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View Full Version : 2 out of 5 Toubou have R1b(v88)



venustas
08-17-2014, 04:44 AM
https://www.familytreedna.com/public/chad,chad/default.aspx?section=yresults
2 have E1b1b and 1 has T.

rms2
08-18-2014, 10:22 AM
I'm not doubting you, but I only see one entry listed in the Toubou category, and he is T-M70. Perhaps you could clarify for us and point out the others.

palamede
08-18-2014, 02:49 PM
I'm not doubting you, but I only see one entry listed in the Toubou category, and he is T-M70. Perhaps you could clarify for us and point out the others.
In Wikipedia
"The Toubou are subdivided in two separate people, the Teda and Daza. They are believed to share a common origin, but speak now two distinct if clearly associated languages, Tedaga (TÚda Toubou) and Dazaga (Daza Toubou), both Nilo-Saharan languages. Of the two, the Daza are the most numerous, being 312,000 persons, while the Teda are only 42,000.
The Daza live primarily in the Sahara regions of south-eastern Niger and north and central Chad. They consider themselves a warrior people, and are almost entirely Muslim. The increasing desertification of Africa has resulted in a reduction of their traditionally nomadic, herding lifestyle. Much of the political class of Chad are drawn from Daza. There are more than a dozen subgroups of Daza: the Kreda of Bahr el Ghazal are the largest; next in importance are the Daza of Kanem Prefecture."

Goran is also a term for Daza
If we added Goran Daza, Goran Kanem and Toubou from FTDNA we have got for N=13 :
1A, 6E, 5R and 1T.

venustas
08-18-2014, 08:51 PM
I'm not doubting you, but I only see one entry listed in the Toubou category, and he is T-M70. Perhaps you could clarify for us and point out the others.

I originally added the Toubou singlelton and I also added the Goran Daza, I did not think to add the Goran Kanem but I should have as the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goran_(disambiguation) Dazazda language is also known as Goran.

proffg
01-01-2015, 02:10 AM
I am the Admin for the chad tribes dna project and the results you were discussing above i have personally tested all the participants. B)

1- Wikipedia is not a reliable source for information, anyone can edit it.
2- The classification of Toubou's as Daza and Teda, is NOT how we Chadians classify our self's, its how western scholars decided to classify us. And the results of all "Toubou' candidates are prove of that, as the results are all scattered and there is only STR 12 match is between 1 Goran from Kanem and 1 Daza. There are no Genetics evidence supporting common ancestry less than 2000 years ago for " Toubou" thus far. Some of the tested samples are of cousin tribes and they are expected to have a common ancestor less than 2000 years ago IF the theory of one toubou ancestor is true .
As for the similarities in languages between the Daza and the Teda, Algerians and Yemenis speak Arabic, but more than 70% of Yemenis are on J1 and more than 70% of Algerians are on E-M81.
3- If you ask a Daza in Chad right now if he is a toubou, the answer you will get is NO. Only westren education and western influenced scholars say otherwise. I wonder why? :\
4- The classifications of the samples in the project is based on the "accurate" classification of each segment in the society and as per our oral history. And before i classify a person, i do ask him personally ' How Do you Classify your self? " There is no reason for a Toubou to claim to be otherwise? And my personal understanding of tribale structure in Chad and the history of each tribe has helped me insure my classification is inline with the accurate tribal structure in the region.
5- Therefore, there is only "one" Toubou result in the project and its on Haplogroup T.

So the title of post is misleading and incorrect.>:(

MaialachiWedeyi15
01-19-2015, 07:28 AM
Kalahan,

I am Toubou and I am here to correct a bit of misinformation about our people.

(1) There is no difference between Teda and Daza other than politics. No Daza will tell you they are NOT Toubou. In fact, a Daza will argue with you or fight you if you suggest that they are not.

(2) Both Teda and Daza are Gourane. Gourane is Chad Arabic for "Garamante."

(3) The heading of this thread is very incorrect. "2 out of 5." I would advise you to gain a thorough understanding of statistics and quantitative reasoning before making such of a claim. It is impossible for a handful of people to to be a genetic representation of the entire population which is some 500 million of so, possibly more when we acknowledge the fact that both the Teda and Daza have clans that are mixed with Kanembu, Kanuri, Zuwaiya, Shuwa, Zaghawa and the list goes on.

(4) What #3 implies is that if a thorough DNA test were to be conducted of our peoples, one would find a range of genetics from R1b V88 to E1b1a7,8,9, etc. on the paternal lineage and a range from H and HV to L2 and L3e on the maternal side. Chad is the 'cross corridor' of African culture. This means that genetics commonly found in East Africa, Asia, North Africa, Europe, West Africa and South Africa can be found, provide the testing is thorough.

(5) So far to date, and to the best of my knowledge, word coming from our brothers and sisters who have migrated to Canada and the US, there are only a handful of Toubou samples out there, mostly from the Daza in the Bahr el Ghazal region, which respectfully speaking, has three Daza clans: Kreda, Kadawa, Kercheda and to a lesser extinct, Anakaza. All of these clans are mixed the ethnics mentioned above.

(6) So far to date, word coming from some Kreda, Anakaza, Tomagra and Zaghawa residing in the US, there are two black Americans with our genetics and a third residing in London. But their connection is said to be maternal.

(7) Any attempt to understand these genetics should be done with consent of our people. Simple put, come to us and ask and if you have asked, make sure you are asking the right questions.

Salaam

dp
01-19-2015, 08:57 AM
...
Welcome to Anthrogenica.
David Powell
dp :-)