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View Full Version : The autosomal make-up of Europe after the 2015 study



Piquerobi
02-16-2015, 04:23 PM
With the sequence of studies on ancient European remains, our understanding of the peopling of Europe has increased substantially. Initially Europe had Hunter Gatherers, on a West to East Axis (Mesolithic and before). Then came the Neolithic, which meant a pull towards the Near East. What exactly was this component is something still to be more investigated. We already know there was significant mtDNA and yDNA change, as well as autosomal change. The autosomal meant a pull towards the Near East. Then came the steppe invasion, which also brought R1b/R1a and the autosomal make-up of the Yamnayans (Eastern Hunter Gatherer + Neolithic, their own type of Near Eastern pull, Armenians being a proxy for that). With the steppe invasion, the WHG+EEF population of Europe was pulled, depending on the degree of Yamnaya input, towards the East. There are many more observations one can make. What else have you noticed?

http://i57.tinypic.com/2cdibte.png
http://i59.tinypic.com/71tcw1.png

Shaikorth
02-16-2015, 04:48 PM
Broadly speaking that's how it is. Note that PCA has the ancients projected though, that means it underestimates the distance of ancient genomes to modern populations. Figure 2 is not, it looks broadly similar but hunter-gatherer samples are more distant from modern ones.

http://s24.postimg.org/t0woqjqo5/haakfigure2.jpg

newtoboard
02-16-2015, 05:06 PM
Broadly speaking that's how it is. Note that PCA has the ancients projected though, that means it underestimates the distance of ancient genomes to modern populations. Figure 2 is not, it looks broadly similar but hunter-gatherer samples are more distant from modern ones.

http://s24.postimg.org/t0woqjqo5/haakfigure2.jpg

Do you think it is possible the more Southern Yamnaya/Southern EHG groups will show more ANE (ie they might be equidistant between the Samara/Karelia EHG and the ANE-Malta sample)?

Shaikorth
02-16-2015, 05:15 PM
Do you think it is possible the more Southern Yamnaya/Southern EHG groups will show more ANE (ie they might be equidistant between the Samara/Karelia EHG and the ANE-Malta sample)?

Samara EHG seems to have a bit less ANE than Karelian sample so probably ANE did not increase towards south. However it is also of poorer quality than the Karelian, so perhaps they were more similar to each other than it seems from the study. Hard to say for sure without more EHG genomes.

newtoboard
02-16-2015, 05:27 PM
Samara EHG seems to have a bit less ANE than Karelian sample so probably ANE did not increase towards south. However it is also of poorer quality than the Karelian, so perhaps they were more similar to each other than it seems from the study. Hard to say for sure without more EHG genomes.

I have no idea what to make of that Karelian HG. It certainly seems like an outlier and it has an mtDNA that is very eastern. Couldn't the presence of an ENA component drag down the ANE percentage? That and hunters having smaller numbers in a region like Karelia than Samara. I mean it would otherwise be logical to expect the lower river regions to have more ANE given their distance away from the forest steppe.

Shaikorth
02-16-2015, 06:41 PM
Number of individuals in a population should have no bearing on the amount of ANE they have. Since Samara HG has less SNP's available for testing than Karelia HG comparisons may be iffy, but Samara sample seems to pull towards the WHG/BedouinB ends of the PCA compared to Karelian HG, not towards MA-1. If that implies anything, I'd say it's lower ANE.

newtoboard
02-16-2015, 08:03 PM
I meant the Karelian HG comes from a population in which there were more ANE individuals than WHG individuals relative to the Samara HG.

Piquerobi
11-09-2015, 09:11 PM
Interestingly, one can see it so clearly how genetic profile varies not only in space but also, and quite importantly, in time. The core European of today is different from the core European of the Neolithic era, who in turn was different from the core European of the hunter gatherer period. Just to show how relative the notions of "core" and "peripheral" are. Sardinians of today are peripheral in relation to the core European of today but mainstream in relation to the core European of the Neolithic era.

This is the updated map (Mathieson et al study):

http://i63.tinypic.com/15ek46x.png