Results 1 to 5 of 5

Thread: Genomic models for SE Asians using nMonte

  1. #1
    Registered Users
    Posts
    588
    Sex
    Omitted

    Genomic models for SE Asians using nMonte

    Since, there is no East/SE Asia thread, I decide to post in Oceania as it is the closest subforum to SE Asia.

    SE Asians seem to have actual South Asian (not just ASI) + minor amounts of West Eurasian ancestry based on these models using nMonte. According to these models, SE Asians like Burmese (ethnic Bamar) and Cambodians seem to have around 6-8% West Eurasian/West Eurasian-related admix.

    Some terms to know here: ASI-Ancestral South Indian-an ancient pop is not related to anyone outside to the continent, ANI-Ancestral North Indians-the other ancestry of South Asians that is very related to Caucasians/Near Easterners/North Africans (genetic wise)/Europeans aka West Eurasians

    If SE Asians have actual South Asian, they will also have both ASI and ANI, not only just ASI.

    I will start with the models for the ethnic Bamar, (Burmese) first...
     
    [1] "distance%=0.2661 / distance=0.002661"

    Burmese

    Naxi 41.0
    Tujia 32.7
    Austroasiatic_Kharia 24.8
    Sardinian 1.5

    Sardinian is a South Euro that is often used as reference for the purest West Eurasian pop cline. Also Kharia is an Austroasiatic pop from India that seems to have some West Eurasian ancestry. In this case, Kharia is representing the South Asian ancestry of the Burmese. This shows that the Burmese likely have West Eurasian ancestry.

    [1] "distance%=0.1266 / distance=0.001266"

    Burmese

    Naxi 36.8
    Tujia 35.1
    Austroasiatic_Bonda 23.1
    Balochi 5.0

    Balochi is a heavily West Asian-related pop from Balochistan (Western Pakistan, Iran, parts of Afghanistan) and they are also mostly West Eurasian genetically. Bonda is an Austroasiatic population from India that is used to represent the South Asian ancestry of the Burmese. In this case, it can be said that the Burmese have West Eurasian ancestry from the Bonda and Balochi clusters.

    Now I model the Burmese with a more mainstream South Asian pop, the Chamar, a schedule caste from North India.

    [1] "distance%=0.3036 / distance=0.003036"

    Burmese

    Tujia 72.15
    Chamar 21.35
    Ulchi 4.05
    Agta 2.05
    Papuan 0.40

    In this case, the actual South Asian ancestry of the Burmese is in the form of the Chamars, who are around 38.7% ANI/West Eurasian. Now lets do the math here= 21.35*38.7=8.26245. Burmese have around 8.26% West Eurasian ancestry using this model.

    Note: This doesn't mean that Chamar is the actual South Asian ancestry in Burmese. You can basically used any South Asian pop or even West Asian to model. The idea here is to find the best fit for the model.

    Let's try model the Burmese using another South Asian scheduled caste, Dusadh from Bihar
    [1] "distance%=0.4203 / distance=0.004203"

    Burmese

    Naxi 55.9
    Dai 23.4
    Dusadh 19.6
    Agta 1.0
    Papuan 0.2

    The Dusadh now represent the South Asian ancestry of the Burmese. Dusadh are about 41% ANI/West Eurasian. Again, do the math= 19.6*41= 8.036. The Burmese are around 8.04% West Eurasian according to this model.


    Based on these results, it seems like the South Asian admix of Burmese (ethnic Bamar) is genuine and not just something ASI (Ancestral South Indian)/ASI-like. This is because there seems to also be substantial West Eurasian admix in them.

    One more observation, it seems the Burmese get very good fits when being modelled with Naxi+Tujia or Tujia+Ulchi as the Mongoloid portion of the Burmese. The fit will be terrible for the Burmese if they are modelled as Dai+Atayal or Dai+Igorot which fits very well for other SE Asians. It just shows that the Burmese is distinct genetically from other SE Asians; with their Mongoloid ancestry being much more East Asian/NE Asian affinity than their neighbors. This makes sense as the Burmese speak a Sino-Tibetan language and are believed to be southward migrants from Central China.

    Now here are the models for Khmers:
     

    [1] "distance%=0.3114 / distance=0.003114"

    Cambodian

    Dai 45.4
    Atayal 29.9
    Austroasiatic_Bonda 20.5
    Georgian 4.2

    Georgian is a West Asian (Caucasus) population is used to represent any likely West Eurasian admix in Cambodians. South Asian ancestry of Khmers is represented by Bonda, an Austroasiatic tribe from India, who also have some West Eurasian admix. According to this model, Cambodians received West Eurasian from both Georgian-like and Bonda-like sources.
    [1] "distance%=0.4595 / distance=0.004595"


    Cambodian

    Dai 55.6
    Igorot 24.1
    Austroasiatic_Santhal 17.9
    Tunisian 2.3

    In this model, Tunisian is used to represent the Western Eurasian-related affinity in Khmers. Santhal, an Austroasiatic tribe from India is used to model the South Asian ancestry of Cambodians. Keep in mind, that Santhal also have some West Eurasian ancecstry. Therefore, this model shows that Cambodians likely have both West Eurasian ancestry from Santhal-like and Tunisian-like populations.

    Now I decided to model Cambodians using more mainstream South Asians like the Dharkar and Dusadh.

    Using Dharkar
    [1] "distance%=0.4252 / distance=0.004252"

    Cambodian

    Dai 55.0
    Atayal 22.2
    Dharkar 15.5
    Batak 6.5
    Papuan 0.8

    The Dharkar, a Northern Indian caste or Scheduled tribe from Uttar Pradesh, is used to represent the South Asian ancestry of Cambodians here. Dharkars are around 47.8% ANI/West Eurasian-related. Doing the math= 15.5*47.8/100= 7.049. This means that the Khmers (Cambodians) have around 7.05% West Eurasian according to this model

    Using Dusadh, a caste also from Uttar Pradesh in Northern India.
    1] "distance%=0.3373 / distance=0.003373"

    Cambodian

    Dai 59.6
    Igorot 22.4
    Dusadh 16.6
    Papuan 1.5

    Dusadh, the same caste from North India that I used to model the Burmese with, is also used to model the Khmers. Dusadh is around 41% ANI/West Eurasian-related. Do the math= 16.6*41=6.806. According to this model, Khmers/Cambodians have around 6.81% West Eurasian ancestry.

    Based on these results, it seems like the South Asian admix of Cambodians is genuine and not just something ASI (Ancestral South Indian)/ASI-like. This is because there seems to also be substantial West Eurasian admix in them.

    One more observation, it seems the Khmers get very good fits when their Mongoloid ancecstry is modelled as Dai+Atayal or Dai+Igorot which is in line with the Mongoloid side of most other SE Asians.
    Last edited by Tsakhur; 10-25-2017 at 08:40 AM.

  2. The Following 10 Users Say Thank You to Tsakhur For This Useful Post:

     Angoliga (05-15-2019),  Awale (10-30-2017),  bmoney (10-26-2017),  DMXX (10-31-2017),  jortita (10-25-2017),  MonkeyDLuffy (10-25-2017),  okarinaofsteiner (04-11-2018),  parasar (10-29-2017),  Reza (10-30-2017),  Zayd (10-29-2017)

  3. #2
    Bronze Class Member
    Posts
    1,571
    Sex
    Ethnicity
    Assamese Tai and Kachari
    Nationality
    Indian
    Y-DNA (P)
    R1a1
    mtDNA (M)
    M13'46'61

    India China Myanmar Vietnam Laos
    I have requested Admin to create a new Southeast Asia Forum, I am also keen on such a forum where i can start threads

  4. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to jortita For This Useful Post:

     bmoney (10-26-2017),  Zayd (10-29-2017)

  5. #3
    Registered Users
    Posts
    3,640
    Sex
    Y-DNA (P)
    L1a1
    mtDNA (M)
    M30
    Y-DNA (M)
    R-L295

    +1

    Very interested in more E Asian and SE Asian results

  6. The Following User Says Thank You to bmoney For This Useful Post:

     Tsakhur (11-07-2017)

  7. #4
    Registered Users
    Posts
    588
    Sex
    Omitted

    Sorry, I forget to post the ANI-ASI references for the South Asian population used for modelling the Burmese and Cambodians: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/art...33/table/tbl1/

  8. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Tsakhur For This Useful Post:

     jortita (10-30-2017),  Reza (10-30-2017)

  9. #5
    Administrator
    Posts
    4,719
    Sex
    Y-DNA (P)
    R2a*-M124 (L295-)
    mtDNA (M)
    D4j5*

    A SE Asian section, alongside several other additions, should be introduced within the week.

    As a quick reminder regarding the use of archaic physical anthropology terms in a genetics context:

    http://www.anthrogenica.com/showthre...655#post302655

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 7
    Last Post: 02-18-2021, 06:26 PM
  2. Replies: 183
    Last Post: 04-17-2020, 05:50 PM
  3. Replies: 134
    Last Post: 05-25-2018, 02:41 AM
  4. Replies: 11
    Last Post: 03-11-2018, 01:53 PM
  5. D-Stat Models
    By Kale in forum Autosomal (auDNA)
    Replies: 67
    Last Post: 03-28-2017, 06:16 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •