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Táltos
01-14-2017, 03:37 AM
23&me threw us a bone; a new ancestry feature! The larger admixture percentages seem pretty accurate. Of course the smaller ones are probably less so. Anyway check it!
http://www.rootsandrecombinantdna.com/2017/01/new-23andme-ancestry-timeline-tool.html

A Norfolk L-M20
01-14-2017, 03:54 AM
Still stuck on Old Experience with customers from the other 195 countries, so no new tools for us. But no sour grapes ha ha, enjoy! :-)

MonkeyDLuffy
01-14-2017, 03:57 AM
I'm still stuck on old website and I was never updated to new website. :(

Táltos
01-14-2017, 04:12 AM
Ugh so frustrating that everyone is not on the new one yet. :(

MonkeyDLuffy
01-14-2017, 04:20 AM
I sent them an email asking if they can change it. I'm tempted to use new features

Táltos
01-14-2017, 04:53 AM
Here is mine.
13575
These statements are fairly accurate for me.

You most likely had a parent, grandparent, or great-grandparent who was 100% Eastern European. This person was likely born between 1880 and 1940.

You most likely had a parent, grandparent, or great-grandparent who was 100% Italian. This person was likely born between 1880 and 1940.

Táltos
01-14-2017, 04:55 AM
Now looking closer at my mother's...no the largest admixture percentage is very wrong!!

13576

You most likely had a parent, grandparent, or great-grandparent who was 100% British & Irish. This person was likely born between 1850 and 1910.

firemonkey
01-14-2017, 05:36 AM
Ugh so frustrating that everyone is not on the new one yet. :(


I will probably get notification of transfer to the new experience in 2047;if I live that long.

vettor
01-14-2017, 05:52 AM
I will probably get notification of transfer to the new experience in 2047;if I live that long.

well, that is still before I get it

khanabadoshi
01-14-2017, 06:59 AM
Myself (R-Z282 | A8a)
https://i.gyazo.com/c2c4a519bb54b772184fb15fd894e4ae.jpg
You most likely had a third great-grandparent, fourth great-grandparent, fifth great-grandparent, or sixth great-grandparent who was 100% Middle Eastern. This person was likely born between 1750 and 1840.
You most likely had a fourth great-grandparent, fifth great-grandparent, sixth great-grandparent, or seventh great (or greater) grandparent who was 100% Yakut. This person was likely born between 1720 and 1810.
You most likely had a fourth great-grandparent, fifth great-grandparent, sixth great-grandparent, or seventh great (or greater) grandparent who was 100% Southeast Asian. This person was likely born between 1720 and 1810.
You most likely had a fourth great-grandparent, fifth great-grandparent, sixth great-grandparent, or seventh great (or greater) grandparent who was 100% Eastern European. This person was likely born between 1720 and 1810.

Brother (R-Z282 | A8a)
https://i.gyazo.com/e53db5e30f7591d643ebfa6e8c518d60.jpg

Sister (.Hanif) (R-Z282 | A8a)
https://i.gyazo.com/ef8bdc1a31059efaa07a296f5c95971e.jpg

Paternal Uncle (.Jam) (R-Z282 | U7)
https://i.gyazo.com/5e2caf8c0146651f2e1f5d56baf5393c.jpg

Maternal Aunt (R-Z282 | A8a)
https://i.gyazo.com/b49e7cf7af13e710b9a28f115c8a2f3c.jpg

Maternal Grandmother (.Balq) (R-M417 | A8a)
https://i.gyazo.com/0d8b0f1f3da692a53019e13ae381c951.jpg

Maternal Grandmother Brother (R-M417 | A8a)
https://i.gyazo.com/2628c43df50f397a2330620e233250fc.jpg

Maternal Grandfather Sister (.Sadia) (R-Z282 | R5a2)
https://i.gyazo.com/1cec0138685786204e45807c75b31255.jpg

2nd Cousin - Leghari (R-M417 | U2b1)
https://i.gyazo.com/9141bd6eaf65607947410fe506af2fc9.jpg

Mohmand Pashtun (R-M417 | H)
https://i.gyazo.com/408be01fdd6e5383603b1d117ebe5389.jpg

Multani - Durrani/Syed (R-L23 | U2a)
https://i.gyazo.com/fa764457df9564ed3c5a5f12e2a4bfe7.jpg

Lahori - Rajput/Kashmiri (R-M207 | M3a2)
https://i.gyazo.com/ad40fc7a0d57c956df52091e43e08635.jpg

Ashkenazi Jew (E-M44 | J1c7a)
https://i.gyazo.com/d6a69b272392254b8287d28e81604776.jpg

shazou
01-14-2017, 07:31 AM
http://i.imgur.com/oA8zlBE.jpg

sgdavies@hotmail.com
01-14-2017, 08:14 AM
Thanks for the blog, and screenshots, unfortunately im also stuck on old experience, seems 23andme, dont like European customers as they treat us like second/third class, sad...

evon
01-14-2017, 10:12 AM
Still stuck on Old Experience with customers from the other 195 countries, so no new tools for us. But no sour grapes ha ha, enjoy! :-)

Its not just US costumers who have been transitioned to the new platform, that rumor needs to die already...

Adrian Stevenson
01-14-2017, 11:05 AM
Quiet a nice feature.

If it ever gets applied to UK/European customers, it might persuade me to give it a go.

Cheers, Ade.

Il Papŕ
01-14-2017, 12:58 PM
Its not just US costumers who have been , that rumor needs to die already...

Ok but then so why some members like me and my family haven't been transitioned to the new platform, any particular reason ?

A Norfolk L-M20
01-14-2017, 02:07 PM
I don't personally know of any nonUSA customers that have been transitioned, and another board member here did a few weeks ago ask if any non USA customers had been transitioned, with no answers. Could you tell us under what circumstances any have been transferred? Cheers.

Mike_G
01-14-2017, 02:09 PM
Interesting that what I'd considered "noise" showed up in this. Trying to figure out the possibilities will probably keep me up for a couple nights.

13580

Lirio100
01-14-2017, 02:12 PM
It's an interesting feature, if nothing else. The time line suggested for the British & Irish, Ashkenazi, and Scandinavian are more or less right, but the French & German are off by a couple of generations--my paternal grandmother was born here but her parents were both German (single population) and the time line says fourth great grandparent or earlier. The Eastern European, given at this level too, is probably part of the Ashkenazi line. I was a little surprised to find Finnish indicated, but they give this one as originating between 1680 and 1770, suppose it could come in through the Norwegians in my tree.

firemonkey
01-14-2017, 02:23 PM
I wonder how this fiasco over transitioning people is affecting 23andMe's business.

On one hand you get this from their community manager.


We received hundreds of thousands of kits at our lab over the holidays!


On the other hand you get a good number of those who have previously bought 23andMe kits saying they are using FTDNA and Ancestry for any new kits.

It seems to me 23andMe ,with the hundreds and thousands of kits claim, are aware of the disquiet but instead of trying to tackle the root cause are waging a propaganda war .

Hanna
01-14-2017, 02:26 PM
My account is old so I don't have this feature but my grandfather and aunt have the new version.

My grandfather:

https://scontent-sin6-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/16105847_772733876235620_3784772545336077975_n.jpg ?oh=e0b63f1089d551de7d68835414f94478&oe=58E077AA

My aunt:

https://fb-s-a-a.akamaihd.net/h-ak-xaf1/v/t1.0-9/16105912_772735822902092_6156751031901358420_n.jpg ?oh=9d8128e3fd526f249fbefb03a42804af&oe=58DE4507&__gda__=1491090229_e6cc2d0e1af72934c703335fcdb3ed0 5

Little bit
01-14-2017, 02:36 PM
Mine are ok, good for the big inputs and some of the small non-noisy inputs, but giving a timeline for the noisy Scandinavian/Iberian in B&I, North African for my Germans, and Yakut for my Polish testers is not helpful. I like that 23andme is trying to address the 'when did this ancestor live" quandary but giving credibility to the noise might just cause more confusion.

I have 57.2% B&I; 6.8% F&G; and .4% E Euro which represents known ancestors. On paper, I am 87.5% UK/Irish; 12.5% PA Dutch/German; and 2 distant Prussian ancestors who immigrated to England and Scotland in the late 1700's, one from each side. The entire .4% is on one chromosome, attributed to my mother, which was a Prussian who immigrated to London by 1800.
13581

Polish mother-in-law, all 8 grandparents born in what is modern day NW Poland. 70.9% E Euro; 2.9% B&I; .4% Finnish/.3% Scandinavian; .2% Yakut:
13582

Husband is half Polish from mom born in 1930's, German grandmother and Irish grandfather from dad, both born in early 1900's. Great for the big inputs, too much credibility to the noise:
13583

Our kids are interesting:
13584
13585

MfA
01-14-2017, 02:43 PM
This seems like pure garbage.

If I were on the new experience mine would be look like this. It's basic math nothing else that anyone could done it:

1960-1930-Middle Eastern
1870-1840-Broadly European
1780-1750-South Asian
1750-1690-Broadly East Asian
1720-1690-Italian
1690-Ashkenazi Jewish, Eastern European, Yakut

Táltos
01-14-2017, 02:48 PM
This seems like pure garbage.

If I had been on the new experience mine would be look like this. It's basic math nothing else that anyone could done it:

1960-1930-Middle Eastern
1870-1840-Broadly European
1780-1750-South Asian
1750-1690-Broadly East Asian
1720-1690-Italian
1690-Ashkenazi Jewish, Eastern European, Yakut

Here is their white paper on it. https://permalinks.23andme.com/pdf/23-14_admixture_date_estimator.pdf

Sounds like they are using segment lengths for the estimates.

Amerijoe
01-14-2017, 03:02 PM
Here is more GIGO!

13586

23 Ancestry breakdown.

European
100%
Northwestern European
98.2%
British & Irish
90.8%
Scandinavian
1.4%
Finnish
0.0%
French & German
0.0%
Broadly Northwestern European
6.0%
Southern European
0.8%
Italian
0.4%
Sardinian
0.0%
Iberian
0.0%
Balkan
0.0%
Broadly Southern European
0.3%
Eastern European
0.0%
Ashkenazi Jewish
0.0%
Broadly European
1.0%

My 1.4% Scandinavian g.....grandpa and my 0.4% Italian g.....grandpa are from the same time frame. Wouldn't it be something if they were friends! :lol:

MitchellSince1893
01-14-2017, 03:32 PM
From a genealogical perspective I get the least value out of 23andme. Most expensive price and fewest matches with accessible genealogical data. Of course if your focus is health then it's the way to go.

Rafe
01-14-2017, 04:27 PM
Americans are not the only ones that have been transitioned, no questions asked.

Mine:

http://i.imgur.com/IiFnJTU.jpg


It sure is interesting that, despite my Native being much larger than, say, my Italian (5.5% v. .1%), 23andme estimates them to be equally remote.

A Norfolk L-M20
01-14-2017, 05:07 PM
Americans are not the only ones that have been transitioned, no questions asked.

Mine:

http://i.imgur.com/IiFnJTU.jpg


It sure is interesting that, despite my Native being much larger than, say, my Italian (5.5% v. .1%), 23andme estimates them to be equally remote.

http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?9409-Has-anyone-outside-the-US-been-transitioned

Rafe
01-14-2017, 05:14 PM
http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?9409-Has-anyone-outside-the-US-been-transitioned

Huh, now I remember that I did buy my kit using a US address.

Vllhrms
01-14-2017, 05:48 PM
Mine :)

http://i.imgur.com/ktzciIN.png

Lirio100
01-14-2017, 08:05 PM
From a genealogical perspective I get the least value out of 23andme. Most expensive price and fewest matches with accessible genealogical data. Of course if your focus is health then it's the way to go.

