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Thread: Me vs. Some South Asian People

  1. #1
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    Me vs. Some South Asian People

    Hey all,

    I hesitated to ask this, but I want to get this off my chest mainly because I'm hoping others could relate.

    So, I've had some discussion over the past year with family and other people about some of my results. I showed them my GedMatch results or talked about the little info I have about ANI and ASI for South Asians.

    Perhaps I'm doing it the wrong way or perhaps I shouldn't discuss it ever at all. But, it seems as though the South Asians I talk to will listen to what I have to say at first and then later it's like they're a whole new person. The discussion is exciting at first but then they almost attack me saying things like I'm, "trying to be white."

    I don't even know what to say to that.

  2. #2
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    What do you mean by "trying to be white?" By discussing the West Eurasian (ANI like) versus "indigenous" ASI like related components among South Asians? The Steppe NE Euro admixture? You're not giving enough detail. Also, for people who are for a better lack of a term, "ignorant" about South Asian genetics, a lot of the stuff we discuss might come across as offensive or "trying to be this or that" to the average person. I don't got into detailed discussions regarding admixture calculators or ancient DNA with my friends or family. Only people on this forum whom I know in person or on social media.
    Last edited by Sapporo; 03-13-2018 at 06:41 PM.

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  4. #3
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    Sapporo yes all of the above! And the stuff I've learned on this forum from people like khana, parsar, etc.

    I recently found out about my great grandma being persian from a cousin I hadnt talked to for over 20+ years and so we started talking about my results. He didn't say anything negative, but conversations like the one I had with my cousin come up quite a bit between friends and family.

    My assumption is that this information should be spread to those "ignorant" about South Asian genetics so it excites me to talk about what I've learned, but in return for sharing the knowledge I feel rather than others show same excitement it's like they've been offended by something or attack me personally.

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    I understand what the OP of this thread is talking about, I had to explain to one of my cousins why claiming Central Asian ancestry among Pakistanis and North Indians is not such a big deal since many (if not most) of us have some Bronze Age Central Asian DNA from the Andronovo culture.

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    Thank you for sharing your experience. I feel that this was important for me. I did feel like maybe I was going about it the wrong way but your reply makes me think maybe it's not what I'm doing wrong.

    I too talk similarly as you about what you mentioned your reply.

    So how do you usually handle this type of negative comment?

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    There's a lot of pseudo science in the air about genetics and race etc. I was discussing my genographic results with my grandmother's brother (a professor and internationally renown in his field). I casually mentioned my autosomal percentages, and my own interpretation (gathered from input on this forum) regarding ANI ASI Neolithic bronze age Indo European etc... before going further, I feel it is important to mention some physical background here.
    My grandmother's father was a West Bengal Brahmin, long headed sharp featured fair complexions broad shouldered and was over 6 feet tall. My grandmother's mother is also a Bengali Brahmin but with roots in eastern Bangladesh, and she was very dark skinned, button nosed and round faced and very very short. As expected in recombination of varied phenotypes, my grandmother got her father's side's light complexion and sharp features but was still very short like her mom's side, while her brother got nothing from his dad and is an exact replica of the males on his mom's side.
    So after I tell him my percentages, he legitimately ponders and says, "hmm I wonder how much your grandmother must be... If you are 74% Caucasian then she must be 90%. I'm probably like 40%."
    I was like wtf yo. It is one thing trying to guess from my results as to what my grandmother would be. But why would my grandmother and him have any difference? I figured he probably thought this was some kind of colonial craniometry crap lol. After that I stopped telling anyone anything about genetics because there is a learning curve. Matter of fact, there is an unlearning curve first, then the learning curve.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TJRocks760 View Post
    Thank you for sharing your experience. I feel that this was important for me. I did feel like maybe I was going about it the wrong way but your reply makes me think maybe it's not what I'm doing wrong.

    I too talk similarly as you about what you mentioned your reply.

    So how do you usually handle this type of negative comment?
    Well in my case, it is usually because of identity. The majority of opposition to my DNA results comes from my Pakistani side, my Indian side do not really have much trouble accepting the results since we have always said that we are descended from converts. We also celebrate the main Hindu festivals like Dussehra, Diwali and Holi as well as both Eids so I have grown up embracing both parts of my cultural heritage (both Hinduism and Islam).

    The only Indians who was sceptical of my results was a friend influenced by the writings of Periyar (who famously didn't believe in the Aryan Invasion Theory) and another one whose views was more in line with Hindu nationalist thought.

    Are you of Indian or Pakistani descent by the way?.

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  12. #8
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    I'm Pakistani descent. I love the Hindu festivals so I celebrate with my Indian friends and then Eid etc with my family. I don't identify as either religiously though.

    My biological anthropology professor believed in the out of india theory and he was Australian born. Regardless, that class really got me interested in the evolution of human species and the migration pathways of humans Out of Africa. Ever since watching Bill Nye the eyes of nye episode on race I had been wanting to do my own test. But that class got me interested and Spencer Wells documentary Journey of Man was a recommended documentary for me in class. In it he travels to India to do dna testing and that sort of opened my eyes as well. My professor seemed pretty level headed he taught out of africa theory quite well so I was pretty surprised when a student asked his views and he didn't accept himself what he was teaching in class. To me he was a good educator even though likely wrong.






    This is fascinating for me but if I have to be attacked by people who I know including family and friends I don't want to be apart of it.

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    I don't even know where to start on all the bogus crap I see coming from South Asians regarding genetics and ethnicity.
    You have people claiming Pakistanis and North Indians are the exact same. You have people claiming there are "Aryans" and "Dravidians" in India which are supposedly two distinct races. Some people claiming that north Indians are heavily mixed with recent invaders like Greeks and Moghuls.

    Then there are people claiming all kinds of foreign ancestry which rarely, if ever, turns out to be real. And of course every other Indian on the internet insisting that they don't "look Indian" and that they look "Persian, Greek, or Italian" when they just look like the guy from Harold and Kumar.

    Am I alone in feeling like our community is a lost cause when it comes to education?

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  16. #10
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    Honestly, it's the "you're trying to be white," mentality that might be stopping South Asians from getting that education. I was talking to a Paki girl the other day who wishes she was arab or persian rather than Paki. But, the question is where's this coming from? I've talked to others who refuse to strictly identify as Paki but instead claim Italian heritage when clearly that's not the case.

    On a side note, my lithuanian friend just found out that he has Italian heritage. Our other Italian friend said he can accept him into the Italian community. So, as a joke I claimed 0.03% Italian so they can claim me as one of theirs.

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