Where did haplogroup T-M184 originate

[AndresT]

Allowed multiple choice. Thanks for your participation.

[drobbah]

I am not sure so I won't vote but I am curious about its origin since my maternal grandfather belonged to this haplogroup and so do a huge percentage of Somalis.

Does anyone know of any papers/studies that pertain to the origin and distribution of this haplogroup?

[AndresT]

Actually, studies on Haplogroup T are outdated and none of these studies have T-M184 (xL206) samples.

However, you can figure out with this Phylogenetic tree that I'm updating as fast as new results come in:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a7/Haplogroup_T-M184_tree.png

By the way, we need a Somali T1a-M70 to be tested with BigY or Y Elite 2.0 to know if they belong to CTS2214 or instead they belong to Y16897. This is needed to discover their subclade.

[vettor]

Actually, studies on Haplogroup T are outdated and none of these studies have T-M184 (xL206) samples.

However, you can figure out with this Phylogenetic tree that I'm updating as fast as new results come in:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a7/Haplogroup_T-M184_tree.png

By the way, we need a Somali T1a-M70 to be tested with BigY or Y Elite 2.0 to know if they belong to CTS2214 or instead they belong to Y16897. This is needed to discover their subclade.

IMO, Somali T would be associated and similar with Madagascar and Tanzania T ............which arrived with O1a2 haplogroup from the Bay of Bengal, making the T an East-Indian marker.
The Somali T follows the same trait/system as the other 2 areas , being that, from only one or 2 members settling in the area from years ~600AD onwards . They seem to be either traders/merchants or slavers.

[drobbah]

IMO, Somali T would be associated and similar with Madagascar and Tanzania T ............which arrived with O1a2 haplogroup from the Bay of Bengal, making the T an East-Indian marker.
The Somali T follows the same trait/system as the other 2 areas , being that, from only one or 2 members settling in the area from years ~600AD onwards . They seem to be either traders/merchants or slavers.
Smh Traders/Merchants never had a significant impact on Somalis.Majority of these Somali clans that have this haplogroup are also inland pastoralists with no recent foreign admixture lol.Also this haplogroup is also found among other cushite groups like the Iraqw of Tanzania.

It makes much more sense that this haplogroup entered Africa from the Levant maybe during the neolithic and was spread southward by migrating Cushites.

[vettor]

Smh Traders/Merchants never had a significant impact on Somalis.Majority of these Somali clans that have this haplogroup are also inland pastoralists with no recent foreign admixture lol.Also this haplogroup is also found among other cushite groups like the Iraqw of Tanzania.

It makes much more sense that this haplogroup entered Africa from the Levant maybe during the neolithic and was spread southward by migrating Cushites.

The cushites died out by 300Bc


From Underhill 2000 paper through Luis 2004 paper and smith's 2010 paper ........all have stated that the east-african T branch is less than 2000 years ..........even Oman T group in southern Arabian Peninsula is only 1600 Ybp

this 2004 states
The K2-M70 expansion estimates in Egypt (17.5–13.7 ky; see table 3) are consistent with an early African diaspora. From the present-day African distribution of K2-M70, it is difficult to determine which of the two Africa/Asia migratory passages, if any, prevailed in its southward journey. However, the BATWING expansion estimates of both the Egyptian and Turkish K2-M70 lineages (13.7 ky and 9.0 ky, respectively) are much older than that of Oman (1.6 ky), which suggests that the Levantine corridor may have been used more extensively in the African dissemination of this lineage as well. K2-M70 chromosomes are detected in Tanzania (3.8%), Egypt (8.2%), and Oman (8.3%).

Being pastorilists today means nothing to what they where yesterday.

The Dir clan of Somali is the only one in somali which has T of any significance..........https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dir_(clan) is one of the youngest group in somali.

Plaster et al., "Variation in Y chromosome, mitochondrial DNA and labels of identity on Ethiopia," UCL Discovery (2011) ...........states these DIR came via the border of somali and Ethiopia


this 2014 paper https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4055572/
some HOA ( Horn of Africa ) populations carry moderate to high frequencies of T-M70 (previously K2-M70) Y chromosomes [44]–[46]. The T haplogroup originated in the area of the Levant approximately 21 ka and the T-M70 sub-haplogroup was present in northeast Africa by at least 14 ka, possibly arriving in the HOA as early as 5 ka [44], [45], [47].

So, maybe , yes in regards to HOA, but a very long time elapsed between any Levant or Egyptian migration of T to HOA