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Thread: Haplogroup U7

  1. #1
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    Haplogroup U7

    Im just trying to gather some information on this haplogroup. There doesnt seem to be a topic here about it so I thought i'd make one.

    23andme says my haplogroup is U7. so u7's unite lol?

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  3. #2
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    Have you tried plugging your 23andme download into James Licks mtDNA Haplogroup Analysis Tool? (https://dna.jameslick.com/mthap/. It should give you a slightly more accurate result than what 23andme gives you.

    The origin of U7 would have occured around 17100 years ago around the region that surrounds the South Caspian Sea (Mostly North Iran). Source - Sahakyan et al. 2016 - https://www.nature.com/articles/srep46044



    The current distribution of U7 seems to mainly be concentrated around the Near East and South Asia, as well as a separate cluster in West Siberia. Different areas in this region will have different subclades of U7, and getting a more accurate prediction from James Licks Tool can give you a more specific region where you tend to see your maternal subclade the most.

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  5. #3
    U7 is very diverse my friend is U7b with 23andme me calling him U7 and LivingDNA narrowing him down to U7b specifically it’s extremely rare in Europe today but may have once been much more prominent in the ancient past in short my friend is tall red haired of British ancestry with 100% north Western European ancestry. So his U7b Haplogroup is very unusual indeed where are you all from?

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  7. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tomoboy092 View Post
    U7 is very diverse my friend is U7b with 23andme me calling him U7 and LivingDNA narrowing him down to U7b specifically it’s extremely rare in Europe today but may have once been much more prominent in the ancient past in short my friend is tall red haired of British ancestry with 100% north Western European ancestry. So his U7b Haplogroup is very unusual indeed where are you all from?


    You can find a bigger picture by looking at the Sahakyan et al, 2017 study "Origin and spread of human mitochondrial DNA haplogroup U7".

    While U7 is rare in Europe, 47/60 European U7 samples (according to Supplementary Dataset 2) belong to U7b. If we just look at NW Europe, then 16/18 NW European U7 samples come under U7b. The remaining U7a samples in NW Europe are both Ashkenazi Jews, so if you want to exclude them, then 16/16 NW European U7 samples (non-Jewish) from the study come under U7b. There is a U7b sample from the USA, this person is ethnically European however the exact region his/her maternal line somes from is unknown, so I'm excluding him/her from the NW European number, but I will mention this person later on.

    Out of these 16 U7b NW Euro samples, 2 come under U7b* (10000 year TMRCA), 4 come under U7b1* (9500 year TMRCA), 3 come under U7b1c (4000 year TMRCA), 6 come under U7b2 (3000 year TMRCA) and 1 comes under U7b5 (6500 year TMRCA).

    U7b has a TMRCA of 10000 years, so all U7b people worldwide can trace their maternal lines to a single woman who lived around 10000 years ago. I'm not sure where this woman lived but she may have lived not too far from the U7 MRCA (around the southern half of the Caspian Sea).

    Looking at the two most recent U7b lineages (U7b1c and U7b2):

    - Worldwide, U7b1c is exclusive to Europe. 3/5 of these worldwide samples specically come from Germany (which accounts for all NW European U7b1c samples), and the other two come from Spain, and USA (the person I excluded earlier).

    - Worldwide, U7b2 is exclusive to Finland. All 6 global samples of U7b2 from the dataset come from there.

    So U7b in Europe is rare, but not necessarily unusual

    If you're wondering about me, I'm from England but my parents are from Punjab, India. I come under U7a (more specifically, U7a3a), which has a cluster around NW India, especially Punjab. U7a is much bigger here than U7b. 99/121 South Asian samples in the study come under U7a, compared to 12/121 U7b samples. The remaining samples (10/121) come under U7c.
    Last edited by aaronbee2010; 12-21-2018 at 11:57 PM.
    FTDNA: IN41220
    YFull: YF62636

    FATHER:

    Y-DNA (ISOGG 2019): R2a2b1b2a1a1-Y1383* (Y154917-)
    Y-DNA path: M207 > M479 > M124 > P267 > Y12100 > Y8763 > Y8766 > V3714 > SK2142 > Y1377 > Y1379 > Z29271 > Y1383 x Y154917


    mtDNA (YFull): M5a1c-G9064A


    MATERNAL UNCLE:

    Y-DNA (ISOGG 2019): R1b1a1b1b3a-Z2109
    Y-DNA path: M207 > M173 > M343 > L754 > L388 > P297 > M269 > L23 > Z2103 > Z2106 > Z2109

    mtDNA (YFull): U7a3a1e1a-C15433T

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    Quote Originally Posted by aaronbee2010 View Post
    Have you tried plugging your 23andme download into James Licks mtDNA Haplogroup Analysis Tool? (https://dna.jameslick.com/mthap/. It should give you a slightly more accurate result than what 23andme gives you.

