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Thread: K Geographic Origins

  1. #1
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    K Geographic Origins

    I'm a K1c2. I'm on a mt K forum where one of our contributors hypothesized that K may have originated in the Doggerlands, the land bridge connecting the British Isles and the continent. This would be consistent with K's relative concentration in both the British Isles and Scandinavia. The rapid loss of the land bridge by flooding might explain K's broad geographic distribution but relative rarity in the general population. Does anyone else know any theories about the potential origin of K?
    Last edited by Paminohio; 09-16-2018 at 03:11 PM.

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  3. #2
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    He was referring to sub-groups of K. I don't think there's any other theory but that K originated in the Middle East.

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    Thanks, j1. It seems I have heard that before, now that you mention it. That makes sense to me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by J1 DYS388=13 View Post
    He was referring to sub-groups of K. I don't think there's any other theory but that K originated in the Middle East.
    This.

    A lot of K seems to have come with Neolithic farmers, but it's important to distinguish subclades. That's true for K1a and its subclades (which together are most common K subclades), K1b and K2a, but not for K1c, K2b and K2c. According to Eupedia, those subclades haven't been found among Neolithic farmers, are most common in eastern Europe today, and likely would have spread with Y-haplogroup R1a during the Bronze Age to Germanic countries and Central Asia, where they are also found at relatively high frequencies.

    I'm mostly interested in K2b and its subclades, and so far the oldest example of that I've seen identified was in a northern portion of the Funnelbeaker culture, in remains found in Sweden, dated from around 2800 BCE. There's also some in Central European Bell Beakers from around 2500 BCE.

    It's frustrating how often people just reference K and not the subclade, given these different origins (and that K1a and also K2a are so much more common). There's a good bit of K in some Viking remains, but I think it was mostly K1, and even with the Bell Beakers mentioned they had more K1 than K2, and some of the K2 was K2a, so that all could just be from intermarriage with descendants of early farmers.

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    Two more Ks newly reported:

    One from an Anatolian Hunter Gatherer (AHG), ZBC, 13,642-13,073 cal BCE, Pınarbaşı, K2b. (Y-DNA: C1a2)
    One from an Anatolian Aceramic early Farmer (AAF), ZMOJ, 8300-7800 BCE, Boncuklu, K1a. (Y-DNA: C)

    Feldman et al. 2018. “Late Pleistocene human genome suggests a local origin for the first farmers of central Anatolia”
    https://www.biorxiv.org/content/early/2018/09/20/422295
    Last edited by Fungene; 09-21-2018 at 12:07 AM.

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     euasta (02-06-2019),  J1 DYS388=13 (09-21-2018),  msmarjoribanks (09-22-2018),  palamede (12-08-2018)

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    Exciting, particularly the K2b.

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    Hey, I am K1C2 as well! It fascinates me because I think it is associated with health issues in my family and how it is correlated to diet.

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