PDA

View Full Version : Were Aryan Lineages replaced in Eastern Europe by Slavic Lineages ?



VishwamitraSunuh
01-04-2021, 06:27 AM
looking at the maps of the Eastern Russia we see that R1a z93 and other lineages were dominating in the Fatyanovo-Abashivo-Sintasta Period, i assume even in Middle Deniper Culture z93 lineage was present maybe in smaller number. but after they Scythain age it seems that Slavic migration replaced Aryan/Indo-Iranian lineages and communities with Slavic one in the region and today very very few z93 samples are there in Eastern Europe.
https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-gYHk8ckB7DQ/XDi1YOl7efI/AAAAAAAAHbA/EHIeYYhaFUQhyIx393tjFOLYLL-bIa5vwCLcBGAs/s1600/Corded_influences_in_the_west.png

what is the reason behind this Replacement ? just the Slavic Migration ?

Pressure from Turkic and Hunnic groups that allowed complete replacement of Aryan lineages by Slavic as they were probably destroyed by Nomadic tribes ?

what is the name of this Replacement event ?

====

i hope you guys wont mind too many questions, i am a newbie in this area and i am interested in knowing history of Aryans in Europe and what they were and how they were in their original homeland. i use that information to compare with Vedic and Modern North Indian cultures. this data is useful when i explain AMT to fellow Indians.

Coldmountains
01-04-2021, 10:54 AM
looking at the maps of the Eastern Russia we see that R1a z93 and other lineages were dominating in the Fatyanovo-Abashivo-Sintasta Period, i assume even in Middle Deniper Culture z93 lineage was present maybe in smaller number. but after they Scythain age it seems that Slavic migration replaced Aryan/Indo-Iranian lineages and communities with Slavic one in the region and today very very few z93 samples are there in Eastern Europe.
https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-gYHk8ckB7DQ/XDi1YOl7efI/AAAAAAAAHbA/EHIeYYhaFUQhyIx393tjFOLYLL-bIa5vwCLcBGAs/s1600/Corded_influences_in_the_west.png

what is the reason behind this Replacement ? just the Slavic Migration ?

Pressure from Turkic and Hunnic groups that allowed complete replacement of Aryan lineages by Slavic as they were probably destroyed by Nomadic tribes ?

what is the name of this Replacement event ?

====

i hope you guys wont mind too many questions, i am a newbie in this area and i am interested in knowing history of Aryans in Europe and what they were and how they were in their original homeland. i use that information to compare with Vedic and Modern North Indian cultures. this data is useful when i explain AMT to fellow Indians.

Slavs not replaced Fatyanovo and Z93 was unlikely the dominant marker in Central Russia when Slavs arrived. Rather Fatyanovo was earlier replaced by Finno-Ugrians and Baltic_BA-like types coming from Trzciniec-Komariv after 1500 B.C. I am not sure when Fatyanovo derived languages were exactly gone in Central Russia but probably around 1500 B.C .

CopperAxe
01-04-2021, 11:24 AM
Slavs not replaced Fatyanovo and Z93 was unlikely the dominant marker in Central Russia when Slavs arrived. Rather Fatyanovo was earlier replaced by Finno-Ugrians and Baltic_BA-like types coming from Trzciniec-Komariv after 1500 B.C. I am not sure when Fatyanovo derived languages were exactly gone in Central Russia but probably around 1500 B.C .
To add to this, the replacement of the Fatyanovo culture materially did not really represent a disappearance of Indo-Iranians in the vicinity as by then they had expanded already and were living more southern basically, occupying the steppes and adjacent regions.

I think he is more referring to the regions such as Ukraine occupied by Scythian cultures rather than the western Russian forest zone where Fatyanovo resided.

VishwamitraSunuh
01-04-2021, 11:42 AM
Slavs not replaced Fatyanovo and Z93 was unlikely the dominant marker in Central Russia when Slavs arrived. Rather Fatyanovo was earlier replaced by Finno-Ugrians and Baltic_BA-like types coming from Trzciniec-Komariv after 1500 B.C. I am not sure when Fatyanovo derived languages were exactly gone in Central Russia but probably around 1500 B.C .

Thanks for the reply, is this the reason why North Russia was Uralic Speaking before Slavic tribes migrated there .

VishwamitraSunuh
01-04-2021, 11:43 AM
To add to this, the replacement of the Fatyanovo culture materially did not really represent a disappearance of Indo-Iranians in the vicinity as by then they had expanded already and were living more southern basically, occupying the steppes and adjacent regions.

I think he is more referring to the regions such as Ukraine occupied by Scythian cultures rather than the western Russian forest zone where Fatyanovo resided.

Yes i was talking about Eastern and South Eastern Europe like former Fatyanovo lands, Ukraine and Southern Russia till the Ural mountain.

I excluded Andronovo Culture as it was located in Asia.

Alain
01-04-2021, 01:12 PM
To add to this, the replacement of the Fatyanovo culture materially did not really represent a disappearance of Indo-Iranians in the vicinity as by then they had expanded already and were living more southern basically, occupying the steppes and adjacent regions.

I think he is more referring to the regions such as Ukraine occupied by Scythian cultures rather than the western Russian forest zone where Fatyanovo resided.

But the Scythians came to this area a little later (further south of Faytanovo) and Faytanovo was a long way off. From the 800 century BC onwards, Scythians in the Black Sea region and the European steppe area were in contact with Uralic peoples who immigrated to this area a few centuries earlier, i.e. where Faytanovo used to be, Uralic peoples now settled in the forest steppe zone

VishwamitraSunuh
01-08-2021, 06:18 AM
But the Scythians came to this area a little later (further south of Faytanovo) and Faytanovo was a long way off. From the 800 century BC onwards, Scythians in the Black Sea region and the European steppe area were in contact with Uralic peoples who immigrated to this area a few centuries earlier, i.e. where Faytanovo used to be, Uralic peoples now settled in the forest steppe zone

what is the name of this migration event ?