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Ahaddad
01-16-2014, 11:05 AM
LEBANESE GENO 2.0 RESULTS

PATERNAL LINE- R-PF6215

MATERNAL LINE- X


WHO I AM

59% MEDITERRANEAN
31% SOUTHWEST ASIAN
8% NORTH EUROPEAN

FIRST POPULATION REFERENCE- GEORGIAN
SECOND POPULATION REFERENCE-LEBANESE

1,1% NEANDERTHAL
1,3% DENISOVAN

Ahaddad
01-16-2014, 11:06 AM
I'm very curious about Y-Haplogroup and mtdna Haplogroup, how common is this haplogroups? What Mean R-PF6215?

GTC
01-16-2014, 02:26 PM
What Mean R-PF6215?

As far as I can determine, PF6215 belongs in R1a. Didn't FTDNA classify you as R1b?


mtdna Haplogroup

"The greatest frequency of haplogroup X is observed in the Druze, a minority population in Israel, Jordan, Lebanon, and Syria"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup_X_%28mtDNA%29

Humanist
01-16-2014, 02:32 PM
As far as I can determine, PF6215 belongs in R1a. Didn't FTDNA classify you as R1b?

That is interesting. Reminded me of this past post, regarding Ahaddad's STR markers:


Perhaps his nearest neighbor in Ysearch is ZMFMV (http://www.ysearch.org/search_view.asp?uid=zmfmv&viewuid=ZMFMV&p=1#), who has (I think) a Turkish surname and lists his haplogroup as R1a !

Rathna
01-16-2014, 02:55 PM
PF6215, if it is the final SNP, is like R-M420*, i.e. the most ancient, as I think having said when we discussed about the "Case Haddad" I posted here. The haplotype seemed similar to the European ones found in the Isles and Italy above all. We don't know so far the haplotypes of the R-M420* found in Iran. In the Morley's tree there is also an Arab R-M420 with an own other mutation whose haplotype isn't known to me.

P.S. The Arab is this:

1883 1R1a–1 Z1866
R [1/1]
1884 1N114240

ADW_1981
01-16-2014, 04:09 PM
FTDNA is losing credibility more and more each day. Some much for the "confirmed" M269 result.

Joe B
01-16-2014, 05:13 PM
FTDNA is losing credibility more and more each day. Some much for the "confirmed" M269 result.

Deleted. ADW_1981 has better information on post #12.

Ahaddad
01-16-2014, 05:31 PM
Anyone have the frequency for my Y-Haplogroup in World? how common in european or arabs my haplogroup? What my SNP? About Who i'am i can get more clear the data like admixing in GedMatch? Because say just Georgian and Lebanese. How is my branch of R so? I'm R1a??

Mehrdad
01-16-2014, 05:36 PM
Anyone have the frequency for my Y-Haplogroup in World? how common in european or arabs my haplogroup? What my SNP? About Who i'am i can get more clear the data like admixing in GedMatch? Because say just Georgian and Lebanese. How is my branch of R so? I'm R1a??

If you're R1a here's something from Eupedia to read. Very rare in the Levant region unlike R1b

http://www.eupedia.com/europe/Haplogroup_R1a_Y-DNA.shtml

Ahaddad
01-16-2014, 05:37 PM
Yes, but what branch are my SNP we can know? Are european R1a or asian etc? What sublcade i meaning..

Mehrdad
01-16-2014, 06:09 PM
Good point, it'll be good to get either Michal or parasar to expound on your questions. I'm a novice and still learning.

ADW_1981
01-16-2014, 06:13 PM
Morely's predictor for Haddad
Examining: R1a [R1a-F3650 (R1a-F928, R1a-CTS10627)]

This suggested classification does not account for the following positive SNPs:
CTS8749
F2302 (Geno 2.0 results are erratic for this SNP)
L566 (mis-called by FTDNA?)
PF15 (mis-called by FTDNA?)
PF601 (mis-called by FTDNA?)
PF720 (mis-called by FTDNA?)

Ftdna removed M269 from the confirmed SNPs list for Haddad in the projects. Is that typical?
The same lab, FTDNA, is giving conflicting results using different methodologies. It should be up to FTDNA to rerun these test. From a professional credibility standpoint, FTDNA or any lab, should want to clear this up.
http://ytree.morleydna.com/

There's two related Haddad's with the exact same haplotype in the FTDNA Iraq project. The newest one is confirmed R1, and the older one (I think the forum poster) labeled as *green* R1b1a2

There are a bunch of likely R-V88 results among SW Asian projects erroneously labeled R1b1a2. I'm not expert on the science and methods behind the test results, but this "glitch" is very troubling.