Oddly enough I've had the most success with 23andme, although that means all of.....two connections that were confirmed with paper trails. One connection was to the family of a great grandfather through a Swedish line here in the US. The second was actually a connection back to the family in England, at the 2x great grandfather level. I have one more connection through 23andme that is inferred to be at the 3x great grandparents level (and shows up at Ancestry, FTDNA, and dnaland) but we can't find the paper trail to match.

MitchellSince1893
01-14-2017, 08:19 PM
To cover all possibilities I've tested with all 3. You never know where that missing piece of the puzzle may lie.

wombatofthenorth
01-15-2017, 12:13 AM
Mine are ok, good for the big inputs and some of the small non-noisy inputs, but giving a timeline for the noisy Scandinavian/Iberian in B&I, North African for my Germans, and Yakut for my Polish testers is not helpful. I like that 23andme is trying to address the 'when did this ancestor live" quandary but giving credibility to the noise might just cause more confusion.

Yeah good points, the Yakkut stuff for instance is likely way far back and from many different people, not one semi-recent ancestor. To be fair, they state in the instructions to be aware that the ancestry might have come from a few or many people instead. But it does overemphasize certain things in the presentation in many people's mind's I'm sure.

wombatofthenorth
01-15-2017, 12:16 AM
It sure is interesting that, despite my Native being much larger than, say, my Italian (5.5% v. .1%), 23andme estimates them to be equally remote.

wow, quite interesting
I wonder if that has to do with complex segment length and parcels or if they sort of cheat NA and assume there were few 100% non-admixed NA before a certain date and bias that ancestry backwards?

wombatofthenorth
01-15-2017, 12:18 AM
They seem like they could be reasonable for us. So far we haven't found any of the records for anyone born outside of Latvia yet though but these dates seem mostly reasonable.

olive picker
01-15-2017, 12:23 AM
this is so annoying that they exclude EU customers like that

MonkeyDLuffy
01-15-2017, 01:37 AM
this is so annoying that they exclude EU customers like that

Canadian too.

gruder
01-15-2017, 04:53 AM
Here's mine.

13599

evon
01-15-2017, 01:14 PM
Ok but then so why some members like me and my family haven't been transitioned to the new platform, any particular reason ?


I don't personally know of any nonUSA customers that have been transitioned, and another board member here did a few weeks ago ask if any non USA customers had been transitioned, with no answers. Could you tell us under what circumstances any have been transferred? Cheers.

This is a rumor that was started very early on, but I personally know several Norwegians who live in Norway, who ordered their kits to a Norwegian address etc, who has been transitioned.. Some members on this forum who are also Europeans living in Europe, have also been transitioned.

While I cannot explain why the transitioning has taken so long for most of us (US and European costumers), I think they did not really think things through before initiating the transition. Many accounts, like my own, have family members that are tested with different chipset (in my case we are on V3 and V2), something that basically means that they have to rerun us through the system in order for us to become V4 before being transitioned (and many people currently on V2 and V3 have not utilized the biobank offer provided by 23andme, so if they are to be transitioned to V4, they would have to send a new spit sample to the lab).

We talked shortly about it here before:
http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?8192-Coming-soon-A-new-23andMe-experience/page4

A Norfolk L-M20
01-15-2017, 03:50 PM
This is a rumor that was started very early on, but I personally know several Norwegians who live in Norway, who ordered their kits to a Norwegian address etc, who has been transitioned.. Some members on this forum who are also Europeans living in Europe, have also been transitioned.

While I cannot explain why the transitioning has taken so long for most of us (US and European costumers), I think they did not really think things through before initiating the transition. Many accounts, like my own, have family members that are tested with different chipset (in my case we are on V3 and V2), something that basically means that they have to rerun us through the system in order for us to become V4 before being transitioned (and many people currently on V2 and V3 have not utilized the biobank offer provided by 23andme, so if they are to be transitioned to V4, they would have to send a new spit sample to the lab).

We talked shortly about it here before:
http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?8192-Coming-soon-A-new-23andMe-experience/page4

It is a revelation that the Norwegians have been transitioned, and I would be very curious to understand why this is the case. However, this is hijacking this thread, I apologise. If any other Non-USA have been transitioned, I'd ask them to report it on the other thread:

http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?9409-Has-anyone-outside-the-US-been-transitioned

Rather than on here. However, @evon, this really does look like an exception. The Old Experience forums are full of very upset non-USA testers (plus some USA testers locked out, because of shared non-USA samples). It isn't a rumour at all, you are the first on the New Experience that I have encountered, and I'd like to know if it's just certain countries such as Norway, or if their tests were purchased directly from the USA?

Apologies to the op. I'll not respond here again.

evon
01-15-2017, 04:10 PM
It is a revelation that the Norwegians have been transitioned, and I would be very curious to understand why this is the case. However, this is hijacking this thread, I apologise. If any other Non-USA have been transitioned, I'd ask them to report it on the other thread:

http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthread.php?9409-Has-anyone-outside-the-US-been-transitioned

Rather than on here. However, @evon, this really does look like an exception. The Old Experience forums are full of very upset non-USA testers (plus some USA testers locked out, because of shared non-USA samples). It isn't a rumour at all, you are the first on the New Experience that I have encountered, and I'd like to know if it's just certain countries such as Norway, or if their tests were purchased directly from the USA?

Apologies to the op. I'll not respond here again.

The moderates can move this, so it should not be a problem...

Yes it is a rumor, and as my friends have proven, it isnt the case (It is not all Norwegians, as I myself am Norwegian and stuck on the old site, so my guess it has to do with what chipset they were on, I suspect the first to be transitioned were all V4 and those of us on V2 and V3 are still in the works). I am also not the only one to mention it on this forum as the thread I posted shows.. I saw that thread when it first appeared, but I was hoping it would die out on its own, but that didnt happen I see.. If you want to find others, you could go the new site and open a thread for non-US costumers, follow this link and log in (its been a while since I first logged in, but I think you need to create a forum profile for the new forum before you can enter the actual forum):

www.23andmeforums.com/
or
https://www.23andmeforums.com/discussions

And yes you can log into the new forum even if you are on the old site like me, but you will not have access to various ancestry rapports etc..only the forum.. And yes, the Norwegian testers purchased their tests from Norway, to Norwegian addresses.

Hope my spelling isnt too bad, I have an epic caffeine headache... :redface:

Judith
01-15-2017, 04:18 PM
I am sorry but I am going to be incredibly cynical and marketing oriented, in this hypothetical suggestion on the roll-out.

The main market is USA, being a country of migrants some of whom will want to discover their ancestry and others will like it to be confirmed.
Those of us who are 100% British and Irish we get loudedly irritated about being told we are from Central Europe Southern Europe North Africa etc etc. So knowing that they lock us out. Other European customers with known trees are also just as critical. Even LivingDNA say they need more Germany samples to distinguish East Anglia from Benelux and Germany and they have apparently good algorithms and data base (for U.K.).
Many threads testify to this "insight ".
It is a very good feature, and from the comments above, moderately accurate feature. Well done 23&me!

A Norfolk L-M20
01-15-2017, 04:46 PM
The moderates can move this, so it should not be a problem...

Yes it is a rumor, and as my friends have proven, it isnt the case (It is not all Norwegians, as I myself am Norwegian and stuck on the old site, so my guess it has to do with what chipset they were on, I suspect the first to be transitioned were all V4 and those of us on V2 and V3 are still in the works). I am also not the only one to mention it on this forum as the thread I posted shows.. I saw that thread when it first appeared, but I was hoping it would die out on its own, but that didnt happen I see.. If you want to find others, you could go the new site and open a thread for non-US costumers, follow this link and log in (its been a while since I first logged in, but I think you need to create a forum profile for the new forum before you can enter the actual forum):

www.23andmeforums.com/
or
https://www.23andmeforums.com/discussions

And yes you can log into the new forum even if you are on the old site like me, but you will not have access to various ancestry rapports etc..only the forum.. And yes, the Norwegian testers purchased their tests from Norway, to Norwegian addresses.

Hope my spelling isnt too bad, I have an epic caffeine headache... :redface:

Okay evon, so you haven't actually been transitioned yourself, but know of Norwegians that have. Okay, but as I say, I personally haven't encountered any non-USA that have. Perhaps there is some sort of marketing aspect in relation to Norway that is behind this. I still see new non-USA testers pouring onto the Old Experience. If it is just a rumour, then the company has so far announced nothing to discredit it. Thanks for the links evon, yes I am aware that we can log onto the new experience forums, and there have been many angry posts concerning this issue by several non-USA customers.

jeanL
01-15-2017, 04:53 PM
Here are the results from my Paternal Grandmother:

13603

13604

Notice that even though her Native American (4.6%) is three times the value of her West African (1.5%), they are both placed in the 4th-7th+ Great-Grandparent range. On the other hand her North African (2.2%) is given a fixed range from 3rd-6th Great-Grandparent range. Interestingly, her genealogy has 7/16 2nd Great Grandparents born in Gran Canaria/Tenerife. She doesn't have any recent Native American ancestor, even though she scores 5.3% Native American and East Asian, I guess that this support the notion that the admixture might have happened either in Western Cuba or in Florida during the 1500s, and I haven't gone that far back in the genealogy. I also haven't found any Italian(10%) ancestors, which in her timeline are placed as being great-grandparent to 3-great-grandparent range. The 7/16 Great-Grandparent from the Canary Islands all had Castilian/Native-Guanche lastnames. The closest thing to a non-Castilian last name is her Paternal Great-Grandfather (Paternal Grandfather's Dad) whose last name was Pereira(Portuguese).

firemonkey
01-15-2017, 05:43 PM
I am on v4 and have not been transferred.

evon
01-15-2017, 06:08 PM
Okay evon, so you haven't actually been transitioned yourself, but know of Norwegians that have. Okay, but as I say, I personally haven't encountered any non-USA that have. Perhaps there is some sort of marketing aspect in relation to Norway that is behind this. I still see new non-USA testers pouring onto the Old Experience. If it is just a rumour, then the company has so far announced nothing to discredit it. Thanks for the links evon, yes I am aware that we can log onto the new experience forums, and there have been many angry posts concerning this issue by several non-USA customers.

It is not just Norwegians, from memory I remember one French, or Belgian from this forum, a guy who lives in Europe, but is from the Near East etc (GTC, the guy who was active in the thread I posted, is German or French I think?)... So like I said, it is far more likely to be chipset related than to have anything to do with what country you are a resident in (Those that have been transferred where likely all on the V4 chipset). Also, 23andme have always been notoriously bad at PR issues, keep in mind that the transition which was supposed to be complete in November 11th 2015, is still ongoing and they simply removed the deadline notice from their site during 2016, without any form of public announcement as to how long it would take or why..

If you want, I can ask one of these Norwegians to comment on it himself, but I doubt he could tell you anything more than me..

evon
01-15-2017, 06:09 PM
I am on v4 and have not been transferred.

That could be an indicator that they are still doing V4 and that everyone on V2 and V3 will be transitioned later.. either way, the rumor is proven false, so all we can do is speculate about how the inner workings of 23andme operates..

evon
01-15-2017, 06:24 PM
Actually, I did some checking and some costumers on V2 and V3 have been transitioned, so I guess it is not chipset related... All my profiles are stored in the biobank too, so that isnt the problem.. So it is not likely chipset related or biobank related, my next guess would be that it is done alphabetically, or something else according to the internal 23andme database.. anyways, I just wanted to inform everybody that the rumor that only US-based costumers have been transitioned is false..everything else is just speculation at this point..

firemonkey
01-15-2017, 06:31 PM
If it's taken them 14 months and they haven't got to G yet(my surname initial) then something's seriously amiss.

evon
01-15-2017, 06:38 PM
If it's taken them 14 months and they haven't got to G yet(my surname initial) then something's seriously amiss.

It was like I said just a speculation.. 23andme has had a very rough time since they started the transition, just go into the 23andme sub-folder and you will see plenty of threads on the subject:
http://www.anthrogenica.com/forumdisplay.php?134-23andMe

Táltos
01-15-2017, 06:41 PM
If it's taken them 14 months and they haven't got to G yet(my surname initial) then something's seriously amiss.

Surely not alphabetical. Initials associated with my kits are I and O and they are all transitioned. One on v3 the rest on v4, and all from the US. Who knows what the problem is already.

jeanL
01-16-2017, 02:09 AM
My mother's results:

13606

The African Central & South thing is definitely noise since she scores <0.1% of it in her Ancestry Composition.

13607

I too somehow got my noisy <0.1% South Asian that neither of my parents have (It's supposed to come from my mother according to the phasing results; but that region is European in her AC) dated. In any case, her French and German(0.8%) gets dated more recently than all the other stuff such as the West African (1.8%), Native American (1.2%) or even North African (0.9%). For the record she is from her mother's side 1/8 Galician, 1/8 Murcian, 1/4 Colonial White Cuban; whereas on her father's side she is 15/32 Colonial White Cuban, 1/32 Galician.

gruder
01-16-2017, 04:17 AM
My mother's results:

13606

The African Central & South thing is definitely noise since she scores <0.1% of it in her Ancestry Composition.

13607

I too somehow got my noisy <0.1% South Asian that neither of my parents have (It's supposed to come from my mother according to the phasing results; but that region is European in her AC) dated. In any case, her French and German(0.8%) gets dated more recently than all the other stuff such as the West African (1.8%), Native American (1.2%) or even North African (0.9%). For the record she is from her mother's side 1/8 Galician, 1/8 Murcian, 1/4 Colonial White Cuban; whereas on her father's side she is 15/32 Colonial White Cuban, 1/32 Galician.

I have only a mere .7% Native yet my range is all the way in the 1850s.

firemonkey
01-16-2017, 04:27 AM
Does this just give you populations listed in your ancestry composition or additional populations?

jeanL
01-16-2017, 02:25 PM
I have only a mere .7% Native yet my range is all the way in the 1850s.

There must be more to it than the mere percentages.

geebee
01-16-2017, 05:19 PM
One thing that's misleading here is that it isn't just individuals who can be admixed, but entire populations.

For example, my father was born in central Pennsylvania. So were both of his parents, and their parents, and their parents' parents, for several generations. If you look at surnames, you'll find they're mostly either German or British, because these were the chief sources of immigration into the area until relatively recently.

What that means is that you may find several generations of a family showing about the same admixture. For example, my father's British and Irish component is reported to be 45.0%. Mine is very close to that, at 43.5%. 23andMe tells my father that, "You most likely had a parent, grandparent, or great-grandparent who was 100% British & Irish. This person was likely born between 1840 and 1900." However, that is definitely not the case.

Instead, you have go back at least one more generation before you find an ancestor who might actually have been "purely" British and Irish. The reason is by my father's great grandparents' time, those of German descent and those of British or Irish descent had already begun intermarrying.

Besides the problem of admixture having already begun by several generations ago, there is the problem of uneven inheritance. By that I mean, you don't necessarily inherit half of each of a parent's ancestral components. For example, 23andMe says that I inherited 27.9% British and Irish from my father. But half of 45% is actually only 22.5%, so I would seem to have inherited more than half of my father's British and Irish component.

Since my mother's ancestry likely would have also included a British and Irish component, my total isn't much different from my father's, at 43.5%.

I also take issue with the idea of things like "100% Iberian" having the meaning that 23andMe seems to think it does. My most recent immigrant ancestors were all 2nd great grandparents, and all on my mother's side. Two of these came directly from the Spanish island of Minorca.

23andMe puts my Iberian ancestry one more generation back, at a minimum: "You most likely had a third great-grandparent, fourth great-grandparent, fifth great-grandparent, or sixth great-grandparent who was 100% Iberian. This person was likely born between 1720 and 1810." No, I two "Iberian" 2nd great grandparents.

So to recap, this new feature ignores both the fact that admixture isn't a phenomenon of just the most recent generation or two, but also the fact that recombination doesn't result in even inheritance from all ancestors in a given generation.

EDIT: I might add that my youngest sister's Iberian is nearly double mine. I show only 1.9%, while my sister shows 3.4%. Our actual percentage of Spanish ancestry is 12.5%, whether or not our Iberian ancestry reflects that.

gruder
01-16-2017, 05:43 PM
There must be more to it than the mere percentages.

I think it's according to the age of the participant. I am in my 20s and both parents were born in the 1960s. .7% would be anywhere from 5 or 6 generations back. Assuming a generation 25 to 35 years, my Native American ancestor would have been born around 150 years ago, which would be in the 1850s (at the latest).

geebee
01-16-2017, 06:50 PM
Age of the participant is obviously a factor. For my siblings and me, our British & Irish component is universally predicted to reflect a fully British & Irish ancestor from one to three generations back. However, somewhat different years are given for this. For my older brothers -- born in 1950 and 1952 -- 23andMe says "this person was likely born between 1860 and 1920", whereas for me (born in 1956) the company says "this person was likely born between 1870 and 1930". The same thing is said for the first of my sisters (born in 1961), but for my two youngest sisters (born in 1965 and 1968), it's "this person was likely born between 1880 and 1940".

My siblings and I are full siblings, so our ancestors are absolutely identical, so three different ranges for the birth of any of them doesn't really make sense -- except that it's based on our own ages.

EDIT: This is just one of the problems with taking this too seriously. To use a specific example, my daughter has a great grandfather born in 1883, and another one born in 1910. They're obviously the same number of generations removed from her, but they're also a generation apart in their birth years.

geebee
01-16-2017, 07:30 PM
If 23andMe does this sensibly, they'll also consider factors such as whether there's an attached parent. If there is, they should have an idea whether a given ancestry is on only one side or on both. If it's on both sides, it's likely to be a generation further back than would otherwise be predicted.

For example, 23andMe shows my Native American ancestry as 2.0%. On that basis, plus my date of birth, I'm told that "You most likely had a fourth great-grandparent, fifth great-grandparent, sixth great-grandparent, or seventh great (or greater) grandparent who was 100% Native American. This person was likely born between 1690 and 1780." Only I happen to know that this ancestry, though only through my mother, was through both of her parents.

That makes it less likely that we're talking about the closest of these relationships. In fact, I know that on my mother's mother's side, the segments in question are probably from nine generations back (a 7th great grandmother)! Likely the only reason they reached me is that there are multiple lines leading from this ancestor to me, due to some consanguineous marriages.

On my mother's father's side, the known NA ancestor is a somewhat closer: a 5th great grandfather, so seven generations back. As in the case of my maternal grandmother's ancestor, there are multiple paths between my maternal grandfather's ancestor and me.

MfA
01-17-2017, 07:11 PM
Calling HOGWASH on 23andMe’s Ancestry Timeline - dna-explained.com (https://dna-explained.com/2017/01/17/calling-hogwash-on-23andmes-ancestry-timeline/)

rocky
01-18-2017, 01:05 PM
13620

C J Wyatt III
01-19-2017, 05:04 PM
13620

I find it very interesting that you have seven different influences that are from the same time period. I see this in some other's results. Could there be a reason for it?

Jack

Rafe
01-23-2017, 04:26 AM
I find it very interesting that you have seven different influences that are from the same time period. I see this in some other's results. Could there be a reason for it?

Jack

We don't know if they are really from the same period. It seems that in the graph each period is expressed in 95% Confidence Intervals; it is possible, for example, that his Native American is closer to 1730 and his Ashkenazi Jewish to 1820, even though both are placed on the same part of the graph.

MacEochaidh
01-23-2017, 05:43 PM
Mine are fairly accurate, since my Dad was born in Ireland in 1926. My French Canadian grandmother was born in 1893.
13649

Pratt
03-14-2017, 02:36 AM
i don't find Your Ancestry Timeline very accurate.

Tolan
03-16-2017, 06:27 AM
Mine:
14558

Helgenes50
03-16-2017, 08:37 AM
Mine
Very nice for the eyes !!!! but not realistic at all !!!
Very similar to the previous AC14563

Exosuits
03-17-2017, 01:57 PM
14581

I generally don't get any European across any of my results, 23andme is the only company to pick that up

sgdavies@hotmail.com
03-17-2017, 02:07 PM
Here is mine.. In my case, there was only a family story about a British soldier during the Napoleonic Wars bring back a French woman who he married, who was a maid of Josephine, no idea of the truth in it, but here is my result.
14582

The_Lyonnist
03-20-2017, 10:07 PM
For British & Irish : My maternal grandfather was born in Alsace in 1918, when this region was still in Germany. His father came from further afield in southwestern Germany.

For the rest, I do not know.

http://img4.hostingpics.net/pics/81715423andMeChronologieancestrale.png

BalkanKiwi
03-20-2017, 10:13 PM
http://i.imgur.com/H72PzjNh.png

tchekitchek
03-21-2017, 11:43 AM
http://img4.hostingpics.net/pics/431182timelin.jpg

No clue about the Italian and the Scandinavian thing

ViktorL1
04-22-2017, 10:45 PM
15395

Here's mine-- obviously for a non-recently admixed Central Asian, a lot of the population labels make no sense-- they're probably just reflecting ancient (as in the Baltic/Middle Eastern "ancestors") or medieval (as in the Mongolian "ancestor"). Korean, Chinese, Native American all probably reflect shared admixture with East Eurasian population groups (Turkic, probably).

JFWinstone
06-12-2017, 11:29 PM
16807

Hmmm.. not so sure about this :noidea:

Stephen1986
06-14-2017, 04:39 PM
Here's the timelines for myself -

16860

And my brother -

16861

The B&I is right, obviously, and the F&G could indicate a recent continental ancestor as some analyses have suggested over the years. For my brother, though, I'm not sure about his smaller segments, although I guess Iberian and North African could probably be from a Mediterranean ancestor somewhere, although the amounts in his DNA are noise level.

SWAHILLI_PRINCE16
06-14-2017, 09:31 PM
Mine
16878

My Dads
16879

My Mums
16880

A Norfolk L-M20
06-15-2017, 01:12 AM
After waiting 16 months for transition, here is mine:

http://www.anthrogenica.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=16881&d=1497488213

What do I think? Trash bin fodder based on autosomal DNA tests using data-sets and an algorithm that simply don't work.

My recorded ancestry in comparison, and I really don't think that it's that wrong is:

Generation 1 has 1 individual. (100.00% recorded) English
Generation 2 has 2 individuals. (100.00% recorded) English
Generation 3 has 4 individuals. (100.00% recorded) English
Generation 4 has 8 individuals. (100.00% recorded) English
Generation 5 has 16 individuals. (100.00% recorded) English
Generation 6 has 31 individuals. (96.88% recorded) English
Generation 7 has 57 individuals. (89.06% recorded) English
Generation 8 has 63 individuals. (49.22% recorded) English
Generation 9 has 48 individuals. (19.53% recorded) English

Now before any of you start to think that I'm promoting any sort of racial purity agenda, please let me state that I do not give a fig nor any desire for "purity" or for "race". I'm a liberal that would be absolutely happy to find ANY ancestry, regardless where from. It's just what I find on record, family, and local history - compared with what a commercial DNA test for ancestry is selling me.

I have previously surveyed English test results on 23andme, and found that they usually score in the order of 1. British & Irish, 2. French & German, 3. Broadly NW European, 4. Scandinavian, and often a small percentage of Southern European. Sometimes spikes of Eastern European, SSA, East Asian, Native American, etc

Magnetic
06-15-2017, 02:03 AM
http://up.picr.de/29492009ug.jpg

angscoire
06-23-2017, 10:06 AM
17147

British and Irish recent ancestry is correct. Everything else....not impossible but hardly very likely.

Judith
06-28-2017, 05:07 PM
After waiting 16 months for transition, here is mine:

What do I think? Trash bin fodder based on autosomal DNA tests using data-sets and an algorithm that simply don't work.

My recorded ancestry in comparison, and I really don't think that it's that wrong is:

Generation 1 has 1 individual. (100.00% recorded) English
Generation 2 has 2 individuals. (100.00% recorded) English
Generation 3 has 4 individuals. (100.00% recorded) English
Generation 4 has 8 individuals. (100.00% recorded) English
Generation 5 has 16 individuals. (100.00% recorded) English
Generation 6 has 31 individuals. (96.88% recorded) English
Generation 7 has 57 individuals. (89.06% recorded) English
Generation 8 has 63 individuals. (49.22% recorded) English
Generation 9 has 48 individuals. (19.53% recorded) English

I am so pleased to see your's Paul, because mine on this new experience has French or German in the 1870 to 1780 range and in the early area of that I do have gaps.
They also give me Finnish earlier in the 1600s.
Since livingDNA gives something very similar for my brother then I was beginning to wonder, could my unknown brick wall be sailors from Germany roaming around Liverpool but seeing yours tells me no. Like mine it just says there is an ancient signal preserved by inbreeding in small clusters of villages.
I wonder if the Finnish is really Scottish since there were significant Scottish soldiers settling there and only a small local population. After all modern samplers would not ask the test subjects have you Scottish ancestors in the last 400 years, just where do your grandparents come from? So modern Finns are coloured with Scots, at some proportion.

Judith
06-28-2017, 05:38 PM
With the screen capture
1726717268

I suspect the time line is just messed up by the DNA signal being preserved within a small community. I suspect my Scandinavian could be 1,700 years old. Finnish, well see above. My mtDNA matches include about half from Finland but that signal is very old ~5000+ years.

agil
07-02-2017, 06:57 PM
How do they calculate this anyway?

Amerijoe
07-02-2017, 07:19 PM
How do they calculate this anyway?

With a monkey and darts. :laugh:

Ann Turner
07-03-2017, 11:33 AM
How do they calculate this anyway?

The underlying principle is that longer segments indicate more recent ancestry than shorter ones, as illustrated in this blog post

https://blog.23andme.com/23andme-and-you/23andme-how-to/meet-your-chromosome-painting/

The white paper goes into the technical details and includes some of the caveats about interpreting the results.

https://permalinks.23andme.com/pdf/23-14_admixture_date_estimator.pdf

evon
07-03-2017, 01:47 PM
With a monkey and darts. :laugh:

Yeah, that sounds about right :biggrin1:

My grandmothers results is proof of how bad this tool works:

http://i68.tinypic.com/2vb3ngk.jpg

The south Asian and eastern European has been in her family since at least 1200's when the Romani ethnic group "came into being". The British I suppose represents Danish and German and not actual British ancestry, which is wrong by about 150-200 years. The rest is hard to say, but my guess they are both from between 1500 to 1600.

You can also compare it with her son, which in theory should have the same "dates":
http://i68.tinypic.com/6ghcv8.jpg

wombatofthenorth
07-08-2017, 06:17 AM
it seems to work very well for my parents and I

geebee
07-08-2017, 08:43 AM
How do they calculate this anyway?


With a monkey and darts. :laugh:

That might actually be an improvement. :beerchug:

Mike_G
07-08-2017, 07:10 PM
it seems to work very well for my parents and I

Well sure for you, wombat. Aren't you 184% Eastern European or something? ;)

If I remember correctly at least one of your parents had recent German ancestry, did that show up at about the right time?

SWAHILLI_PRINCE16
12-08-2017, 07:17 PM
20328

Adam A
12-11-2017, 01:48 PM
https://i.gyazo.com/2da3070f68685420c930722b80c263fa.png

Updated results

misanthropy
01-13-2018, 06:04 AM
Still kinda trying to figure out where the Middle Eastern comes from and which specific area. The paternal Yemeni mixture is North African + East African (Saudis and Yemeni results I've seen usually have little to no Middle Eastern). I suspect the Middle Eastern (Northern M.E. countries) is from my mom's side, her lineage comes from Persians/Persian speakers hundreds of years ago. My brother, maternal cousins, and I have more Levantine features (think Syria, Palestine, etc.), which is further west than Persia, that's the kicker.

http://i.imgur.com/932rNhT.png

JFWinstone
01-17-2018, 10:05 PM
My phased timeline

20892

JenneR
01-18-2018, 07:12 PM
Phased with my Dad
20913

jellybee
06-29-2018, 11:32 AM
Hi, here are my results:

You most likely had a parent, grandparent, or great-grandparent who was 100% Southeast Asian. This person was likely born between 1880 and 1940.

You most likely had a grandparent, great-grandparent, or second-great-grandparent who was 100% Eastern European. This person was likely born between 1850 and 1910.

You most likely had a great-grandparent, second-great-grandparent, or third-great-grandparent who was 100% French & German. This person was likely born between 1820 and 1880.

You most likely had a great-grandparent, second-great-grandparent, or third-great-grandparent who was 100% Iberian. This person was likely born between 1820 and 1880.

You most likely had a third-great-grandparent, fourth-great-grandparent, fifth-great-grandparent, or sixth-great-grandparent who was 100% South Asian. This person was likely born between 1730 and 1820.

You most likely had a third-great-grandparent, fourth-great-grandparent, fifth-great-grandparent, sixth-great-grandparent, or seventh-great- (or greater) grandparent who was 100% Balkan. This person was likely born between 1700 and 1820.

You most likely had a fourth-great-grandparent, fifth-great-grandparent, sixth-great-grandparent, or seventh-great- (or greater) grandparent who was 100% Melanesian. This person was likely born between 1700 and 1790.

You most likely had a fourth-great-grandparent, fifth-great-grandparent, sixth-great-grandparent, or seventh-great- (or greater) grandparent who was 100% Native American. This person was likely born between 1700 and 1790.

You most likely had a fourth-great-grandparent, fifth-great-grandparent, sixth-great-grandparent, or seventh-great- (or greater) grandparent who was 100% Ashkenazi Jewish. This person was likely born between 1700 and 1790.

geebee
06-29-2018, 07:45 PM
The way 23andMe calculates the timeline is actually quite simple. They look at the percentage Ancestry Composition gives for each ancestry, and make one critical assumption about how you got that ancestry: on the least possible number of sides.

So, for example, if you're close to "half" of some ancestry, they figure you inherited all of that from just one parent. Of course, this is often not true; but since it also sometimes is true, sometimes they're right. In my case, they aren't right about my 43.4% British & Irish.

Since that's fairly close to half, they tell me that I "likely had a parent, grandparent, or great-grandparent who was 100% British & Irish." However, if they crossed checked with my tested and linked father, they'd see that his British & Irish component isn't much higher than mine: 45.0%. The result is that he gets the same prediction about "parent, grandparent, or great grandparent". The only thing different between our timelines for British & Irish is the years predicted for the births of these folks. The range is 1870 to 1930 for me, and 1840 to 1900 for my father.

These ranges, too, are rather simply determined. They just subtract 30 years (for each generation) from your birth year, but then round the result to the nearest decade year. Since I was born in 1956, this gives a range of 1870 to 1930 after rounding.

If they didn't do that rounding, they'd actually have excluded my father from my prediction, since he was born in exactly 1930. Technically, that means they do exclude my mother, since she wasn't born until 1932. They also exclude both of my father's parents from his prediction, since my paternal grandparents were born in 1910 and 1911 -- a full decade beyond the date range in my father's timeline.

Of course, this can work the other way, too. If my father's youngest brother were tested, presumably he'd show a similar "British & Irish" percentage to my father. So likely he'd get the same prediction of "parent, grandparent, or great grandparent". But for the range of years he'd get "born between 1870 and 1930" -- just like me. (This is assuming they'd round 1865 and 1925 up, since that's usually what's done for a number exactly in between.)
This would work for his parents (born in 1910 and 1911) and his grandparents (born in 1882, 1887, 1884, and 1880), but not for any of his great grandparents. These were all born between 1845 and 1864.

A greater problem, though, is just the fact that for those with colonial American ancestry, especially from Pennsylvania. When the first census was taken in 1790, it's estimated that Pennsylvania's German population amounted to about a third of the total. This included some of my father's ancestors.

And mixing between British Americans and Germans Americans didn't start much later than that. As an example, my "Scots-Irish" 4th great grandfather Andrew Gregg married my "German" 4th great grandmother Rachel Creps. So presumably, if my 3rd great grandmother Susannah Gregg could be tested by 23andMe, they'd tell her that she likely had a parent, grandparent, or great grandparent who was 100% British & Irish and was born between 1730 and 1790. And they'd be right, since her Scots-Irish father was born in Connecticut in 1779. (He over 20 years older than Rachel, who actually wouldn't fit in the date range. She was born after 1800.)

But again, as look as you fit the assumptions -- basically, each ancestry tracing ultimately to just as few sides as possible, and date ranges based on an average generation length of about 30 years -- then 23andMe will probably be right.

Well, there is one more assumption: that the ancestry percentages are essentially correct. The timeline also tells me that I


"most likely had a third-great-grandparent, fourth-great-grandparent, fifth-great-grandparent, or sixth-great-grandparent who was 100% Iberian. This person was likely born between 1720 and 1810.

In fact, I have two 2nd great grandparents who were born in Spain, specifically on the island of Minorca. This should make me about 12.5% Catalan, but Ancestry Composition only shows me as 1.9% Iberian (plus some Italian that is very clearly from my Minorcan ancestry, and a little bit of "broadly Southern European"). There is definitely no NPE involved here, since I share DNA with other descendants of both of these grandfathers.

Of course, it's possible that I inherited less than the "average" of 6.25% from each of these 2nd great grandfathers, or that either or both would not have tested as "100% Iberian". Still, it means that in this case Ancestry Compositions misses my Spanish ancestors by -- effectively -- two generations. (Technically, it could be considered just one, since 23andMe's prediction says a 3rd great grandparent is possible, and what I have is a 2nd great grandparent. Or rather, two of them, which is the same degree of ancestry as if I had one great grandparent.)

JFWinstone
06-29-2018, 10:03 PM
Mine after phasing with both parents

https://i.imgur.com/3fXP5nj.png

Mum's

https://i.imgur.com/P1fqIXC.png

ValerieAnne
07-02-2018, 09:23 PM
23andMe results:

24407

Ancestry -> 23andMe results:

24408


I added both to show the difference, #2 looks more like what the original results showed (minus the Iberian and East African, as I didn't have either of them), wheres #1 added Italian and Finnish (after a few weeks of my original results) and removed the Native American. So it's interesting to me, anyway, to see the different results.

PoxVoldius
07-03-2018, 05:06 AM
24412

Vrump
07-03-2018, 06:58 AM
I hope that most people here have made their family tree, because the timeline of 23andme is usually (if not all the time) in total contradiction with the genealogical tree of most people (those who have a family tree well supplied).

Adam A
07-08-2018, 02:33 PM
24494