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Thread: Ancestry Results Reveal a Major Oops!!! Need second Opinions, Please.

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    Ancestry Results Reveal a Major Oops!!! Need second Opinions, Please.

    When I got my results back from Ancestry, I quickly discovered two oops's on my dad's side of the family. They were pretty straightforward and easy to figure out. Several months later I found another oops, but this one on my mom's side. I have a second cousin match who matches both of my mom's parent's families. My grandfather was from Michigan and my grandmother was from Virginia. DNA confirms my grandparents are not related. This match is a second cousin and when I run shared matches with him, matches from my grandfather's family show up as well as matches from my grandmother's family are present. So first, as a second cousin match at high probability, then this means one of his parents is my first cousin, correct? Second, only descendants of both of my grandparents, meaning their children, grandchildren, great-grandchildren, would be genetic matches to both my grandparents, correct?

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    >So first, as a second cousin match at high probability, then this means one of his parents is my first cousin, correct?

    If A and B are second cousins, that means a parent of A and a parent of B are first cousins.

    In contrast, if one of his parents is your first cousin, you are first cousins once removed.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cousin#Examples
    Last edited by pmokeefe; 03-18-2019 at 07:42 PM. Reason: typo
    YFull: YF14620 (Dante Labs 2018)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Webb View Post
    So first, as a second cousin match at high probability, then this means one of his parents is my first cousin, correct? Second, only descendants of both of my grandparents, meaning their children, grandchildren, great-grandchildren, would be genetic matches to both my grandparents, correct?
    No. The matches could be independently related to both grandparents -- they would not have to be their descendants.

    Here's one example. I have a cousin who is both my 3rd cousin once removed and my 3rd cousin twice removed. Her paternal grandfather is my 2nd cousin once removed, which makes her father my 3rd cousin; and her paternal grandmother is my 3rd cousin, which makes her father my 3rd cousin once removed.

    Notice, though, that just because I'm related to both of her grandparents does not make me her grandparents' descendant. I'm related to them upstream, not down. But I wouldn't have had to be related to both of them on the same side -- I could have been independently related to one on my father's side and to the other on my mother's side, for example.

    This doesn't mean they aren't descended from your grandparents, just that they don't necessarily have to be.
    Last edited by geebee; 03-19-2019 at 02:24 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by geebee View Post
    No. The matches could be independently related to both grandparents -- they would not have to be their descendants.
    Thanks for responding. Did I ask this question before? I am having a dejavu moment. I don't see how it could be independent at a second cousin match when my grandparents are themselves not related. He is related to my grandfather's family in Michigan, and my grandmother's family in Virginia. I really suspect his mother is the biological child of one of my uncles.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Webb View Post
    Thanks for responding. Did I ask this question before? I am having a dejavu moment. I don't see how it could be independent at a second cousin match when my grandparents are themselves not related. He is related to my grandfather's family in Michigan, and my grandmother's family in Virginia. I really suspect his mother is the biological child of one of my uncles.
    He could be a descendant of your grandparents but that may not be the case either. Here is an example in my family of how both my parents match someone without being related to each other. My 3x great grandfather's brother Augustine on my dad's side married my 2x great grandmother's sister on my mum's side. The descendants of this couple are related to both my mum and dad without Mary and Augustine being related to each other.
    Ancestry: Ireland (Paper trail ≅ 81.25% Roscommon, 12.5% Galway, 6.25% Mayo)
    Paternal ancestor (Y): Kelly b. c1830 in Co. Roscommon (Uí Maine)
    Father's mtDNA: Fleming b. c1831 in Co. Roscommon (H27e1)
    Maternal ancestor (mt): McDermott b. c1814 in Co. Roscommon
    Paternal great grandfather (mt): Connella b. c1798 in Co. Roscommon (T2a1a8)

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    This kit matches all of my relatives. Every single line on both of my grandparents sides of the family. My grandmother is a Cooper and Tribby. He matches them. All of them. My grandfather is a Schlegel and a Prosch. He matches all of them as well. All of my lines on my mother’s side he matches, plus he is a second cousin to me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Webb View Post
    This kit matches all of my relatives. Every single line on both of my grandparents sides of the family. My grandmother is a Cooper and Tribby. He matches them. All of them. My grandfather is a Schlegel and a Prosch. He matches all of them as well. All of my lines on my mother’s side he matches, plus he is a second cousin to me.
    The more that the same group of folks show up as shared matches with each other, the more likely I think it is that they're all part of the same group -- as opposed to people who simply happen to have the same relatives in common by possibly unrelated paths. (For example, being a shared match with someone on one side, and a shared match with someone else on another side.)

    And obviously, the more DNA you share with someone, the more recently-connected they're likely to be -- unless you happen to be part of a really endogamous group.
    Besides British-German-Catalan, ancestry includes smaller amounts of French, Irish, Swiss, Choctaw & possibly Catawba. Avatar picture is: my father, his father, & his father's father; baby is my eldest brother.

    GB

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    Quote Originally Posted by Webb View Post
    So first, as a second cousin match at high probability, then this means one of his parents is my first cousin, correct?
    In relation to this part, I might be misinterpreting what you're saying so I apologise if you already know what I'm about to write. A second cousin would share great grandparents with you. A second cousin's parent would be your first cousin once removed.

    However, if the match is only a predicted second cousin through DNA that may not be the actual relationship.
    Ancestry: Ireland (Paper trail ≅ 81.25% Roscommon, 12.5% Galway, 6.25% Mayo)
    Paternal ancestor (Y): Kelly b. c1830 in Co. Roscommon (Uí Maine)
    Father's mtDNA: Fleming b. c1831 in Co. Roscommon (H27e1)
    Maternal ancestor (mt): McDermott b. c1814 in Co. Roscommon
    Paternal great grandfather (mt): Connella b. c1798 in Co. Roscommon (T2a1a8)

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    Quote Originally Posted by FionnSneachta View Post
    In relation to this part, I might be misinterpreting what you're saying so I apologise if you already know what I'm about to write. A second cousin would share great grandparents with you. A second cousin's parent would be your first cousin once removed.

    However, if the match is only a predicted second cousin through DNA that may not be the actual relationship.
    You are correct. No matter who the person matches, a second cousin's great grandparents are actually my grandparents. So all of my first cousin's children are my second cousins. This match is sitting with all of my second cousin kits at Ancestry, given "Extremely High" confidence as being a second cousin. I have 12 second cousin matches at Ancestry, all confirmed. Of course except for this kit. If he was very distantly removed from me, then I can see a scenario where he is related to some ancestors on both sides of my grandparent's families, but he is a second cousin match, which means one of his parents is my first cousin, which means his parent's, parents is my aunt or uncle.

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    The second part of this story is when I realized this match matched both of my grandparents lines I quickly looked at his tree, which has about 500 people. I quickly saw that his grandfathers place of death was the same small town in Virginia that I, my mother and my grandmother grew up in. His grandparents were born in a town that borders Virginia and North Carolina, quite a bit away. His grandfather died in 1961, again in the town I am from. So I messaged him and asked him if we could talk, which he replied yes and asked which method was best for me, so I gave him my contact information. Several months went by, so I messaged him again and mentioned that I noticed his grandfather died in the same town I grew up in and that I also noticed he matched both my grandparents. He replied that he had been busy, and then dropped a bomb on me that his family lived in this town for a short stint, when his grandfather was in the military and that his grandfather was murdered and his family left that area and never came back. I then responded that I rather talk via email or on the phone. He never responded and made his tree private. But before he did , I copied down his mother's families information. I found an article that mentioned his grandfather. His grandfather was working at a service station at night and I guess had been having issues with a local man, that my mother remembered. This man was the same age as my grandfather, much older that this matches father. Evidently at the service station the older man said they got into an altercation, and this matches grandfather came at him with a tire iron. So this older guy shot him with his shotgun, claiming self defense, but the matches grandfather was shot in the back several yards into the woods. This matches grandfather was in his mid twenties at the time, while the local guy was in his forties. This matches mother was born in 1958 in the closest hospital at the time, to the town I grew up in. I have four uncles who are at the right age to have been the father of this matches mother. I suspect this because this match's grandmother, who has also passed away, was around the same age as my uncles. My oldest uncle remembers the whole incident, and told me that this match's grandfather was pursuing the older man's daughter, even though he was married. So my theory is his wife stepped out of the marriage with one of my uncles. My oldest uncle is not my grandfather's biological son, so I can rule him out as this match matches my grandmother and grandfather's families. This narrows it down to three uncles. One died from a massive heart attack at the age of 30 in 1968, he was never married or had children. My other two uncles both married after this timeframe and had children, and are still living. So now I am in a quagmire of emotions as what to do next. I never explained any of this to my match. So I don't know what he knows or doesn't know. I haven't tried to contact him since, but I am really torn as this really is more about his mother than him. Any advice?

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