ADW_1981
01-16-2014, 06:18 PM
Anyone have the frequency for my Y-Haplogroup in World? how common in european or arabs my haplogroup? What my SNP? About Who i'am i can get more clear the data like admixing in GedMatch? Because say just Georgian and Lebanese. How is my branch of R so? I'm R1a??

Your branch is probably Alan or Persian in origin. (my own theory) There is a related branch to yours in England/Scotland which might represent Alan mercenary settlement during Roman Britain. Certainly this pet theory of mine weighs more than the previous YDNA G = Alan theory which pervaded these types of forums over the years. We know that was pure oversimplification and just plain wrong.

It seems the Geno 2.0 result is more reliable, you are probably R1a-M420, which is more inline with your haplotype results.

newtoboard
01-16-2014, 06:30 PM
Your branch is probably Alan or Persian in origin. (my own theory) There is a related branch to yours in England/Scotland which might represent Alan mercenary settlement during Roman Britain. Certainly this pet theory of mine weighs more than the previous YDNA G = Alan theory which pervaded these types of forums over the years. We know that was pure oversimplification and just plain wrong.

It seems the Geno 2.0 result is more reliable, you are probably R1a-M420, which is more inline with your haplotype results.

The YDNA G=Alans was based on nothing more than the assumption that Ossetians=Alans. But it is still possible and likely IMO Alans also carried carried G in minor amounts. Their ancestral location in Western Kazakhstan is not very far from the farming settlements of South Central Asia.

Ahaddad
01-16-2014, 06:40 PM
There's two related Haddad's with the exact same haplotype in the FTDNA Iraq project. The newest one is confirmed R1, and the older one (I think the forum poster) labeled as *green* R1b1a2

There are a bunch of likely R-V88 results among SW Asian projects erroneously labeled R1b1a2. I'm not expert on the science and methods behind the test results, but this "glitch" is very troubling.

Yes one it's me and other my dad!!!!

Ahaddad
01-16-2014, 06:42 PM
WHO I AM

59% MEDITERRANEAN
31% SOUTHWEST ASIAN
8% NORTH EUROPEAN
And about this dates what mean??? I can put the GENO 2.0 results one calculator to see admix??

FIRST POPULATION REFERENCE- GEORGIAN
SECOND POPULATION REFERENCE-LEBANESE

1,1% NEANDERTHAL
1,3% DENISOVAN

Humanist
01-16-2014, 09:02 PM
About Who i'am i can get more clear the data like admixing in GedMatch? Because say just Georgian and Lebanese.

Please do not take these literally. The Assyrian ZephyrousMandaru received the same pair, Georgian and Lebanese. They do not have Assyrians and Chaldeans as reference populations.

Humanist
01-16-2014, 09:27 PM
There's two related Haddad's with the exact same haplotype in the FTDNA Iraq project. The newest one is confirmed R1, and the older one (I think the forum poster) labeled as *green* R1b1a2.

One is the forum poster, and one is the sample of the forum poster's father, the Chaldean Catholic from Mosul (Nineveh) Iraq, I believe.


Yes one it's me and other my dad!!!!

I see that Ahaddad beat me to it.

Táltos
01-16-2014, 11:00 PM
Haddad I have been following your story from when you posted over at FTDNA forum. Your Gene 2.0 result for your yDNA is interesting. Have you questioned FTDNA about the discrepancy between their result for you and your Geno 2.0 result?

Ahaddad
01-16-2014, 11:27 PM
Haddad I have been following your story from when you posted over at FTDNA forum. Your Gene 2.0 result for your yDNA is interesting. Have you questioned FTDNA about the discrepancy between their result for you and your Geno 2.0 result?

Not yet, i don't know what i write and where i send.

Ahaddad
01-17-2014, 02:17 AM
This is my subclade haplogroup?? R-M420, defined by the mutation M420, has two branches: R-SRY1532.2, defined by the mutation SRY1532.2, which makes up the vast majority; and R-M420*, the paragroup, defined as M420 positive but SRY1532.2 negative. (In the 2002 scheme, this SRY1532.2 negative minority was one part of the relatively rare group classified as the paragroup R1*.) Mutations understood to be equivalent to M420 include M449, M511, M513, L62, and L63.(Underhill 2009 and ISOGG 2012)
Only isolated samples of the new paragroup R-M420* were found by Underhill 2009, mostly in the Middle East and Caucasus: 1/121 Omanis, 2/150 Iranians, 1/164 in the United Arab Emirates, and 3/612 in Turkey. Testing of 7224 more males in 73 other Eurasian populations showed no sign of this category.(Underhill 2009)



Someone have the frequency of my subclade?

Táltos
01-17-2014, 05:26 AM
Ahaddad here is their phone number (713) 868-1438. If you live on the other side of the globe and it would not be possible to talk directly to them during business hours then fill out their assistance form on the upper right hand side of their home screen. Also called feed back section. Ask them why their backbone predicted you as R1B-M269 and Geno 2.0 has you listed as R1a-PF6215.

Rathna
01-17-2014, 11:50 AM
This is my subclade haplogroup?? R-M420, defined by the mutation M420, has two branches: R-SRY1532.2, defined by the mutation SRY1532.2, which makes up the vast majority; and R-M420*, the paragroup, defined as M420 positive but SRY1532.2 negative. (In the 2002 scheme, this SRY1532.2 negative minority was one part of the relatively rare group classified as the paragroup R1*.) Mutations understood to be equivalent to M420 include M449, M511, M513, L62, and L63.(Underhill 2009 and ISOGG 2012)
Only isolated samples of the new paragroup R-M420* were found by Underhill 2009, mostly in the Middle East and Caucasus: 1/121 Omanis, 2/150 Iranians, 1/164 in the United Arab Emirates, and 3/612 in Turkey. Testing of 7224 more males in 73 other Eurasian populations showed no sign of this category.(Underhill 2009)



Someone have the frequency of my subclade?

I dedicated to your case a thread: The case Haddad
in
Y-Chromosome (Y-DNA) Haplogroups.

I have spoken there and elsewhere of your R-M420*.

GTC
01-17-2014, 11:52 AM
Not yet, i don't know what i write and where i send.

It might be worth bringing your case to the attention of the consultant Rebekah Canada ([email protected]) who has recently been appointed by FTDNA to be responsible for Web Presence and Customer Engagement, which includes administering the FTDNA Forums. I think she might be able to help make sure the right person at FTDNA takes a good look at your case.

Rathna
01-17-2014, 11:55 AM
Ahaddad here is their phone number (713) 868-1438. If you live on the other side of the globe and it would not be possible to talk directly to them during business hours then fill out their assistance form on the upper right hand side of their home screen. Also called feed back section. Ask them why their backbone predicted you as R1B-M269 and Geno 2.0 has you listed as R1a-PF6215.

I am denouncing from years the wrong results of FTDNA, above all of the SNP M269. Many have been updated, others are testing now (see Mangino), other aren't tested so far (Marchesi) but I have said from so long that he is R-V88+ and not R-M269* etc.

If I had had to expect FTDNA tests for doing my theories I'd already be to the Middle Eastern origin of R1b1* and subclades!

ZephyrousMandaru
01-17-2014, 02:29 PM
LEBANESE GENO 2.0 RESULTS

PATERNAL LINE- R-PF6215

MATERNAL LINE- X


WHO I AM

59% MEDITERRANEAN
31% SOUTHWEST ASIAN
8% NORTH EUROPEAN

FIRST POPULATION REFERENCE- GEORGIAN
SECOND POPULATION REFERENCE-LEBANESE

1,1% NEANDERTHAL
1,3% DENISOVAN

These results are remarkably similar to mine, it just goes to show that Geno 2.0's Reference Populations are lacking.

Ahaddad
01-17-2014, 04:32 PM
I can transfer this results to know admixture? Like GedMatch do?

Ahaddad
01-17-2014, 08:13 PM
The question is, what is my subclade? The frequency of this in world and what the origin?

Ahaddad
01-17-2014, 08:14 PM
These results are remarkably similar to mine, it just goes to show that Geno 2.0's Reference Populations are lacking.

I can transfer this results to know admixture? Like GedMatch do? What is the more arab component in this tab? Southweast asian or Mediterranean?

Ahaddad
01-19-2014, 05:29 PM
Really, i want know how origin qnd what subclade i'am... If someone can help me hehehe

ZephyrousMandaru
01-19-2014, 05:55 PM
I can transfer this results to know admixture? Like GedMatch do? What is the more arab component in this tab? Southweast asian or Mediterranean?

Mediterranean is Southwest Asian, Southwest Asian is like Gedrosia and Caucasus. As for Northern European, I'm not sure, the Northern European is inconsistent with other tests I've taken though it probably correlates with the Atlantic_Baltic component in the ADMIXTURE tests.

Ahaddad
01-19-2014, 06:15 PM
So Sardinian are the people who have the more% of southwest asian? They have more than 70% in geno 2.0 of mediterranean

ADW_1981
01-19-2014, 07:22 PM
I can transfer this results to know admixture? Like GedMatch do? What is the more arab component in this tab? Southweast asian or Mediterranean?

SW Asian. Mediterranean is major component in southern and western Europeans on any admixture test. SW Asian in Europeans tends to be far lower.

Sapporo
01-19-2014, 07:30 PM
Mediterranean is Southwest Asian, Southwest Asian is like Gedrosia and Caucasus. As for Northern European, I'm not sure, the Northern European is inconsistent with other tests I've taken though it probably correlates with the Atlantic_Baltic component in the ADMIXTURE tests.


I think Mediterranean is a mixture of Med + SW Asian/Caucasus depending on the group. It's pretty high in Southern Euros, Northern Euros and Levantines as well as some Caucasus groups. SW Asian is Gedrosia + Caucasus. For Euros, it's mostly Med + Caucasus. For Levantines, mostly Caucasus + SW Asian. Med on most admixture runs is higher in Southern Euros and North Africans than any Levantines or other Middle Easterners.

Northern Euro definitely correlates well with Atlantic_Baltic. Not too much with Dodecad K12B's Northern Euro though.

ZephyrousMandaru
01-19-2014, 10:01 PM
I think Mediterranean is a mixture of Med + SW Asian/Caucasus depending on the group. It's pretty high in Southern Euros, Northern Euros and Levantines as well as some Caucasus groups. SW Asian is Gedrosia + Caucasus. For Euros, it's mostly Med + Caucasus. For Levantines, mostly Caucasus + SW Asian. Med on most admixture runs is higher in Southern Euros and North Africans than any Levantines or other Middle Easterners.

Northern Euro definitely correlates well with Atlantic_Baltic. Not too much with Dodecad K12B's Northern Euro though.

Mediterranean and Southwest Asian are incorporating elements from Caucasus and Southwest Asian, it's important to remember that these components are not the same ones as in the ADMIXTURE runs. It's high in Southern Europeans today, due to inbreeding and isolation. But it ultimately originated in the Middle East.

GTC
01-20-2014, 03:44 AM
Ahaddad: you have a private message.

Ahaddad
01-20-2014, 02:27 PM
That i see make more sense my haplogroup origin or sublcade from West Asia than Europe, i don't know but i think my subclade i think from middle east..for example maybe origin of this subclade from Iran, Turkey, Iraq.. Because that we know majority of tests in database are from europe and too little have tested like me, i think if we tested more middle eastern we found more subclades like me.

Ahaddad
01-21-2014, 02:39 PM
1247 My Patternal line origin, i don't know if now is better to detect my subclade.

Mehrdad
01-21-2014, 03:47 PM
1247 My Patternal line origin, i don't know if now is better to detect my subclade.

That's really cool, thanks for sharing. You're mtDNA is X, which is very rare. This map is interesting because it shows that Haplogroup R1 made it into the Americas during the last ice age. Anyone knows whether it was R1a or R1b?

parasar
01-21-2014, 04:50 PM
PF6215 is equivalent to M420 and upstream of SRY10831.2. As per current phylogeny, your branch diverged prior to the SRY10831.2 mutation.
http://ytree.morleydna.com/ExperimentalGenoPhylogeny20131108.pdf

Ahaddad
01-21-2014, 11:33 PM
PF6215 is equivalent to M420 and upstream of SRY10831.2. As per current phylogeny, your branch diverged prior to the SRY10831.2 mutation.
http://ytree.morleydna.com/ExperimentalGenoPhylogeny20131108.pdf

This is my subclade haplogroup?? >>>>>>>>>>
R-M420, defined by the mutation M420, has two branches: R-SRY1532.2, defined by the mutation SRY1532.2, which makes up the vast majority; and R-M420*, the paragroup, defined as M420 positive but SRY1532.2 negative. (In the 2002 scheme, this SRY1532.2 negative minority was one part of the relatively rare group classified as the paragroup R1*.) Mutations understood to be equivalent to M420 include M449, M511, M513, L62, and L63.(Underhill 2009 and ISOGG 2012)
Only isolated samples of the new paragroup R-M420* were found by Underhill 2009, mostly in the Middle East and Caucasus: 1/121 Omanis, 2/150 Iranians, 1/164 in the United Arab Emirates, and 3/612 in Turkey. Testing of 7224 more males in 73 other Eurasian populations showed no sign of this category.(Underhill 2009)

THE SRY 10831.2 is the same of R-SRY1532.2???? My case is the same of this haplogroup that underhill say that is just found in Middle East?