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Maximilian
10-07-2016, 08:00 PM
Dear Anthrogenica Community!


I got my Geno 2.0 results two weeks ago and since then I am very confused. My paternal haplogroup, determined by My Family Tree DNA, is J-S12192. I found a lot of websites, talking about the Cohen Modal Haplotype and that my mutation is a child of this tree. Whenever I tried to get information about this group people wanted to sell me more tests or join strange genealogy-groups. My family origins from East Europe.

Is the Haplogroup J-S12192 a proven Jewish-Cohen haplogroup?

What does this site (http://jewishdna.net/J1-S12192.html) tell me about my haplogroup?

I am a bit confused because I am not well informed about genetic science. I have a lot of confirmed SNP's from my results - what can they tell me about my ancestors? Can somebody interpret them?


Maximilian.

J1 DYS388=13
10-07-2016, 08:16 PM
I can't answer your question, but if you look at all the FTDNA ID numbers under S12192 at http://genogenea.com/J-M267/tree and look them up at
https://www.familytreedna.com/public/J-M267/default.aspx?section=ysnp or anywhere else Google can find them, at least you can see some surnames.

Maximilian
10-07-2016, 08:41 PM
12038

This is what I found.

Maximilian
10-07-2016, 08:43 PM
Oh, sorry, the one under Z18271 is S12192 !

Agamemnon
10-07-2016, 08:52 PM
Hi there Maximilian and welcome to Anthrogenica :)

S12192 is the most important branch of J1-Z18271, which is the diagnostic marker shared by roughly 40% to 50% of all Kohanim. As you can see, S12192's TMRCA is ~1,250 years old, meaning the common ancestor of all S12192 positive men in all likeliness lived during the 8th century CE while Z18271's TMRCA is roughly ~2,600 years old. In other words, your paternal ancestors obviously were Kohanim.

Maximilian
10-07-2016, 08:59 PM
Thank you for your help!

Do you know where this common ancestor lived?

I never thought about this possibility!

Do you have any further information about this TMCR ?

Agamemnon
10-07-2016, 09:22 PM
Thank you for your help!

Do you know where this common ancestor lived?

It gets really exciting because I never thought about this possibility!

Do you have any further information about this TMCR ?

If you're talking about S12192, I'd surmise the common ancestor lived in France or along the Rhine, perhaps even in Bavaria. As far as Z18271 goes, the MRCA obviously lived in Judah, probably in Jerusalem, and was in all likeliness part of the priestly class (I won't get into the debate of "who descends from the high priest", it's fruitless).

Maximilian
10-07-2016, 09:34 PM
I am really interested into the history of the common ancestors of jewish Haplogroups, especially the S12192 one. Is there a thread about that, do you know more about this topic?

Agamemnon
10-07-2016, 11:08 PM
I am really interested into the history of the common ancestors of jewish Haplogroups, especially the S12192 one. Is there a thread about that, do you know more about this topic?

A lot has been written about how several subclades under S12192 fit with famous rabbinical lineages, S12192 is also found among Sephardim. It is the most prestigious branch under Z18271 as far as I can tell. My own branch is much more discrete, though also linked to a long line of rabbinical scholars and priests (I am not S12192).

Shamash
10-18-2016, 08:46 PM
Willkommen auf Anthrogenica Maximilian!

Maximilian
10-19-2016, 05:11 PM
Willkommen auf Anthrogenica Maximilian!


Danke Dir vielmals! :)

Myth
12-01-2016, 01:09 AM
Hi there Maximilian and welcome to Anthrogenica :)

S12192 is the most important branch of J1-Z18271, which is the diagnostic marker shared by roughly 40% to 50% of all Kohanim. As you can see, S12192's TMRCA is ~1,250 years old, meaning the common ancestor of all S12192 positive men in all likeliness lived during the 8th century CE while Z18271's TMRCA is roughly ~2,600 years old. In other words, your paternal ancestors obviously were Kohanim.

I also tested positive for S12192, most specifically FGC9941+, Z18283+ . The relatives are showing from Lithuania, I'm assuming that they must have migrated from other Kohanim from the middle east at some point? I do have a Kohen surname as well as a oral history of being Kohanim which is also documented as well on Jewish papers.

Maximilian
12-02-2016, 09:41 AM
.....

Maximilian
05-30-2017, 08:36 PM
So after some time I collected some questions I have about my Y-DNA Haplotype J-S12192.

Are there any finds of this type on the planet and if so, how old are they and where were they found? Does anybody know where and when this mutation started to exist, I could not find any further information. It is pretty hard to coordinate through the internet without special knowledge about genetics.
Are there any known persons who were carrier of this haplotype? Would be great to know!

Thanks! :)

lgmayka
05-31-2017, 11:40 PM
Does anybody know where and when this mutation started to exist,
YFull places S12192 at the J-Y5400 level (https://yfull.com/tree/J-Y5400/). That level began to diverge from its brothers about 3200 years ago, but living men who carry S12192 have a common patrilineal ancestor only 1550 years ago.

J-S12192 includes an Ashkenazi Jewish subclade, presumably J-Y5399 (https://yfull.com/tree/J-Y5399/) whose most recent common patrilineal ancestor lived only 800 years ago.

Kelmendasi
06-10-2017, 09:33 PM
Judging by the fact that the TMRCA of this clade is 1550 years, the common ancestor lived during 467AD or in other words he lived during the 5th century. This means that he lived during the collapse of the Roman empire which could of displaced the Levantine/Cohanim carriers into your region where they later got absorbed by the local population. Agamemnon stated before that he thinks that this common ancestor lived near the Rhine or Bavaria

Kelmendasi
06-10-2017, 09:35 PM
I could belong to this clade judging by STRs but I need to do further SNP testing to know for sure as according to Nevgen I have 90+% chance of being from a "Unsupported clade". I have no Levantine admix which is weird and shows that my paternal ancestor probably came a long time ago

Kelmendasi
06-10-2017, 09:39 PM
Yfull states that it has a TMRCA between 2100 and 1050 years but 1550 years is most probable. Overall this clade is an important clade of P58 and a cool one :)

Kelmendasi
06-11-2017, 01:48 PM
This is a map of 467AD. Judging about what Agamemnon said about where the paternal ancestor was from/located in, he could of lived all the way from the Franks/Frisians to the Lombards/Alemanni although his distant origin was probably from the Levant/Fertile Crescent as S12192 is a descendant of ZS241, so his distant ancestors probably reached Europe via the Roman Empire:

https://s7.postimg.org/yirr27sp7/image_36.png