YP1019 and descending lines

[Daemon2017]

Hello!

Here is a branch of subj topic from another forum :)

Probably, YP1019 is somewhere from borders of Belarus and Baltic states.

STRs:


133999 14 25 16 11 9-11 12 11 12 13 11 29 15 9-11 11 11 23 14 20 32 14-15-16-16 11 10 19-21 16 16 20 18 33-38 13 11 11 8 17-17 8 11 10 8 11 10 12 22-22 15 10 12 12 13 8 15 23 21 12 12 11 13 11 11 12 13
144438 13 25 16 10 11-14 12 13 10 12 11 28 15 9-10 11 11 24 14 20 33 13-15-16-16 11 10 19-23 15 16 18 19 33-36 13 11 11 8 17-17 8 12 10 8 9 10 12 20-22 15 10 12 12 14 8 13 23 21 12 12 11 13 11 11 12 13 32 15 9 15 12 25 27 19 12 12 13 12 10 9 12 11 10 11 11 30 12 13 24 13 9 10 19 15 19 11 22 14 14 15 24 12 23 19 10 15 17 9 11 11
152884 14 25 16 11 11-14 12 13 10 13 11 30 15 9-9 11 11 24 14 20 35 13-15-16-16 11 10 19-23 16 16 17 20 33-37 13 11 11 8 17-17 8 12 10 8 10 10 12 22-22 15 10 12 12 13 8 14 23 21 12 12 11 13 11 11 12 13 32 15 9 15 11 26 27 19 12 12 12 12 10 9 11 11 10 10 11 29 12 14 24 13 9 10 19 15 20 11 23 15 13 15 24 12 23 19 10 15 17 9 12 11
155311 13 25 16 10 11-14 12 13 10 13 11 29 15 9-9 11 11 24 14 20 31 13-15-15-16 11 10 19-23 16 16 17 19 33-37 13 11
166734 13 25 16 11 11-14 12 13 10 13 11 29 15 9-10 11 11 24 14 20 33 13-15-16-16 11 10 19-22 16 16 17 20 33-37 13 11 11 8 17-17 8 12 10 8 10 10 12 22-22 15 10 12 12 13 8 14 23 21 13 12 11 13 11 11 12 13 32 15 9 15 12 26 27 19 12 12 12 12 10 9 12 11 10 11 11 30 12 14 24 13 9 10 18 15 20 12 22 15 13 15 24 12 23 19 10 15 17 9 12 11
210327 14 25 16 11 11-14 12 13 10 13 11 30 15 9-9 11 11 24 14 20 35 13-15-16-16 11 10 19-23 16 16 17 20 33-37 13 11 11 8 17-17 8 12 10 8 10 10 12 22-22 15 10 12 12 13 8 14 23 21 12 12 11 13 11 11 12 13 32 15 9 15 11 26 27 19 12 12 12 12 10 9 11 11 10 10 11 29 12 14 24 13 9 10 19 15 20 11 23 15 13 15 24 12 23 19 10 15 17 9 12 11
224783 13 25 16 11 11-14 12 13 10 13 11 29 14 9-9 11 11 24 14 20 34 13-15-16-16 10 10 19-23 17 15 17 20 33-40 13 11 11 8 17-17 8 12 10 8 10 10 12 22-22 15 10 12 12 13 8 15 23 21 12 12 11 13 11 11 12 13 33 15 9 15 12 25 27 19 12 12 12 12 10 9 12 11 10 11 11 30 12 13 24 13 9 9 19 15 18 11 22 15 13 15 25 12 23 19 10 15 17 9 12 11
236180 14 25 16 11 11-15 12 13 11 13 11 29 15 9-10 11 11 24 14 20 34 13-15-16-16 11 10 19-23 15 16 17 20 32-35 12 11
236263 14 25 16 11 11-15 12 13 11 13 11 29
249168 13 25 16 11 11-14 12 13 11 13 11 29 15 9-10 11 11 23 14 21 32 13-15-16-16 11 10 19-23 16 16 17 20 33-36 13 11
249993 14 25 16 11 11-15 12 13 11 13 11 29 15 9-10 11 11 24 14 20 33 13-15-15-16 11 10 19-23 15 15 17 20 32-34 12 11
261227 13 25 17 10 11-14 12 13 10 13 11 29 15 9-10 11 11 24 14 20 33 13-15-16-16 12 10 19-23 15 16 16 20 33-38 13 11
268691 13 25 16 11 11-14 12 13 10 13 11 29 15 9-10 11 11 24 14 20 33 13-15-15-16 11 10 19-23 17 16 17 20 36-38 12 11 11 8 17-17 8 12 10 8 10 10 12 22-22 15 10 12 12 14 8 15 23 21 12 12 11 13 12 11 12 13
270787 13 25 16 11 11-14 12 13 10 13 11 29 15 9-9 11 11 24 14 20 33 13-16-16-16 10 10 19-23 17 15 17 19 33-37 13 11 11 8 17-17 8 12 10 8 10 10 12 22-22 15 10 12 12 13 8 15 23 21 12 12 11 13 11 11 12 13 35 15 9 15 11 25 27 19 12 12 12 12 10 9 12 11 10 11 11 30 12 14 24 13 9 9 19 15 18 11 22 15 13 15 25 12 23 19 10 15 17 9 12 11
279862 14 25 16 10 11-14 12 13 10 13 11 29 16 9-10 11 11 23 14 20 33 13-15-16-16 11 10 19-23 16 15 17 19 33-38 12 11 11 8 17-17 8 12 10 8 11 10 12 22-22 15 10 12 12 13 8 14 23 21 12 12 11 13 11 11 12 13 31 15 9 15 12 25 27 19 12 12 12 12 10 9 12 11 10 11 11 30 12 13 24 13 9 10 19 15 19 12 22 15 13 15 24 12 24 19 10 15 17 9 11 11
281866 13 25 17 11 11-14 12 13 10 13 11 31
283804 13 25 16 10 11-14 12 13 11 14 11 30
294254 13 24 17 11 10-15 12 15 10 14 11 30 16 9-9 11 11 24 14 20 34 13-15-15-16 12 10 19-23 16 15 19 20 33-38 14 11 11 8 17-17 8 12 10 8 10 10 12 22-22 15 10 12 12 12 8 14 23 21 12 12 11 13 11 11 12 13
329713 13 25 16 10 12-13 12 13 10 12 11 28 15 9-10 11 11 24 14 20 33 13-15-16-16 10 10 19-23 15 16 18 20 33-36 13 11 11 8 17-17 8 12 10 8 9 10 12 20-22 15 10 12 12 14 8 13 23 21 12 12 11 13 11 11 12 13 32 15 9 15 12 25 27 19 12 12 12 12 10 9 12 11 10 11 11 31 12 13 24 13 9 10 18 15 19 11 22 14 15 15 24 12 23 19 10 15 17 9 11 11
330411 13 25 16 10 11-14 12 13 10 13 11 29
387740 13 25 16 10 12-14 12 13 10 13 11 29 16 9-10 11 11 24 14 20 34 13-15-16-16 12 10 19-23 15 16 19 19 33-37 12 11
392450 13 25 15 10 11-14 12 13 10 13 11 29 15 9-10 11 11 24 14 20 34 13-15-16-16 12 10 19-23 15 16 16 20 33-37 12 11
453212 14 25 16 11 11-14 12 13 10 13 11 30 15 9-9 11 11 24 14 20 33 13-15-16-16 11 10 19-23 16 16 17 20 33-37 13 11 11 8 17-17 8 12 10 8 10 10 12 22-22 15 10 12 12 13 8 14 23 21 12 12 11 13 11 11 12 13
N115222 13 25 17 11 11-12 12 13 10 13 11 29
483842 13 25 16 10 11-14 12 13 10 13 11 29 15 9-10 11 11 24 14 20 33 13-16-16-16
507178 13 25 16 11 11-14 12 13 10 13 11 29 15 9-10 11 11 24 14 20 33 13-15-16-16 12 10 19-23 15 16 16 20 34-38 13 11 11 8 17-17 8 12 10 8 10 10 12 22-22 16 10 12 12 13 8 14 23 21 12 12 11 13 11 11 12 13
499513 13 25 15 11 12-14 12 12 10 13 11 30 15 9-10 11 11 24 14 20 34 13-15-15-17 11 12 19-23 15 15 17 20 34-40 13 11 11 8 17-17 8 12 10 8 11 10 12 22-22 15 10 12 12 13 8 14 23 21 12 11 11 13 11 11 12 13 33 15 9 15 12 25 27 18 12 12 12 13 10 9 11 11 10 11 11 30 12 14 24 13 9 10 19 15 19 11 23 15 11 15 24 12 24 19 10 15 17 9 11 11
537359 13 25 17 11 11-14 12 13 10 13 11 29 15 9-10 11 11 24 14 20 33 13-16-16-17 11 10 19-22 16 16 19 19 33-38 13 11
102698 13 25 15 11 11-14 10 12 10 13 11 30


Tree from Phylip:
https://pp.vk.me/c637317/v637317078/36ead/3H-qAZrL2iA.jpg

And scheme of descending SNPs and people, who have BigY:
https://pp.vk.me/c637317/v637317078/36ea3/lOU2PS44uCg.jpg

[kosmonomad]

Thanks for posting. In my hypothesis this lineage plus YP1034 and YP1145 are very-very likely to have been of Fatyanovo descent.

[Daemon2017]

Thanks for posting. In my hypothesis this lineage plus YP1034 and YP1145 are very-very likely to have been of Fatyanovo descent.
May be :)

Michal suggested the following:


Let me also point your attention to the four less known subclades under CTS1211 that are parallel to the major subclades Y35 and YP343. Two of them (YP1034 and YP4932) seem to be quite securely associated with deep Baltic ancestry. IMO, the same is probably true for the two remaining subclades, although I would suspect that YP1019 was partially assimilated by the Proto-Slavs (so it likely originated close to the Proto-Slavic homeland), while YP1147 seems to be associated mostly with Finnish ancestry, so one could assume that it originated close to the Northern (or North-Eastern) periphery of the ancient Baltic (Balto-Slavic) territory.


And the Artek's idea is:


CTS1211>YP1019 is a rare sublineage of R1a-Z280, most likely emerged in Bronze Age within Sosnica culture of post-Corded Ware Trzciniec horizon.
It has rather Baltic character, although on FTDNA participants from that clade are mostly Northwestern Russian and Northeastern Polish.

[Daemon2017]

Map from Semargl:
https://pp.vk.me/c637318/v637318078/396b4/PRBc0coPzYc.jpg

[Michał]

And scheme of descending SNPs and people, who have BigY:
https://pp.vk.me/c637317/v637317078/36ea3/lOU2PS44uCg.jpg
What is the FTDNA kit number for Nasackin? Is he #329713 whose ancestral surname is Ponosak? If so, then something is definietly wrong here (both with his name and with his phylogenetic position). Mutation YP4969 seems to be present in all YP1020 members tested so far, so it cannot define a subclade downstream of YP1020 that is parallel to YP1024.

Also, YP5665 is a subclade under YP4970, not directly under YP1024.

[Daemon2017]

What is the FTDNA kit number for Nasackin? Is he #329713 whose ancestral surname is Ponosak? If so, then something is definietly wrong here (both with his name and with his phylogenetic position). Mutation YP4969 seems to be present in all YP1020 members tested so far, so it cannot define a subclade downstream of YP1020 that is parallel to YP1024.

Also, YP5665 is a subclade under YP4970, not directly under YP1024.

Yes, 329713 - it's me.

In my list of common novels with Valetov (YP1024+) it's no 22183241, so I proposed, that all YP1024+ has YP4969- :biggrin1:

Problem with YP5665 is caused by my inattention. I've changed the scheme and I hope, that now everything is correct:
https://pp.vk.me/c637318/v637318078/397ec/zbngDC7bf3k.jpg

[Daemon2017]

According to YFull common SNP for Makarin and Baca is named YP6073.