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El Greco
05-16-2019, 07:45 PM
Hello everyone.
I wrote earlier in the forum thinking that I belong to the group J1-P58-L829, but in the meantime I worked on the J1 panel at YSEQ and the result is:
M267> CTS3068> PF7261> PH1651
I see that SNP PH1651 is below PH128 and that it is equivalent to SNP Y30278 (PH7)

How old is this SNP and where does its origin come from?

Is there any idea how and from where did this branch come to the Balkans?

My ancestors live in Herzegovina for several hundred years. I suppose they came here with the shepherds' migration from the south of the Balkans, sometimes in the 13th century, or that they were the remains of the Byzantine population or the army. In the tradition we have ancestors once lived in Dubrovnik.

spruithean
05-16-2019, 09:03 PM
Here is YFull's tree: https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-PF7261/

This SNP formed 13200 YBP and its TMRCA for its branches is 11800 YBP. It seems its branches are dispersed through Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Serbia, Russia, Armenia, Italy and Azerbaijan. I would think your line may be in the Serbian branch along with the Armenian as we see in the Yfull tree. Perhaps through an Armenian-derived population in the Byzantine Empire (we know several Byzantines and even one of the dynasties was Armenian in origin).

El Greco
05-16-2019, 09:54 PM
Yes, and I think that migration to the Balkans is at the time of the Byzantine Empire from Armenia. I am not close with the Serbian branch. We are very different to STR, and we are geographically very distant.

How old is this SNP PH1651 and where does its origin come from?

spruithean
05-16-2019, 10:16 PM
Yes, and I think that migration to the Balkans is at the time of the Byzantine Empire from Armenia. I am not close with the Serbian branch. We are very different to STR, and we are geographically very distant.

How old is this SNP PH1651 and where does its origin come from?

PH1651 is the alternate name of V5765 which is phyloequivalent to PH128, which you can see in the previous link formed 11800 YBP and diversified 9300 YBP. I'm not sure where it originated.

These haplogroups are very old, we can't tie them to any ethnicity really.

El Greco
05-18-2019, 09:37 PM
I'm negative on SNP Y30278. Is there anyone in the world's bases that it is positive on SNP PH1651?

alienalp
08-09-2019, 12:50 PM
I have M5577/PF1413/V189

El Greco
09-26-2019, 09:03 PM
That SNP defines the CT haplogroup.

alienalp
11-21-2019, 10:46 PM
What do you mean? At isogg it says J1a3b~, and it is from the file that only contains mutations after J. When i google this mutation i acnt find anything.

Ilgar
11-28-2019, 01:00 PM
Here is YFull's tree: https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-PF7261/

...It seems its branches are dispersed through Saudi Arabia, Pakistan, Serbia, Russia, Armenia, Italy and Azerbaijan...

That Azerbaijani has armenian origin.

El Greco
11-30-2019, 10:07 AM
What do you mean? At isogg it says J1a3b~, and it is from the file that only contains mutations after J. When i google this mutation i acnt find anything.

On Yfull this SNP ranks among the +322 SNPs that define the CT haplogroup
https://www.yfull.com/tree/CT/

alienalp
01-25-2020, 12:05 AM
Hi again. Back then when we were talking i was only have myheritage result and very limited count of SNP's from Y-DNA. Today i got Full Genome sequencing result. And i am positive for all J1a3b (also negative for J1a3b1)
About the SNP that we were talking about (It is actually not important anymore but), It is also listed as j1a3b mutation in isogg database so maybe there is a situation like after CT mutation and between J1a3b it mutated back to the original and later it got mutated back.

Ilgar
01-25-2020, 06:56 PM
Hi again. Back then when we were talking i was only have myheritage result and very limited count of SNP's from Y-DNA. Today i got Full Genome sequencing result. And i am positive for all J1a3b (also negative for J1a3b1)
About the SNP that we were talking about (It is actually not important anymore but), It is also listed as j1a3b mutation in isogg database so maybe there is a situation like after CT mutation and between J1a3b it mutated back to the original and later it got mutated back.

Hi. Do you have bam file?

El Greco
01-26-2020, 11:23 PM
I assume you belong to branch J1> PF7261> PF7257> F17410 as you wrote on Molgen.org? Will your id. be set to YFULL?
What is the legend of your origin?

alienalp
01-27-2020, 12:30 AM
I assume you belong to branch J1> PF7261> PF7257> F17410 as you wrote on Molgen.org? Will your id. be set to YFULL?
What is the legend of your origin?
You are right i am F17410 for sure. I sent my raw data waiting them to process it.
I am from Alanya/Antalya/Turkey.

alienalp
01-30-2020, 01:52 PM
I assume you belong to branch J1> PF7261> PF7257> F17410 as you wrote on Molgen.org? Will your id. be set to YFULL?
What is the legend of your origin?

