Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 11 to 20 of 23

Thread: Why would my grandmother score this on 23andme?

  1. #11
    Registered Users
    Posts
    1,171
    Sex
    Location
    Viseu
    Ethnicity
    Romanised Paesuri
    Nationality
    Portuguese
    Y-DNA
    E-BY36857
    mtDNA
    H20

    Portugal 1143 Portugal 1485 Portugal Order of Christ
    Quote Originally Posted by Sikeliot View Post
    I am sorry you find it insulting you may have a Sub-Saharan African ancestor, but Senegambian slaves to Madeira, Azores, and a lesser extent the Portuguese mainland are documented.
    Always the dishonest, you never change
    Last edited by Ruderico; 01-16-2019 at 01:39 AM.
    YDNA - E-Y31991>PF4428>BY36857. Domingos Rodrigues, b. circa 1680 Hidden Content , Viana do Castelo, Portugal
    mtDNA - H20. Maria Josefa de Almeida, b. circa 1750 Hidden Content , Porto, Portugal

    Global25 PCA West Eurasia dataset Hidden Content
    Hidden Content


    [1] "distance%=1.7726"

    Ruderico

    Celtiberian,77.6
    Roman_Imperial_proxy,13.6
    Guanche,8.8

  2. #12
    Registered Users
    Posts
    410
    Sex
    Omitted
    Nationality
    Canadian
    Y-DNA
    E-V32
    mtDNA
    L0a1*

    Somaliland Ethiopia Arab League Adal Sultanate
    Quote Originally Posted by Sikeliot View Post
    She is Portuguese, with some further back Cape Verdean heritage.

    The African heritage she has comes up mostly as "Senegambian and Guinean" which makes sense, but she gets a tiny bit of something called "Southern East Africa" which is centered on Kenya, Tanzania, Rwanda, Burundi, and Uganda. And it predicts the full blooded ancestor as having lived in the 1700s.

    I cannot imagine there were any slaves that came from this region to Madeira or Cape Verde. Why would she be scoring that?
    Didn't the Portuguese control Mozambique? Perhaps it comes from there

  3. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to drobbah For This Useful Post:

     Lugus (01-16-2019),  Sikeliot (01-16-2019)

  4. #13
    Registered Users
    Posts
    2,836
    Sex
    Location
    USA
    Nationality
    American
    Y-DNA
    R1a1a
    mtDNA
    H

    United States of America
    Quote Originally Posted by Ruderico View Post
    Always the dishonest, you never change
    Despite being presented with evidence of Sub-Saharan input into Madeira from Senegambia you deny it, so I don't expect you to believe that it is present in lower levels still on parts of the mainland. You can deny it but the evidence is against you, so carry on.

  5. The Following User Says Thank You to Sikeliot For This Useful Post:

     JerryS. (01-17-2019)

  6. #14
    Registered Users
    Posts
    1,171
    Sex
    Location
    Viseu
    Ethnicity
    Romanised Paesuri
    Nationality
    Portuguese
    Y-DNA
    E-BY36857
    mtDNA
    H20

    Portugal 1143 Portugal 1485 Portugal Order of Christ
    Quote Originally Posted by Sikeliot View Post
    Despite being presented with evidence of Sub-Saharan input into Madeira from Senegambia you deny it, so I don't expect you to believe that it is present in lower levels still on parts of the mainland. You can deny it but the evidence is against you, so carry on.
    Yes, if your unsourced extrapolations were evidence. But they are not, it's just your decade-long obsession with it
    YDNA - E-Y31991>PF4428>BY36857. Domingos Rodrigues, b. circa 1680 Hidden Content , Viana do Castelo, Portugal
    mtDNA - H20. Maria Josefa de Almeida, b. circa 1750 Hidden Content , Porto, Portugal

    Global25 PCA West Eurasia dataset Hidden Content
    Hidden Content


    [1] "distance%=1.7726"

    Ruderico

    Celtiberian,77.6
    Roman_Imperial_proxy,13.6
    Guanche,8.8

  7. #15
    Registered Users
    Posts
    280
    Sex
    Ethnicity
    Portuguese
    Y-DNA
    R1b DF27
    mtDNA
    H5a2

    Portugal
    Some reading material that might contribute to the debate:

    http://www.upenn.edu/pennpress/book/15140.html

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trans-Saharan_trade

    The Portuguese age of discovery was initially propelled by the goal of of reaching the sources of gold and slaves in West Africa and overtaking the Trans-Saharan route by sea.
    Father's mtDNA: T1a1
    Maternal YDNA: R-L21 Z251

  8. #16
    Registered Users
    Posts
    2,836
    Sex
    Location
    USA
    Nationality
    American
    Y-DNA
    R1a1a
    mtDNA
    H

    United States of America
    Quote Originally Posted by Ruderico View Post
    Yes, if your unsourced extrapolations were evidence. But they are not, it's just your decade-long obsession with it
    Madeira's population was once 10% African slaves most of whom were Senegambian. Where exactly do you think all of them went? They are mixed into the general white population, consistent with the 12-15% of mtdna L there.

    I remember you once claimed that the people with SSA input in Madeira shouldn't be considered Portuguese.. but guess what, they are.

  9. #17
    Registered Users
    Posts
    1,171
    Sex
    Location
    Viseu
    Ethnicity
    Romanised Paesuri
    Nationality
    Portuguese
    Y-DNA
    E-BY36857
    mtDNA
    H20

    Portugal 1143 Portugal 1485 Portugal Order of Christ
    Quote Originally Posted by Sikeliot View Post
    Madeira's population was once 10% African slaves most of whom were Senegambian. Where exactly do you think all of them went? They are mixed into the general white population, consistent with the 12-15% of mtdna L there.

    I remember you once claimed that the people with SSA input in Madeira shouldn't be considered Portuguese.. but guess what, they are.
    That's precisely what I meant when I referenced your "unsourced extrapolations" taken from a quote referencing a particular rough figure form the 1700s in Madeira, and using as it if applied to the entire country, yet you have no idea on the social and population dynamics of the country from the period. Besides most of those individuals did not necessarily leave a lot of descent, it's not like they had happy and free lives like the rest of the colonials. Not that it matters, because the overwhelming majority of modern continental Iberians do not have ancestors who lived in the islands, so it's irrelevant.
    Finally, as can be seen in many 23andme results, it's not only Portuguese who score residual scores of Senegambian, Nigerian or whatever. You have British and French forum users who also score it, besides the countless other Portuguese and Spanish individuals on the platform itself. Maybe there was an unregistered continental-wide phenomena in the 1700s in which people suddently decided to "have an illegitimate affair with slaves" for whatever reason, even in regions where there are no documents that indicate their presence. Or maybe - just maybe - values like 0,2% shouldn't be taken literally


    Besides I NEVER made that last claim - which you obviously cannot source. I'm reporting you for spreading accusatory lies, it's completely unnaceptable that you try to fake your way out of this by framing something that preposterous on me.
    Last edited by Ruderico; 01-16-2019 at 12:37 PM.
    YDNA - E-Y31991>PF4428>BY36857. Domingos Rodrigues, b. circa 1680 Hidden Content , Viana do Castelo, Portugal
    mtDNA - H20. Maria Josefa de Almeida, b. circa 1750 Hidden Content , Porto, Portugal

    Global25 PCA West Eurasia dataset Hidden Content
    Hidden Content


    [1] "distance%=1.7726"

    Ruderico

    Celtiberian,77.6
    Roman_Imperial_proxy,13.6
    Guanche,8.8

  10. #18
    Registered Users
    Posts
    2,836
    Sex
    Location
    USA
    Nationality
    American
    Y-DNA
    R1a1a
    mtDNA
    H

    United States of America
    Quote Originally Posted by Ruderico View Post
    Besides I NEVER made that last claim - which you obviously cannot source. I'm reporting you for spreading accusatory lies, it's completely unnaceptable that you try to fake your way out of this by framing something that preposterous on me.
    You said they aren't Madeiran but probably descended from Venezuelans and/or Brazilians. Did you not? I am not saying this to attack you, but you have been relentless in denying any possibility of Sub-Saharan input into the Madeiran population and claiming the people I posted DNA results for who scored it are not native to the island.

    I can easily source my claim that you do not believe any Madeiran scoring SSA should be considered Madeiran or Portuguese.

    See this thread: https://www.theapricity.com/forum/sh...deira-Portugal!


    You said that this person I posted, with below 5% Sub-Saharan input, is not a real Portuguese, no different than an African living in Portugal:

    There's plenty of africans both in Portugal and Madeira, and admixed people. I don't consider them ethnic portuguese though.
    I don't think i need to repeat myself again on what my definition of what ethnic portuguese is. I think i was very clear.
    Listen, I am NOT here to argue, I am here to discuss why my grandmother scores Southeastern Bantu DNA. THAT IS ALL.

  11. #19
    Gold Class Member
    Posts
    11,105
    Sex
    Location
    Virginia, USA
    Ethnicity
    British and Irish
    Nationality
    USA
    Y-DNA
    R1b-FGC36981
    mtDNA
    U5a2c3a

    Wales Ireland Scotland France Bretagne England Switzerland
    Is one or two tenths of a percent of anything much of anything? How can we be sure something so minuscule represents anything real?

    That's not even 1%, not even close, and 1% isn't much.
     


    Hidden Content


    Y-DNA: R1b-FGC36981 (L21> DF13> Z39589> CTS2501> Z43690> Y8426> BY160> FGC36974>FGC36982 >FGC36981)

    Additional Data:
    Lactase Persistent:
    rs4988235 AA (13910 TT)
    rs182549 TT (22018 AA)

    Red Hair Carrier:
    Arg160Trp+ (rs1805008 T) aka R160W

    Dad's mtDNA: K1a1

  12. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to rms2 For This Useful Post:

     DMXX (01-16-2019),  JMcB (01-16-2019),  Ruderico (01-16-2019)

  13. #20
    Registered Users
    Posts
    1,171
    Sex
    Location
    Viseu
    Ethnicity
    Romanised Paesuri
    Nationality
    Portuguese
    Y-DNA
    E-BY36857
    mtDNA
    H20

    Portugal 1143 Portugal 1485 Portugal Order of Christ
    Quote Originally Posted by Sikeliot View Post
    You said they aren't Madeiran but probably descended from Venezuelans and/or Brazilians. Did you not? I am not saying this to attack you, but you have been relentless in denying any possibility of Sub-Saharan input into the Madeiran population and claiming the people I posted DNA results for who scored it are not native to the island.

    I can easily source my claim that you do not believe any Madeiran scoring SSA should be considered Madeiran or Portuguese.

    See this thread: https://www.theapricity.com/forum/sh...deira-Portugal!


    You said that this person I posted, with below 5% Sub-Saharan input, is not a real Portuguese, no different than an African living in Portugal:





    Listen, I am NOT here to argue, I am here to discuss why my grandmother scores Southeastern Bantu DNA. THAT IS ALL.
    Very funny but that isn't me. You have been reported
    YDNA - E-Y31991>PF4428>BY36857. Domingos Rodrigues, b. circa 1680 Hidden Content , Viana do Castelo, Portugal
    mtDNA - H20. Maria Josefa de Almeida, b. circa 1750 Hidden Content , Porto, Portugal

    Global25 PCA West Eurasia dataset Hidden Content
    Hidden Content


    [1] "distance%=1.7726"

    Ruderico

    Celtiberian,77.6
    Roman_Imperial_proxy,13.6
    Guanche,8.8

Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Italian gg grandmother.
    By Blakiston in forum General
    Replies: 59
    Last Post: 09-12-2018, 07:25 PM
  2. Replies: 2
    Last Post: 11-05-2017, 11:19 AM
  3. YNDA From Paternal Grandmother
    By RogCH2 in forum General
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 04-06-2017, 11:22 AM
  4. Colonial American Grandmother's 23andme Results
    By mapuajames in forum Autosomal (auDNA)
    Replies: 18
    Last Post: 05-16-2016, 05:22 AM
  5. Your nonword reading score on 23andme?
    By Piquerobi in forum 23andMe
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 05-21-2015, 01:14 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •