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View Full Version : Is Chess ability strongly associated with IQ/intelligence?



shazou
11-23-2019, 01:06 AM
What **IQ number** would you need at the very least to be a Chess Grandmaster in your opinion for example?....

Post any online studies/links if possible to back up your claim....

firemonkey
11-23-2019, 02:33 AM
Why are some people more skilled in complex domains than other people? Here, we conducted a meta-analysisto evaluate the relationship between cognitive ability and skill in chess. Chess skill correlated positively and sig-nificantly withfluid reasoning (Gf) (r= 0.24), comprehension-knowledge (Gc) (r= 0.22), short-term memory(Gsm) (r= 0.25), and processing speed (Gs) (r= 0.24); the meta-analytic average of the correlations was (r=0.24). Moreover, the correlation between Gf and chess skill was moderated by age (r= 0.32 for youth samples vs.r= 0.11 for adult samples), and skill level (r= 0.32 for unranked samples vs.r= 0.14 for ranked samples). In-terestingly, chess skill correlated more strongly with numerical ability (r= 0.35) than with verbal ability (r=0.19) or visuospatial ability (r= 0.13). The results suggest that cognitive ability contributes meaningfully to in-dividual differences in chess skill, particularly in young chess players and/or at lower levels of skill.




https://artscimedia.case.edu/wp-content/uploads/sites/141/2016/12/22143817/Burgoyne-Sala-Gobet-Macnamara-Campitelli-Hambrick-2016.pdf

rms2
11-23-2019, 01:28 PM
I think chess tests a certain kind of intelligence that does not necessarily translate into overall intellectual ability or much that is very practical. I am (or was) a pretty good chess player, although certainly not unbeatable. Nowadays I get bored with chess and lack the patience for it.

I can think of great chess masters and child prodigies of the past whom everyone regarded as geniuses, and perhaps they were, but who never seemed to accomplish much of any value.

I remember reading about a chess master, a Belgian, if I recall correctly, who could play something like thirty people simultaneously while he was blindfolded and beat them all. So, what else did he do? Anything actually worthwhile?

Saetro
11-24-2019, 02:52 AM
Agree with rms2

At a lower level, the ability to systematize and commit to memory a series of:
1) standard openings and range of tactics
2) general strategies
3) general tactics
4) endgame tactics
can make up for a deal of missing general ability.
(I had this stuff down, but my untutored mother thrashed me with naive native ability.)

The ability to look forwards an extra few moves must surely be somewhat linked to speed of thinking, which is connected to IQ.

Good players I met generally had good mathematical thinking.
They also had many hours of playing - associated with the 10,000 hours thesis of excellence,
but people who stick with such a regime usually have more native ability than the general population, so they tend to be confounded factors.

The one former world champion I was lucky enough to meet, Max Euwe, appeared to possess good general abilities and was reasonably gregarious.
Others I have read about appear limited and relatively non-social.
Along the lines mentioned by rms2

mainer
02-17-2020, 09:46 AM
Intelligence is not a narrow thing. It encompasses so many aspects of living--from the mundane to the exalted. Neither is it a linear thing. Intelligence needs to be accessed. In other words, it needs to be applied. It's almost like a verb. Passive intelligence may fall more in the realm of ability. Even scholars in the field of genetics are now acknowledging the role the social and the cultural--not to mention the personal/the psychological aka the self--play in determining the extent of one's intelligence (See: Human Heredity: Principles and Issues (https://www.bartleby.com/textbooks/human-heredity-principles-and-issues-mindtap-course-list-11th-edition/9781305251052/solutions)). In other words, yes intelligence affects how you play the game, but also vice versa.

LTG
02-17-2020, 12:57 PM
There is a measurable correlation.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/09/160913124722.htm

firemonkey
02-17-2020, 01:21 PM
My father tried teaching me chess and got nowhere. Without doubt because my fluid intelligence is low, and my executive functioning isn't good either .

Online non- verbal tests created by psychometricians 75
Online verbal tests created by psychometricians 149

rms2
02-17-2020, 04:44 PM
Personality is another factor. One has to enjoy sitting and pondering the chessboard. I've known some bright people who just don't care for chess or who lack the patience for it.

I used to really enjoy chess. As I said earlier, these days it generally just bores me.

When I do play chess, I enjoy playing the computer. That way, when I win, I don't feel sorry for my opponent, and when I lose, I don't feel bad about that either.

I do like really nice chess sets. They're really cool looking and make nice additions to the decor of a house.

alan
02-17-2020, 09:21 PM
I can play chess. Not brilliantly but I can keep a reasonable player at bay for for good long time before being beat LOL. However, ive no patience and that is a major factor in ever getting really good at something like chess. Its a bit like playing cards or computer games. I see them as 'killing time' pursuits and I have never really understood why anyone wants to kill time when your only here once and life is short!

alan
02-17-2020, 09:23 PM
Personality is another factor. One has to enjoy sitting and pondering the chessboard. I've known some bright people who just don't care for chess or who lack the patience for it.

I used to really enjoy chess. As I said earlier, these days it generally just bores me.

When I do play chess, I enjoy playing the computer. That way, when I win, I don't feel sorry for my opponent, and when I lose, I don't feel bad about that either.

I do like really nice chess sets. They're really cool looking and make nice additions to the decor of a house.

Ive always fancied getting a replica Isle of Lewis chessmen set. Surely the coolest chess set in the world.

rms2
02-17-2020, 10:01 PM
Ive always fancied getting a replica Isle of Lewis chessmen set. Surely the coolest chess set in the world.

I agree. I'd like one of those myself.

Saetro
02-19-2020, 05:17 AM
I agree. I'd like one of those myself.

The Lewis chessmen come from several different sets. (I have been fortunate to see some originals on two occasions.)
Sure you can get a readymade copy.
But if you have a student artist looking for a project for credit, why not have them follow the basic artistic designs, but commission the inclusion of some faces of your choice?
For example, aficionados of the series Vikings might like depictions of the actors involved.
(And if you think that is a lot of work for a beginner carver, maybe something more along the lines of 3D design and 3D printing is more achievable.)

MacUalraig
02-20-2020, 10:09 AM
Agree with rms2

At a lower level, the ability to systematize and commit to memory a series of:
1) standard openings and range of tactics
2) general strategies
3) general tactics
4) endgame tactics
can make up for a deal of missing general ability.
(I had this stuff down, but my untutored mother thrashed me with naive native ability.)

The ability to look forwards an extra few moves must surely be somewhat linked to speed of thinking, which is connected to IQ.

Good players I met generally had good mathematical thinking.
They also had many hours of playing - associated with the 10,000 hours thesis of excellence,
but people who stick with such a regime usually have more native ability than the general population, so they tend to be confounded factors.

The one former world champion I was lucky enough to meet, Max Euwe, appeared to possess good general abilities and was reasonably gregarious.
Others I have read about appear limited and relatively non-social.
Along the lines mentioned by rms2

My own play is poor but I do chess programming and spend a lot of time testing other programs. Never met any great players but I did meet Ken Thompson (inventor of UNIX/'C') at the world cc champs.

As regards whether chess players are generally intelligent presumably everyone caught this recent story?

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2019/dec/16/chess-champion-magnus-carlsen-top-of-world-fantasy-football-rankings-premier-league

Saetro
10-03-2020, 02:38 AM
I definitely agree.

See https://www.britishmuseumshoponline.org/lewis-chessmen-chess-set-premium.html for a set from the original seller. Not cheap, since they are being sold as genuine replicas of historical pieces.
Or search "british museum lewis chess set" for resellers via usual sites.
Often at lower prices.

firemonkey
10-04-2020, 11:35 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nx3h70GoaoM

Hikaru 102 on online mensa Norway.

Basta
10-06-2020, 06:10 AM
At recreative and lower level, chess indeed corelates with IQ because creativity is necessary. But, on higher and professional levels, chess player must memorize numerous complex plays and variants to be good. So, good chess player must have high IQ and excellent memory.