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Thread: On the origin of E-M183

  1. #121
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pribislav View Post
    Speaking of the final nail in the coffin, but not the coffin you expected...
    The Berber lineages are E-V65 and E-V13. The glaring absence of E-V13 in Pre-Roman Europe and the presence of E-L618 among blackskinned Taforalt people are obvious proofs of its late arrival and its foreign character.

    You Eurocentrists were wrong just like when you claimed that Natufians would be Sardinian-like.

  2. #122
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    Ok lock this thread, and back to Mordor.

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  4. #123
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    >During the Iron Age, Phoenician colonies were established in the Balearic islands. The Ibiza Phoenician individual published in 50 232 is not consistent with forming a clade with any of the Bronze Age individuals from the Balaeric islands newly reported in this study, and indeed we find that she can not be modeled even with our least parsimonious model of 4 distal sources. However, when we add in a North African source of ancestry, we can fit her as a two-way mix of 18.8 ± 7.9% Anatolia_Neolithic and 81.2 ± 7.9% Morocco_LN ancestry (p=0.141) (Supplementary Materials). We also can fit the Ibiza Phoenician as two-way mixture of a variety of groups closer to her in time one of which is always Morocco_LN. While several of these models include a Balaeric Island Bronze Age source, we cannot rule out the possibility that the Ibiza Phoenician individual has no local Balaeric ancestry at all. Specifically, we find that we can fit her with models that do not have a Balaeric source and that instead have Balaeric Bronze Age individuals in the outgroups (e.g. (e.g. 17.1 ± 3.5% France_Bell_Beaker and 82.9 ± 3.5% Morocco_LN, p=0.869) (Supplementary Table 11).

     
    All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.

  5. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shamayim View Post
    All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.
    ...and the truth is you don't have the faintest idea what you're talking about. So, I guess you haven't reached stage three yet?

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  7. #125
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    The truth is that this almost pure-blooded Canaanite can be modeled as 80% North African and 20% European, there is no way to get around that fact. Wannabe Afroasiatic Hurrian pretenders fool none except themselves.


    Quote Originally Posted by Canaan in the Second Millennium B.C.E., Page 3-4
    The earliest indication of the presence of "northern" (i.e., Hurrian and other elements of northern origin) people in the Land of Canaan came from several cuneiform tablets unearthed in Palestine (Anbar and Na'aman 1986-1987:7-11). A few names appear on an envelope fragment from Gezer (Shaffer 1970), one on an letter from Shechem (Birashena)(Shaffer 1970), one on an account tablet from Heberon (Intu) and probably one on a legal document from Hazor (Ḫanuta). The overall number of names from seventeenth century Palestine is too small for any definite conclusion, but it is clear that the majority of the names were West Semitic (Amorite) and that elements of northern origin are nevertheless detected in all four Palestinian cities in which cuneiform tablets were uncovered. We may conclude that the infiltration by northern groups into Canaan had begun by the late-Middle Bronze IIB and that the newcomers mingled with autochthonous Semitic population (Anbar and Na'aman 1986-1987:10-11). In this context, one may further mention the group of metal objects from Shiloh, which have clear northern associations (Finkelstain and Brandl 1985). The archeological conclusion that "This should apparently be connected with the presence of northern groups in Canaan in that period" (ibid.,25) agrees nicely with the documentary evidence.

    In the sixteenth century BCE, there is a gap in documention, and when the mist lifts once more in the second half of the fifteenth century BCE, we find that the number of people of northern origin in the population of Palestine has increased significantly. About one-third of the personal names in the Taanach tablets are of northern, mainly Hurrian origin (Gustavs 1927; 1928; Albright 1944; Landsberger 1954:59 nn. 123-124; Glock 1971; Na'aman 1988a). The presence of a distinctive Hurrian words in the letters sent to the king of Taanach (zarninu, uppašiannu (Na'aman 1988a:179). A document from Shechem attributed to the same period also indicates an appreciable presence of migrants of northern origin (Böhl 1926:322-25; Albright 1942:29-30; Landsberger 1954: 59 n. 123). It is hardly accidental that, from the time of Thutmose III onward, the Egyptians applied the term Ḫ3rw (i.e., Ḫurru) to the inhabitants of Syria-Palestine and that Ḫ3rw as a geographical name is known since the time of Thutmose IV (Gardiner 1947:180-187; Halck 1971:269-270; Vernus 1978).

    The penetration of a large number of Hurrians into Canaan was dominant enough to justify the designation of "Ḫurru" for the land and its inhabitants. The term H3rw is sometimes used quite vaguely, particularly after the time of the Eighteenth Dynasty. As a geographical name, Ḫ3rw usually designated the Asiatic territory under Egyptian control, i.e., the Land of Canaan, and was parallel to the older geographical names of Djahi and Retenu. The thousands of Ḫurru-people mentioned in the booty list of Amenophis II apparently were captured in Canaan (Spalinger 1983). Thutmose IV mentioned Ḫurru-people who were captured at Gezer and settled in Egypt. These and other examples make it clear that the people of Canaan were sometimes regarded by the Egyptians as “Hurrians” (see Edel 1959; 172-173)

  8. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shamayim View Post
    The truth is that this almost pure-blooded Canaanite can be modeled as 80% North African and 20% European, there is no way to get around that fact. Wannabe Afroasiatic Hurrian pretenders fool none except themselves.
    Again, none of this relates to your claims about EV13. You are a troll.

    At least learn something about what you are spamming about. Learn what TMRCA and clades are, and go check the EV13 tree out.


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  10. #127
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    I am aware of E-V13's phylogeny, it formed during the Neolithic and its MRCA date back to the Bronze Age. Most of the subclades under E-CTS1273 also date back to the Bronze Age, indicating an expansion during this period. The problem is that it wasn't found among Bronze Age Europeans, thus, it must have come from somewhere else. Since an Indo-European origin is unlikely, only North Africa is left. A North African origin is corroborated by the fact that it peaks in the Peloponnese where Libyans settled.

    According to Greek sources, Libya was the grandmother of Danaus and Aegyptus. Danaus and his 50 daughters ran way from Aegyptus and his 50 sons, they fled to Argos pursued by Aegptus and his sons. Although most of Aegyptus' sons were killed, Danaus, Aegyptus and one of his sons did settle in Greece. Danaans (sons of Danaus) is one of the names of the Achaeans in the Illiad. I'm not saying that this legend is true but, it attest that there was a powerful migration from Libya. Furthermore, Herodotus also attests that some Greek customs are derived from Libyans.


    The rites which the wandering Libyans use in sacrificing are the following. They begin with the ear of the victim, which they cut off and throw over their house: this done, they kill the animal by twisting the neck. They sacrifice to the Sun and Moon, but not to any other god. This worship is common to all the Libyans. The inhabitants of the parts about Lake Tritonis worship in addition Triton, Neptune, and Minerva, the last especially. The dress wherewith Minerva's statues are adorned, and her Aegis, were derived by the Greeks from the women of Libya. For, except that the garments of the Libyan women are of leather, and their fringes made of leathern thongs instead of serpents, in all else the dress of both is exactly alike. The name too itself shows that the mode of dressing the Pallas-statues came from Libya. For the Libyan women wear over their dress stripped of the hair, fringed at their edges, and colored with vermilion; and from these goat-skins the Greeks get their word Aegis (goat-harness). I think for my part that the loud cries uttered in our sacred rites came also from thence; for the Libyan women are greatly given to such cries and utter them very sweetly. Likewise the Greeks learnt from the Libyans to yoke four horses to a chariot.
    Last edited by Shamayim; Yesterday at 12:58 AM.

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