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Thread: Corded Ware A-Horizon and P310/P311/L52

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    Corded Ware A-Horizon and P310/P311/L52

    With datasets from Poland, Switzerland and France coming out in just the past two weeks, now is a good time to reflect on the likeliest of scenarios for the spread of R-L51. Here is an outline in the order that the datasets appeared.

    Lesser Poland (Małopolska):
    Four Corded Ware Culture (CWC) samples from Łubcze and Święte were found to be derived for at least one R1b1a1b1a1 equivalent SNP (P310/PF6546/S129, L52/PF6541, P311/PF6545/S128, PF6540/YSC0000082). However, all samples were ancestral for at least one R1b1a1b1a1a equivalent SNP (L151/PF6542, L11, PF6543/S1159/YSC0000191). Due to lower coverage, four other samples could only be classified as M269, L23, L51 and L52 respectively, but all were ancestral for L151. The P310 samples were radiocarbon tested to between 2479 cal BC and 2349 cal BC, which places them in the final CWC phase of Małopolska CWC chronology. Their genetic variation overlaps with the majority of previously published CWC individuals from Germany and not with Bell Beaker Culture samples from anywhere in Central Europe. That they are ancestral to L151 et al. and that older samples of L151 exist elsewhere (see the Switzerland section below), makes it impossible for these specific samples to be the ancestors of modern day L151. However, they share their P310 ancestry with L151 men that may have moved from the forest steppe/steppe through the region and onto Western Europe. While the exact origin further east is still unclear, it is noteworthy that theses CWC samples shared more genetic drift with Russia_Afanasievo than with Yamnaya, which may explain why Z2103 dominates in Yamnaya but not in Corded Ware nor Central European Bell Beaker.

    Switzerland:
    All samples from Switzerland in the study with radiocarbon dates older than 2800 BC belonged to haplogroup G2a. The only pre-2800 BC non-G2a sample from the study was from Lingolsheim, Alsace, France, who belonged to haplogroup I2a1b. It is only post 2800 BC that L151 appears in the form of Aesch25. While has was buried in a Neolithic dolmen, he was chronologically the last one buried of the samples that produced DNA (2864-2501 cal BC). Due to his high steppe ancestry, he too overlaps with other Corded Ware samples and is nothing like the others buried in the dolmen. He is as genetically different from them as modern Sardinians are to modern northern Russians. More importantly, and unlike the Małopolska samples, he was also derived at L151, meaning his Y-DNA was more related to Bell Beaker samples. However, he is not likely to have been the direct descendant of Bell Beaker P312 men as he was also ancestral at P312 and U106 and both were likely already in existence. Also of interest from this study is another sample from Lingolsheim which is derived at P310, P311, and CTS7650 but is ancestral at P312 and U106. He is dated to the Bell Beaker period (2463-2208 cal BC) but nonetheless shows another branch off from the main Bell Beaker line. The prior reporting of a Proto-Nagyrev L11 (xP312,U106), albeit from a much younger sample, makes it very unlikely that L11 arose anywhere as far west as Switzerland.

    When considering the quick movement from east to west and the lack of CWC pottery in the Aesch25 dolmen, the CWC A-Horizon seems like a fairly good bet as a vector for L151. Here is the CWC circa 2900 BC:



    By 2750 BC, all CWC regions were using what is considered CWC pottery or regional variants like that of the Single Grave Culture. Here is a map to illustrate:



    France:
    Only the sampled raw data has been released so far, but the samples include time period labels of Mesolithic, Neolithic, Bell Beaker Bronze Age and Iron Age. No M269 samples were found prior to the Bell Beaker period. All Mesolithic and Neolithic samples belonged to I2a, although a prior study from the Late Neolithic Treilles Culture also had G2a. The earliest M269 sample from the study was Bell Beaker sample CBV95 from Ciry-Salsogne in north-east France. Unfortunately, the sample did not produce calls for anything downstream. He was buried with an All-Over Corded beaker, a Grand Pressigny flint dagger and a bow-shape pendant and dates to 2574-2452 cal BC. The position of his burial is interesting; he is buried in the W-E Corded Ware manner, but is on his back with knees bent upward, which is a Yamnaya tradition. He too plots with Corded Ware samples and perhaps shows a transition from Single Grave Culture to Bell Beaker. In the Netherlands, All Over Corded pottery is attributed to Single Grave Culture and Grand Pressigny flint daggers are common in SGC burials. The two Late Neolithic (2750-2725 BC) males buried in the Dolmen of La Pierre Fritte and belonging to I2a1 (Lacan et al. 2011) likely represent the older male population of Northern France. Both I2a and G2a were present in the Late Neolithic (3000 BC) Treilles males from Languedoc.

