

According to my parents some of them were very dark-skinned and others were light-skinned.

bmoney
10-19-2018, 12:53 AM
Harappa is incredibly efficient in getting Indian castes down. If your ancestors were actually nearer New Delhi they were outliers. As for Calcutta, your levels are very low East Asian for someone from that region. Perhaps they were lower castes from UP or Bihar? Or they were mixed UP mid castes with someone tribal heavy. Regardless, on the genetic calculators you look to be similar to Southern Indian folks. If you really show traits similar to NW or N Indians then either we are seeing some Founder effects or selection for features that happens in India often as well. Another example would be folks that fall in the Gujarat D category, they have similar genetics to mid caste South Indians but don't look like them often. (less rounded features, more Caucasian like features)

His results are probably normal for non-Brahmin castes from that area who form the majority of the population.

Obviously UP Brahmins/Kshatriyas would score different

Theres this conception that 'North Indians' score like Punjabis. Thats not true at all, the masses are undersampled and live in UP/Bihar with no means of gene testing

His low Baloch, detectable NE Euro (which is close to 0 in non-Brahmin South Indians like Kush usually), relatively high Papuan (suggestive of Munda ancestry) to me looks like hes from a lower caste background from East UP/West Bengal

bmoney
10-19-2018, 01:03 AM
I have a light brown skin and sharp facial features. I have never been to India, so I don't know if my looks are common in Southern India. I have personally met Indian expats from Bangalore and they thought I was from Pakistan. I even had random Pakistani dudes talking Urdu to me.

My ancestors were 100% sure from Northern India (the area between New Delhi and Calcutta), but most likely present-day UP/Bihar. They were people from the rural part and did agricultural work. The language they spoke was Bhojpuri.

My paternal haplogroup is H, which is indigenous to India. My maternal haplogroup is A, which is common among East Asians and Native Americans. It's weird, because the female ancestors of my mother look 100% Indian to me. According to 23andme I'm 99% South Asian!



I don't know much about caste. My ancestors migrated to a small country in South America where caste became irrelevant, because they were forced to live and work with each other. They were also marrying with each other regardless of caste.

I do know that most of them were lower caste or untouchable. I know some of my ancestors were Pasi and Chamar, which are untouchable castes. I also know some were Kurmi and Kohar, which are probably lower castes too.

According to my parents some of them were very dark-skinned and others were light-skinned.

y-Haplogroup H mtdna A (this is rare and East Asian/Siberian related, Khana a moderator here of mixed NW background is also mtdna A), your scores, family Bhojpuri background

all fits the pattern.

You should compare your score to Ssamlal on this forum who's Carribean Indian. I suspect Fijian Indians would also score similar

Welcome to the forum btw

Stix
10-19-2018, 11:29 AM
His results are probably normal for non-Brahmin castes from that area who form the majority of the population.

Obviously UP Brahmins/Kshatriyas would score different

Theres this conception that 'North Indians' score like Punjabis. Thats not true at all, the masses are undersampled and live in UP/Bihar with no means of gene testing

His low Baloch, detectable NE Euro (which is close to 0 in non-Brahmin South Indians like Kush usually), relatively high Papuan (suggestive of Munda ancestry) to me looks like hes from a lower caste background from East UP/West Bengal

It could indeed be that the population I come from is underrepresented. That's why I was surprised. I never thought I would have so much ASI in my genetics. Papuan also surprised me. I didn't even know Indians had these type of genetics.

My ancestors are indeed from a lower socio-economic class, but I know little of the castes they came from. They recruited people who were experienced in outdoor physical labour and willing to work hard for their money. So the rural parts were the most obvious recruitment places.

I have read some stories that higher caste people were deceived with nice talks, but in the end they had to do the same work as everybody else. Some of them committed suicide, because they wouldn't work in the field for 5 years and had no money to buy off their contract and pay for the boat back to India. Others died of weakness, because they weren't used to hard physical labour: 10 hours per day and 6 days per week.

Btw: According to DNA.Land I'm also mostly Dravidian, but they also found some Kalash. It could be noise, because I have never seen this result before.

26798

Stix
10-19-2018, 11:46 AM
y-Haplogroup H mtdna A (this is rare and East Asian/Siberian related, Khana a moderator here of mixed NW background is also mtdna A), your scores, family Bhojpuri background

all fits the pattern.

You should compare your score to Ssamlal on this forum who's Carribean Indian. I suspect Fijian Indians would also score similar

Welcome to the forum btw

Yes, as far as I know all Caribbean Indians were recruited from present-day UP/Bihar. The boat was in Calcutta, so I also expect some Bengalis.

The Indians who live in South Africa were shipped from Madras, so most of them were Tamils.

When it comes to haplogroups: I don't think people should value this so much. I may have an Asian/Siberian maternal haplogroup, but >90% of my genes are traced back to the Indian subcontinent. It's like Pakistanis who claim to be Turkic or Persian, because of their paternal haplogroup, while their genes are >90% South Asian.

bmoney
10-20-2018, 02:21 AM
It could indeed be that the population I come from is underrepresented. That's why I was surprised. I never thought I would have so much ASI in my genetics. Papuan also surprised me. I didn't even know Indians had these type of genetics.

My ancestors are indeed from a lower socio-economic class, but I know little of the castes they came from. They recruited people who were experienced in outdoor physical labour and willing to work hard for their money. So the rural parts were the most obvious recruitment places.

I have read some stories that higher caste people were deceived with nice talks, but in the end they had to do the same work as everybody else. Some of them committed suicide, because they wouldn't work in the field for 5 years and had no money to buy off their contract and pay for the boat back to India. Others died of weakness, because they weren't used to hard physical labour: 10 hours per day and 6 days per week.

Btw: According to DNA.Land I'm also mostly Dravidian, but they also found some Kalash. It could be noise, because I have never seen this result before.

26798

None of these calculators are good beyond Harappa and G25 from Eurogenes (IMO) and can't take into account subtleties that separate South Indians from Gangetic Indians

Heres a few populations I found from your ancestral region who score like you

Ethnicity chamar dharkar kol kurmi bengali bengali lodi caribbean-indian
Dataset metspalu metspalu metspalu metspalu harappa metspalu reich harappa
N 10 11 16 1 11 1 5 3
S Indian 66% 53% 61% 53% 47% 51% 59% 51%
Baloch 26% 34% 30% 37% 27% 33% 32% 30%
Caucasian 0% 1% 1% 3% 2% 3% 1% 4%
NE Euro 2% 5% 3% 3% 4% 4% 3% 5%
SE Asian 1% 1% 1% 1% 7% 5% 1% 2%
Siberian 1% 1% 0% 0% 2% 2% 0% 0%
NE Asian 1% 1% 1% 2% 6% 0% 1% 2%
Papuan 1% 0% 1% 0% 1% 1% 1% 1%
American 1% 0% 0% 1% 1% 1% 0% 1%
Beringian 1% 1% 1% 0% 1% 0% 0% 1%
Mediterranean 1% 2% 1% 0% 1% 0% 1% 2%
SW Asian 0% 1% 0% 0% 1% 0% 0% 0%
San 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0%
E African 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0%
Pygmy 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0%
W African 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 0% 1%

And you're absolutely right about y or mtdna barely having any impact on your autosomal dna at the individual level

However correlations with ancestry and group frequencies of haplogroups, for example higher H% in South Asia associated with higher AASI populations, or higher R1a% associated with more steppe adna, is observable

26284729292
10-20-2018, 04:28 AM
Yes, as far as I know all Caribbean Indians were recruited from present-day UP/Bihar. The boat was in Calcutta, so I also expect some Bengalis.

The Indians who live in South Africa were shipped from Madras, so most of them were Tamils.

When it comes to haplogroups: I don't think people should value this so much. I may have an Asian/Siberian maternal haplogroup, but >90% of my genes are traced back to the Indian subcontinent. It's like Pakistanis who claim to be Turkic or Persian, because of their paternal haplogroup, while their genes are >90% South Asian.


Eh it depends on the recency. Ancient wise, many south asians are not 90% "south asian". I know pakistani pashtuns from khyper pakhtunkawa who in no way shape or form are 90% "south asian" in the way popularly described (Iran_N/AASI). Same goes for Jatt sikhs, many of whom can be modeled reasonably well with 55 velama 45 scythian hungary. Is scythian hungary south asian?

This calc is garbage. There's no real distinction given between gujarati and dravidian. I score no gujarati on this one, despite my high iran_n which would mesh well with gujarati populations.

ssamlal
10-20-2018, 12:34 PM
I have a light brown skin and sharp facial features. I have never been to India, so I don't know if my looks are common in Southern India. I have personally met Indian expats from Bangalore and they thought I was from Pakistan. I even had random Pakistani dudes talking Urdu to me.

My ancestors were 100% sure from Northern India (the area between New Delhi and Calcutta), but most likely present-day UP/Bihar. They were people from the rural part and did agricultural work. The language they spoke was Bhojpuri.

My paternal haplogroup is H, which is indigenous to India. My maternal haplogroup is A, which is common among East Asians and Native Americans. It's weird, because the female ancestors of my mother look 100% Indian to me. According to 23andme I'm 99% South Asian!

I don't know much about caste. My ancestors migrated to a small country in South America where caste became irrelevant, because they were forced to live and work with each other. They were also marrying with each other regardless of caste.

I do know that most of them were lower caste or untouchable. I know some of my ancestors were Pasi and Chamar, which are untouchable castes. I also know some were Kurmi and Kohar, which are probably lower castes too.

According to my parents some of them were very dark-skinned and others were light-skinned.

Welcome to the forum Stix.

My ancestor story (like my fellow Caribbean Indians) is similar to yours. You likely know more about your ancestors than I do.

My family's Harrapa scores are posted here: https://anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?15471-Post-HarappaWorld-results&p=497584&viewfull=1#post497584

The scores are similar to yours.