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DMXX
04-09-2013, 04:41 PM
Users may log onto their profiles now to note they've drastically altered the main menu for customers. Is it more user-friendly? Arguably so in my opinion, but is it a necessary change?

As ever, 23andMe continues to ignore the shortcomings of its service while focusing on the general sheen of their product. 23andMe is still using outdated Y-DNA and mtDNA nomenclature (Y-DNA dates back to ISOGG 2009), but my main chagrin continues to be with their Relative Finder.

I noted that RF frequently misses DNA segment matches which are less than 0.10% in size. I can appreciate the basis for this cut-off, given many users on their database from endogamous or well-represented communities would otherwise be overcome by potentially hundreds of matches.

That arbitrary cut-off is very much at the detriment of people such as myself, who neither belong to endogamous nor well-represented groups. I discovered some time ago that relatives can be manually found by adding those with plausible genetic connections (in my case Kurdish or Armenian users). I have found four relatives to date by doing this.

It would be an idea for me to approach 23andMe requesting user-based control of the segment size cut-off, but I can't imagine I'm the only one to have discovered this.

So, how does 23andMe's layout change fare with everyone else?

AJL
04-09-2013, 05:00 PM
I have to agree with you that problems with Relative Finder and other ancestry tools overshadow any cosmetic changes they've introduced.

The changes appear aimed at making this all more accessible to the average person, which is great. Ancestry Composition is a step forward from Ancestry Finder, and it's nice to see they're making ancestry more a part of the dashboard. But basic issues like slow page load times, errors in the phasing engine of AC, and the inability for users to filter RF adequately as you note are of a more direct concern to me.

Jean M
04-09-2013, 05:23 PM
I can appreciate the basis for this cut-off, given many users on their database from endogamous or well-represented communities would otherwise be overcome by potentially hundreds of matches.


I have 992 matches as it is. And I haven't traced the link with any of them. Not that I've put much effort into it. But I have responded to all queries with nary a paper link to show for it.

AJL
04-09-2013, 06:00 PM
There's a lot of luck involved, specifically, who else tests. My fourth cousin happened to test, and later tested her mother as well (my mother's third cousin). Lots of shared DNA: the parts with two navy and two pale-blue bars on chromosomes 10, 14, and 16, plus the bit at the top of chromosome 4, all come from our pair of shared ancestors born 1791 and 1801. Shown via my mother's kit (3rd cousins):

369

My confidence in the accuracy of predictions past this range of third cousins is very low, however.

Tregowath
04-10-2013, 12:55 AM
So, how does 23andMe's layout change fare with everyone else?

I hate it. I don't have an i-phone, and I only access 23andMe from my i-pad when I'm traveling. The rest of the time, I access it from a desktop or laptop. I've been on the site for over four years. It is enormously disorienting and off-putting to show up one morning and find the layout of the site drastically changed, to the point where I can't find anything. I don't even care to debate the pros and cons. Once again, 23andMe demonstrates audacious contempt for their customer base by rolling out something that most long-term users don't want, while failing to address numerous issues that customers have been clamoring for for years. I visit the site on at least a daily basis, and over the past year have paid to have three family members tested (at $299 a pop). I feel betrayed and insulted. I don't see why it was necessary to disable the old view except to intentionally kick users in the face.

geebee
04-10-2013, 05:26 AM
This seems to be the trend, however. I don't want to get us off on a Windows 8 kick, but I would note that there, too, developers decided to make a significant change in part to accommodate smartphone and tablet users. Those of us who use our (non-touchscreen) computers more -- and have for many years -- didn't even have the option to continue to use the techniques we'd grown comfortable with over a period of years.

It isn't that I mind change, but I don't see the point of what looks like change for change's sake. I prefer the old interface, but maybe the new one will grow on me.

(I do use a Samsung Galaxy SIII, but almost never to connect to the internet.)

EDIT: As a complete side note, my current computer does indeed use the Windows 8 OS. I'm much more okay with it now than I was at the beginning, but I still don't see it as a significant "improvement". And I had a greater learning curve than I think should have been necessary.

On the other hand, I have a high risk of "Late Onset Alzheimers", according to both family history and 23andMe. So maybe exercise for my brain is a good thing.

soulblighter
04-10-2013, 01:48 PM
Like applying makeup to a pig (although piglets look good!).
I think 23andme is making a big mistake by only going after hypochondriacs.

Jean M
04-10-2013, 02:34 PM
I think 23andme is making a big mistake by only going after hypochondriacs.

There speaks a young and healthy person! :) Some of us are old enough to have acquired a list of ailments so long we can't remember them all. At least I can't. My memory is not my strong point. I have to keep notes. Then we get the medical inquisition "Has anyone in your family ever had X?" "Er. I think maybe my aunt Susie. Or did she have Y? Um." So 23andMe is ideal. I just hand over the report. No guessing and ferreting around in my memory banks. :)

Scarlet Ibis
04-10-2013, 09:40 PM
I was dreading logging in to look at it, but I have to say it isn't as bad as I thought it would be...I'll adjust. Although in all fairness, my expectations were extremely low.

leonardo
04-11-2013, 02:28 PM
I am still trying to adapt to the new changes. I would really appreciate more user control.

leonardo
04-11-2013, 02:32 PM
I discovered some time ago that relatives can be manually found by adding those with plausible genetic connections (in my case Kurdish or Armenian users). I have found four relatives to date by doing this.
How exactly does one do this?

AJL
04-11-2013, 04:57 PM
How exactly does one do this?

If you seek to share somewhat aggressively with those with similar surnames, towns, or regional backgrounds, you will eventually find some who show up as matches who then populate your Relative Finder upon your sharing.

This may be for two reasons: the first is that slightly shorter minimum segment lengths are accepted for those already sharing (because it is presumed that you have a known connection, since you are sharing); the second is that Relative Finder has a maximum number of cousins for those not already sharing, but as you share genomes with your matches, the maximum is raised. This is especially an issue with endogamous and well-represented populations in the database e.g. colonial Americans and Ashkenazim. The prioritization of these matches is through total cM, and even cousins who have opted out of RF are used to fill the maximum quota.

I have over 2,200 matches, and have found many more that are not in my Relative Finder but, by examining myself and my mother's genome in Family Inheritance: Advanced for mutual overlap with my mother's RF matches, I have found many more cousins that could be in my RF but aren't.

Ian B
04-11-2013, 10:47 PM
Jean said,
"I have to keep notes."

But what a nuisance it is when you forget where you placed the notes, or the fact that you even made notes.:biggrin1:

Jean M
04-12-2013, 12:29 AM
@ Ian B

That's why I have a filing system, and the equivalent on computer. I have to be organised.

soulblighter
05-25-2013, 06:53 PM
Jean, where do South-Asians fall when it comes to health risks at 23andme? Are they pretty much useless to us?
P.S: I am one month late on posting because I can never remember this forum's name (i just bookmarked it finally!) to log in... I realize my rant about 23andme's bad ancestry offering was a personal grudge and that it is very useful to others as a health screening tool.

Jean M
05-26-2013, 12:17 AM
Jean, where do South-Asians fall when it comes to health risks at 23andme? Are they pretty much useless to us?
The 23andMe results are not ideal for South Asians. Although some of the same mutations can be found causing the same problems in Europeans and South Asians, the latter have some of their own mutations as well. See for example http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17090840?dopt=Abstract . Let us hope that more of such studies enter the literature and that 23andMe can offer a South Asian option for ethnicity at some point.