    My Conclusion:
    It is now fact-based to say that both L11 lineages and steppe ancestry reached the Rhine and beyond around 2700 BC. The appearance of P310(xL151) CWC samples in Poland and the fact that the best fit for the non-steppe component of Central European Bell Beaker samples is the Globular Amphora Culture makes it quite possible that L11 males took a more northern route than the traditionally held Yamnaya-Danube route. A rather large area is required to have P312 and U106’s major sublclades develop and expand, with the Single Grave Culture serving as a perfect launching point. That Dutch P312 and British L21 are the Bell Beaker samples with the most CWC ancestry and with U106 appearing in Early Bronze Age Netherlands and Swedish Battle Axe Culture sample further supports SGC as a strong candidate.
    Paternal: R1b-U152 >> L2 >> FGC10543 >> PR5365, Pietro Rocca, b. 1559, Agira, Sicily, Italy
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    Father's Maternal: T2b-C150T, Francisca Santa Cruz, b.1916, Garganchon, Burgos, Spain
    Paternal Great (x3) Grandfather: R1b-U106 >> L48 >> CTS2509, Filippo Ensabella, b.~1836, Agira, Sicily, Italy

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    Does the source for the top map have any info on CWC pre 2900 BC or which CWC site is the oldest?

    Of course there is no gurantee oldest CWC sites are the ones containing L151.
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    Quote Originally Posted by R.Rocca View Post
    With datasets from Poland, Switzerland and France coming out in just the past two weeks, now is a good time to reflect on the likeliest of scenarios for the spread of R-L51. Here is an outline in the order that the datasets appeared.

    Lesser Poland (Małopolska):
    Four Corded Ware Culture (CWC) samples from Łubcze and Święte were found to be derived for at least one R1b1a1b1a1 equivalent SNP (P310/PF6546/S129, L52/PF6541, P311/PF6545/S128, PF6540/YSC0000082). However, all samples were ancestral for at least one R1b1a1b1a1a equivalent SNP (L151/PF6542, L11, PF6543/S1159/YSC0000191). Due to lower coverage, four other samples could only be classified as M269, L23, L51 and L52 respectively, but all were ancestral for L151. The P310 samples were radiocarbon tested to between 2479 cal BC and 2349 cal BC, which places them in the final CWC phase of Małopolska CWC chronology. Their genetic variation overlaps with the majority of previously published CWC individuals from Germany and not with Bell Beaker Culture samples from anywhere in Central Europe. That they are ancestral to L151 et al. and that older samples of L151 exist elsewhere (see the Switzerland section below), makes it impossible for these specific samples to be the ancestors of modern day L151. However, they share their P310 ancestry with L151 men that may have moved from the forest steppe/steppe through the region and onto Western Europe. While the exact origin further east is still unclear, it is noteworthy that theses CWC samples shared more genetic drift with Russia_Afanasievo than with Yamnaya, which may explain why Z2103 dominates in Yamnaya but not in Corded Ware nor Central European Bell Beaker.

    Switzerland:
    All samples from Switzerland in the study with radiocarbon dates older than 2800 BC belonged to haplogroup G2a. The only pre-2800 BC non-G2a sample from the study was from Lingolsheim, Alsace, France, who belonged to haplogroup I2a1b. It is only post 2800 BC that L151 appears in the form of Aesch25. While has was buried in a Neolithic dolmen, he was chronologically the last one buried of the samples that produced DNA (2864-2501 cal BC). Due to his high steppe ancestry, he too overlaps with other Corded Ware samples and is nothing like the others buried in the dolmen. He is as genetically different from them as modern Sardinians are to modern northern Russians. More importantly, and unlike the Małopolska samples, he was also derived at L151, meaning his Y-DNA was more related to Bell Beaker samples. However, he is not likely to have been the direct descendant of Bell Beaker P312 men as he was also ancestral at P312 and U106 and both were likely already in existence. Also of interest from this study is another sample from Lingolsheim which is derived at P310, P311, and CTS7650 but is ancestral at P312 and U106. He is dated to the Bell Beaker period (2463-2208 cal BC) but nonetheless shows another branch off from the main Bell Beaker line. The prior reporting of a Proto-Nagyrev L11 (xP312,U106), albeit from a much younger sample, makes it very unlikely that L11 arose anywhere as far west as Switzerland.

    When considering the quick movement from east to west and the lack of CWC pottery in the Aesch25 dolmen, the CWC A-Horizon seems like a fairly good bet as a vector for L151. Here is the CWC circa 2900 BC:



    By 2750 BC, all CWC regions were using what is considered CWC pottery or regional variants like that of the Single Grave Culture. Here is a map to illustrate:



    France:
    Only the sampled raw data has been released so far, but the samples include time period labels of Mesolithic, Neolithic, Bell Beaker Bronze Age and Iron Age. No M269 samples were found prior to the Bell Beaker period. All Mesolithic and Neolithic samples belonged to I2a, although a prior study from the Late Neolithic Treilles Culture also had G2a. The earliest M269 sample from the study was Bell Beaker sample CBV95 from Ciry-Salsogne in north-east France. Unfortunately, the sample did not produce calls for anything downstream. He was buried with an All-Over Corded beaker, a Grand Pressigny flint dagger and a bow-shape pendant and dates to 2574-2452 cal BC. The position of his burial is interesting; he is buried in the W-E Corded Ware manner, but is on his back with knees bent upward, which is a Yamnaya tradition. He too plots with Corded Ware samples and perhaps shows a transition from Single Grave Culture to Bell Beaker. In the Netherlands, All Over Corded pottery is attributed to Single Grave Culture and Grand Pressigny flint daggers are common in SGC burials. The two Late Neolithic (2750-2725 BC) males buried in the Dolmen of La Pierre Fritte and belonging to I2a1 (Lacan et al. 2011) likely represent the older male population of Northern France. Both I2a and G2a were present in the Late Neolithic (3000 BC) Treilles males from Languedoc.

    My Conclusion:
    It is now fact-based to say that both L11 lineages and steppe ancestry reached the Rhine and beyond around 2700 BC. The appearance of P310(xL151) CWC samples in Poland and the fact that the best fit for the non-steppe component of Central European Bell Beaker samples is the Globular Amphora Culture makes it quite possible that L11 males took a more northern route than the traditionally held Yamnaya-Danube route. A rather large area is required to have P312 and U106’s major sublclades develop and expand, with the Single Grave Culture serving as a perfect launching point. That Dutch P312 and British L21 are the Bell Beaker samples with the most CWC ancestry and with U106 appearing in Early Bronze Age Netherlands and Swedish Battle Axe Culture sample further supports SGC as a strong candidate.


    It is well known since 2018 that the non steppe component in Yamnaya is Globular Amphora like ( WHG rich EEF). So a direct and rapid movement from a Yamnaya group from the steppe ( without marry out) following even a Danubian route will not be easily detected and distinguished from a more northern one. I'm not saying that it is not likely but that the farmer component argument is rather weak.
    Also I'm curious about the Auvernier sample which IIRC was of the same age of the Swiss one. You did not mention that. What about his burial and genome wide profile?

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    Great thread and very timely.

    Am also of the opinion (restated: 'an opinion') that L51 via the Carpathian Basin and Danube is unsustainable. AFAICT There is nothing among ancient burials to back that old line of argument up.

    IMHO L51 was already in Europe (nth & west - as pointed out in the parent post) by at least 4700 ybp and apparently ahead of Yamnaya arrival in the Carpathian Basin. The only evidence supporting Yamnaya in the Carpathian points to R1b-Z2103 + I2.

    L151 is showing as emerging post these Sth Poland finds.

    Some more expected papers may well explain this in attention getting detail.
    Last edited by dsm; 04-28-2020 at 09:30 PM. Reason: minor clarity + 1 typo
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    L151 child clades P312==U106==S1194==A8053
    NOTE: S1200 & A8039 are child clades of S1194
    Also note: S1200==CTS4528, and S1203==DF100

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    Quote Originally Posted by dsm View Post
    Great thread and very timely.

    Am also of the opinion (restated: 'an opinion') that L51 via the Carpathian Basin and Danube is unsustainable. AFAICT There is nothing among ancient burials to back that old line of argument up.

