Page 2 of 9 FirstFirst 1234 ... LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 86

Thread: R1a-M458-L1029*

  1. #11
    Banned
    Posts
    1,412
    Sex
    Location
    United States
    Ethnicity
    Albanian
    Nationality
    American
    Y-DNA (P)
    R1a-L1029>Y133383
    mtDNA (M)
    H11a2*-146+
    Y-DNA (M)
    J2b-L283>PH1751
    mtDNA (P)
    T1a1I

    Albania Kosovo Macedonia United States of America Sweden Greece
    Quote Originally Posted by dink View Post
    Maybe it came to the Balkans with space aliens.
    You stand out like a sore thumb Dick.

  2. The Following User Says Thank You to Dibran For This Useful Post:

     dink (01-07-2018)

  3. #12
    Gold Class Member
    Posts
    2,719
    Sex

    Quote Originally Posted by Trojet View Post
    In this case The Most Recent Common Ancestor of anyone who is under L1029 lived ~2000 years.
    To be fair, Michał has often claimed that:

    - We should add 10-20% to YFull TMRCAs. This would give L1029 a TMRCA of 2200-2400 years.

    - A clade incubates (comes to prominence within a clan/tribe) over a long interval (500-1000 years). We could hypothesize that Dibran's lineage is actually a clade, as yet unidentified by YFull due to undersampling of his region. One could then further hypothesize that this clade rose to promiinence within a particular clan, which then traveled south as part of the Slavic expansion.

    But as Dibran points out, many hypotheses are possible.
    Last edited by lgmayka; 01-07-2018 at 04:04 PM.

  4. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to lgmayka For This Useful Post:

     Brent.B (01-08-2018),  Dibran (01-07-2018),  Michał (01-07-2018),  Waldemar (01-07-2018)

  5. #13
    Banned
    Posts
    1,412
    Sex
    Location
    United States
    Ethnicity
    Albanian
    Nationality
    American
    Y-DNA (P)
    R1a-L1029>Y133383
    mtDNA (M)
    H11a2*-146+
    Y-DNA (M)
    J2b-L283>PH1751
    mtDNA (P)
    T1a1I

    Albania Kosovo Macedonia United States of America Sweden Greece
    Quote Originally Posted by Trojet View Post
    Dibran, I think you might be confused in regards to TMRCA estimates. In this case The Most Recent Common Ancestor of anyone who is under L1029 lived ~2000 years. If we assume that L1029 expanded out of Central or Eastern Europe, then your line could've migrated to Albania sometime after 2000 years ago, and not exactly 2000 years ago.

    The Italian who is right underneath L1029 is not L1029* (which would mean negative for all downstreams). The reason why he is placed as such must be because his status is unknown (whether positive or negative) for one or more L1029 sub-branches.

    Anyways, we need to wait until the YFull analysis is done to confirm terminal placement. Also, another thing to keep in mind is if you end up being L1029* or share a SNP with an existing L1029* sample, it doesn't mean that you will stay forever like that. As we know, the YFull tree is based on only NGS tests which not every L1029 has taken. So there may be other L1029 out there who in the future take an NGS test and share one or more of your Novel or Unique SNPs, and therefore will form a sub-branch with a younger TMRCA between you two.
    The point I am making is with a lack of downstream SNPs, theres no certainty it only arrived with Slavs. I think people are being a little closed minded here. Ignoring numerous scenarios with the movements of tribes and peoples throughout central and eastern europe. To say L1029 was only brought to the Balkans by Slavic speakers is to adopt a level of certainty absent any scientific fact. Is all J2b Albanian? Is all E-V13 Albanian? No, of course not.

    It is a well known fact East Germanic tribes, and even Dacians occupied eastern Europe and even spread up to the Balts. Whether it was originally Balto-Slavic is besides the point. There is no certainty the early ancestor to carry it was a Slavic speaker. Assuming any and all L1029 only came in the great migration with Slavs is a little ignorant.

    I don't share any downstream SNPs associated with the time frame of the migration period. Many people seem to ignore insurmountable factors that are at play, for an easy clean cut explanation.

