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Deftextra
11-05-2016, 08:06 PM
I have had a new match, who's mt haplogroup turned out to be K1a. I could not find much info about its distribution in Africa. However, this person is very closely related to me and comes from the same clan, has the same autosomal profile, etc. But if this Mt haplogroup turns out to be of none somali/horn african origin, this would be the first time I have encountered this. But given that we are already mixed (west-asian+south-asian+african) what likelihood do you think this is a none African lineage?

Thanks

C J Wyatt III
11-05-2016, 08:15 PM
I have had a new match, who's mt haplogroup turned out to be K1a. I could not find much info about its distribution in Africa. However, this person is very closely related to me and comes from the same clan, has the same autosomal profile, etc. But if this Mt haplogroup turns out to be of none somali/horn african origin, this would be the first time I have encountered this. But given that we are already mixed (west-asian+south-asian+african) what likelihood do you think this is a none African lineage?

Thanks

Perhaps an ancestor was a European female taken captive by the Barbary Pirates.

Jack Wyatt

Abd.H
11-05-2016, 09:42 PM
It could be near eastern
Actually K1a is a common maternal lineage in the near east

Haplougroup K map
12446

C J Wyatt III
11-05-2016, 09:53 PM
It could be near eastern
Actually K1a is a common maternal lineage in the near east

Haplougroup K map
12446

I see that you are K1a. I'm curious how far back you are able to trace your maternal line.

Thanks,

Jack

Abd.H
11-05-2016, 10:18 PM
I see that you are K1a. I'm curious how far back you are able to trace your maternal line.

Thanks,

Jack
Actually I have only one mtDNA match and it's from Poland
my maternal grandmother ,great-grandmother and great-great-grandmother all were Syrians from north west Syria ,but I don't have information about older maternal ancestors

Deftextra
11-05-2016, 10:33 PM
It could be near eastern
Actually K1a is a common maternal lineage in the near east

Haplougroup K map
12446

Yeah, I would imagine this to be the most likely case, Given our autosomal mixture.

C J Wyatt III
11-05-2016, 11:39 PM
Actually I have only one mtDNA match and it's from Poland
my maternal grandmother ,great-grandmother and great-great-grandmother all were Syrians from north west Syria ,but I don't have information about older maternal ancestors

Appreciate it. The timeline would allow the possibility that your K1a ancestor was brought into the region by the Barbary Pirates. Just something to consider.

Jack

Deftextra
06-25-2019, 12:01 AM
A closely related cousing tested and her mt dna turned out to be also K1a but this time more refined. Looks like this is K1a12a, which through a simple search is found in the Levant (Jews, Druzes), Turkey, Ethiopia and neolitic Turkey and Iran.

VytautusofAukstaitija
06-25-2019, 12:37 AM
The 4,000 year old ydna E2 early male pastoralist (I12533) buried in Prettejohn's Gully, Kenya had K1a, and so did a 1500 year old Cushitic/Erythrean Pastoral Neolithic/ELM female buried in Keringet Cave, also in Kenya (I12394).

So certain branch(s) of K1a clearly arn't a post-Neolithic arrival in NE Africa. Unless the K1a you speak of is of a non-NE African branch.

There are Somalis with very Bronze Age Semitic-looking mtdna, probably due to Habesha and Abyssinian/Oromo and other female-biased geneflow into the Somali genepool, especially due to slavery, concubinage, and the patriarchal nature of Somali identity. Or perhaps a Benadiri maternal line is another possibility.

Grossvater
06-25-2019, 07:35 PM
As far as I know, my K1a-C150T comes from Southern Germany probably brought there by Middle Eastern farmers many thousands of years ago. I had my mind blown awhile back when a person from Yemen on this very forum told me that they share my K1a-C150T mitochondrial haplogroup. Yemen is not that far from Somalia.

Alfa
05-25-2020, 09:47 PM
I have had a new match, who's mt haplogroup turned out to be K1a. I could not find much info about its distribution in Africa. However, this person is very closely related to me and comes from the same clan, has the same autosomal profile, etc. But if this Mt haplogroup turns out to be of none somali/horn african origin, this would be the first time I have encountered this. But given that we are already mixed (west-asian+south-asian+african) what likelihood do you think this is a none African lineage?

Thanks

In a small sample (I saw from a friend)of 79 Tutsi/Hima mtdna who did 23andme dna test, they carry this K1a1 haplogroup at ~6%. Since Tutsi/Hima are predominantly South Cushites genetically, I would assume this haplogroup was brought by ancient South Cushites in Great Lakes to Rwanda via Tanzania. Probably a very old haplogroup in horn of Africa.

drobbah
05-25-2020, 10:46 PM
4.7% of Somalis according to a study (https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s00414-012-0694-6) carry K1a

Alfa
05-28-2020, 12:53 AM
4.7% of Somalis according to a study (https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s00414-012-0694-6) carry K1a

On 23andme, Tutsi who have mtdna K1 are all K1a except 1 who has K1a1(I thought it was same thing)

Alfa
05-28-2020, 12:56 AM
4.7% of Somalis according to a study (https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s00414-012-0694-6) carry K1a

I know it has nothing to do with this thread, do you know if mtdna J1 have been found in the Horn?

Adamm
05-28-2020, 01:03 AM
I'm K1a from N Africa.

drobbah
05-28-2020, 01:08 AM
I know it has nothing to do with this thread, do you know if mtdna J1 have been found in the Horn?
I haven't seen Somalis with J1 maternal haplogroup but it exists in the Horn among the Northern-Central Ethiopians and can be found as far south as the Datog (neigbours of the Iraqw)


Three of the five haplogroup J lineages in Ethiopians share a distinct HVS-I motif, 16069-16126-16193-16300-16309 (J1c), that is characteristic of J sequences in populations from the southern Caucasus, the Near East, and North Africa (Di Rienzo and Wilson 1991; Richards et al. 2000; Brakez et al. 2001; Maca-Meyer et al. 2001; Plaza et al. 2003). In East Africa, J1c sequences have been found in one Datoga from Tanzania (Knight et al. 2003) and in one Gurna from Egypt (Stevanovitch et al. 2004).

Mnemonics
05-28-2020, 04:57 AM
I have a fully autosomal Somali match on 23andme with J1b as their mtdna.

J1 DYS388=13
05-28-2020, 01:17 PM
I'm K1a from N Africa.

Skeletons:

K1a4a1 4827–4692 BC Spain North Iberia Early Neolithic
K1a4a1 4300–3700 BC Spain Southwest Iberia Middle Neolithic
K1a4a1 2700-2300 BC Portugal Bell Beaker
K1a4a1 2344-2135 BC Spain Early-Late Chalcolithic (Copper and Stone Age)
K1a4a1 2300–1900 BC Spain Chalcolithic (Copper and Stone Age)

Kristiina
05-28-2020, 03:23 PM
There are also ancient K1a samples from Africa:
Early Pastoral Prettejohn's Gully Nakuru County Kenya I12533 4084-3891 K1a,
Pastoral Neolithic/ Elmenteitan Keringet Cave Nakuru County Kenya I12394 1529-1403 BP K1a

Ancient DNA Reveals a Multi-Step Spread of the First Herders into Sub-Saharan Africa
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6827346/

Alfa
06-07-2020, 05:32 AM
I haven't seen Somalis with J1 maternal haplogroup but it exists in the Horn among the Northern-Central Ethiopians and can be found as far south as the Datog (neigbours of the Iraqw)

@drobbah

Again, I don't wanna derail this thread, I have 1 more question.
There is 1 person from Rwanda_Burundi who was recently found to carry mtdna L1c1'2'4'6 haplogroup by 23andme

And mtdna haplo L1c2a1 and L1c2b2 are concentrated in South West Africa, South East Africa, and East Africa Tanzania, and almost absent in west/central africa.

Please note that there may be Afro Americans who carry L1c2a1, L1c2b2, they are most likely descendants of slaves who were taken from South West Africa like Angola

KHOISAN Hadza/Pygmies perhaps are responsible for the spread of B-M112 and L1c who seem connected. Where do you think those B-M112/L1c originated? Who carried them first Khoisan&Hadza or pygmies?

Adamm
07-10-2020, 07:31 PM
I got analyzed on Yfull and went a bit deeper, instead of K1a4a1 I'm now K1a4a1k:

https://i.imgur.com/ulpUzCs.png

J1 DYS388=13
07-11-2020, 10:09 AM
Contact YF19845 and YF19670 to find out where they are from.

J1 DYS388=13
07-11-2020, 02:40 PM
I found two cases of that supposed branch, K1a4a1 with C15154A:
KY509039(Latvia)
MK936800(Lithuania)
http://www.ianlogan.co.uk/sequences_by_group/k1a4_genbank_sequences.htm

Adamm
07-11-2020, 04:52 PM
I found two cases of that supposed branch, K1a4a1 with C15154A:
KY509039(Latvia)
MK936800(Lithuania)
http://www.ianlogan.co.uk/sequences_by_group/k1a4_genbank_sequences.htm

Are those two K1a4a1k?

