Page 19 of 85 FirstFirst ... 917181920212969 ... LastLast
Results 181 to 190 of 848

Thread: Central and South Asian DNA Paper

  1. #181
    Registered Users
    Posts
    3,767
    Sex
    Location
    USA
    Ethnicity
    Italo-Iberian
    Nationality
    American
    Y-DNA (P)
    R1b-U152+L2+FGC10543
    mtDNA (M)
    H4a1-T152C!

    United States of America Italy 1861-1946 Spain
    Quote Originally Posted by jeanL View Post
    The only reason I bring up Iran is because the SNP calls have been released and they support the haplogroup assignment.
    @jeanL, I have seen a couple posted by you and Chris, but I am mobile the past two days and haven't been able to find them. Can you provide a link? Tks.
    Paternal: R1b-U152 >> L2 >> FGC10543 >> PR5365, Pietro Rocca, b. 1559, Agira, Sicily, Italy
    Maternal: H4a1-T152C!, Maria Coto, b. ~1864, Galicia, Spain
    Mother's Paternal: J1+ FGC4745/FGC4766+ PF5019+, Gerardo Caprio, b. 1879, Caposele, Avellino, Campania, Italy
    Father's Maternal: T2b-C150T, Francisca Santa Cruz, b.1916, Garganchon, Burgos, Spain
    Paternal Great (x3) Grandfather: R1b-U106 >> L48 >> CTS2509, Filippo Ensabella, b.~1836, Agira, Sicily, Italy

  2. #182
    Gold Class Member
    Posts
    7,786

    I6891 500-300 BCE Saidu Sharif, Swat Valley Pakistan 34.75 72.35 M R5a2 R1a1a1b

    I7725 1200-800 BCE Khyber-Pakhtunkwa, Swat M M65a1 E1b1b1b2
    I1799 1200-800 BCE Khyber-Pakhtunkwa, Swat M T2a1b E1b1b1b2
    I8195 1200-800 BCE Khyber-Pakhtunkwa, Swat M U8b1a2b E1b1b1b2
    I8194 1100-900 BCE Khyber-Pakhtunkwa, Swat M R30a1b H1a1a
    I3261 1200-800 BCE Swat District , Khyber-Pakhtunkwa M .. DE
    I1992 1195-978 calBCE Swat District , Khyber-Pakhtunkwa M H2a2 E1a
    I6899 1044-830 cal BCE Swat District , Khyber-Pakhtunkwa M .. E1b1b1b2
    I6900 1400-1126 cal BCE Swat District , Khyber-Pakhtunkwa M .. E1b1b1b2
    I1985 1192-939 calBCE Swat District , Khyber-Pakhtunkwa M E1b1b1b2a
    I3262 976-832 calBCE Swat District , Khyber-Pakhtunkwa M H14a E1b1b1b2a
    I6197 1200-800 BCE Swat District , Khyber-Pakhtunkwa Province M M65a A0-T
    I6194 1376-1041 cal BCE Swat District , Khyber-Pakhtunkwa M U8b1a CT
    I1799 1044-922 calBCE Swat District , Khyber-Pakhtunkwa M T2a1b E1b1b1b2

    I8246 970-550 BCE Aligrama Pakistan 34.767667 72.344693 M .. G2a2a
    I8245 970-550 BCE Aligrama Pakistan M .. R2a3a2b2b1
    I6548 1000-800 BCE Barikot Pakistan 30.4 72.12 M H20a H1a1

    I6549 167-46 calBCE Butkara Pakistan M M30b J1
    I6550 41 calBCE - 57 calCE Butkara Pakistan M U2a J1

    I5396 904-817 calBCE Katelai Pakistan M U4d J2a1
    I5399 1000-800 BCE Katelai Pakistan M J1d R2a3a

    I10001 1300-1000 BCE Pakistan M R30b1 L1a
    I10974 900-800 BCE Loebanr 1 Pakistan M .. L1a
    I8998 1000-800 BCE Loebanr 1 Pakistan M W3a1b R1b1a1a2a1a1c2b2b1a2
    I8997 900-800 BCE M W3a1b R2a
    I6553 971-834 calBCE Loebanr 1 Pakistan M U2e1'2'3 C1b1a1a1
    I6555 906-820 calBCE Loebanr 1 Pakistan M M4 L1a
    I5400 927-831 calBCE Loebanr 1 Pakistan M M5a Q1b2
    I6554 831-796 calBCE Loebanr 1 Pakistan M T2g1 L1a

  3. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to parasar For This Useful Post:

     bmoney (04-02-2018),  Hando (04-03-2018),  palamede (04-02-2018)

  4. #183
    Gold Class Member
    Posts
    7,786

    "We call this group Indus Periphery because they were found at sites in cultural contact with the Indus Valley Civilization (IVC) and along its northern fringe, and also because they were genetically similar to post-IVC groups in the Swat Valley of Pakistan. By co-analyzing ancient DNA and genomic data from diverse present-day South Asians, we show that Indus Periphery related people are the single most important source of ancestry in South Asia—consistent with the idea that the Indus Periphery individuals are providing us with the first direct look at the ancestry of peoples of the IVC ... 41 ancient individuals from northern Pakistan ... northern Indus Valley (1200-800 BCE). These individuals had between 14-42% of their ancestry related to the AASI and the rest related to early Iranian agriculturalists and West_Siberian_HG. Like contemporary and earlier samples from Iran/Turan we find no evidence of Steppe-pastoralist-related ancestry in these samples ... we find that these individuals also had negligible Anatolian agriculturalist-related admixture ..."

  5. The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to parasar For This Useful Post:

     Awale (04-01-2018),  bmoney (04-02-2018),  Hando (04-03-2018),  kingjohn (04-02-2018),  Michał (04-02-2018),  redifflal (04-02-2018)

  6. #184
    Registered Users
    Posts
    3,254
    Sex
    Location
    French Flanders
    Ethnicity
    Northwestern European
    Y-DNA (P)
    R1b L21>DF13
    mtDNA (M)
    K1a29a

    France Belgium Flanders Wallonia Occitania France Bretagne
    Quote Originally Posted by Coldmountains View Post
    Yamnaya was probably late PIE and of course crucial for the dispersal of many India-European languages, but Corded Ware, Afanasievo and maybe even Bell Beakers are derived from earlier steppe cultures which were very similar to later Yamnaya. Not sure about Bell Beakers but Corded Ware seems to be derived from Sredny Stog. Indo-Iranian and Balto-Slavic R1a-M417 did not exist in Yamnaya or was irrelevant there. Indo-Iranians seem to be derived from Andronovo/Sintashta>Abashevo>Fatyanovo-Balanavo>Middle Dnjepr>Early Corded Ware>Sredny Stog. But Andronvo/Sintashta people absorbed earlier Poltavka/Yamnaya/Afanasievo people so that they became genetically closer to Yamanya and less EEF-shifted and more Steppe EMBA-like
    No. The first branching is Yamanaya Bulgaria, and it's the best candidate for the Anatolian branch. All other branching are posterior (CWC or BBs) and seem derived from Yamanya themselves (or from an Early Yamaya if you like).

    Difference in Y haplogrpoups are irrelevent, given that we already know that Steppe was more diverse than what we get from samples.

    By the way, Khvalynsk and Sredny Stog disappeared hundred of years before the Steppe expansion, and became part of a single PIE horizon. There is no reason to refer to them around 3000 BC, when the expansion took place.

  7. The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to ffoucart For This Useful Post:

     Agamemnon (04-02-2018),  Awale (04-02-2018),  Hando (04-03-2018),  Nibelung (04-01-2018),  pegasus (04-02-2018),  vettor (04-02-2018)

  8. #185
    Registered Users
    Posts
    3,254
    Sex
    Location
    French Flanders
    Ethnicity
    Northwestern European
    Y-DNA (P)
    R1b L21>DF13
    mtDNA (M)
    K1a29a

    France Belgium Flanders Wallonia Occitania France Bretagne
    Quote Originally Posted by ernekar View Post
    Yamnaya did play an important part in the dispersal of later IE languages. But to keep calling them 'PIE' is just senseless.

    It can't still be PIE, when the anatolian branch had already branched off 2-3000 years earlier than yamnaya.

    Caucasian PIE diverged into anatolian IE and steppe IE. Neither steppe IE or anatolian IE are 'PIE'. Their common linguistic ancestor living south of caucasus, on the other hand, can confidently be called PIE.
    The anatolian branch is attested only after 2000BC, and is confidently estimated to have branched of in the IVth millenium BC. So at the beginning og the Yamanya horizon (probably at the time when we found the first Yamnaya in Bulgaria and Thrace).

    It's extremely unlikely that PIE was South of the Caucasus in any case. Remember that the first attested cultures there weren't IE, and that Yamnaya and all derived population don't have South Caucasus admixture (even if some ara saying otherwise but are confusing CHG and Iran_N).

  9. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to ffoucart For This Useful Post:

     Agamemnon (04-02-2018),  Hando (04-03-2018)

  10. #186
    Registered Users
    Posts
    1,578
    Sex
    Location
    Calgary
    Ethnicity
    Anglo
    Nationality
    Canadian
    Y-DNA (P)
    I2-S2361 < L801
    mtDNA (M)
    H2a2b(1)
    mtDNA (P)
    H3

    Canada
    Many of the samples have very poor coverage and I wouldn't really trust the haplogroup assignments.

    The Indus Periphery men (both from Shahr-i-Sokhta) had J2a and J2a1h; the other 2 men from this site also had J2a1.

    The decent coverage BMAC samples (4 sites) are 1 E1b1b1, 1 G2a2a, 1 J1, 4 J2a(1), 2 L1a, 1 Q1b2, 1 R1b1*, 2 R2a, and 1 T. 2 of the sites have unique haplogroups, J2a(1) and L1a are found at both of the other 2 sites. One of these samples was an outlier with some Steppe_MLBA ancestry - he had the Q1b2.

    Of decent coverage samples, at the 7 Swat Valley Iron Age-Early Historic sites:
    - 4 R2a(3a2b) total, at 4 sites
    - 6 L1a total at 3 sites - 1 site with 50% L1a (4/8)
    - 2 H1a1(a) total, at 2 sites
    - 2 Q1b2 total, at 2 sites
    - At the Early Historic site of Butkara 2/2 J1
    - At the Iron Age site Udegram 90% (8/9) E1b1b1b2-Z830 (including a pair of relatives), some or all of it E1b1b1b2a-M123.
    - 1 each of J2a1, G2a2a, C1b1a1a1, R1a-Z645, R1b-U106 (?) [prob R2* really].

    There are 4 additional very low coverage samples from Udegam: A0-T and CT could be anything, DE and E1a (if an error) may be more E-Z830. There is also a very low coverage A from Saidu Sharif, conceivably T as it may be at Gonur Tepe? [The supposed A is too low coverage to classify, no reason to be T.]

    Overall the Swat Valley and BMAC Y DNA pools seem quite similar at low resolution. There is H1a1, R1a, and C1 only in Pakistan and T only in BMAC, probably an insignificant difference considering the small sample sizes.

    There is strikingly little sharing with the steppe to the north; 1 R1a, possibly the 2 R1b. There is 1 J2a1h2-L25 in Steppe_MLBA, in the Turan-admixed subgroup from southeast Kazakhstan.

    Some other interesting samples: an L2-L595 from Tepe Hissar in northeastern Iran, if called correctly (coverage is okay); a T1a-M70 at the same site; West Eurasian/Indian Q1a2b2-L933 in another of the Turan-admixed Kazakh Steppe_MLBA; Ket/Altaian Q1a2a1c-L330 in one of the East Asian-admixed (?) Sintashta outliers; a C2b in Andronovo of far eastern Kazakhstan (genetically Okunevo). Of course in the unlikely event that the A, E1a, and E1b1a1a1 turn out to be real they would be very interesting.
    Last edited by Megalophias; 04-02-2018 at 09:54 PM. Reason: minor clarification

  11. The Following 16 Users Say Thank You to Megalophias For This Useful Post:

     Agamemnon (04-02-2018),  Awale (04-02-2018),  bmoney (04-02-2018),  Coldmountains (04-02-2018),  Hando (04-03-2018),  kingjohn (04-02-2018),  Lank (04-02-2018),  MfA (04-02-2018),  Michał (04-02-2018),  Observer (04-02-2018),  palamede (04-02-2018),  parasar (04-02-2018),  redifflal (04-02-2018),  Ryukendo (04-04-2018),  Skerdilaidas (04-02-2018),  xKeleix (04-02-2018)

  12. #187
    Gold Class Member
    Posts
    7,786

    Quote Originally Posted by Megalophias View Post
    Many of the samples have very poor coverage and I wouldn't trust the haplogroup assignments at all.

