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Thread: Global25 automated nMonte for South/Central Asian members

  1. #7811
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    Quote Originally Posted by kpb View Post
    Are there other Kashmiri Muslim samples? Though outdated, Harappa had my closest population as “Kashmiri” as opposed to “Kashmiri pandit”; same for my parents. I guess I mistakenly attributed that to my slightly higher NE Asian as according to Harappa.
    None afaik but Kashmiri Muslims are definitely more diverse, the HW oracles via dnagenics are more accurate I find.

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  3. #7812
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    Quote Originally Posted by pegasus View Post
    Jurble is different, well because he is not a Kashmiri Pandit so the point here is moot. Though, Jurble come to think of it now is quite superficially similar to many Gujarati Brahmins sans the Tibetan admixture.

    sample: :Jurble
    distance: 1.6419
    Brahmin_Gujarat: 87
    Alalakh_MLBA_o: 8
    Chokhopani_2700BP: 4
    Srubnaya_MLBA: 1

    sample: Kashmiri Pandit:BR Kashmiri Pandit-1
    distance: 1.8748
    Brahmin_Gujarat: 70.5
    Alalakh_MLBA_o: 22
    Chokhopani_2700BP: 4
    Srubnaya_MLBA: 3.5

     
    The user kpb has the same NE Asian, as the Gujarati Brahmin. While the Barcin admixture in Jurble sample and KPB are alike, with the 'Kashmiri Pandit' and 'Gujarati Brahmin' samples having an equal amount NE Asian. This underscores the diversity among the Kashmiri Pandit population as well, especially when you look at the distances between them.

    Distance: 2.3732% / 0.02373184
    Target: Kashmiri_Pandit
    42.3 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    26.1 RUS_Srubnaya_MLBA
    17.9 AASI_NW
    10.1 MNG_Munkhkhairkhan_MBA_1
    3.6 TUR_Barcin_N

    Distance: 3.1490% / 0.03148958
    Target: Jurble_scaled
    39.9 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    21.9 AASI_NW
    20.7 RUS_Srubnaya_MLBA
    10.3 MNG_Munkhkhairkhan_MBA_1
    7.2 TUR_Barcin_N

    Distance: 2.8930% / 0.02893043
    Target: Brahmin_Gujarat
    40.0 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    24.7 RUS_Srubnaya_MLBA
    23.8 AASI_NW
    7.4 MNG_Munkhkhairkhan_MBA_1
    4.1 TUR_Barcin_N

    Distance: 2.5169% / 0.02516939
    Target: KPB_Scaled
    40.9 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    24.4 RUS_Srubnaya_MLBA
    20.3 AASI_NW
    7.3 TUR_Barcin_N
    7.1 MNG_Munkhkhairkhan_MBA_1

    Besides, its a moot point, including ancient and modern samples as admixture components for modeling a modern.

  4. #7813
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rahuls77 View Post
    The user kpb has the same NE Asian, as the Gujarati Brahmin. While the Barcin admixture in Jurble sample and KPB are alike, with the 'Kashmiri Pandit' and 'Gujarati Brahmin' samples having an equal amount NE Asian. This underscores the diversity among the Kashmiri Pandit population as well, especially when you look at the distances between them.

    Distance: 2.3732% / 0.02373184
    Target: Kashmiri_Pandit
    42.3 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    26.1 RUS_Srubnaya_MLBA
    17.9 AASI_NW
    10.1 MNG_Munkhkhairkhan_MBA_1
    3.6 TUR_Barcin_N

    Distance: 3.1490% / 0.03148958
    Target: Jurble_scaled
    39.9 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    21.9 AASI_NW
    20.7 RUS_Srubnaya_MLBA
    10.3 MNG_Munkhkhairkhan_MBA_1
    7.2 TUR_Barcin_N

    Distance: 2.8930% / 0.02893043
    Target: Brahmin_Gujarat
    40.0 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    24.7 RUS_Srubnaya_MLBA
    23.8 AASI_NW
    7.4 MNG_Munkhkhairkhan_MBA_1
    4.1 TUR_Barcin_N

    Distance: 2.5169% / 0.02516939
    Target: KPB_Scaled
    40.9 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    24.4 RUS_Srubnaya_MLBA
    20.3 AASI_NW
    7.3 TUR_Barcin_N
    7.1 MNG_Munkhkhairkhan_MBA_1

    Besides, its a moot point, including ancient and modern samples as admixture components for modeling a modern.
    Gujarati Brahmins most definitely do not harbor any East Asian related admixture, along with most Northern Indian/Pakistani populations, that is the rationale for excluding groups like Sakas and Huns as a Steppe source. That BA sample your using as a proxy for East Asian ancestry has significant West Eurasian ancestry in particular WSHG (30-40%), that's what is causing that component to be inflated.