NetNomad
07-11-2020, 04:57 PM
I haven't seen Somalis with J1 maternal haplogroup but it exists in the Horn among the Northern-Central Ethiopians and can be found as far south as the Datog (neigbours of the Iraqw)

Low frequency lineages sometimes aren't caught in small sample sizes.


I have a fully autosomal Somali match on 23andme with J1b as their mtdna.

Same here (a connection on my cousin's account):

https://i.imgur.com/D3yNLi6.png

Also, K1a12a is found among non-recently-admixed Somalis:

https://i.imgur.com/NCvqm12.png

J1 DYS388=13
07-11-2020, 05:12 PM
Yes, they are what YFull calls K1a4a1k.

J1 DYS388=13
07-11-2020, 07:30 PM
I suspect that

221297 Lithuania at https://www.familytreedna.com/public/mtDNA_K?iframe=mtresults
is the same case as MK936800 at k1a4_genbank_sequences.htm

and that
577286 Latvia at https://www.familytreedna.com/public/mtDNA_K?iframe=mtresults
is the same case as KY509039 at k1a4_genbank_sequences.htm

and that those are the two cases you see on Yfull as YF19845 and YF19670.

Some researchers do that, posting their data everywhere they can.

Deftextra
07-16-2020, 11:08 PM
Low frequency lineages sometimes aren't caught in small sample sizes.



Same here (a connection on my cousin's account):

https://i.imgur.com/D3yNLi6.png

Also, K1a12a is found among non-recently-admixed Somalis:

https://i.imgur.com/NCvqm12.png

Thanks. Almost all Mt dna lineages I have come across can be found in the horn. Have you come across H14a by any chance? or do know if it can be found in the horn in general?

NetNomad
07-17-2020, 10:25 AM
Thanks. Almost all Mt dna lineages I have come across can be found in the horn. Have you come across H14a by any chance? or do know if it can be found in the horn in general?

The only Hs I occasionally see is HV1b1. I have only one H14a connection and he is half German (maternally). H14 seems of Neolithic Anatolian origin and is quite widespread from Europe to India. If a Benadiri connection of yours has it, it is likely from the recent Indian Ocean migrations.

wombatofthenorth
07-06-2021, 02:03 AM
Contact YF19845 and YF19670 to find out where they are from.

Yeah those are both me. The site has now been updated and those deleted and combined into YF76417 Lithuania (although the person is actually Latvian as far back as traced, but born in Lithuania in the earliest Latvian outpost established in Lithuania by a baron with ties back to Jelgava (Mitau) in Latvia which is where her descendants were found. I also have one extra unique mutation beyond k1a4a1k.



I found two cases of that supposed branch, K1a4a1 with C15154A:
KY509039(Latvia)
MK936800(Lithuania)
http://www.ianlogan.co.uk/sequences_..._sequences.htm


One of these, the one marked as Latvian, is me. That was before I traced it back a bit further to the birth in Latvian outpost in Lithuania.
The other one is a different person, a Lithuanian, he is my only perfect match (he also has the same one extra mutation beyond k1a4a1k). He has not done much work on his maternal side, mostly working on his strictly paternal line. I think he only has back to his grandmother on that line, I forget. He hasn't uploaded to YFull only to database above.

I know of one other k1a4a1k, this an exact k1a4a1 like the original poster here from Morocco, without the extra mutation beyond. She has traced her strictly maternal line to a tiny village deep in the hills of central Sicily. I forget, but I think she had it traced back to like early 1700s. I haven't been able to get into contact with her so far, so she hasn't loaded to YFull or any of the other databases, just has the result at FTDNA (FamilyTreeDNA) only where she is my one distance one match there.

It is a sort of curious haplogroup for me to have as it appears to be Western European and not Baltic or Eastern European and yet as far back as I have traced so far the line appears to be Baltic Latvian and heads back to serfs with no surnames. It isn't unheard of for a male Baltic German baron or other Baltic German to father a kid out of wedlock with a local Baltic Latvian and have the kid end up not getting his surname and being left as a serf with their mother. More rare would be a case where a Baltic German woman or some other Western European woman would someone end up with a kid not at least getting her surname and staying out of serfdom. Maybe even more odd is that it appears the same happened as well for the Lithuanian who is my exact match. So it is a bit puzzling, since it would seem the latter case would have had to have happened here. Unless maybe k1a4a1k somehow ended up in the Baltics in super small numbers way back when and one or two lines kept going?

diini95
07-06-2021, 10:18 PM
I was contacted by a relative today his maternal haplogroup is K1a12 he is 84.6% Somali

diini95
07-06-2021, 10:20 PM
I was contacted by a close relative today his Mtdna is K1a12 and he is 84.6% Somali

drobbah
07-06-2021, 10:34 PM
Some of those Cushitic PN samples had K1a I think