    Of decent coverage samples, at the 7 Swat Valley Iron Age-Early Historic sites:
    - 4 R2a(3a2b) total, at 4 sites
    - 6 L1a total at 3 sites - 1 site with 50% L1a (4/8)
    - 2 H1a1(a) total, at 2 sites
    - 2 Q1b2 total, at 2 sites
    - At the Early Historic site of Butkara 2/2 J1
    - At the Iron Age site Udegram 8/9 E1b1b1b2-Z830 (including a pair of relatives), some or all of it E1b1b1b2a-M123.
    - 1 each of J2a1, G2a2a, C1b1a1a1, R1a-Z93, R1b-U106 (?).

    There are 4 additional very low coverage samples from Udegam: A0-T and CT could be anything, DE and E1a (if an error) may be more E-Z830. There is also a very low coverage A from Saidu Sharif, conceivably T as it may be at Gonur Tepe?

    The decent coverage BMAC samples (4 sites) are 1 E1b1b1, 1 G2a2a, 1 J1, 4 J2a(1), 2 L1a, 1 Q1b2, 1 R1b1, 2 R2a, and 1 T. 2 of the sites have unique haplogroups, J2a(1) and L1a are found at both of the other 2 sites. One of these samples was an outlier with some Steppe_MLBA ancestry - he had the Q1b2.

    Overall the Swat Valley and BMAC Y DNA pools seem quite similar at low resolution. There is H1a1, R1a, and C1 only in Pakistan and T only in BMAC, probably an insignificant difference considering the small sample sizes.

    There is strikingly little sharing with the steppe to the north; 1 R1a, possibly the 2 R1b. There is 1 J2a1h2-L25 in Steppe_MLBA, in the Turan-admixed subgroup from southeast Kazakhstan.

    The Indus Periphery men (both from Shahr-i-Sokhta) had J2a and J2a1h; the other 2 men from this site also had J2a1.

    Some other interesting samples: an L2-L595 from Tepe Hissar in northeastern Iran, if called correctly (coverage is okay); a T1a-M70 at the same site; West Eurasian/Indian Q1a2b2-L933 in another of the Turan-admixed Kazakh Steppe_MLBA; Ket/Altaian Q1a2a1c-L330 in one of the East Asian-admixed (?) Sintashta outliers; a C2b in Andronovo of far eastern Kazakhstan (genetically Okunevo). Of course in the unlikely event that the A, E1a, and E1b1a1a1 turn out to be real they would be very interesting.
    That one R1a is circa 400 BC when steppe influence is seen. The 41 samples from 1200-800 BC have no R1a and 0 steppe influence. Essentially the 1500 BC R1a=Aryan incursion theory via NW passes is dead.

  13. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to parasar For This Useful Post:

     Hando (04-03-2018),  MMerlin (04-02-2018),  poi (04-02-2018),  redifflal (04-02-2018)

  14. #188
    Registered Users
    Posts
    779
    Sex
    Location
    Gonur Tepe
    Y-DNA (P)
    L-SK1414
    mtDNA (M)
    U8b1a1

    African Union Ainu AchaemenidEmpire1 Kurdistan Star of David Dravida Nadu
    Some interesting stuff:

    1- Tajik farmers are 75% Iran Neolithic 25% West Siberia Noelithic. Other Samples from
    The BMAC area and nearby have the same mixture, with in increase of Iran Neolithic in areas closer to Iran itself(such as Turkmen farmers). Itís kinda ironic that Iranians and Tajiks were almost identical genetically(unlike the present).

    2- BMCA Bronze Age samples(the ones with the steppe) were 10-25% steppe, with one sample from Uzbekistan averaging around 30% steppe(sintashta stuff$). Sample is Sappali Bronze Age. These samples are most likely ancestral to iranics, at least the western ones.

    3- Iranís Hajji Feruz samples(late Neolithic, early copper age) were roughly 50% Iran Neolithic 50% Anatolia Neolithic. They were located in the most NW part of Iran (Urmia). Eastern/central Iran had less Anatolian admix. Minor Anatolian farmer admix was found in the southern Turkmen farmers.The Urmia region still has higher Anatolian Neolithic than other Iranians(shout out to dmxx the Urmian rapper and Admin).

    4- Swat valley Aryans were around 10-15% steppe. Modern NW South Asian groups get 20-25% steppe. These groups potentially have Kushan or Saka type ancestry.

    5- Dashti kozi is an interesting case. 3 samples from northern Tajikistan( the most southern tip of Andronovo according to some, not a part of BMAC) were basically Sintashta transplants. One of my friends predicts that these people are the ancestral indo aryans, while the iranics were more similar to the BMAC steppe admixed samples. Greek scenario repeated?

    6- The south eastern Iranian sample( on the Afghan border) were kinda shocking. One was almost 40% Onge and the other was around 15-20% Onge. Both were Y-DNA J2a(I think one of him had a south Aisha linked mtDNA). Economic migrants? Imported wives? The other Iranian samples had no Onge(less than 2-1%).

    7- The Afghan sample has almost no steppe at all, maybe itís a bit too early for them. Hajji Feruz samples can also be easily modeled without using steppe groups.

  15. The Following 10 Users Say Thank You to jesus For This Useful Post:

     Awale (04-02-2018),  bmoney (04-02-2018),  Cascio (04-02-2018),  ffoucart (04-02-2018),  Hando (04-03-2018),  K33 (04-02-2018),  MfA (04-02-2018),  Michał (04-02-2018),  palamede (04-02-2018),  ren (04-02-2018)

  16. #189
    Global Moderator
    Posts
    4,660
    Sex
    Y-DNA (P)
    R1a-L657 >BY160158
    mtDNA (M)
    M30g
    Y-DNA (M)
    R1a-L657 >Y6
    mtDNA (P)
    U2C1

    Quote Originally Posted by parasar View Post
    That one R1a is circa 400 BC when steppe influence is seen. The 41 samples from 1200-800 BC have no R1a and 0 steppe influence. Essentially the 1500 BC R1a=Aryan incursion theory via NW passes is dead.
    The biggest question now is why would R1a be so prevalent? I think the "true" IndoAryan patrilineal signal could be those haplogroups that they don't find... due to cremation practices.

  17. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to poi For This Useful Post:

     Hando (04-03-2018),  K33 (04-02-2018),  parasar (04-02-2018),  Tomenable (04-02-2018)

  18. #190
    Registered Users
    Posts
    779
    Sex
    Location
    Gonur Tepe
    Y-DNA (P)
    L-SK1414
    mtDNA (M)
    U8b1a1

    African Union Ainu AchaemenidEmpire1 Kurdistan Star of David Dravida Nadu
    Quote Originally Posted by parasar View Post
    That one R1a is circa 400 BC when steppe influence is seen. The 41 samples from 1200-800 BC have no R1a and 0 steppe influence. Essentially the 1500 BC R1a=Aryan incursion theory via NW passes is dead.
    No, the 41 samples are 10-15% steppe on average. They wuz aryans. It’s enough to cause a cultural shift.

  19. The Following 8 Users Say Thank You to jesus For This Useful Post:

     Awale (04-02-2018),  bmoney (04-02-2018),  ffoucart (04-02-2018),  Hando (04-03-2018),  Michał (04-02-2018),  Rafe (04-15-2018),  surbakhunWeesste (04-02-2018),  Tomenable (04-02-2018)

Page 19 of 85 FirstFirst ... 917181920212969 ... LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 7746
    Last Post: 10-21-2020, 05:35 PM
  2. Replies: 87
    Last Post: 10-09-2020, 07:43 AM
  3. Replies: 66
    Last Post: 04-24-2019, 03:47 PM
  4. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 09-11-2018, 03:14 AM
  5. In what world is Afghanistan Central or South Asian?
    By MyAnthropologies in forum Central
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 08-17-2016, 08:18 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •