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Thread: Genetically isolated populations & Endogamy

  1. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by tipirneni View Post
    In genetics, when a small number of ancestors give rise to many descendants, it known as a founder event or, alternatively, a population bottleneck. A study of anthropologically different subpopulations in South Asia has revealed that many of them are a result of strong founder events. In each of these groups, large stretches of the DNA seem to have originated from a common ancestor in the last 100 generations or so. Many studies are trying to find out but the sampling errors & population errors look obvious in the study by Thangaraj


    https://thewire.in/science/caste-fou...gamy-recessive


    The study, led by scientists at the Hyderabad-based Centre for Cellular and Molecular Biology (CCM, appeared in the journal Nature Genetics on July 18. Scientists analysed samples from over 2,800 individuals from over 275 distinct South Asian populations belonging to various social and linguistic groups, across India, Pakistan, Nepal, Sri Lanka and Bangladesh. They developed an algorithm to quantify the impact of founder events in each group based on stretches in DNA received from a common ‘founder’.

    “We found that 81 out of 263 unique South Asian groups, including 14 groups with estimated census sizes of over a million, have had a strong founder event,” said Kumarasamy Thangaraj, who led the study along with David Reich of Harvard Medical School. These large population groups with founder events include the Gujjar (from Jammu & Kashmir), Baniya (Uttar Pradesh), Pattapu kapu (Andhra Pradesh), Vadde (Andhra Pradesh), Yadav (Puducherry), Kashtriya Aqnikula (Andhra Pradesh), Naga (Nagaland), Kumhar (Uttar Pradesh), Reddy (Telangana), Kallar (Tamil Nadu), Brahmin Manipuri (Manipur), Arunthathiyar (Tamil Nadu) and Vysya (Telangana) communities.



    There are many other suspected examples of disease associations that have yet to be systematically studied in South Asia. Some medical caregivers speculate that people with the surname Reddy may be more likely to develop a form of arthritis affecting the spine, Dr. Thangaraj said. Others think people from the Telugu Raju community, in southern India, may have higher incidence of cardiomyopathy, which affects the heart muscle. The Telugu Vysya have about a 100-fold-higher rate of a metabolic disorder called butyrylcholinesterase (BChE) deficiency compared to other groups.

    What do they mean by Naga, there are 66 naga ethnic communities, Government of India recognises 35 tribes within the Naga composite identity.

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  3. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by MonkeyDLuffy View Post
    This is very interesting because Khatris who moved after partition are known to marry among cousins. Infact Sikh Khatris are the only Sikhs I've seen who marry in their cousins. I know 3 family friends who did that. Had few coworkers and classmates who did that. It includes both Hindu and Sikh Khatris, and confirmed roots from west Punjab.
    It's interesting to me too. I do know that Sikh Khatris marry within families. Hindus I have never heard. It was such a huge no no with my grandparents. Maybe since the communities were small, in the Delhi area I haven't heard 1 case. I'll ask my dad and mom and report back.

  4. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by jortita View Post
    What do they mean by Naga, there are 66 naga ethnic communities, Government of India recognises 35 tribes within the Naga composite identity.
    Study populations are vaguely described with wrong sizes etc... Probably another paper might be coming.

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    Study https://www.researchgate.net/profile...s-in-India.pdf
    says Muslim in South India very close to local population


    "
    Although marriage between Muslim men and Hindu women was important for the spread of
    Islam in India, it has not been sufficient to replace the Hindu Y-chromosomal heritage built
    up in prehistoric times. This is in contrast with observations in Muslim groups from other
    places such as China and Central Asia, where there has been more marked movement of
    Muslim Y chromosomes into the area. Our conclusion does assume that the Muslim
    population entering India would have been genetically distinct from the indigenous
    populations, which seems likely in view of their distinct geographical origin. Moreover, our
    results are in accordance with previous work on the sharing of Y-chromosomes among
    different religious communities that live side by side, namely Jewish groups and their nonJewish
    neighbors in the Near East (Hammer et al. 2000; Nebel et al. 2000; Thomas et al.
    2002).
    At least at the Y-chromosomal level, the origin of Muslim isolates in south India is
    predominantly from local populations rather than from other Muslims of other parts of India,
    or outside the country. Some Indian Muslim families can trace their ancestry back to sources
    outside India >1,000 years ago, and our findings do not conflict with this fact, but do show
    that the largest minority religious group in India arose in the main from a cultural change
    among Hindus who started to follow and spread the precepts of Islam. The Y-chromosomal
    variation among Indian populations reflects geographical and prehistorical factors rather
    than the practices of Hinduism or Islam. "

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    Quote Originally Posted by MonkeyDLuffy View Post
    This is very interesting because Khatris who moved after partition are known to marry among cousins. Infact Sikh Khatris are the only Sikhs I've seen who marry in their cousins. I know 3 family friends who did that. Had few coworkers and classmates who did that. It includes both Hindu and Sikh Khatris, and confirmed roots from west Punjab.
    Just talked to mom and dad. They said they have heard (and seen) that 2nd and 3rd cousins will sometimes marry. It is not common though.

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  10. #16
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    Consanguinity survey
    http://consang.net/index.php/Summary

    Although marriages between close biological kin are preferential in many parts of the world, there still is a great lack of knowledge of this central feature of human kinship structure. As an introduction to the subject, brief summaries are presented on topics such as the religious and legal backgrounds to consanguineous marriage in different societies, sociodemographic aspects of marriages between close biological kin, fertility in consanguineous unions, and the effects of consanguinity on rates and patterns of morbidity and mortality.

    With the exception of Japan, which has undergone rapid industrialization and urbanization since World War II, past predictions of a rapid decline in the overall prevalence of consanguineous unions have proved to be largely incorrect. In fact, the recorded numbers of consanguineous unions appear to have grown at least in step with increasing national and regional populations, and in some economically less developed countries the proportion of marriages contracted between close biological kin has expanded. The simplest explanation for this observation is that as greater numbers of children survive to marriageable age, the traditional social preference for consanguineous unions can be more readily accommodated.

    Migrant communities now permanently resident in Western countries may represent a special case, especially where they practice a religion not followed by the majority indigenous population. In such communities, the available evidence from Western Europe, North America and Australasia suggests that the prevalence of consanguineous unions is increasing, in many cases from an already high level (for example, de Costa 1988; Modell 1991; Hoodfar and Teebi 1996; Reniers 1998). Various reasons can be advanced for this finding, including the desire to find a marital partner from within the community, which itself may be numerically small and composed of a restricted number of kindreds, and the wish to maintain community traditions in a new and unfamiliar environment. However, explanations of this type underestimate the strong belief that marriage within the family, as opposed solely to community endogamy, is the most desirable and reliable marital option (Bittleset al. 1991; Hussain and Bittles 1998; Hussain 1999). As previously noted, the current increase in the numbers of persons of marriageable age within these communities effectively facilitates the fulfillment of this belief.


  11. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by tipirneni View Post

    LOL why does India have its states outlined, but the rest of the world is explored by country?

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  13. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by midichlorian View Post
    LOL why does India have its states outlined, but the rest of the world is explored by country?
    Well obvious, lot of populations are Caste & State specific.

  14. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by tipirneni View Post
    Consanguinity survey
    http://consang.net/index.php/Summary

    Although marriages between close biological kin are preferential in many parts of the world, there still is a great lack of knowledge of this central feature of human kinship structure. As an introduction to the subject, brief summaries are presented on topics such as the religious and legal backgrounds to consanguineous marriage in different societies, sociodemographic aspects of marriages between close biological kin, fertility in consanguineous unions, and the effects of consanguinity on rates and patterns of morbidity and mortality.

    With the exception of Japan, which has undergone rapid industrialization and urbanization since World War II, past predictions of a rapid decline in the overall prevalence of consanguineous unions have proved to be largely incorrect. In fact, the recorded numbers of consanguineous unions appear to have grown at least in step with increasing national and regional populations, and in some economically less developed countries the proportion of marriages contracted between close biological kin has expanded. The simplest explanation for this observation is that as greater numbers of children survive to marriageable age, the traditional social preference for consanguineous unions can be more readily accommodated.

    Migrant communities now permanently resident in Western countries may represent a special case, especially where they practice a religion not followed by the majority indigenous population. In such communities, the available evidence from Western Europe, North America and Australasia suggests that the prevalence of consanguineous unions is increasing, in many cases from an already high level (for example, de Costa 1988; Modell 1991; Hoodfar and Teebi 1996; Reniers 1998). Various reasons can be advanced for this finding, including the desire to find a marital partner from within the community, which itself may be numerically small and composed of a restricted number of kindreds, and the wish to maintain community traditions in a new and unfamiliar environment. However, explanations of this type underestimate the strong belief that marriage within the family, as opposed solely to community endogamy, is the most desirable and reliable marital option (Bittleset al. 1991; Hussain and Bittles 1998; Hussain 1999). As previously noted, the current increase in the numbers of persons of marriageable age within these communities effectively facilitates the fulfillment of this belief.

    I heard that in parts of South India they sometimes marry their nieces, must be why the consanguinity rate is relatively high there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Berdy View Post
    I heard that in parts of South India they sometimes marry their nieces, must be why the consanguinity rate is relatively high there.
    Thats right, and it must be more common in AP and TN as the first I ever heard of it was on this forum.

    Kerala seems lighter in that map

    Probably a Dravidian tradition

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