Hey, actually now i see that there is a possibility of we may be from same clade. Are you negative for F17410 or your test is inconclusive about it ? Considering there are handfull of people and most of them tested by Alexander. Weird coincidence. When i see you at the tree after uploading my raw data to yfull, i assumed that you may be me because there was a new tag :D

Kelmendasi
01-30-2020, 03:58 PM
Hey, actually now i see that there is a possibility of we may be from same clade. Are you negative for F17410 or your test is inconclusive about it ? Considering there are handfull of people and most of them tested by Alexander. Weird coincidence. When i see you at the tree after uploading my raw data to yfull, i assumed that you may be me because there was a new tag :D
He's J-PH128* (sample YF68142), probably will form his own cluster under that SNP. This means he's negative for F17410, and so not a part of the same cluster as you.

alienalp
01-31-2020, 12:09 AM
He's J-PH128* (sample YF68142), probably will form his own cluster under that SNP. This means he's negative for F17410, and so not a part of the same cluster as you.

No, his data is lacking necessary STRs to determine further sub clades. In his post he says he did YSEQ panel and his terminal clade is equivalent of SNP Y30278 (PH7). And it is probably a terminal clade for that YSEQ panel.

Pribislav
01-31-2020, 01:19 AM
No, his data is lacking necessary STRs to determine further sub clades. In his post he says he did YSEQ panel and his terminal clade is equivalent of SNP Y30278 (PH7). And it is probably a terminal clade for that YSEQ panel.

No, he has done BigY-700, and he's PH128* (negative for all downstream subclades). I hope we'll soon get someone who's positive for at least 1 of his 133 novel variants.

El Greco
01-31-2020, 11:09 AM
No, he has done BigY-700, and he's PH128* (negative for all downstream subclades). I hope we'll soon get someone who's positive for at least 1 of his 133 novel variants.

That's right.

alienalp
01-31-2020, 12:38 PM
No, he has done BigY-700, and he's PH128* (negative for all downstream subclades). I hope we'll soon get someone who's positive for at least 1 of his 133 novel variants.

So he don't have any common SNPs with the Sardinian (Other one in PH128) ? Or the Sardinian may have inconclusive data?
I don't understand how it is possible to determine novel SNPs with BigY-700 test? Does it also include SNPs. Because i was thinking STR tests were only looking known mutations.

Kelmendasi
01-31-2020, 04:40 PM
So he don't have any common SNPs with the Sardinian (Other one in PH128) ? Or the Sardinian may have inconclusive data?
I don't understand how it is possible to determine novel SNPs with BigY-700 test? Does it also include SNPs. Because i was thinking STR tests were only looking known mutations.
BigY-700 is an NGS test, it tests STRs and SNPs.

El Greco
02-03-2021, 09:53 PM
A new member of the PH128 branch appeared on Yfull. This is id: YF81018.

Does anyone know who is this about? I guess it was tested on FTDNA?
https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-PH128/

El Greco
03-20-2021, 07:41 PM
Does anyone know why the philogeographer at YFULL, the origin of the haplogroup J1, was placed on the Crimean peninsula in 16300, as well as branch Z2215?

The same question applies to its sub-branches Y29696, PF7261 and PH128, which for some reason from around 9000 to 6200 were located on the Euphrates River near Deir ez-Zur?

Jatt1
03-20-2021, 07:45 PM
Does anyone know why the philogeographer at YFULL, the origin of the haplogroup J1, was placed on the Crimean peninsula in 16300, as well as branch Z2215?

The same question applies to its sub-branches Y29696, PF7261 and PH128, which for some reason from around 9000 to 6200 were located on the Euphrates River near Deir ez-Zur?

Where do you find those placements on YFULL?

RCO
03-20-2021, 07:52 PM
They considered the Northeastern European Ancient J1 branches but we still don't have a critical mass to establish such claims.

Jatt1
03-20-2021, 08:05 PM
They considered the Northeastern European Ancient J1 branches but we still don't have a critical mass to establish such claims.

Can you name some of those ancient samples that the conclusion is based on.

El Greco
03-20-2021, 08:34 PM
https://i.postimg.cc/j2JMWPKH/Untitled.png (https://postimages.org/)

El Greco
03-20-2021, 08:38 PM
https://phylogeographer.com/mygrations/?hg=J1&clade=J-PH128

RCO
03-20-2021, 09:00 PM
There are two ancient basal J1 from the North:
I0211 - Karelia Man - Age Estimate: 6850-5000 BCE - Yuzhny Oleni Ostrov, Northern Russia (Genome-wide patterns of selection in 230 ancient Eurasians" Iain Mathieson - Nature - 2015) and
Popovo2 - Age Estimate: 5500-5000 BCE - Lake Lacha, Northern Russia (The genetic prehistory of the Baltic Sea region - Alissa Mittnik - Nature - 2018). They were related to a modern Finnish clade https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-F2306/

El Greco
03-20-2021, 09:11 PM
Okay, I guess this is the reason for the assumption of the origin of the J1 haplogroup in Crimea. But why is PH128 in Syria? Shouldn't it be in the Caucasus?

Jatt1
03-21-2021, 12:36 AM
There are two ancient basal J1 from the North:
I0211 - Karelia Man - Age Estimate: 6850-5000 BCE - Yuzhny Oleni Ostrov, Northern Russia (Genome-wide patterns of selection in 230 ancient Eurasians" Iain Mathieson - Nature - 2015) and
Popovo2 - Age Estimate: 5500-5000 BCE - Lake Lacha, Northern Russia (The genetic prehistory of the Baltic Sea region - Alissa Mittnik - Nature - 2018). They were related to a modern Finnish clade https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-F2306/

But they aren't old enough.

El Greco
03-24-2021, 09:25 AM
Yes, you are right!