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genealogist_jewish
01-18-2021, 08:52 AM
Dear friends,

I recently ran the Eurogenes K7 AMI test on DNA Genics's admixture stuido. I have attached my results.

I was rather surprised by the high Near Eastern percentage. I am aware Ashkenazim have a Levantine ancestry--but didn't think it was as high as 60%.

Do these results seem accurate? It would be interesting to compare it against people on here with a lower, or no Ashkenazi %s, if anyone would be willing to share.

Thank you. 42667

Seabass
01-18-2021, 09:18 AM
Nothing surprising here, I think people underestimate the overall MENA percentage of DNA in Western Jews and Ashkenazi Jews which doesn't just comprise a Levantine origin. IMO Eastern-Mediterranean + Levantine + Berber + Other Misc West-Asian origins I think could well account for 70-85% of Ashkenazi Jews (depends whether Eastern or Western) and maybe 80-90% for Sephardic Jews. If you consider some Syrian Jews of Sephardic identity, it might be as high as 100%.

I personally consider the Imperial Romans of Lazio to be more Near-Eastern than European, but this kind of East-Mediterranean ancestry high in Southern Italians, Greek Islanders, Cypriots and Western Jews could really be considered both which complicates the whole debate over what is 'European' and 'Near Eastern'. Clearly the populations I've just mentioned descend from people who bridged Southern Europe with the Near East.

firemonkey
01-18-2021, 11:11 AM
I'm British with no known Jewish .

42670

genealogist_jewish
01-18-2021, 11:26 AM
Thanks for this, @firemonkey.

Can anyone explain the almost 40% Near Eastern result, for someone who is completely European? Is this the result for most Europeans?

This is why I was slightly sceptical as to the accuracy of this test. I see from this link that most Europeans have a substantial Near Eastern result, so doubt this is accurate. https://www.theapricity.com/forum/showthread.php?290607-Post-Eurogenes-K7-AMI-from-AdmixtureStudio-(with-oracle)/page2

leorcooper19
01-18-2021, 03:47 PM
Hey, thanks for making the transition from Facebook! Welcome to AG.

In short: a major source of ancestry throughout Europe, the Near East, and North Africa is derived from "Anatolian Farmers", who lived and spread their population and technology throughout the Neolithic. A good page on the European impact of this can be found here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_European_Farmers

In this calculator, this kind of ancestry is put into the Near Eastern Category, because it ultimately did from the "Near East", even though it's been part of "European" for many thousands of years.

If you have any kits on FTDNA with Family Finder, you can see a variation of this same thing with their "Ancient Origins" tool. Here are the results of a 100% Eastern Ashkenazi Jew (EAJ) with roots from Poland:
Farmer - 62%
Metal Age Invader (Steppe) - 19%
Hunter Gatherer - 16%
Non-European - 3%

And for reference, my own results, half EAJ and half British
Farmer - 52%
Metal Age Invader - 16%
Hunger Gatherer - 32%
Non-European - 0%

However, these models can be better expressed by G25 coordinates using the aDNA references themselves:
Target: Ashkenazi_Poland
Distance: 1.7754% / 0.01775358
56.8 TUR_Tepecik_Ciftlik_N
25.8 Yamnaya_RUS_Samara
8.8 Levant_PPNB
4.6 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
2.6 MAR_Taforalt
1.2 Han
0.2 WHG

So it really just matters what time frame you're looking at.

genealogist_jewish
01-18-2021, 07:08 PM
Brilliantly explained!

Is there a way of knowing how far back the calculators go more or less? I would imagine EG K13 is more recent as Europeans tend to get a low East_med (which is essentially Levant) %, despite their Near East %s in the K7 AMI test.

Thanks for introducing me to this fantastic forum!

leorcooper19
01-18-2021, 08:05 PM
Brilliantly explained!

Is there a way of knowing how far back the calculators go more or less? I would imagine EG K13 is more recent as Europeans tend to get a low East_med (which is essentially Levant) %, despite their Near East %s in the K7 AMI test.

Thanks for introducing me to this fantastic forum!

Good question. I suppose a good rule of thumb is the more populations there are, the more "recent" it is. For example, K36 includes populations like "Italian" and "Iberian" so it has to be distinguishing between ancestries that are more recent than the Neolithic or Bronze Age, for example.

Considering your interests, I'd recommend reading the Western Jewish Megathread here: https://anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?14484-Could-Western-Jews-(Ash-and-Seph-)-descend-from-Aegeans-and-Levantine-admixture

It's the record of many thousands of posts, arguments, discussions, and debates on all things Jewish genetics, focusing mostly of the ethnogenesis of Western Jews. It would take a long time to read all the way through, but skimming much of it would be eye-opening to any interested beginner.

genealogist_jewish
01-18-2021, 10:25 PM
Thanks for the link to the thread. Over 1000 pages!! Will read what I can...

Thanks so much for your help, Leo. Both on FB and here you’ve helped me understand the complex and fascinating wold of Jewish genetics. Thank you.