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Thread: New study Iraqi Ethnic Groups - Y DNA

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    New study Iraqi Ethnic Groups - Y DNA

    Finally a long needed DNA study of the various ethnic groups of Iraq using 500 samples. Too bad it was restricted to Y-DNA STRs and not a genomewide study. Here is an excerpt from http://journals.plos.org/plosone/art...l.pone.0187408

    A glimpse at the intricate mosaic of ethnicities from Mesopotamia: Paternal lineages of the Northern Iraqi Arabs, Kurds, Syriacs, Turkmens and Yazidis
    Introduction

    Often considered as one of the cradles of human civilization, Mesopotamia encompasses the ancient fertile lands defined by the Tigris and Euphrates river systems. Today, these lands are largely situated in Iraq, which shares borders with Jordan to the west, Syria to the north-west, Turkey to the north, Kuwait and Saudi Arabia to the south and Iran to the east (Fig 1). Iraq has a population of ~40 million, comprising mainly of Arabs and Kurds, but also the Assyrians, Turkmens, Shabakis, Yazidis, Armenians, Mandeans, Circassians, and Kawliya minorities. Accordingly, population genetics of Iraqis is of interest not only because of this ethnic diversity, but also due to the fact that the country was home to the Sumerian, Akkadian, Assyrian and Babylonian civilizations, and ruled by the Persians, Greeks, Arabs, Mongolians, Ottomans and British [1, 2].
    The birthplaces of the 500 samples are as follows:

    [IMG][/IMG]



    Not surprisingly, Kurds (n = 104) were the ethnic group that had the highest frequency of R1a and J2 which is consistent with previous studies on the Kurds of Iran and Turkey.

    [IMG][/IMG]



    What they also did was calculate genetic distance based on the Y-DNA STRs. A couple of things to keep in mind with this:

    1- Y-DNA STRs reveal ancient relationships between those population because unlike STRs in the autosome they don't change from father to son. Thus they reflect old relationships going back to the TMRCA for the haplogroups they used, which are pretty deep into the phylogentic tree;

    2- Females don't enter the equation here since we are talking patrilineal ancestors only

    After removing a couple of non-informative groups, this is the sorted list of genetic distance to Kurds with the closest on top, based on their TABLE 3:

    [IMG][/IMG]
    Last edited by Kurd; 01-26-2018 at 01:49 PM. Reason: color coded table

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    Very interesting

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurd View Post
    Finally a long needed DNA study of the various ethnic groups of Iraq using 500 samples. Too bad it was restricted to Y-DNA STRs and not a genomewide study. Here is an excerpt from http://journals.plos.org/plosone/art...l.pone.0187408


    The birthplaces of the 500 samples are as follows:


    Not surprisingly, Kurds (n = 104) were the ethnic group that had the highest frequency of R1a and J2 which is consistent with previous studies on the Kurds of Iran and Turkey.


    What they also did was calculate genetic distance based on the Y-DNA STRs. A couple of things to keep in mind with this:

    1- Y-DNA STRs reveal ancient relationships between those population because unlike STRs in the autosome they don't change from father to son. Thus they reflect old relationships going back to the TMRCA for the haplogroups they used, which are pretty deep into the phylogentic tree;

    2- Females don't enter the equation here since we are talking patrilineal ancestors only

    After removing a couple of non-informative groups, this is the sorted list of genetic distance to Kurds with the closest on top, based on their TABLE 3:
    Yezidis (here 'Yazidis') are also Kurds. Their native language is Kurmanji, Northern Kurdish dialect. Yezidis have kept the original Kurdish/Median religion close to Mithraism and don't mix with outsiders. You are Yezidi only when both of your parents are born Yezidi.
    Last edited by ms85; 05-10-2018 at 02:32 PM.

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    Any idea about the Yazidi L subclades?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mori yek View Post
    Ezidi religion was either reformed or found after Islam's spread like Bahai faith in Iran. They speak very close dialects to kurmanji spoken by muslim kurds in Mardin and Qamishlo. It would not surprise me, if muslim kurds from these regions also have high r1b frequencies.

    We don't have any sources whether if kurds were zoroastrian or mithraist but most likely kurds were zoroastrian.
    Yezidism was never found after Islam because Ezdi Kurds never believed in 'Allah' and his prophet called Mohammed and never accepted him. So Ezdi Kurds were never Muslims at the first place, sicne they never believed in Allah or Mohammed.


    Yezidi call their God 'Xode' or 'Xode Shems'. They believe in 7 Sumerian angels. Tause Melek is the supreme angel of the 7 angels. But Ezdi Kurds honour all the 7 angels.


    The ancient Medes were Mitraists and since Kurds are from the ancient Medes, native religion of Kurds is Mitra. Ezdi Kurds are the 'Sun' worshippers. 'Xode Shems' means in Kurdish 'Sun God'. Xode = God and Shamash/Utu was the Sumerians Sun God. Mithra was a 'Sun God' of Mitanni and the Medes etc.


    Ezdi Kurds are one of the 'purest' Kurds. R1b can be connected to PIEans and therefore to proto-west Iranians (Aryans) like Mitanni/Medes.
    Last edited by ms85; 05-12-2018 at 08:33 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mori yek View Post
    I never heard any kurd using Shams for sun, but in arabic it means sun. They have a prophet/reformer who has a arabic name. (shx ad) and he was born after islam's spread.

    Ezdi Kurds call their God, ‘Xode Shems’. This is a fact! Just ask any Ezdi you meet.

    And Shamas is an ancient Mesopotamian name for the Sun God.

    "Shamash, (Akkadian), Sumerian Utu, in Mesopotamian religion, the god of the sun, who, with the moon god, Sin (Sumerian: Nanna), and Ishtar (Sumerian: Inanna), the goddess of Venus, was part of an astral triad of divinities. Shamash was the son of Sin"

    https://www.britannica.com/topic/Shamash

    The origin of Shex Adi is disputed. Ezdi Kurds are divided by 3 classes: Shexs, Pirs and Mrids. Those 3 classes don't marry each other. But we have got DNA of all those 3 classes and they are similar to each other. People from all these 3 classes are the same by DNA. They are full of CHG/Iranian neolithic farmer DNA like most West Iranian do. Actually Ezdi Kurds have more CHG/Iranian neolithic farmer DNA than most of the other Kurds. This can be seen as an indication that Ezdi Kurds are less mixed than other Kurds.

    Yezidi Kurds predate Islam by thousands of years, because Yezidi Kurds still have their original religion and NEVER believed in Allah and never accepted his prophet Mohammed. The NEVER believe in Mohammed, so they are older.


    This Ezdi guy is mentioning Shems in Kurmnaji:





    Sun as most important symbol:





    Sun at the entrance of Lalish:

    Last edited by ms85; 05-12-2018 at 09:04 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mori yek View Post
    I know they are calling their "xod shems". I meant that the word shams isn't of kurdish origin and the shams is not used by any kurds its arabic word. even yezidis dont call the sun "shams".

    SHAMS (شمس) in arabic means SUN. And the word SHAMS it is not present in ANY kurdish or iranian language and I doubt if it is present in historical languages like parthian, middle persian or old persian.
    Shamas is an ancient word and predate the Arabs.

    Shamas was the ancient Mesopotamian Sun God. Shamas is much, much, much older than Arabs.


    Maybe Arabs took this word from the Akkadians?


    About Mithra in Kurdistan:










    Mitanni ROYAL seal







    Ezdixan Ezdi seal from Lalish holiest temple:




    Last edited by ms85; 05-12-2018 at 09:27 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mori yek View Post
    "Shx, Pirs and Murids" these are common words used by muslims. Shkh (شيخ ) (old) and murid (المريد) (disciple) are words of arabic origin. Pr (meaning old) is used also by anatolian and iranian sufis, alevis and so on. It means old in persian just like the kurdish word pr (old).
    I don't know. But Ezdi Kurds are MORE Kurds than other Kurds. Ezdi Kurds are the 'purest' Kurds. DNA of Ezdi Kurds is more pure than DNA of Muslim Kurds. Muslim Kurds accepted the GOD of the Arabs, while Ezdi Kurds still have their own Iranic Sun God after thousands of years being loyal to the Sun God.


    It has been said that Kurds are children of the sun and fire.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mori yek View Post
    the resembleance of mitanni and yezidi seals are interesting however.
    In a treaty between the Hittites and the Mitanni (between Suppiluliuma and Shattiwaza, c. 1380 BC) Mitra (SUN God) was mentioned as a deity.


    The Medes believed also in Mithra. "The Medes had an ancient Iranian religion (a form of pre-Zoroastrian Mazdaism or Mithra worshipping) with a priesthood named as "Magi"."

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medes


    Sumerian Sun God, Mitanni/Medes Sun God and Ezdi Sun God are all the same. That's why it has been said that the Yezism is an ancient North Mesopotamian religion.



    "Before ancient religious reformer Zarathustra (Greek name Zoroaster) gained influence in the region during the 6th century bce, the Iranians had a polytheistic religion, and Mithra was the most important of their gods."

    https://www.britannica.com/topic/Mithraism
    Last edited by ms85; 05-12-2018 at 09:44 PM.

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    it can be in aramaic. arabic evolved from aramaic. and this building was in possession of aramaics before shex adi gave it back to ezdi kurds.
    Last edited by ms85; 05-13-2018 at 01:01 AM.

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