    IMHO L51 was already in Europe (nth & west - as pointed out in the parent post) 4750 ybp and apparently ahead of Yamnaya arrival in the Carpathian Basin. The only evidnce supporting Yamnaya in the Carpathian points to R1b-Z2103 + I2.

    L151 is showing as emerging post these Sth Poland finds.

    Some more expected papers may well explain this in attention getting detail.
    Really, never heard that. We have a clear western Yamnaya culture which is Budzak in Romania, Moldova and western Ukraine already in the late 4th millennium.
    Also we have R1b L51 in Afanasevo which is basically a copy and paste culture of Yamnaya.
    Last edited by etrusco; 04-28-2020 at 09:03 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MitchellSince1893 View Post
    Does the source for the top map have any info on CWC pre 2900 BC or which CWC site is the oldest?

    Of course there is no gurantee oldest CWC sites are the ones containing L151.
    It is from Furholt (2003). Absolutchronologie und die Entstehung der Schnurkeramik. Be aware that almost all of the radiocarbon dates from Poland with the prefix "KI-" have been discredited as subsequent dating of the same materials by other labs consistently produce a younger result. That is not to say CWC in Poland is not older though, just something to be aware of.
    Last edited by R.Rocca; 04-28-2020 at 11:01 AM.
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    Father's Maternal: T2b-C150T, Francisca Santa Cruz, b.1916, Garganchon, Burgos, Spain
    Paternal Great (x3) Grandfather: R1b-U106 >> L48 >> CTS2509, Filippo Ensabella, b.~1836, Agira, Sicily, Italy

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    Quote Originally Posted by etrusco View Post
    It is well known since 2018 that the non steppe component in Yamnaya is Globular Amphora like ( WHG rich EEF). So a direct and rapid movement from a Yamnaya group from the steppe ( without marry out) following even a Danubian route will not be easily detected and distinguished from a more northern one. I'm not saying that it is not likely but that the farmer component argument is rather weak.
    You are right to say that a rapid movement is not easily detectable. However, what we don't see is any Danubian Copper Age ancestry in L11 samples, so whatever weakness is perceived in the GAC/northern argument is an even weaker argument in the Danubian one.

    Quote Originally Posted by etrusco View Post
    Also I'm curious about the Auvernier sample which IIRC was of the same age of the Swiss one. You did not mention that. What about his burial and genome wide profile?
    The Auvernier sample was not radiocarbon tested and his dating was based on someone else who was buried in the same communal grave. The dolmen was used up to the Bronze Age. Without a radiocarbon date, he is as useful as the samples from Spain that are labeled "Bell Beaker" because they have a pottery shard thrown in even though the grave contains dozens of individuals. Of the 96 individuals in this study, MX304 had the fourth fewest amount of SNP calls, so it is a very low coverage sample.
    Paternal: R1b-U152 >> L2 >> FGC10543 >> PR5365, Pietro Rocca, b. 1559, Agira, Sicily, Italy
    Maternal: H4a1-T152C!, Maria Coto, b. ~1864, Galicia, Spain
    Mother's Paternal: J1+ FGC4745/FGC4766+ PF5019+, Gerardo Caprio, b. 1879, Caposele, Avellino, Campania, Italy
    Father's Maternal: T2b-C150T, Francisca Santa Cruz, b.1916, Garganchon, Burgos, Spain
    Paternal Great (x3) Grandfather: R1b-U106 >> L48 >> CTS2509, Filippo Ensabella, b.~1836, Agira, Sicily, Italy

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    Quote Originally Posted by R.Rocca View Post
    It is from Furholt (2003). Absolutchronologie und die Entstehung der Schnurkeramik. Be aware that almost all of the radiocarbon dates from Poland with the prefix "KI-" have been discarded as subsequent dating of the same materials by other labs constantly produce a younger result. That is not to say CWC in Poland is not older though, just something to be aware of.
    I'm a bit wary of Furholt's dates. Apparently he dated the individual in Lilla Bed[d]inge Grave 53 to 3350-2880 cal BCE, but in according to Fornander 2013 Dietary diversity and moderate mobility – isotope evidence from Scanian Battle Axe Culture burials it was dated in Ahlström 2009 Underjordiska dödsriken. Humanosteologiska studier av neolitiska kollektivgravar and using a 2010 OxCal calibration curve ends up as 2872–2476 cal BCE.

    To thicken the plot, Fornander based on Ahlström also gives the individual we know as RISE94 (by her called Håslöv Grave 26) a date of 2866–2467 cal BCE, but in Allentoft 2015 (which has Ahlström as co-author) it's 2621-2472 cal BCE. And correspondingly RISE98 (NOT a Battle Axe Culture grave, BTW) goes from Ahlström/Fornander's 2476–2141 cal BCE to Allentoft's 2275-2032 cal BCE.

    So the dates are going increasingly younger. It's not adjustments for marine reservoir effects, as Allentoft states that such adjustments were not done to his dates, but Allentoft used even newer calibration curves, so I guess that must be the reason.

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    It seems that R1b-L51 and R1a-M417 in Corded Ware have been established. The issue now is where Corded Ware came from. Y-dna, autosomal dna and cultural characteristics say the steppe. But where exactly and how and by what route?

    If one reads the older literature (some of it not so old), he will see that the experts did not agree on the genesis of Corded Ware. Many of them thought it was native to the North European Plain and had roots in TRB. Gimbutas and Mallory, among others, attributed Corded Ware to the steppe, and they have been proven right.

    But now we are all interested in the genesis of Corded Ware on the steppe, in the Eneolithic cultures of the steppe.

    BTW, Yamnaya in the Carpathian basin is a big unknown in terms of ancient dna. I'd wait before pronouncing it all Z2103 and a done deal. I'm not saying it's the source of L51 in Corded Ware; I'm just urging caution.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rms2 View Post
    It seems that R1b-L51 and R1a-M417 in Corded Ware have been established. The issue now is where Corded Ware came from. Y-dna, autosomal dna and cultural characteristics say the steppe. But where exactly and how and by what route?

    If one reads the older literature (some of it not so old), he will see that the experts did not agree on the genesis of Corded Ware. Many of them thought it was native to the North European Plain and had roots in TRB. Gimbutas and Mallory, among others, attributed Corded Ware to the steppe, and they have been proven right.

    But now we are all interested in the genesis of Corded Ware on the steppe, in the Eneolithic cultures of the steppe.

    BTW, Yamnaya in the Carpathian basin is a big unknown in terms of ancient dna. I'd wait before pronouncing it all Z2103 and a done deal. I'm not saying it's the source of L51 in Corded Ware; I'm just urging caution.
    That is a very good point. Even despite all the ancient DNA evidence being added to the archaeological evidence, archaeologists still dont know exactly where the steppe part of CW (which in the early days was most of it) came from.

    Anyway, I was reading recently about Estonian CW (which some think is the source of Swedish battle axe) and they only have a few graves but they are interesting. This was the the same tradition as Swedish battle axe which had bell beaker-style burial position with a north-south orientation with the males heads at the north, facing east. Like this guy from Ardu grave II in Estonia who appears to date to around 2720BC https://www.researchgate.net/figure/...fig1_255716945.

    Re-reading the Supplementary Text from The genomic ancestry of the Scandinavian Battle Axe Culture people and their relation to the broader Corded Ware horizon I also noted a CW burial Obłaczkowo, Wielkopolska, Poland dating to around 2750BC had a N-S orientation. Apparently an early example of a grouping found in Wielkopolska and Kujawy.

    In the same paper I also noted that the (R1a) Swedish battle axe samples chosen all had the classic CW E-W orientation rather than the N-S one that apparently is far more common is battle axe Sweden. That IMO is a bit of a blunder. Selecting archaeologically atypical samples. Whats the bets that the N-S orientated Swedes will turn out to be L151? I think they might well be. It does, however, suggest the Swedes may have had a couple of waves or traditions in their battle axe culture, something that never struck me before.

    So, it seems to me that there were two CW burial traditions from a fairly early period. One was a beaker type N-S orientation and gender orientation preferences. This seems to have existed in Poland and Estonia at least 200 years before steppe bell beaker existed anywhere. I think this was also dominant in battle axe Sweden. The other was the classic CW E-W type burial and gender orientations which dominated central Europe between the Oder and the Rhine (including Denmark and Holland on its northern edge). I bet that to at least a large degree this corresponds with a division between R1b and R1a. I really need to find some time to dig into this more.

    Again, this makes me think bell beaker spread from a more easterly N-S burying CW tradition that was apparently known pretty early in the CW sequence in parts of Poland, Estonia and Sweden and in Fatyanovo too.
    Last edited by alan; 04-28-2020 at 03:58 PM.

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