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Thread: Scythian U152+ L2+ Sample

  1. #1
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    Scythian U152+ L2+ Sample

    I checked Scythian sample scy009 (768-431 BC) from Starosillya, Cherkasy, Ukraine and he is P312+ > U152? > L2+ > FGC59563+ 22304007(C/T)+ DF90-, therefore breaking up the DF90 cluster.

    Here is the updated ancient DNA U152+ map: https://drive.google.com/open?id=15z...W0&usp=sharing

    A very nice summary level write-up on the Scythians:

    https://blog.britishmuseum.org/intro...the-scythians/
    Paternal: R1b-U152 >> L2 >> FGC10543, Pietro della Rocca, b. 1559, Agira, Sicily, Italy
    Maternal: H4a1-T152C!, Maria Coto, b. ~1864, Galicia, Spain
    Mother's Paternal: J1+ FGC4745/FGC4766+ PF5019+, Gerardo Caprio, b. 1879, Caposele, Avellino, Campania, Italy
    Father's Maternal: T2b-C150T, Francisca Santa Cruz, b.1916, Garganchon, Burgos, Spain
    Paternal Great (x3) Grandfather: R1b-U106 >> L48 >> CTS2509, Filippo Ensabella, b.~1836, Agira, Sicily, Italy

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  3. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by R.Rocca View Post
    I checked Scythian sample scy009 (768-431 BC) from Starosillya, Cherkasy, Ukraine and he is P312+ > U152? > L2+ > FGC59563+ 22304007(C/T)+ DF90-, therefore breaking up the DF90 cluster.

    Here is the updated ancient DNA U152+ map: https://drive.google.com/open?id=15z...W0&usp=sharing

    A very nice summary level write-up on the Scythians:

    https://blog.britishmuseum.org/intro...the-scythians/
    Just sent you PM on the baffling absence of L2>Z49 in ancient samples so far. Hopefully that will change soon. Thanks for doing the analysis on this.

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    Nice! Would the best way to determine how far down he is from the new split in DF90 be looking at his results and finding novel variants or using age estimates for DF90 and his carbon dated age?

    It sure would be neat if this guy could be incorporated into some of the public trees out there. Seems like that would be something that could really stir up people's imagination and interest.

    "We predict Mr. Scythian is your 13th cousin 74 times removed."

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  6. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by R.Rocca View Post
    I checked Scythian sample scy009 (768-431 BC) from Starosillya, Cherkasy, Ukraine and he is P312+ > U152? > L2+ > FGC59563+ 22304007(C/T)+ DF90-, therefore breaking up the DF90 cluster.

    Here is the updated ancient DNA U152+ map: https://drive.google.com/open?id=15z...W0&usp=sharing

    A very nice summary level write-up on the Scythians:

    https://blog.britishmuseum.org/intro...the-scythians/
    Ok so he's at least on my branch of L2 (if you count L2 > Z41150 like we do in the FTDNA U152 project and Alex Williams does on his tree).

    L2 >Z41150 has these subclades

    Z41150>A6454
    Z41150> BY4245
    Z41150>FGC22501
    Z41150>FGC59563 (our Scythian sample scy009 (768-431 BC) from Starosillya, Cherkasy, Ukraine)
    Z41150>S1567
    Z41150>Y11667
    Z41150>Y61135
    Z41150>Y86601
    Z41150>Z49 (My peeps)

    Z41150 is a rather "bushy" part of the tree.
    Last edited by MitchellSince1893; 10-05-2018 at 06:59 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MitchellSince1893 View Post
    Ok so he's at least on my branch of L2 (if you count L2 > Z41150 like we do in the FTDNA U152 project and Alex Williams does on his tree).

    L2 >Z41150 has these subclades is

    Z41150>A6454
    Z41150> BY4245
    Z41150>DF90
    Z41150>FGC22501
    Z41150>FGC59563 (our Scythian sample scy009 (768-431 BC) from Starosillya, Cherkasy, Ukraine)
    Z41150>S1567
    Z41150>Y11667
    Z41150>Y61135
    Z41150>Y86601
    Z41150>Z49 (My peeps)

    Z41150 is a rather "bushy" part of the tree.
    Just a slight correction: DF90 now drops one level below FGC59563 on your list.
    Paternal: R1b-U152 >> L2 >> FGC10543, Pietro della Rocca, b. 1559, Agira, Sicily, Italy
    Maternal: H4a1-T152C!, Maria Coto, b. ~1864, Galicia, Spain
    Mother's Paternal: J1+ FGC4745/FGC4766+ PF5019+, Gerardo Caprio, b. 1879, Caposele, Avellino, Campania, Italy
    Father's Maternal: T2b-C150T, Francisca Santa Cruz, b.1916, Garganchon, Burgos, Spain
    Paternal Great (x3) Grandfather: R1b-U106 >> L48 >> CTS2509, Filippo Ensabella, b.~1836, Agira, Sicily, Italy

  9. #6
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    Deleted
    Paternal: R1b-U152 >> L2 >> FGC10543, Pietro della Rocca, b. 1559, Agira, Sicily, Italy
    Maternal: H4a1-T152C!, Maria Coto, b. ~1864, Galicia, Spain
    Mother's Paternal: J1+ FGC4745/FGC4766+ PF5019+, Gerardo Caprio, b. 1879, Caposele, Avellino, Campania, Italy
    Father's Maternal: T2b-C150T, Francisca Santa Cruz, b.1916, Garganchon, Burgos, Spain
    Paternal Great (x3) Grandfather: R1b-U106 >> L48 >> CTS2509, Filippo Ensabella, b.~1836, Agira, Sicily, Italy

  10. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by R.Rocca View Post
    Just a slight correction: DF90 now drops one level below FGC59563 on your list.
    Fixed thanks.

    Makes the Horse and Arrows on the U152 logo/Shield even more relevant



    Last edited by MitchellSince1893; 10-05-2018 at 07:07 PM.

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  12. #8
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    Alex Williams has the median age for Z41150 at 2340 BC, 95% confidence interval is 2836 BC to 1896 BC.

    The FGC59563 block median age is 2016 BC, 95% confidence interval is 2642 BC to 1341 BC

    http://www.ytree.net/BlockInfo.php

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    Quote Originally Posted by MitchellSince1893 View Post
    Just sent you PM on the baffling absence of L2>Z49 in ancient samples so far. Hopefully that will change soon. Thanks for doing the analysis on this.
    I still think the Upper Rhine will have a lot of Z49 (and don't forget Z367).
    Paternal: R1b-U152 >> L2 >> FGC10543, Pietro della Rocca, b. 1559, Agira, Sicily, Italy
    Maternal: H4a1-T152C!, Maria Coto, b. ~1864, Galicia, Spain
    Mother's Paternal: J1+ FGC4745/FGC4766+ PF5019+, Gerardo Caprio, b. 1879, Caposele, Avellino, Campania, Italy
    Father's Maternal: T2b-C150T, Francisca Santa Cruz, b.1916, Garganchon, Burgos, Spain
    Paternal Great (x3) Grandfather: R1b-U106 >> L48 >> CTS2509, Filippo Ensabella, b.~1836, Agira, Sicily, Italy

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    Quote Originally Posted by MitchellSince1893 View Post
    Ok so he's at least on my branch of L2 (if you count L2 > Z41150 like we do in the FTDNA U152 project and Alex Williams does on his tree).

    L2 >Z41150 has these subclades

    Z41150>A6454
    Z41150> BY4245
    Z41150>FGC22501
    Z41150>FGC59563 (our Scythian sample scy009 (768-431 BC) from Starosillya, Cherkasy, Ukraine)
    Z41150>S1567
    Z41150>Y11667
    Z41150>Y61135
    Z41150>Y86601
    Z41150>Z49 (My peeps)

    Z41150 is a rather "bushy" part of the tree.
    I think with time BY4245 will be divided into BY3485 and others.
    Paternal: R1b-U152+ L2+ BY4245+ BY3485+ BY3478+ , Giovanni Domenicus Rabai, b. 1609, Savona, Italy
    Maternal: Haplogroup H65, María García Martínez, b. 1746, Cuenca, Spain

    Manuel David Rabaez 1974, Manuel Rabaez 1948, Manuel Rabaez 1912, Antonio Rabay 1868, Antonio Rabay 1833, Manuel Rabay 1791, Manuel Rabay 1764, Pedro Rabai 1727, Pedro Joseph Rabai 1691, Giovanni Battista Rabai 1647, Jo. Domenicus Rabai 1609, Pietrus Rabai (work in progress...)

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