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castle3
09-27-2019, 04:37 PM
Can anyone tell me where in the first 111 markers DYS710 & DYS712 rank? For example DYSCDYa, DYS576 & DYS534 were rated as the 2nd, 3rd and 5th fastest mutators. Where do DYS710 & DYS712 sit?

RobertCasey
09-28-2019, 03:46 AM
570
fast
0.00509


449
fast
0.00579


576
fast
0.00617


CDYa
volatile
0.02474


CDYb
volatile
0.02678




715
0.00444
fast

Heinilla
Y111


650
0.00758
fast

Heinilla
Y111


714
0.00773
fast

Heinilla
Y111


712
0.01638
very fast

Heinilla
Y111


710
0.01828
very fast

Heinilla
Y111



CDY is so fast mutating that I no longer this marker in any analysis (YSNP prediction or charting). 710 and 712 are pretty fast but still are at the high end of mutation rates but still reasonably accurate for usage.

Some of the Y700 markers may eventually fall into the unusable category. Not enough data for mutation rates. First grouping uses the average of Heinilla and Burgarella papers. Burgarella has CDY markers at 0.03512 which I believe is more accurate. For Y67 markers - just under 50 % of all Y67 mutations are just the two CDY markers.

castle3
09-28-2019, 08:16 AM
Many thanks, Robert. I have 8 differences out of 828 markers with a same-name chap who I think I share a common ancestor with in the early 1600s. Interestingly, 6 of our misses are in the first 111 markers and, with the info you supplied, it appears that 4 of the 6 misses are the fastest markers. The other 2 are DYS391 & DYS463 which I gather are classed as 'medium'? On Panel 6 of the Big Y-700 results we miss at FTY394 and on Panel 7 at FTY927. I have no idea what rates these mutate at. We have 11 Private Mutations.

Dave-V
09-28-2019, 12:35 PM
This PDF (link (https://drive.google.com/file/d/1f57nR50I54-rAHqo2bkdVW7iWPBxOAvH/view?usp=drivesdk)) has the 111 markers listed in order of the Family Tree DNA test results, with a column ranking them by slowness - in this case #1 is the slowest, #111 is the fastest.

This happens to use a different mutation rate set than the Heinilla rates referenced by Robert; a few markers would switch around between the two studies but the basic order would be the same.

Wing Genealogist
09-28-2019, 01:34 PM
It is my understanding the vast majority of additional STRs in the Big Y-500 & Big Y-700 are shorter STRs (between 2 base pairs & 4 base pairs). As such, I believe most of them have a slower mutation rate than the slowest markers in the 1-111 STRs.

castle3
09-28-2019, 02:28 PM
Thanks for that tip.

castle3
09-28-2019, 02:28 PM
Excellent! Thanks Dave.