    The origin of U7 would have occured around 17100 years ago around the region that surrounds the South Caspian Sea (Mostly North Iran). Source - Sahakyan et al. 2016 - https://www.nature.com/articles/srep46044



    The current distribution of U7 seems to mainly be concentrated around the Near East and South Asia, as well as a separate cluster in West Siberia. Different areas in this region will have different subclades of U7, and getting a more accurate prediction from James Licks Tool can give you a more specific region where you tend to see your maternal subclade the most.
    I can't help but what if there's an ANE or later connection to U7. That's the first thing I thought of immediately when I saw that cluster in Siberia. I'm U7 as well and I knew that it was connected to the Iranian Neolithic expansion but Iranian Neolthic itself had some sort of ANE link. The sparse occurrence in Europe could also be due to that ancient Siberian link, or it could be due to the Iranian neolithic/CHG that was found in Yamnaya itself. This is pure speculation on my part and I know little abot haplogrops but its fascinating to try to connect the dots.
    Last edited by Censored; 02-15-2019 at 05:00 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Censored View Post
    I can't help but what if there's an ANE or later connection to U7. That's the first thing I thought of immediately when I saw that cluster in Siberia. I'm U7 as well and I knew that it was connected to the Iranian Neolithic expansion but Iranian Neolthic itself had some sort of ANE link. The sparse occurrence in Europe could also be due to that ancient Siberian link, or it could be due to the Iranian neolithic/CHG that was found in Yamnaya itself. This is pure speculation on my part and I know little abot haplogrops but its fascinating to try to connect the dots.
    U7's origins seem to be somewhere near the southern half of the Caspian Sea, so it's definitely an ANE lineage. I would agree with you that it most likely came from Iran during the Neolithic/Chalcolithic.

    I believe Iran_N is defined as ANE, among others.

    The cluster in Siberia is predominantly U7a, however it's worth mentioning that it's quite far from all other U7a clusters seen, so is probably a result of a founder effect from one or a few women who went far North for goodness-knows-what reason. Most European U7's come under U7b, with both of the only European U7a's being Ashkenazi Jews, so that U7a is most likely a recent addition and not representative of native European population genetics.
    FTDNA: IN41220
    YFull: YF62636

    FATHER:

    Y-DNA (ISOGG 2019): R2a2b1b2a1a1-Y1383* (Y154917-)
    Y-DNA path: M207 > M479 > M124 > P267 > Y12100 > Y8763 > Y8766 > V3714 > SK2142 > Y1377 > Y1379 > Z29271 > Y1383 x Y154917


    mtDNA (YFull): M5a1c-G9064A


    MATERNAL UNCLE:

    Y-DNA (ISOGG 2019): R1b1a1b1b3a-Z2109
    Y-DNA path: M207 > M173 > M343 > L754 > L388 > P297 > M269 > L23 > Z2103 > Z2106 > Z2109

    mtDNA (YFull): U7a3a1e1a-C15433T

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    Quote Originally Posted by aaronbee2010 View Post
    U7's origins seem to be somewhere near the southern half of the Caspian Sea, so it's definitely an ANE lineage. I would agree with you that it most likely came from Iran during the Neolithic/Chalcolithic.

    I believe Iran_N is defined as ANE, among others.

    The cluster in Siberia is predominantly U7a, however it's worth mentioning that it's quite far from all other U7a clusters seen, so is probably a result of a founder effect from one or a few women who went far North for goodness-knows-what reason. Most European U7's come under U7b, with both of the only European U7a's being Ashkenazi Jews, so that U7a is most likely a recent addition and not representative of native European population genetics.
    ANE(Ancestral North Eurasian) is MA1(Mal'ta boy) as well Afontovagora. It is Siberian in origin and peaks in modern Siberians and Native Americans, and then after that South Asians. I do not believe Iranian neolithic was fully ANE-it just had a lot of ANE ancestry.

    If the clade found in Siberia is not older than the one found further south then U7 probably didn't come from Siberia. I now think it's more likely that the distribution of U7 in Europe is due to CHG/Iranian neolithic like ancestry from the Pontic steppe rather than directly from Siberia.

    I hope that all made sense.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Censored View Post
    ANE(Ancestral North Eurasian) is MA1(Mal'ta boy) as well Afontovagora. It is Siberian in origin and peaks in modern Siberians and Native Americans, and then after that South Asians. I do not believe Iranian neolithic was fully ANE-it just had a lot of ANE ancestry.

    If the clade found in Siberia is not older than the one found further south then U7 probably didn't come from Siberia. I now think it's more likely that the distribution of U7 in Europe is due to CHG/Iranian neolithic like ancestry from the Pontic steppe rather than directly from Siberia.

    I hope that all made sense.
    To be more precise, ANE-like may be a better term.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aaronbee2010 View Post
    U7's origins seem to be somewhere near the southern half of the Caspian Sea, so it's definitely an ANE lineage. I would agree with you that it most likely came from Iran during the Neolithic/Chalcolithic.

    I believe Iran_N is defined as ANE, among others.

    The cluster in Siberia is predominantly U7a, however it's worth mentioning that it's quite far from all other U7a clusters seen, so is probably a result of a founder effect from one or a few women who went far North for goodness-knows-what reason. Most European U7's come under U7b, with both of the only European U7a's being Ashkenazi Jews, so that U7a is most likely a recent addition and not representative of native European population genetics.
    Ashkenazi U7 is almost entirely U7a5 (my father is U7a5 for example), this branch is also found in Iranian Jews. There is a pre-U7a5 individual from ad-Dammam in Eastern Arabia. U7b is also found in Samaritans, tellingly amongst their Kohanim. IMO we can be fairly confident that U7a5 was present amongst the Israelites and the Judeans. So even with this lineage, we technically haven't stepped out of Western Asia.

    From a more general standpoint, U7 seems to be tied to CHG-type and Iran_HG-type populations. U7a was found in one of the Chalcolithic samples from Seh Gabi (I1665), so several branches might well have been tied to Iran_ChL-type ancestry as well. Too little is known about Paleolithic West Asia to tell which strand of ancestry U7 was initially associated with.
    Last edited by Agamemnon; 02-18-2019 at 02:52 AM.
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    νῆα κατισχέμεναι: ἐπεὶ οὐκέτι πιστὰ γυναιξίν.


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  19. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Agamemnon View Post
    Ashkenazi U7 is almost entirely U7a5 (my father is U7a5 for example), this branch is also found in Iranian Jews. There is a pre-U7a5 individual from ad-Dammam in Eastern Arabia. U7b is also found in Samaritans, tellingly amongst their Kohanim. IMO we can be fairly confident that U7a5 was present amongst the Israelites and the Judeans. So even with this lineage, we technically haven't stepped out of Western Asia.

    From a more general standpoint, U7 seems to be tied to CHG-type and Iran_HG-type populations. U7a was found in one of the Chalcolithic samples from Seh Gabi (I1665), so several branches might well have been tied to Iran_ChL-type ancestry as well. Too little is known about Paleolithic West Asia to tell which strand of ancestry U7 was initially associated with.
    Sorry, I should correct myself! What I meant to say is that the two only Northwest European U7a samples (from the Sahakyan et al. 2017 study) are Ashkenazi Jews! There are other European U7a's however they're from other parts of Europe. Again, my apologies.

    Regarding your first comment, the two Ashkenazi Jews from the study are both U7a5, just as you've said (these two samples actually come from the Behar et al. 2012 study - "A “Copernican” reassessment of the human mitochondrial DNA tree from its root"). In fact, they're the only U7a5's present in all of Europe in this study.
    FTDNA: IN41220
    YFull: YF62636

    FATHER:

    Y-DNA (ISOGG 2019): R2a2b1b2a1a1-Y1383* (Y154917-)
    Y-DNA path: M207 > M479 > M124 > P267 > Y12100 > Y8763 > Y8766 > V3714 > SK2142 > Y1377 > Y1379 > Z29271 > Y1383 x Y154917


    mtDNA (YFull): M5a1c-G9064A


    MATERNAL UNCLE:

    Y-DNA (ISOGG 2019): R1b1a1b1b3a-Z2109
    Y-DNA path: M207 > M173 > M343 > L754 > L388 > P297 > M269 > L23 > Z2103 > Z2106 > Z2109

    mtDNA (YFull): U7a3a1e1a-C15433T

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