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J Man
01-03-2021, 05:13 AM
The village of Shengjin in Fan Mirdite is an interesting one so far in terms of Y-DNA results. So far all of the tested samples from this village are J2a-L70 which of course is very rare among the Ghegs of Northern Albania. Sources seem to say that the founder of this village was a man named ''Gjin'' that arrived there probably during the 18th century although there seems to be some indications that he may have arrived earlier although it really is hard to say.


https://sq.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sh%C3%ABngjin_(Mirdit%C3%AB)

https://es-la.facebook.com/554394537968431/posts/shengjin-fane-mirditefshati-shengjin-eshte-i-perbere-nga-lagjet-flyre-ka-nje-sip/1352326358175241/

https://issuu.com/rresheni/docs/fan_profile_eng

Kelmendasi
02-14-2021, 01:41 PM
On the Albanian Rrėnjėt project Facebook page, a new post (https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=247644973603074&id=101700961530810&__tn__=K-R)regarding the village of Shėngjin in Fan, Mirdita, has been posted. A couple of interesting points are brought up in the post.

It seems that the project has almost tested at least one male member from every brotherhood of Shėngjin which is very good. The oral traditions of the village all seem to state that the brotherhoods of Noka, Ēeēi, Ndreu, and Boēi all come from the same paternal ancestor, whilst the Bushati are an unrelated fis that may have lived in the region prior to the arrival of the ancestor of the aforementioned brotherhoods. Oral traditions also mention an older Cakoni fis which is no longer present in the village. As for where the four main brotherhoods came from, Mark Prendi states that they came from the southeast, crossing Mali i Zepes. Preng Vorfi on the other hand suggests that they came from Bitola (Manastir in Albanian), but that they also share common origin with some brotherhoods from Klinė in Peja, Kosovo.

In regards to Y-DNA, five members coming from the Boēi, Noka, Ēeēi, and Bushati have tested as J2a-Y24651 (https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-Y24651/). Close clusters have been found around Tirana, Bulqiza, Lezha, Elbasan, Fier, Himara, and also in a sample with Aromanian origin from Voskopojė. Though one sample from Debar in North Macedonia belongs to this same cluster, which might give credibility to the tradition of origin from the southeast. Sample R136 from Imperial Rome belonged to J2a-Y24651>Z40772 (https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-Z40772/), suggesting a potential arrival with the Romans.

Korabi
02-14-2021, 03:20 PM
On the Albanian Rrėnjėt project Facebook page, a new post (https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=247644973603074&id=101700961530810&__tn__=K-R)regarding the village of Shėngjin in Fan, Mirdita, has been posted. A couple of interesting points are brought up in the post.

It seems that the project has almost tested at least one male member from every brotherhood of Shėngjin which is very good. The oral traditions of the village all seem to state that the brotherhoods of Noka, Ēeēi, Ndreu, and Boēi all come from the same paternal ancestor, whilst the Bushati are an unrelated fis that may have lived in the region prior to the arrival of the ancestor of the aforementioned brotherhoods. Oral traditions also mention an older Cakoni fis which is no longer present in the village. As for where the four main brotherhoods came from, Mark Prendi states that they came from the southeast, crossing Mali i Zepes. Preng Vorfi on the other hand suggests that they came from Bitola (Manastir in Albanian), but that they also share common origin with some brotherhoods from Klinė in Peja, Kosovo.

In regards to Y-DNA, five members coming from the Boēi, Noka, Ēeēi, and Bushati have tested as J2a-Y24651 (https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-Y24651/). Close clusters have been found around Tirana, Bulqiza, Lezha, Elbasan, Fier, Himara, and also in a sample with Aromanian origin from Voskopojė. Though one sample from Debar in North Macedonia belongs to this same cluster, which might give credibility to the tradition of origin from the southeast. Sample R136 from Imperial Rome belonged to J2a-Y24651>Z40772 (https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-Z40772/), suggesting a potential arrival with the Romans.

Not to derail the main subject. But I recently got an interesting 23andme match in J2a. More specifically -L70 from Kosova.

J Man
02-14-2021, 03:47 PM
On the Albanian Rrėnjėt project Facebook page, a new post (https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=247644973603074&id=101700961530810&__tn__=K-R)regarding the village of Shėngjin in Fan, Mirdita, has been posted. A couple of interesting points are brought up in the post.

It seems that the project has almost tested at least one male member from every brotherhood of Shėngjin which is very good. The oral traditions of the village all seem to state that the brotherhoods of Noka, Ēeēi, Ndreu, and Boēi all come from the same paternal ancestor, whilst the Bushati are an unrelated fis that may have lived in the region prior to the arrival of the ancestor of the aforementioned brotherhoods. Oral traditions also mention an older Cakoni fis which is no longer present in the village. As for where the four main brotherhoods came from, Mark Prendi states that they came from the southeast, crossing Mali i Zepes. Preng Vorfi on the other hand suggests that they came from Bitola (Manastir in Albanian), but that they also share common origin with some brotherhoods from Klinė in Peja, Kosovo.

In regards to Y-DNA, five members coming from the Boēi, Noka, Ēeēi, and Bushati have tested as J2a-Y24651 (https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-Y24651/). Close clusters have been found around Tirana, Bulqiza, Lezha, Elbasan, Fier, Himara, and also in a sample with Aromanian origin from Voskopojė. Though one sample from Debar in North Macedonia belongs to this same cluster, which might give credibility to the tradition of origin from the southeast. Sample R136 from Imperial Rome belonged to J2a-Y24651>Z40772 (https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-Z40772/), suggesting a potential arrival with the Romans.

I have talked to a few people from this village on Facebook and it is quite clear that they are very proud of where they come from. They seem to have a very strong identity among them. Unfortunately none of them seem to know when Shėngjin was settled though.

trdbr1234
02-14-2021, 03:56 PM
On the Albanian Rrėnjėt project Facebook page, a new post (https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=247644973603074&id=101700961530810&__tn__=K-R)regarding the village of Shėngjin in Fan, Mirdita, has been posted. A couple of interesting points are brought up in the post.

It seems that the project has almost tested at least one male member from every brotherhood of Shėngjin which is very good. The oral traditions of the village all seem to state that the brotherhoods of Noka, Ēeēi, Ndreu, and Boēi all come from the same paternal ancestor, whilst the Bushati are an unrelated fis that may have lived in the region prior to the arrival of the ancestor of the aforementioned brotherhoods. Oral traditions also mention an older Cakoni fis which is no longer present in the village. As for where the four main brotherhoods came from, Mark Prendi states that they came from the southeast, crossing Mali i Zepes. Preng Vorfi on the other hand suggests that they came from Bitola (Manastir in Albanian), but that they also share common origin with some brotherhoods from Klinė in Peja, Kosovo.

In regards to Y-DNA, five members coming from the Boēi, Noka, Ēeēi, and Bushati have tested as J2a-Y24651 (https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-Y24651/). Close clusters have been found around Tirana, Bulqiza, Lezha, Elbasan, Fier, Himara, and also in a sample with Aromanian origin from Voskopojė. Though one sample from Debar in North Macedonia belongs to this same cluster, which might give credibility to the tradition of origin from the southeast. Sample R136 from Imperial Rome belonged to J2a-Y24651>Z40772 (https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-Z40772/), suggesting a potential arrival with the Romans.

Do we know the TMRCA between the Shengjin individuals? As well as between them and the Dibra individuals?

Rrenjet.
02-14-2021, 06:03 PM
Do we know the TMRCA between the Shengjin individuals? As well as between them and the Dibra individuals?

These distances have not been calculated through high resolution testing. We currently have some hints, but no conclusive evidence, to support the tradition of ancestry from SE.

broder
02-15-2021, 06:23 PM
Same cluster seems to be widespread among Vlachs. Encountered among Vlachs of Krusevo, Shtip and Kogalnicea, Romania in Bosch paper.

J Man
04-17-2021, 06:04 PM
On the Albanian Rrėnjėt project Facebook page, a new post (https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=247644973603074&id=101700961530810&__tn__=K-R)regarding the village of Shėngjin in Fan, Mirdita, has been posted. A couple of interesting points are brought up in the post.

It seems that the project has almost tested at least one male member from every brotherhood of Shėngjin which is very good. The oral traditions of the village all seem to state that the brotherhoods of Noka, Ēeēi, Ndreu, and Boēi all come from the same paternal ancestor, whilst the Bushati are an unrelated fis that may have lived in the region prior to the arrival of the ancestor of the aforementioned brotherhoods. Oral traditions also mention an older Cakoni fis which is no longer present in the village. As for where the four main brotherhoods came from, Mark Prendi states that they came from the southeast, crossing Mali i Zepes. Preng Vorfi on the other hand suggests that they came from Bitola (Manastir in Albanian), but that they also share common origin with some brotherhoods from Klinė in Peja, Kosovo.

In regards to Y-DNA, five members coming from the Boēi, Noka, Ēeēi, and Bushati have tested as J2a-Y24651 (https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-Y24651/). Close clusters have been found around Tirana, Bulqiza, Lezha, Elbasan, Fier, Himara, and also in a sample with Aromanian origin from Voskopojė. Though one sample from Debar in North Macedonia belongs to this same cluster, which might give credibility to the tradition of origin from the southeast. Sample R136 from Imperial Rome belonged to J2a-Y24651>Z40772 (https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-Z40772/), suggesting a potential arrival with the Romans.

Another interesting thing about these families from Shengjin is that they all claim that the Bushati family was already present in the area of Shengjin before the others arrived. Traditionally they claim to be unrelated but they do not intermarry. Bushati though matches the rest in terms of Y-DNA...They are all part of the same genetic lineage it seems.

Kelmendasi
05-17-2021, 02:26 AM
Oral traditions also mention an older Cakoni fis which is no longer present in the village.
The Cakoni according to a source presented to me by J Man were in numerous territorial disputes and conflicts with the Bushati, ultimately leading to them being displaced from Shėngjin to the settlement of Bushkash which today is within the Mat District and I believe traditionally belongs to the ethnographic or tribal region of Rranza. There they grew developing into three brotherhoods: Cakoni, Algjeka, and Halili. I have also come across this family name in other villages of the Ulėz Municipality such as Baz, Ulėz and Urakė. So it could be possible to reach out to individuals from these villages to test. Branches have even settled further south-west, for example in the village of Borizanė to the north of Kruja.

XXD
05-17-2021, 12:07 PM
The Cakoni according to a source presented to me by J Man were in numerous territorial disputes and conflicts with the Bushati, ultimately leading to them being displaced from Shėngjin to the settlement of Bushkash which today is within the Mat District and I believe traditionally belongs to the ethnographic or tribal region of Rranza. There they grew developing into three brotherhoods: Cakoni, Algjeka, and Halili. I have also come across this family name in other villages of the Ulėz Municipality such as Baz, Ulėz and Urakė. So it could be possible to reach out to individuals from these villages to test. Branches have even settled further south-west, for example in the village of Borizanė to the north of Kruja.

Does the name Cakoni have an Albanian etymology? Because the Tzakones were a special corps of guerilla soldiers who were used to guard castles by the Byzantines, especially in frontier areas. Given the prominent role of Albanians as mercenaries, I was wondering whether some of them functioned as Tzakones as well.

Kelmendasi
05-17-2021, 07:41 PM
Does the name Cakoni have an Albanian etymology? Because the Tzakones were a special corps of guerilla soldiers who were used to guard castles by the Byzantines, especially in frontier areas. Given the prominent role of Albanians as mercenaries, I was wondering whether some of them functioned as Tzakones as well.
To be honest I am not too sure on the etymology of this name, it may very well be connected to tzakōnes (Τζάκωνες) and has a connotation with the mercenary/marine group. But what makes me sceptical is the fact that that the aforementioned name seems to be a connected to the Tsakonians with the name itself possibly being a corruption of Lakōnes (Λάκωνες) or 'Laconians'.

XXD
05-17-2021, 08:03 PM
To be honest I am not too sure on the etymology of this name, it may very well be connected to tzakōnes (Τζάκωνες) and has a connotation with the mercenary/marine group. But what makes me sceptical is the fact that that the aforementioned name seems to be a connected to the Tsakonians with the name itself possibly being a corruption of Lakōnes (Λάκωνες) or 'Laconians'.

In fact, the name of the Tsakonians comes from a combination of Tzakones + Lacones. So the Laconians of SouthEastern Peloponnese where employed by the Byzantines as Tzakones, and the word Lacones became corrupted into Tsakones. There are Tzakonies in many parts of the Byzantine world.

In fact the medieval and modern Greek word to intercept is τσακώνω (tsakono), and to have an argument with someone is τσακώνομαι (tsakonome), because the Tzakones would intercept foreign enemies from the towers they were guarding.

If there were Kastrati Albanians, perhaps why not Cakoni? Many Albanians were mercenaries for the Byzantines. But who knows, their actual etymology may stem from another word.

J Man
09-13-2021, 08:49 PM
The Cakoni according to a source presented to me by J Man were in numerous territorial disputes and conflicts with the Bushati, ultimately leading to them being displaced from Shėngjin to the settlement of Bushkash which today is within the Mat District and I believe traditionally belongs to the ethnographic or tribal region of Rranza. There they grew developing into three brotherhoods: Cakoni, Algjeka, and Halili. I have also come across this family name in other villages of the Ulėz Municipality such as Baz, Ulėz and Urakė. So it could be possible to reach out to individuals from these villages to test. Branches have even settled further south-west, for example in the village of Borizanė to the north of Kruja.

Here is that source if others wish to see it. Not sure how accurate any of this is really.

"🇦🇱Kolosian - Shengjin dhe lidhja e tyre
historike.

Kolosiani eshtė njė nga fshatrat e Lumės nė Rrethin e Kukesit me njė histori interesante.
Emrin e ketij fshati e hasim ne regjistrat
osmane ne fund te shekullit XVI, dhe ne vitet 1571-1591 me emrin KOLOSNA.
Ky toponim ėshtė njė emertim antro-ponimik nga :KOL/ (e+es+ jan)....shihe "gjurmime onomastike...f.76 Tirane".Ne vitin 1571 Kolosiani ka patur 19 shtepi 8 prej tyre
kishin emrin e tyre ose te Babes Kol.Kola- Gjini, Kola-Nikolli, Kola-Biba, Kola-Andrea,
Kola-Gjon, Gjoni -Kol, Biba-Kol(beqar). Shih..."Autonomia e Lumes e lumjanet kap.II f.37." Njė studiues Elez Braha ne librin:
"Zeri i se Vertetes dhjetor 1998 f12" mbeshtetur ne gojedhėna thote se disa banore te kolosianit kishin ardh nga Gojani i Mirdites.
Emrin e fshatit e lidhe me tog fjaleshin, KOL -
S'jam.
Sipas njė burimi tjeter ISLAM SPAHIA f.15:" Kola e Gjini kan qene dy vllezer nga Malsia e Lezhes, largohen prej atje dhe KOLA vendoset ne Kolosian dhe Gjini ne Shengjin te Fanit dhe lidhjet e tyre kan vazhduar deri vone.
Pleqtė e Kolosianit, tregojnė se Kola e Gjini jane vllezer, prandaj ne shkonim e vinim tek njeri - tjetri per mire e per keq.
Kete na e ka pohu edhe ISUF SPAHIA sipas Hyllit te Drites 1932 qe shkruan: "Ne vdekjen e Sali Spahisė ne vitin 1917 kane ardhe me pa njė tub burrash nga Gjini Fanit me njė ka per dore". Pas asaj kohe jane nderpre shkuarjet e ardhjet ne mes Shengjinit e Kolosianit.
Profesor Dr.Shefqet Hoxha duke e trajtuar kėtė Histori tregon edhe njė fakt tjetėr ne vitin 1968. Plaku NDU LEKA i MADHE i Shengjinit 80 vjeqar tregon:" Kur erdhi turkia dy vllezerit Kola e Gjini ishin ne Kolosjan. KOLA ishte i martuar dhe kur e pyeten turqit si e ke emerin, ai pergjigjej Kol S' jam.
Kola qendroj ne Kolosian se nuk kishte ku te shkonte me familje. Gjini ishte beqare dhe erdhi ne Fanė.
Ai erdhi ne Xhuxhe fshati kishte rreth 30-40 shtepi.
Mori njė vajze e u pigjat (iku me te shpejt) e erdhi e u vendos ne Shengjin.
Gjini lindi pasardhesit qe krijuan fisin qe sot
perbehet nga 4 vllazni te nji gjaku. 1) NDOKA me barqet: Nushi Preni
Vorfaj Dozhi Keqi e Gjergji.
2.BOĒI me barqet:Gjidoda Leka Kola e Boēi. 3.ĢJEĒI( ĒEĒI) me barqet:Ēeēi e Brunga.
4.Ndrejat me barqet: Margjokajt e Kecajt."
Deshminė e Ndue Lekes e tregon Prof. Dr. Shefqet Hoxha ma perforcoj edhe Plaku 80 vjeqar nga Flyra Preng Gjok Keqi qe me renditi te 4 fiset dhe tregoje lidhjet e Shengjinit me Kolosian siq mi ka tregue KEĒI
( Tate gjyshi).qe kemi patur te shkuar e te ardhe deri para 70 vjetėsh
Kjo ka ndodh qe ne kohen e shpates, (ne kohen e islamizimit).

Shenim:
Nga mbledhja e te gjitha te dhenave mund
te arrimė ne disa perfundime:
Historia e Shengjinit duhet hulumtuar pasi ka mundesi qe Gjini ti perkasė Fisit vjetėr Cipni pasi ky fis ėshtė zhdukur dhe sot ruhen rrenojat dhe varrezat e fshatit. Te paret e Gjinit kan levizur nga Shengjini por nuk dihet se ku kan shkuar por dimė qe vllezerit Kola e Gjini te Kolosjanit i perkasin periudhės 1500-1600.
Ne Shengjin para se te kthehet Gjini e te vendoset ne kete fshat kemi patur dy fise Bushat e Cakoni ata u vranė me njeri tjetrin dhe largohet fisi Cakoni e vendoset ne Bushkash te Matit.
Kur ka ardh Gjini ka gjet Bushatin, keto kanė bashkėjetuar pa probeleme deri ne ditet e sotme.
Sipas gjykimit tim vendosja e Gjinit ne Shengjin tregon se para ardhesit e tij jane larguar per shume kohe dhe jane kthyer perseri ne vendin e tyre nė origjinė.
Per ta ilustruar kete teze mund tė sjellim si argument fisin Mamezi te Xhuxhes qe iku e u vendos ne Mamez te Kukesit dhe pas 3- 4 shekuj u rikthye ne Xhuxhe.
Keshtu ka ndodh edhe me Gjinin. Kjo eshtė historia e Gjinit dhe lidhjet e hershme ne vitet 1500 1600 me vėllain e tij Kolen dhe ma vone lidhjet Kolosjan -Shengjin.

Shėnim:
Profesor Dr Shefqet Hoxha bashkėbisedoj me Ndue Lekėn e Madh mbi historikun e Shėngjinit nė vitin 1968."