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Thread: The genetic prehistory of the Greater Caucasus[preprint Harvard/Jena]

  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agamemnon View Post
    See for yourself:

    I wonder what happened to that V7 found in the Nezoluzhko study a few years back?
    1 Jew_Ashkenazy_Poland +Volga-German Custom:AGUser_Eihwaz 1.7783 85.83 14.17

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  3. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agamemnon View Post
    I already gave you an answer: "The split-ergative system is a common innovation of the Anatolian branch (in other words, it probably appeared in Proto-Anatolian)." and "Proto-Anatolian had a split-ergative system and was a language of the nominative-accusative type, this doesn't even remotely resemble the ergative alignment in the languages of the region which usually have ergative-absolutive systems and are of the agglutinative type, much like Hattic."

    Once again, try reading my posts next time instead of skimming over them.
    So, that makes proto-Anatolian NATIVE to Anatolia. Game over for you

  4. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tag Heuer View Post
    Yes, I know, just emphasised the similarity, so the Bosnian comrade can make some conclusions on the difference between Caucasian and IE-languages
    A more important difference to stress IMO would be the incomparably complex case system as well as the large phonemic inventories in NE Caucasian languages. These differences are much more important.
    ᾽Άλλο δέ τοι ἐρέω, σὺ δ᾽ ἐνὶ φρεσὶ βάλλεο σῇσιν:
    κρύβδην, μηδ᾽ ἀναφανδά, φίλην ἐς πατρίδα γαῖαν
    νῆα κατισχέμεναι: ἐπεὶ οὐκέτι πιστὰ γυναιξίν.


    -Αγαμέμνων; H Οδύσσεια, Ραψωδία λ

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  6. #104
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    The one thing I can conclude in a nutshell is that IE languages most likely originated somewhere around the Black sea.
    And someone correct me if I'm mistaken, the Balkans have the greatest variety of branches of IE languages. And I doubt that's because everyone wanted to migrate there. Why? Was there some kind of a gold rush? Probably because they're also the oldest languages in Europe.

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  8. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by ms85 View Post
    So, that makes proto-Anatolian NATIVE to Anatolia. Game over for you
    Read carefully: "this doesn't even remotely resemble the ergative alignment in the languages of the region which usually have ergative-absolutive systems and are of the agglutinative type, much like Hattic."
    ᾽Άλλο δέ τοι ἐρέω, σὺ δ᾽ ἐνὶ φρεσὶ βάλλεο σῇσιν:
    κρύβδην, μηδ᾽ ἀναφανδά, φίλην ἐς πατρίδα γαῖαν
    νῆα κατισχέμεναι: ἐπεὶ οὐκέτι πιστὰ γυναιξίν.


    -Αγαμέμνων; H Οδύσσεια, Ραψωδία λ

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  10. #106
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    paternal-ggf YDNA: R1b-L48. Scott, William Hamilton mdka Ireland(?) < 1800s

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  12. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by Username View Post
    The one thing I can conclude in a nutshell is that IE languages most likely originated somewhere around the Black sea.
    And someone correct me if I'm mistaken, the Balkans have the greatest variety of branches of IE languages. And I doubt that's because everyone wanted to migrate there. Why? Was there some kind of a gold rush? Probably because they're also the oldest languages in Europe.
    While this is technically true, it is completely irrelevant in this context. Diachronic linguistics doesn't work like population genetics, just because diversity is centered in a specific area does not mean that the language family originated there (and indeed, you don't need to go far back in time to pinpoint the arrival of specific IE branches in the Balkans). That kind of lousy equivalence between genetics and linguistics should be avoided.
    ᾽Άλλο δέ τοι ἐρέω, σὺ δ᾽ ἐνὶ φρεσὶ βάλλεο σῇσιν:
    κρύβδην, μηδ᾽ ἀναφανδά, φίλην ἐς πατρίδα γαῖαν
    νῆα κατισχέμεναι: ἐπεὶ οὐκέτι πιστὰ γυναιξίν.


    -Αγαμέμνων; H Οδύσσεια, Ραψωδία λ

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  14. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by Username View Post
    The one thing I can conclude in a nutshell is that IE languages most likely originated somewhere around the Black sea.
    And someone correct me if I'm mistaken, the Balkans have the greatest variety of branches of IE languages. And I doubt that's because everyone wanted to migrate there. Why? Was there some kind of a gold rush? Probably because they're also the oldest languages in Europe.
    The Balkans are the oldest IEan places in Europe! Hellenic is one of the most oldest European IEan language.

  15. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agamemnon View Post
    A more important difference to stress IMO would be the incomparably complex case system as well as the large phonemic inventories in NE Caucasian languages. These differences are much more important.
    they are indeed, but I'm not that good in English to explain these differences in scientific language
    Moxk bocu šrzu qiygo a tergal ca jo

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  17. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agamemnon View Post
    Read carefully: "this doesn't even remotely resemble the ergative alignment in the languages of the region which usually have ergative-absolutive systems and are of the agglutinative type, much like Hattic."
    Doesn't even matter. ERGATIVIY is still from Anatolia and it was in IEan proto-Anatolian. That makes proto-Anatolian native to Anatolia. Hittite evolved from Anatolian, That means that Hittite evolved from proto-Anatolian IN Anatolia. That makes Hittite hardcore Anatolian language. Because it was derived from proto-Anatolian IN Anatolia.

    Proto-Anatolian ERGANTIVITY = Anatolian
    Hittites evolved from proto-Anatolian in Anatolia = Hittites is native to Anatolia!

    Ancestor of Hittite which is proto-Anatolian got EGRATIVITY in Anatolia. And Hittites got it from proto-Anatolians.

    So Hittite was born in Anatolia. proto-Hittites who started to use Hittite language were hardcore natives of Anatolian!


    Game, set and match!
    Last edited by ms85; 05-17-2018 at 02:03 AM.

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