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tipirneni
04-12-2022, 07:56 PM
https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-Z2433/
https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-Y28241/


might have the most of the maximum Indians under the J2b2 ( clades in India )


The <10% presence among some South/South Central India middle caste groups and big presence in the tribal groups doesn't provide enough historical narrative to explain the supposed demic diffusion from Iran

tipirneni
04-12-2022, 08:43 PM
Scientific studies are saying this is a neolithic demic diffusion from Iran.

The majority of J2b2 found among Dravidian castes like Balija, Kamma, Maha caste, Vellalar, Lingayat, Nepali Tharus and Tribals like asur, mondi, shikari, pichakuntla, narikuravar


India, 17 STRs, 158 samples, 11 SNPs: Singh et al 2016, 355 of 3023 males belonged to J2, no J*-M304 and J2*-M172, a lot of J2b-M241 and some J2b-M205; J2b2-M241 concentrated in Eastern India/South central (15–35% in tribals Asur, Narikuravar, Pichakuntla, Shikari and Mondi, etc.). 2-10% in castes like Balija, Kamma, Maha, Lingayat etc...

Afghan Hindu Kush, 39 STRs, 279 samples (262 J2a, 17 J2b), 10 SNPs: Di Cristofaro et al. 2013, “87 Pashtun, 142 Tajik, 77 Hazara, 74 Turkmen and 127 Uzbek obtained successful Y-chromosome analysis.

BeansGas
04-12-2022, 11:39 PM
I think J2b2 in India still might be related with indo europeans expanding into india, just look at the northern pakistanian sample from ~900 bce, there is also a new sample from the iron age xinjiang in this branch :https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-Y958/.

tipirneni
04-13-2022, 12:22 AM
I think J2b2 in India still might be related with indo europeans expanding into india, just look at the northern pakistanian sample from ~900 bce, there is also a new sample from the iron age xinjiang in this branch :https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-Y958/.

Asa you can see the top branch is from 5th and 4th millenium BC that spread into India. Only very few samples from this lot found outside which probably shows it was a single migration and there was some isolation/bottleneck for long time before they spread in Medieval time into South. Those few samples that you see outside can be described by reverse migration out of India. We see those cases among H-M82 where huge number of people traveled outside either alone with Arabs/ISrealis or as Romani etc.. Even R1a has spread out starting Ashokas victories in the NW and Buddhist teachers in Central Asia/China.

BeansGas
04-13-2022, 01:59 AM
Asa you can see the top branch is from 5th and 4th millenium BC that spread into India. Only very few samples from this lot found outside which probably shows it was a single migration and there was some isolation/bottleneck for long time before they spread in Medieval time into South. Those few samples that you see outside can be described by reverse migration out of India. We see those cases among H-M82 where huge number of people traveled outside either alone with Arabs/ISrealis or as Romani etc.. Even R1a has spread out starting Ashokas victories in the NW and Buddhist teachers in Central Asia/China.

No older J2b2 found in India to suport your imaginary claim.

tipirneni
04-13-2022, 08:39 PM
6th millennium BC (8300YBP-7600YBP) is a Neolithic timeframe when the https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-Z2433/ formed and probably existed in small number

BeansGas
04-14-2022, 04:38 PM
6th millennium BC (8300YBP-7600YBP) is a Neolithic timeframe when the https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-Z2433/ formed and probably existed in small number

Considering all the ancient samples found so far it is, clear that in the neaolithic J2b2 was both in western iran and central asia (it possibly mutated/formed somewhere inbeetwen) from where it later migrated into india, possibly with indo european groups coming from Iran and central asia.

tipirneni
04-14-2022, 07:06 PM
Considering all the ancient samples found so far it is, clear that in the neaolithic J2b2 was both in western iran and central asia (it possibly mutated/formed somewhere inbeetwen) from where it later migrated into india, possibly with indo european groups coming from Iran and central asia.

Where do you see Iran or central asia there? Most of them are in India meaning https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-Z2433/ developed somewhere but now solely exists in India/South Asia. Few here and there probably moved out along with H1 and R1a people but the bulk of that branch developed in India after initial split. More than half the people there are Tribals meaning they have high Austroasiactic tribal mix.

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04-15-2022, 03:53 PM
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AlluGobi
04-29-2022, 06:55 PM
I think J2b2 in India still might be related with indo europeans expanding into india, just look at the northern pakistanian sample from ~900 bce, there is also a new sample from the iron age xinjiang in this branch :https://www.yfull.com/tree/J-Y958/.

Just wanted to clarify that this "Pakistanian" sample is a Barakzai Pashtun with roots in Kandahar, Afghanistan.

Under J-FT14578, the Kuwaiti sample has the surname Al-bloushi so has roots in Baluchistan, difficult to say anything about the Bahraini one since the name doesn't give away much. There were also a couple of samples from Kuwait under this branch that were removed, at least one of whom was a native of the Failaka Island off the coast of Kuwait.

Vognejar
05-02-2022, 07:43 AM
In this context, it seems to me very likely that the origin was from some ancient Indo-European branch with the influence of the ancient Iranians. The Pashtuns have a Saka theory of origin?

tipirneni
05-03-2022, 12:08 AM
In this context, it seems to me very likely that the origin was from some ancient Indo-European branch with the influence of the ancient Iranians. The Pashtuns have a Saka theory of origin?

We dont know if they distantly related to IE branch or not. But there is no separate civilization like Vedic civilzation associated with R1a-Z93 mixing with local HG like H1 or ancient reocrds of Iran Neolithic towns/colonies associated with J2a mixing with local H1 people. These J2b groups some how lost their civilization and became tribals and then mixed with later Medieval expansion with other groups like H1 and L1 and expanded.