    sample: Brahmin Gujarat:Average
    distance: 1.7862
    Ganj_Dareh_N • Average: 42.5
    Simulated_AASI_by_DMXX • Average: 28.5
    Sidelkino_HG • Average: 13.5
    Barcin_N • Average: 10
    Tyumen_HG • Average: 5.5
    Chokhopani_2700BP • Average: 0

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  6. #7814
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    Quote Originally Posted by pegasus View Post
    Gujarati Brahmins most definitely do not harbor any East Asian related admixture, along with most Northern Indian/Pakistani populations, that is the rationale for excluding groups like Sakas and Huns as a Steppe source. That BA sample your using as a proxy for East Asian ancestry has significant West Eurasian ancestry in particular WSHG (30-40%), that's what is causing that component to be inflated.


    sample: Brahmin Gujarat:Average
    distance: 1.7862
    Ganj_Dareh_N • Average: 42.5
    Simulated_AASI_by_DMXX • Average: 28.5
    Sidelkino_HG • Average: 13.5
    Barcin_N • Average: 10
    Tyumen_HG • Average: 5.5
    Chokhopani_2700BP • Average: 0
    On most models I do score some Chokhopani (2-3%), don't know how significant that would be though. I replaced the NE Asian source in Rahul's model with Chokhopani and here it seems to become a bit inflated:

    Target: KB_scaled
    Distance: 2.6744% / 0.02674386
    39.6 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    28.4 RUS_Srubnaya_Alakul_MLBA
    23.6 NW_AASI_Sim_Avg
    6.2 NPL_Chokhopani_2700BP
    2.2 TUR_Barcin_N

    With your model:

    Target: KB_scaled
    Distance: 1.9610% / 0.01961015
    43.0 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    23.6 NW_AASI_Sim_Avg
    15.6 RUS_Sidelkino_HG
    10.8 TUR_Barcin_N
    4.4 NPL_Chokhopani_2700BP
    2.6 RUS_Tyumen_HG
    “Some of you say, “Joy is greater than sorrow,” and others say, “Nay, sorrow is the greater.”
    But I say unto you, they are inseparable.
    Together they come, and when one sits alone with you at your board, remember that the other is asleep upon your bed.”
    ― Khalil Gibran, The Prophet, 1923

  7. #7815
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirtan24 View Post
    On most models I do score some Chokhopani (2-3%), don't know how significant that would be though. I replaced the NE Asian source in Rahul's model with Chokhopani and here it seems to become a bit inflated:

    Target: KB_scaled
    Distance: 2.6744% / 0.02674386
    39.6 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    28.4 RUS_Srubnaya_Alakul_MLBA
    23.6 NW_AASI_Sim_Avg
    6.2 NPL_Chokhopani_2700BP
    2.2 TUR_Barcin_N

    With your model:

    Target: KB_scaled
    Distance: 1.9610% / 0.01961015
    43.0 IRN_Ganj_Dareh_N
    23.6 NW_AASI_Sim_Avg
    15.6 RUS_Sidelkino_HG
    10.8 TUR_Barcin_N
    4.4 NPL_Chokhopani_2700BP
    2.6 RUS_Tyumen_HG
    Thats because AASI NW is not sufficient enough to account for intraspecific variation between AASI, thats why DMXX formulated the newer one. I am not a fan of using Steppe MLBA in a distal analysis because it eats up all the ANF.


    sample: KB
    distance: 2.0963
    Ganj_Dareh_N: 42.5
    Simulated_AASI_by_DMXX: 29
    Tyumen_HG: 5
    Barcin_N: 9.5
    Chokhopani_2700BP: 0

    sample: GB
    distance: 1.7786
    Shahr_I_Sokhta_BA3: 65
    Srubnaya_Alakul_MLBA: 20
    Dzharkutan1_BA: 15
    CG_IVCp: 0
    Last edited by pegasus; 11-29-2020 at 01:15 PM.

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  9. #7816
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    Quote Originally Posted by pegasus View Post
    Thats because AASI NW is not sufficient enough to account for intraspecific variation between AASI, thats why DMXX formulated the newer one. I am not a fan of using Steppe MLBA in a distal analysis because it eats up all the ANF.


    sample: KB
    distance: 2.0963
    Ganj_Dareh_N: 42.5
    Simulated_AASI_by_DMXX: 29
    Tyumen_HG: 5
    Barcin_N: 9.5
    Chokhopani_2700BP: 0
    The components are not adding up to a 100, no? They only make up 86%
    “Some of you say, “Joy is greater than sorrow,” and others say, “Nay, sorrow is the greater.”
    But I say unto you, they are inseparable.
    Together they come, and when one sits alone with you at your board, remember that the other is asleep upon your bed.”
    ― Khalil Gibran, The Prophet, 1923

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  11. #7817
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirtan24 View Post
    The components are not adding up to a 100, no? They only make up 86%
    This is what I get on Genoplot (default penalty on)
    sample: Kirtan24:MyHeritageSample
    distance: 2.9011
    Ganj_Dareh_N: 42.5
    Simulated_AASI_by_DMXX: 28.5
    Barcin_N: 15
    Tyumen_HG: 12.5
    Chokhopani_2700BP: 1.5
    “Some of you say, “Joy is greater than sorrow,” and others say, “Nay, sorrow is the greater.”
    But I say unto you, they are inseparable.
    Together they come, and when one sits alone with you at your board, remember that the other is asleep upon your bed.”
    ― Khalil Gibran, The Prophet, 1923

  12. #7818
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kirtan24 View Post
    The components are not adding up to a 100, no? They only make up 86%
    EHG got cut off when I was copying
    sample: GB
    distance: 2.0974
    Ganj_Dareh_N: 42.5
    Simulated_AASI_by_DMXX: 29
    Sidelkino_HG: 14
    Barcin_N: 9.5
    Tyumen_HG: 5

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  14. #7819
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    Quote Originally Posted by pegasus View Post
    EHG got cut off when I was copying
    sample: GB
    distance: 2.0974
    Ganj_Dareh_N: 42.5
    Simulated_AASI_by_DMXX: 29
    Sidelkino_HG: 14
    Barcin_N: 9.5
    Tyumen_HG: 5
    What do I need to add here bro? All I could think of was Iberian WHG cuz that pops up in excess strangely.

    With all DMXX's sims [SPGT/SiSBA3/South]

    pegasusdistalmodel1.PNG

    Minus the South-South sim average:

    pegasusdistalmodel2.PNG
    Last edited by ThaYamamoto; 11-30-2020 at 11:00 PM.

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  16. #7820
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    Quote Originally Posted by pegasus View Post
    EHG got cut off when I was copying
    sample: GB
    distance: 2.0974
    Ganj_Dareh_N: 42.5
    Simulated_AASI_by_DMXX: 29
    Sidelkino_HG: 14
    Barcin_N: 9.5
    Tyumen_HG: 5
    Don't you think that Simulated_AASI_by_DMXX inflates the AASI a little bit (3-4%)? This is what Kashmiri Pandit average scores on Genoplot (penalty off) with this particular model:

    sample: Kashmiri Pandit:Average
    distance: 1.8314
    Ganj_Dareh_N: 31
    Simulated_AASI_by_DMXX: 25.5
    Sidelkino_HG: 9
    Barcin_N: 20
    Tyumen_HG: 14.5

    penalty on:

    sample: Kashmiri Pandit:Average
    distance: 2.9794
    Ganj_Dareh_N: 45
    Simulated_AASI_by_DMXX: 23.5
    Barcin_N: 15
    Tyumen_HG: 8.5
    Sidelkino_HG: 8

    On other models the AASI for KPs limits itself to 20-21%. For me it has typically been at 24-26%. Or am I reading too much into it?

    Some other groups (penalty on):

    sample: Brahmin Gujarat:Average
    distance: 2.1267
    Ganj_Dareh_N: 40.5
    Simulated_AASI_by_DMXX: 30
    Barcin_N: 14
    Tyumen_HG: 9.5
    Sidelkino_HG: 6

    sample: Bihar Brahmin Bhumihar:mean
    distance: 3.1936
    Ganj_Dareh_N: 36.5
    Simulated_AASI_by_DMXX: 30
    Barcin_N: 15
    Tyumen_HG: 13
    Sidelkino_HG: 5.5

    sample: Brahmin Uttar Pradesh:Average
    distance: 3.2536
    Ganj_Dareh_N: 35.5
    Simulated_AASI_by_DMXX: 34.5
    Barcin_N: 12
    Tyumen_HG: 10.5
    Sidelkino_HG: 7.5
    Last edited by Kirtan24; 11-30-2020 at 10:35 AM.
    “Some of you say, “Joy is greater than sorrow,” and others say, “Nay, sorrow is the greater.”
    But I say unto you, they are inseparable.
    Together they come, and when one sits alone with you at your board, remember that the other is asleep upon your bed.”
    ― Khalil Gibran, The Prophet, 1923

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