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Thread: What will Breton ancestry show up as in a DNA test?

  1. #91
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    In MyHeritage Bretons tend to score 80% British/Irish + 20% Spanish etc.

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  3. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tomenable View Post
    In MyHeritage Bretons tend to score 80% British/Irish + 20% Spanish etc.
    myheritage is not a reference in this field...
    Y haplogroup: R1b: L21 --> DF13 --> BY145002
    The oldest L21 known are I2457 et I2565 from Stonehenge (Beaker Culture, 2400-1900 BC)

    MTDNA: U4c1
    The oldest U4c1 known are "poz224", Yamnaya culture (2882-2698 BC), and 2 Bell-Beaker in Germany (Karsdorf, 2314-2042 BC)

    Paternal MTDNA: K1b2b
    The oldest K1b2 are Eastern European Mesolithic: Kunda Donkalnis5 (Lithuania), 6000 BC and Meso-Ene Lepenski Vir Lepe28 in Serbia, 5900 BC.
    The oldest K1b2b is Alt-3, Corded-Ware Germany (2500 BC)

  4. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tolan View Post
    myheritage is not a reference in this field...
    Ok but would you agree that massive Briton migration had a very significant impact on Armorica?

    It even reached Iberia, as there is a region called Britonia there, also named after Insular Celts:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Britonia

    What we really need to determine how much of modern Breton DNA is truly recent influx from the British Isles, and how much is local but just happens to be similar to British/Irish people, are ancient DNA samples from France, including Iron Age and Roman Era Armorican samples:

    Last edited by Tomenable; 10-17-2019 at 11:16 PM.

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  6. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tomenable View Post
    Ok but would you agree that massive Briton migration had a very significant impact on Armorica?

    It even reached Iberia, as there is a region called Britonia there, also named after Insular Celts:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Britonia

    What we really need to determine how much of modern Breton DNA is truly recent influx from the British Isles, and how much is local but just happens to be similar to British/Irish people, are ancient DNA samples from France, including Iron Age and Roman Era Armorican samples:
    I agree..
    I meant that a lambda French gets 20% English or Irish on Myheritage, so really myheritage is not a reference for this area ..

    Otherwise, I am convinced that the Armorican population was quite close to the population of the island of Britain.
    The haplogroup L21, for example, had to be very present even before the arrival of the Bretons!

    To be able to compare, it would take Armorican samples before the arrival of the Breton ...
    We can try dreaming!
    Y haplogroup: R1b: L21 --> DF13 --> BY145002
    The oldest L21 known are I2457 et I2565 from Stonehenge (Beaker Culture, 2400-1900 BC)

    MTDNA: U4c1
    The oldest U4c1 known are "poz224", Yamnaya culture (2882-2698 BC), and 2 Bell-Beaker in Germany (Karsdorf, 2314-2042 BC)

    Paternal MTDNA: K1b2b
    The oldest K1b2 are Eastern European Mesolithic: Kunda Donkalnis5 (Lithuania), 6000 BC and Meso-Ene Lepenski Vir Lepe28 in Serbia, 5900 BC.
    The oldest K1b2b is Alt-3, Corded-Ware Germany (2500 BC)

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  8. #95
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tomenable View Post
    In MyHeritage Bretons tend to score 80% British/Irish + 20% Spanish etc.
    i am Breton (western part)
    but MyHeritage gave me only 29.4 Irish,Scottish and Welsh 0 English (and 29.9 Scandinavian! Why? I don't know . Scandinavian=English? ; 26 Iberian; 0 French of course)
    (LivingDNA 84.3 British and Irish,13 Iberian and 0 Scandinavian 0 French).
    Last edited by Trelvern; 10-18-2019 at 06:21 AM.

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  10. #96
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trelvern View Post
    i am Breton (western part)
    but MyHeritage gave me only 29.4 Irish,Scottish and Welsh 0 English (and 29.9 Scandinavian! Why? I don't know . Scandinavian=English? ; 26 Iberian; 0 French of course)
    (LivingDNA 84.3 British and Irish,13 Iberian and 0 Scandinavian 0 French).
    And for me: 43%English, 11%Irish, Scott, Welsh (54% British/Irish) ; Iberian:21% ; Italian:6%, and East-Europe:15%! and Ashkenaze:4%!
    Y haplogroup: R1b: L21 --> DF13 --> BY145002
    The oldest L21 known are I2457 et I2565 from Stonehenge (Beaker Culture, 2400-1900 BC)

    MTDNA: U4c1
    The oldest U4c1 known are "poz224", Yamnaya culture (2882-2698 BC), and 2 Bell-Beaker in Germany (Karsdorf, 2314-2042 BC)

    Paternal MTDNA: K1b2b
    The oldest K1b2 are Eastern European Mesolithic: Kunda Donkalnis5 (Lithuania), 6000 BC and Meso-Ene Lepenski Vir Lepe28 in Serbia, 5900 BC.
    The oldest K1b2b is Alt-3, Corded-Ware Germany (2500 BC)

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  12. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trelvern View Post
    i am Breton (western part)
    but MyHeritage gave me only 29.4 Irish,Scottish and Welsh 0 English (and 29.9 Scandinavian! Why? I don't know . Scandinavian=English? ; 26 Iberian; 0 French of course)
    (LivingDNA 84.3 British and Irish,13 Iberian and 0 Scandinavian 0 French).
    And IIRC in Celtic vs. Germanic PCA or in Global25 you score very Celtic instead, even compared to other Bretons who don't score Scandinavian in MyHeritage?
    Last edited by Tomenable; 10-18-2019 at 07:43 AM.

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  14. #98
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tomenable View Post
    And IIRC in Celtic vs. Germanic PCA or in Global25 you score very Celtic instead, even compared to other Bretons who don't score Scandinavian in MyHeritage?
    Yes very "Celtic" as long as it has a meaning.
    Compared to other Breton I am in the pack and nothing more.
    Many of them have tested 23 and me
    Therefore comparisons are difficult

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  16. #99
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    Quote Originally Posted by CuriousAboutStuff View Post
    If someone of fully Breton descent were to take a DNA test, would they fall under the French or British category?

    Curious as I'm aware of the linguistic and cultural relationship Brittany has to the British Isles, but I was wondering if there was a genetic relationship too, one maybe distinct from the rest of France?
    I am Breton going back to 1550. Civil and Church records, all in Finstere and some in Morbihan. 23andme says I am 98.6% British and Irish with 1.4% Spanish and Portugese. Ancestry says 54% Irish, 38% Scottish and 8% Welsh.

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  18. #100
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    more "celtic"
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    Quote Originally Posted by ffoucart View Post
    Hauts de France (Top of France) is clearly an awful and stupid name.

    Anyway, to my knowledge, Loire Atlantique has always been mostly French speaking. I am not saying that Nantes is not part of Bretagne, but Breton was not usually spoken there.
    I didn't write otherwise; but the breton language has been spoken over 35/40% of the Loire-Atlantique territory, based on serious toponymy. Not to say that this area was uniquely breton speaking! disglossy and surely social classes distinct pratices, seemingly. And the very limited lasting breton speaking region West of Saint-Nazaire has been more extended towards East before. It isn't new.
    A good book (if not the Bible) is Bertrand Luçon "NOMS DE LIEUX BRETONS DU PAYS NANTAIS (Yoran Embanner) -

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