    Theres as much certainty my line came with a East Germanic tribe as there is with it coming with a Slavic tribe. The science is still to early to make concrete conclusions. Using modern socio-cultural constructs and borders, to define the lineages and their sporadic movements of the past, is part of the problem.
    Last edited by Dibran; 01-07-2018 at 04:25 PM.

  6. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Dibran For This Useful Post:

     Brent.B (01-07-2018),  lgmayka (01-07-2018)

  7. #14
    Banned
    Posts
    1,412
    Sex
    Location
    United States
    Ethnicity
    Albanian
    Nationality
    American
    Y-DNA (P)
    R1a-L1029>Y133383
    mtDNA (M)
    H11a2*-146+
    Y-DNA (M)
    J2b-L283>PH1751
    mtDNA (P)
    T1a1I

    Albania Kosovo Macedonia United States of America Sweden Greece
    Quote Originally Posted by lgmayka View Post
    To be fair, Michał has often claimed that:

    - We should add 10-20% to YFull TMRCAs. This would give L1029 a TMRCA of 2200-2400 years.

    - A clade incubates (comes to prominence within a clan/tribe) over a long interval (500-1000 years). We could hypothesize that Dibran's lineage is actually a clade, as yet unidentified by YFull due to undersampling of his region. One could then further hypothesize that this clade rose to promiinence within a particular clan, which then traveled south as part of the Slavic expansion.

    But as Dibran points out, many hypotheses are possible.
    Exactly. I don't deny any possible scenario at play. It could have arrived with Slavs, but lack of those downstream mutations representative of those migrations brings that into question. Which is why I considered Slavic still, if it were early Antes roman mercenaries or early farmers in Greece before the major migration waves. Not only did the Normans, but also the Germans settled in my area. And whilst L1029 is not typical for Normans, they could have abosrbed it, as I have read plenty about some Slavs assimilating into their tribes in Scandinavia. By the time the Normans arrived they could have brought it on their campaign through Albania.

    I just don't like how people act certain when there's still very little we really know. Majority of the stuff I hear about haplogroups has never actually been confirmed by any real science. If my earliest ancestor participated in the same movement patterns, it should be evident. Maybe he was an early Slav that offered his skills to the Romans or Byzantines? Or maybe a Goth or Bastarnae whose ancestor was assimilated by those tribes at some early point. Just a look of the Y-DNA distribution of Arberesh in south Italy and modern Albanians is enough to see how Y-DNA radically changed in only 500 years. Multiply that by 4, and consider all the possibilities at play. Be they political, war, famine, migration(be it individually or collectively).
    Last edited by Dibran; 01-07-2018 at 04:20 PM.

  8. The Following User Says Thank You to Dibran For This Useful Post:

     lgmayka (01-07-2018)

  9. #15
    Registered Users
    Posts
    790
    Ethnicity
    Venetharum natio populosa
    Nationality
    Polish
    Y-DNA (P)
    R-L1029>YP263>Y2912*
    mtDNA (M)
    H, U5a1b1(wife)


  10. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Waldemar For This Useful Post:

     Brent.B (01-07-2018),  Dibran (01-07-2018),  lgmayka (01-07-2018)

  11. #16
    Banned
    Posts
    1,412
    Sex
    Location
    United States
    Ethnicity
    Albanian
    Nationality
    American
    Y-DNA (P)
    R1a-L1029>Y133383
    mtDNA (M)
    H11a2*-146+
    Y-DNA (M)
    J2b-L283>PH1751
    mtDNA (P)
    T1a1I

    Albania Kosovo Macedonia United States of America Sweden Greece
    I wonder if the 2 German samples and Norway sample and the unknown are the same ones from Yfull.

  12. #17
    Registered Users
    Posts
    790
    Ethnicity
    Venetharum natio populosa
    Nationality
    Polish
    Y-DNA (P)
    R-L1029>YP263>Y2912*
    mtDNA (M)
    H, U5a1b1(wife)

    Quote Originally Posted by Dibran View Post
    I wonder if the 2 German samples and Norway sample and the unknown are the same ones from Yfull.
    Yup.


    2 samples from Mecklenburg-Vorpommern (Germany), 1 from Akershus (Norway), 1 from Poland (not analysed by YFull) and 1 of unknown origin.
    Last edited by Waldemar; 01-07-2018 at 04:48 PM.

  13. The Following User Says Thank You to Waldemar For This Useful Post:

     Dibran (01-07-2018)

  14. #18
    Banned
    Posts
    1,412
    Sex
    Location
    United States
    Ethnicity
    Albanian
    Nationality
    American
    Y-DNA (P)
    R1a-L1029>Y133383
    mtDNA (M)
    H11a2*-146+
    Y-DNA (M)
    J2b-L283>PH1751
    mtDNA (P)
    T1a1I

    Albania Kosovo Macedonia United States of America Sweden Greece
    Quote Originally Posted by Waldemar View Post
    Yup.


    2 samples from Mecklenburg-Vorpommern (Germany), 1 from Akershus (Norway), 1 from Poland (not analysed by YFull) and 1 of unknown origin.
    Cool. I should have my BAM file Monday.

  15. #19
    Banned
    Posts
    1,412
    Sex
    Location
    United States
    Ethnicity
    Albanian
    Nationality
    American
    Y-DNA (P)
    R1a-L1029>Y133383
    mtDNA (M)
    H11a2*-146+
    Y-DNA (M)
    J2b-L283>PH1751
    mtDNA (P)
    T1a1I

    Albania Kosovo Macedonia United States of America Sweden Greece
    Quote Originally Posted by lgmayka View Post
    To be fair, Michał has often claimed that:

    - We should add 10-20% to YFull TMRCAs. This would give L1029 a TMRCA of 2200-2400 years.

    - A clade incubates (comes to prominence within a clan/tribe) over a long interval (500-1000 years). We could hypothesize that Dibran's lineage is actually a clade, as yet unidentified by YFull due to undersampling of his region. One could then further hypothesize that this clade rose to promiinence within a particular clan, which then traveled south as part of the Slavic expansion.

    But as Dibran points out, many hypotheses are possible.
    One thing I completely didn't think to mention. The Varangian Guard. They were hired from Scandinavia(assimilated Balto-Slav), up to the Balts and conscripts of Kievan Rus. It eventually became a profession moreso than a Viking only association. They eventually had Varangians from Huscarls, and Englishman(who also have L1029). Theres any number of scenarios. Our family's history has mostly been between Albania Greece and Macedonia. We also come from a very isolated district of an already somewhat isolated region of Albania.

    I feel like that scenario would make sense. You would expect to find lets say L1029* in north east Europe(considering no participation in the migration). Then take the political landscape of the time. Its not a mystery. Varangians had Slavs and Balts in their ranks as well. Its just as likely a possibility.
    Last edited by Dibran; 01-07-2018 at 06:59 PM.

  16. #20
    Banned
    Posts
    1,412
    Sex
    Location
    United States
    Ethnicity
    Albanian
    Nationality
    American
    Y-DNA (P)
    R1a-L1029>Y133383
    mtDNA (M)
    H11a2*-146+
    Y-DNA (M)
    J2b-L283>PH1751
    mtDNA (P)
    T1a1I

    Albania Kosovo Macedonia United States of America Sweden Greece
    Quote Originally Posted by Waldemar View Post
    .............
    Quote Originally Posted by lgmayka View Post
    ...........
    Finally got my BAM file. Uploading to my Google Drive now. Shortly will be uploading to Yfull. Now we wait.
    Last edited by Dibran; 01-08-2018 at 02:54 AM.

Page 2 of 9 FirstFirst 1234 ... LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. R1a>M458>L1029
    By Varang in forum R1a-Z283
    Replies: 25
    Last Post: 05-17-2020, 08:07 AM
  2. Chinese L1029
    By Brent.B in forum R1a General
    Replies: 29
    Last Post: 08-01-2019, 03:05 PM
  3. Replies: 15
    Last Post: 06-24-2019, 05:43 PM
  4. L1029 in Britain?
    By Brent.B in forum R1a General
    Replies: 42
    Last Post: 10-17-2016, 08:01 AM
  5. Two more individual SNP tests for R1a-L1029
    By lgmayka in forum R1a-Z283
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 07-08-2014, 09:46 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •