Results 1 to 8 of 8

Thread: Haplogroup E-V65's origins

  1. #1
    Registered Users
    Posts
    28
    Sex
    Location
    France
    Y-DNA (P)
    E-M183
    mtDNA (M)
    V7

    Haplogroup E-V65's origins

    Hello, does anyone have any information about this haplogroup's origins?
    It is mainly found in North Africa, especially in Morocco, but its presence seems to be more important in coastal Moroccan Arabs than in Moroccan Berbers.
    Is it native to North Africa or not?
    If any knowledgeable person among you could share some informations, it would be greatly appreciated.

    Thanks in advance.

  2. #2
    Registered Users
    Posts
    54
    Sex
    Location
    Tunisia
    Ethnicity
    North Africa
    Y-DNA (P)
    E-M35-E-M78-E-V65

    Tunisia
    Hi Aizkora,
    E-V65 is certainly native to North Africa, son of E-M78 Haplogroup originate somewhere between Libya and Egypt..
    V65 carriers seem to occur a founder effect along the mediteranean coast of North Africa, from west Egypt to Morocco.
    I am a V65 carrier from coastal Tunisia., ther is a facebook page dedicated to the Haplogroup.
    Are you an e-v65 carrier ?
    Regards.

    Jamel.
    Last edited by jof2311; 11-05-2017 at 06:59 PM.

  3. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to jof2311 For This Useful Post:

     drobbah (11-06-2017),  Targum (11-06-2017)

  4. #3
    Registered Users
    Posts
    28
    Sex
    Location
    France
    Y-DNA (P)
    E-M183
    mtDNA (M)
    V7

    Quote Originally Posted by jof2311 View Post
    Hi Aizkora,
    E-V65 is certainly native to North Africa, son of E-M78 Haplogroup originate somewhere between Libya and Egypt..
    V65 carriers seem to occur a founder effect along the mediteranean coast of North Africa, from west Egypt to Morocco.
    I am a V65 carrier from coastal Tunisia., ther is a facebook page dedicated to the Haplogroup.
    Are you an e-v65 carrier ?
    Regards.

    Jamel.
    I don't know I'm still waiting for my results.
    But it seems like e-v65 was in North Africa even before e-m81..

  5. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Aizkora For This Useful Post:

     mershechu (02-07-2018),  Targum (11-06-2017)

  6. #4
    Registered Users
    Posts
    54
    Sex
    Location
    Tunisia
    Ethnicity
    North Africa
    Y-DNA (P)
    E-M35-E-M78-E-V65

    Tunisia
    Quote Originally Posted by Aizkora View Post
    I don't know I'm still waiting for my results.
    But it seems like e-v65 was in North Africa even before e-m81..
    "it seems like e-v65 was in North Africa even before e-m81"
    Indeed,more and more clues seem to show that , but I am curious to know what make you suggest that ?
    Your source may be interesting.

  7. #5
    Registered Users
    Posts
    28
    Sex
    Location
    France
    Y-DNA (P)
    E-M183
    mtDNA (M)
    V7

    Quote Originally Posted by jof2311 View Post
    "it seems like e-v65 was in North Africa even before e-m81"
    Indeed,more and more clues seem to show that , but I am curious to know what make you suggest that ?
    Your source may be interesting.
    TMRCA for E-M81 is 2300ybp according to this website : yfull(.)com/tree/E-M81/ (not allowed to post links yet!)

    It coincides with the estimated date of the break up of Proto-Berber into several groups and the coming of Numidian berbers from the Sahara into what is now Algeria.
    And Massinissa had 44 sons, maybe he was the one responsible for the founder effect of E-M81 which now dominates E-V65 in the Maghreb?

    Did the Numidians speak Proto-Berber? If so, what did the e-v65 people speak? An Afroasiatic language?

    PS : This is pure speculation, I don't claim to be a specialist

  8. The Following User Says Thank You to Aizkora For This Useful Post:

     mershechu (02-07-2018)

  9. #6
    Registered Users
    Posts
    54
    Sex
    Location
    Tunisia
    Ethnicity
    North Africa
    Y-DNA (P)
    E-M35-E-M78-E-V65

    Tunisia
    The TMRCa is one key, indeed they seem to indicate a Roman spread for the E-m81 carriers, wich it matches with Massinissa rule indeed,
    the Tmrca of E-v65 is older and seems to matche at least with the Punic Carthaginian period .
    and it's true that V65 with somes J1 and perhaps R1v88 are considered as the lineages which brought Afro asiatic linguages in NA.

  10. #7
    Junior Member
    Posts
    1
    Sex

    Quote Originally Posted by Aizkora View Post
    Hello, does anyone have any information about this haplogroup's origins?
    It is mainly found in North Africa, especially in Morocco, but its presence seems to be more important in coastal Moroccan Arabs than in Moroccan Berbers.
    Is it native to North Africa or not?
    If any knowledgeable person among you could share some informations, it would be greatly appreciated.

    Thanks in advance.
    Hello, I am new to the group but thought I would pitch in to the discussion. The MRCA Most Recent Common Ancestor was about 2800 years ago. M81 is considered the Berber (Amazigh) Marker but is the brother, if you will, with V65. You will notice in the map from Cruciani and his research in Tracing Past Human Male Movements in Northern/Eastern Africa and Western Eurasia, the V65 is located in two main clusters, Morocco and Libya. As was stated earlier, there are those in both Libya and Morocco who identify as Arabs but also in Morocco and Libya that consider themselves Berber, especially those in the Moya (Middle) Atlas Mountains. The Berber in the Atlas mountains are very isolated and are serious about their cultural identity. DNA research has found that those who consider themselves Arab in Morocco and Libya are for the most part, genetically identical to those who consider themselves Berber E-v65.

    So, now for a bit of history. There were three major invasions by Armies of Arabs, starting in the 600s until about 1100 AD. The V65 origin appears to originate and branched from E-M78 in the Cyrenaica region of Libya and either, had a branch migrate to Morocco or went there by force or as part of the Arabian armies. Most evidence points to war. The V65 tribal area was right in the middle of the path of the Arab armies. As they left Egypt, one of the first areas they would go through would have been theirs. There were horrific battles and Amazigh were slaughtered. It was about survival really. The Arab armies were as big as 20,000 strong and often killed all the men and took their wives and children to join with them or take them as slaves. Those at the coastline, which most V65 appear to reside, could have escaped by boat. The small pockets of V65 today are found in Sicily, Central Italy, Spain and Sardinia but are for the most part, except for some small exceptions, not found in Europe even, which makes it unique when compared to other subclades. The V65 who could escape, also made it into the mountains where other Berber were living once they found themselves in Morocco and are there to this day and are the highest amount/cluster outside of those who reside in Arab identity rich areas such as the cities.

    Those who consider themselves Arab but have the V65 subclade are the decedents of the Berber who were conquered and eventually were Arabized. Once taken captive, most Amazigh were not even allowed to learn their language or practice much of their cultural traditions in an effort to convert them into Arab-like populations, which would make them considerably easier to control politically. I hope this helps...let me know if you have any questions.
    Last edited by StevenTN; 02-02-2018 at 08:38 PM.

  11. #8
    Registered Users
    Posts
    54
    Sex
    Location
    Tunisia
    Ethnicity
    North Africa
    Y-DNA (P)
    E-M35-E-M78-E-V65

    Tunisia
    Hello,
    V65 , even in Morocco is much older than the Arabs invasions, and particulary in coastal Libya and Tunisia, ancient greek Libya, i don't think that its repartition is so linked to the Mouslims conquest, we should analyse the repatitions of V12 carriers in South Egypt where The Arabs armies (Beni hilal, soleim..) stayed a long time too, that didn't change the ancient founder effect of V12 carriers in Egypts, i think V65 carriers (its sister clade) occured a founder effect on the coast of North Africa mediteranean.
    Last edited by jof2311; 02-05-2018 at 09:17 PM.

  12. The Following User Says Thank You to jof2311 For This Useful Post:

     mershechu (02-07-2018)

Similar Threads

  1. Origins of haplogroup G-L497
    By BMK in forum G2a-P15
    Replies: 38
    Last Post: 05-17-2020, 05:53 PM
  2. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 03-10-2020, 09:53 PM
  3. Replies: 3
    Last Post: 01-05-2019, 12:35 PM
  4. Origins of mtDNA haplogroup U5
    By J Man in forum U
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 01-21-2018, 08:17 AM
  5. YDNA Haplogroup Origins Updated
    By Amerijoe in forum FTDNA
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 09-08-2017, 03:23 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •