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Thread: mtDNA C in South Asia

  1. #1
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    mtDNA C in South Asia

    Replicating discussion from Molgen,

    mtDNA C is found in North East (and North) India among Tibeto-Burman groups.
    But surprisingly, it is also found in South and West India.

    I carry mtDNA C4a1, and my variety appears to be farthest away from the Tibeto-Burman variety in India.

    My sample is on top here: http://cerbere.ca/wconnect/wc.dll?ne...hip~JN392434~E
    The second sample on that list (and closest match to mine so far) is Ukrainian.


    There is a supposed variant of C in Kattunaiken tribes of Kerala, but no one knows what type it is: http://www.hygienecentral.org.uk/pdf...20European.pdf

    I have found another mtDNA C from West India in mitosearch (REXGE), but unfortunately no response.

    On 23andme, I have found 3 other C4a (possibly C4a1) who appear as relatives, but unfortunately not one of them has responded back. I assume they have the same ethnic background as me (south Indian Brahmin).
    Paternal YDNA: G-P303+ -> G-Z30522+
    Paternal mtDNA: U7a3b1
    Maternal YDNA: R-Z2123+ -> R-YP526+
    Maternal mtDNA: C4a1 (T195C!)

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  3. #2
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    Hi

    Google maps shows 10 C4a1
    https://maps.google.co.uk/maps/ms?ie...b82d24e9195dac

    I have two C4a1 matches on 23andMe, well three but two are mother and son I think.

    I don't know if there are any known subclades of C4a1 on 23andMe's V3 chip, but think my matches are of English/Irish ancestry!



    Quote Originally Posted by soulblighter View Post
    Replicating discussion from Molgen,

    mtDNA C is found in North East (and North) India among Tibeto-Burman groups.
    But surprisingly, it is also found in South and West India.

    I carry mtDNA C4a1, and my variety appears to be farthest away from the Tibeto-Burman variety in India.

    My sample is on top here: http://cerbere.ca/wconnect/wc.dll?ne...hip~JN392434~E
    The second sample on that list (and closest match to mine so far) is Ukrainian.


    There is a supposed variant of C in Kattunaiken tribes of Kerala, but no one knows what type it is: http://www.hygienecentral.org.uk/pdf...20European.pdf

    I have found another mtDNA C from West India in mitosearch (REXGE), but unfortunately no response.

    On 23andme, I have found 3 other C4a (possibly C4a1) who appear as relatives, but unfortunately not one of them has responded back. I assume they have the same ethnic background as me (south Indian Brahmin).

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  5. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by soulblighter View Post
    I carry mtDNA C4a1, and my variety appears to be farthest away from the Tibeto-Burman variety in India.

    My sample is on top here: http://cerbere.ca/wconnect/wc.dll?ne...hip~JN392434~E
    The second sample on that list (and closest match to mine so far) is Ukrainian.
    ...............

    On 23andme, I have found 3 other C4a (possibly C4a1) who appear as relatives, but unfortunately not one of them has responded back. I assume they have the same ethnic background as me (south Indian Brahmin).
    As you said for your Y-hg G2a2b2a-P303 which is probably explained by the Indo-Scythian (Sakas) origin of a part of your Brahmin cast the Iyers, same explanation could be done for your mt-hg C4a1.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iyer

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indo-Scythians

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    According to PhyloTree.org - mtDNA tree Build 15 (30 Sep 2012) there are 11 'known' subclades of C4a1
    http://www.phylotree.org/tree/subtree_M.htm

    C4a1'5
    C4a1a
    C4a1a1
    C4a1b
    C4a1b1
    C4a1c
    C4a1c1
    C4a1c1a
    C4a1c2
    C4a1d
    C4a1e

    Have there been any more subclades added since 30 Sep 2012?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Solothurn View Post
    According to PhyloTree.org - mtDNA tree Build 15 (30 Sep 2012) there are 11 'known' subclades of C4a1
    http://www.phylotree.org/tree/subtree_M.htm

    C4a1'5
    C4a1a
    C4a1a1
    C4a1b
    C4a1b1
    C4a1c
    C4a1c1
    C4a1c1a
    C4a1c2
    C4a1d
    C4a1e

    Have there been any more subclades added since 30 Sep 2012?
    Yes, I think that is the last update so far ( http://www.mtdnacommunity.org/ ) . But I belong to none of them. Also, I am the south Indian sample on the google map you posted. Are you sure your C4a1 matches are English/Irish?
    Paternal YDNA: G-P303+ -> G-Z30522+
    Paternal mtDNA: U7a3b1
    Maternal YDNA: R-Z2123+ -> R-YP526+
    Maternal mtDNA: C4a1 (T195C!)

  9. #6
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    Yes. One Is 'wallis' on the 23andMe C4a1 thread you posted on!

    https://www.23andme.com/you/community/thread/7822/2/

    Maybe he is a subclade not on the V3 chip.
    Last edited by Solothurn; 12-21-2013 at 04:24 PM.

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  11. #7
    I believe c4a2 was the branch found on the steppe not c4a1.

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    Quote Originally Posted by newtoboard View Post
    I believe c4a2 was the branch found on the steppe not c4a1.
    C4a1( with no defined subgroup) is all over the place from Ukraine to south Siberia, including the steppe. The only exact HVR1 and HVR2 match for my sample so far is Kyrgyz.
    Paternal YDNA: G-P303+ -> G-Z30522+
    Paternal mtDNA: U7a3b1
    Maternal YDNA: R-Z2123+ -> R-YP526+
    Maternal mtDNA: C4a1 (T195C!)

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  14. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by soulblighter View Post
    C4a1( with no defined subgroup) is all over the place from Ukraine to south Siberia, including the steppe. The only exact HVR1 and HVR2 match for my sample so far is Kyrgyz.
    I might be wrong then. But that might be the modern distribution. I was talking about the C found in ancient samples being C4a2.

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  16. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by newtoboard View Post
    I might be wrong then. But that might be the modern distribution. I was talking about the C found in ancient samples being C4a2.
    Yes you are right, but the C discovered so far all fall under C4a, and with only HVR 1, it is difficult to guess their type.

    Kristiina, Maju and I had a big dicussion about this on his blog. Look at the comments also.


    http://forwhattheywereweare.wordpres...omment-page-3/
    Last edited by soulblighter; 12-22-2013 at 07:33 PM.
    Paternal YDNA: G-P303+ -> G-Z30522+
    Paternal mtDNA: U7a3b1
    Maternal YDNA: R-Z2123+ -> R-YP526+
    Maternal mtDNA: C4a1 (T195C!)

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