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brimcmike
05-26-2016, 10:45 PM
So, I thought I'd prompt a conversation about how the DF49 x M222 Y Tree is shaping up these days.

I bought Big Y while on sale in late May. My results are now back. I imagine this is true for others, or will be soon.

I share 9 high-quality downstream SNPs with another ZP148 FTDNA participant (unsure of the privacy norms). So these should be named and registered with FTDNA soon.

I'm not completely clear about the criteria for the placement of public SNPs onto the Y Tree, or ISOGG Tree. I understand that clarity about relative position is part of it. Not sure how much information that generally requires.

I'm off to Ireland/Northern Ireland this coming week for sightseeing and to meet and tip a pint :beerchug: with some flesh-and-blood DNA-matched McMichael cousins (https://www.familytreedna.com/groups/mc-michael-mac-michael-surname/activity-feed). I'll attempt to tend this pot as able.

Sláinte mhaith! Slŕinte mhath! Iechyd da! Yeghes da! Yec'hed mat!

jdean
05-27-2016, 08:14 AM
So, I thought I'd prompt a conversation about how the DF49 x M222 Y Tree is shaping up these days.

I bought Big Y while on sale in late May. My results are now back. I imagine this is true for others, or will be soon.

I share 9 high-quality downstream SNPs with another ZP148 FTDNA participant (unsure of the privacy norms). So these should be named and registered with FTDNA soon.

I'm not completely clear about the criteria for the placement of public SNPs onto the Y Tree, or ISOGG Tree. I understand that clarity about relative position is part of it. Not sure how much information that generally requires.

I'm off to Ireland/Northern Ireland this coming week for sightseeing and to meet and tip a pint :beerchug: with some flesh-and-blood DNA-matched McMichael cousins (https://www.familytreedna.com/groups/mc-michael-mac-michael-surname/activity-feed). I'll attempt to tend this pot as able.

Sláinte mhaith! Slŕinte mhath! Iechyd da! Yeghes da! Yec'hed mat!

I'm running out of room on the tree I publish on the project page so think I'll have to split it : )

Have fun in Ireland, my eldest took a day trip to Dublin last week with her family, they were holidaying in Scotland.

MacEochaidh
05-27-2016, 04:15 PM
I am also part of a different branch downstream of ZP148. David Stedman says the SNPs will be named ZP171 - ZP178 when the time comes. I am Doherty (97610) from Eskaheen, Donegal and Reynolds, Texas, is the other man on our wee branch. Reynolds and I are 51/67 (-16) on our STR markers, so there is lots of room for more on the branch. I have two Dougherty matches from Pennsylvania, 66/67 and 64/67, who must be somehow related to my Doherty branch that remained in Ireland. Our signature, as per Mike W's great work, is DYS487=14, DYS565=11.

brimcmike
05-29-2016, 12:40 AM
Everything's better with pictures.
9512

brimcmike
06-04-2016, 11:18 PM
From Caldwell's and my BigY results: 8 new SNPs named, and submitted to FTDNA: ZP179-ZP186.

brimcmike
06-17-2016, 02:36 AM
From Caldwell's and my BigY results: 8 new SNPs named, and submitted to FTDNA: ZP179-ZP186.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/10258680/Draft_DF49xM222_Tree%20v22.png

MacEochaidh
06-17-2016, 06:26 PM
And from the results of Reynolds and Doherty (me), new SNPs ZP171 - ZP178.

RobertCasey
06-17-2016, 08:25 PM
You may want to try to use the new charting tool - SAPP. It is still in beta release but is extremely promising for solving your issue. Here are the steps:

1) Using your submission as the baseline, chart all M222 predicted positive submissions by your signature match and genetic distance from your baseline. Use the top 100 to 130 submissions as the input to SAPP (this is the current limit but is growing larger every week or so).
2) With those top matching submissions, determine the known YSNP test results (YSTR trees by themselves are not worth the effort due to massive parallel mutations and lack of divergence from the M222 modal).
3) Run SAPP and let it chart it for you. Manually check / enhance chart based on mutations that SAPP did not match.

Here is a first pass at your M222 cousin - L226. With my first pass, I doubled the size of the chart compared to just using SNP data. Around one of three untested submissions were assigned to branches. Depending on the genetic diversity of you signature compared to others, you results will vary a lot (for instance, my branch, FGC5647, was completely charted correctly due to its genetic isolation):

http://www.rcasey.net/DNA/R_L226/Haplotrees/L226_Home_20160525A.pdf

Here is a link to the SAPP tool (takes a lot of fine tuning):

http://www.jdvtools.com/SAPP/

MacEochaidh
06-26-2016, 05:13 AM
There's a new ZP148, Rodrigues, Portugal ZP148 (ZP181).

brimcmike
07-02-2016, 02:07 PM
Although a little like watching grass grow, it's still fun. One of the 8 SNPs that Caldwell and I validated back in May, ZP181, has branched off into another tester's terminal SNP. By spelling, Mr. Rodrigues' surname is likely Portuguese in origin.
The sea is not a barrier, it's a highway!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gallaecia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Britonia

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/10258680/Draft_DF49xM222_Tree%20v23.png

brimcmike
07-06-2016, 01:29 AM
I am part of a STR cluster of 5 McMichaels, who are presumably all ZP148 (one other kit and mine have already tested ZP148+, the 3 other kits are batched for ZP148 testing now). My line branched off from the others by at least 240 years, being documented in America since at least 1776. At 37 markers, the other lines all diverge from mine by 1, 2 and 3 STR mutations.

10207

I believe it is acceptable to test distant cousins sharing the same surname to validate private SNPs. If so, which kit should I test with NGS to validate our private SNPs; the one least divergent from my line (36/37, 64/67 STRs), or the one most divergent from my line (34/37 STRs)?

Thanks

Bart
07-12-2016, 11:18 AM
Great work. Only wish I could engage my own distant cousins to enable us to do something similar.

Never say never, as the technology improves & the costs fall, the numbers becoming interested should increase.

Sorry, but will purposely leave your question to those more qualified/experienced to respond, keen to know myself too.

brimcmike
09-03-2016, 02:41 AM
Small victory today, got the branches under ZP148 added to the FTDNA Y-DNA haplotree.
11337

Next, hopefully soon they make individual branching SNP tests available, and also add these SNPs to the DFxM222 SNP Pack.

brimcmike
09-09-2016, 03:53 AM
Got the SNPs ZP162-ZP167 (as ZP162, and ZP163-ZP167) added to the FTDNA haplotree.
11495
Sorry for the confusing colors, it's a screenshot of my haplotree.

jdean is working on inclusion of the new SNPs into the DF49xM222 SNP Pack.

Iechid da!

brimcmike
10-07-2016, 12:33 PM
Woolcott had already branched off on the FTDNA DF49 x M222 awaiting validation, then cousin Wolcott tested and so it goes. Lots of SNPs.

On yfull

R-PF2252 Y24527 * Y24524 * Y24525 +26 SNPs formed 4300 ybp, TMRCA 450 ybp
id:YF07100 new
id:YF06004

On the Big Tree

2804282-C-G
8684086-G-A
8686461-C-T
8725569-T-G
13647551-A-G
15230768-A-G
15481357-G-T
16608626-C-T
16970211-T-A
17048594-G-A
17184719-T-C
17210807-A-G
17710971-G-C
19070412-C-T
19117745-T-C
19170317-G-C
19222287-C-T
21541109-T-C
21834854-G-GAT
21876452-G-A
22464419-G-T
PF1181
22473959-C-A
22528663-A-T
22793472-G-A
23430006-C-G
23632468-T-C
PF2252

England Woolcott
388563
England Wolcott
42490

brimcmike
01-04-2018, 03:26 AM
Greetings Robert,

Thanks Robert for your reply.

This is a retrospective reply. I ran a SAPP analysis on a set of kits known or predicted to be R1b-L21>DF49>DF23>ZP148+/ZP149+. These kits were tested to at least 67 markers, with the exception of 2 McMichael kits tested only to 37 markers, but know to be cousins by genealogy, and tested at least to ZP148+. Here is SAPP predicted haplotree from this analysis:

20600

Cheers!

brimcmike
01-06-2018, 05:37 PM
Here's an improved version, showing just kit #s and surnames, thanks to the coding help provided by Dave Vance, the creator of SAPP:

20617

Cheers!