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Thread: The LivingDNA Irish update and being careful what you wish for...

  1. #21
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    The only reason I think it might help with the German is that more recent testers seem to be having much more German show up. I am curious how the Irish panel will affect everything else.

    For example, my Welsh looks about right (if anything, a bit low, as it's consistent with my more recent Welsh ancestry, including the specific locations, but I have other likely Welsh), but currently I get absolutely no Irish or Scottish. My Irish is all (so far as I can tell) probably Ulster, and some of the names seem more English, but I have enough (my mother is around 25%) that I find it odd that none shows up (I get around 25% on Ancestry, which is consistent with what I have on paper if you assume some of that is some of the Welsh).

    My mother is also about 25% German (1700s immigrants to America) and my dad a little bit too, and I only get 1.4% at LDNA, which is clearly wrong and probably throwing off my English regional results. I get around 15% at 23andMe.

    My Scandinavian shows up about right (12%, consistent with one great grandparent, which is correct), so will be curious if that stays as is once they have both the new panels working.

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  3. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kathlingram View Post
    This is my 19% Welsh - More or less 43-45% UK Living DNA says 19.9 %
    Important to me and would like feedback.. Is my North Wales in areas that look more like My 50+ % Irish would have impacted? Or does it seem purely Welsh.. I have a lot of Welsh Tract Delaware ancestors who married their cousins (Other Welsh) in Delaware in 1700-1750s and my unknown-but -probably- a young Uncle of my Grandmother who is my father's unknown bio father would increase that genetic share by about 25%
    #1 is Living DNA #2 is AncestryDNA #3 is 23andme.. all seem about the same
    Thoughts? Thanks!!
    Attachment 29601 Attachment 29602 Attachment 29603
    Iím not sure if I understand the question.

    But LDNA seems to be good at detecting Welsh ancestry and distinguishing between north and south. There are similarities to border regions which sometimes need to be added back, but other than that, the scale of Welsh ancestry seems ok in Standard mode.

    Ancestry struggles with Welsh ancestry. A typical north-west Wales tester will be half Irish/Scottish and half Welsh etc. They will have the North wales region and probably a north-west England one (picking up migration of people from north Wales to Merseyside etc. in previous generations).

    IIRC 23andme just has migrations not regions. Merseyside and Greater Manchester is an obvious one for north Wales. But Merseyside attracted Irish and Scots in great numbers too. So typically, but far from exclusively, Welsh.

    I think the strongest evidence is LDNA ethnicity and also your matches. Ancestry has issues with Matches for parts of Wales and seems to discount the matches unneccesarily. MyHeritage doesnít discount to the same extent but has its own issues. I donít know about the other companies.

    I hope that helps.
    Last edited by Phoebe Watts; 04-02-2019 at 05:10 PM.
    All 32 3xgreat grandparents were Welsh. Two 6xgreat grandparents from England and a few Irish or English surnames before 1800. Paper trail shows several C11th to C14th Anglo-Norman lines and C11th Norse-Irish lines.

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  5. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phoebe Watts View Post
    I’m not sure if I understand the question.

    But LDNA seems to be good at detecting Welsh ancestry and distinguishing between north and south. There are similarities to border regions which sometimes need to be added back, but other than that, the scale of Welsh ancestry seems ok in Standard mode.

    Ancestry struggles with Welsh ancestry. A typical north-west Wales tester will be half Irish/Scottish and half Welsh etc. They will have the North wales region and probably a north-west England one (picking up migration of people from north Wales to Merseyside etc. in previous generations).

    IIRC 23andme just has migrations not regions. Merseyside and Greater Manchester is an obvious one for north Wales. But Merseyside attracted Irish and Scots in great numbers too. So typically, but far from exclusively, Welsh.

    I think the strongest evidence is LDNA ethnicity and also your matches. Ancestry has issues with Matches for parts of Wales and seems to discount the matches unneccesarily. MyHeritage doesn’t discount to the same extent but has its own issues. I don’t know about the other companies.

    I hope that helps.
    Thanks for the reply.. AncestryDNA has not ignored my Welsh matches- I have 2 Geographic communities- Welsh Midlands and North Wales.. 23andme has a bit although they have refined things and also show Greater Manchester and Merseyside which I suspect can be my Tipperary/limerick Fant/Faunts who were military since they came as Norman mercenaries in the 1500s.. my immigrant 2nd Great William Faunt came to US in 1869 with a British Army pension..
    I think, as you say it is both Welsh ancestors who intermarried both in Wales and in the Delaware/PA Welsh Tracts starting in 1690..

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  7. #24
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    [QUOTE=BackToTheForests;558217]Iím glad that your scores seemed reasonable, were your English regionals accurate? I wish that I could help you break down your results but I am absolutely terrible at it and will only embarrass myself when it comes to my own results . Hopefully someone reading can help!



    Very nice, good to hear that you're happy with your results. I'm having the same issue that you had with my own English regionals, large chunks of ancestry that don't match up at all to the genealogical record. I'm thinking, in my case, that a German panel update may help to ease the inconsistencies in my test.



    Thanks, Robert1. I'll be interested to see the differences in the updated Sirius compared to the Orion!

    I'm curious if some minor amount of continental would pop upon the application of the improved German data, I suppose only time will tell but I can't help to think that it would improve my own English regional results and probably yours as well (maybe you are actually 100% British/Irish, that would be really cool to find out too). I've been thinking about how DNA washes out and it can potentially happen very quickly, especially depending upon how much of the said DNA you actually inherit from your ancestor.

    Hah, I love the evolution of measuring our own ethnic backgrounds as we gain access to more information, it seems the ratios are always changing a bit but also becoming more accurate.



    Iím glad that your scores seemed reasonable, were your English regionals accurate? I wish that I could help you break down your results but I am absolutely terrible at it and will only embarrass myself when it comes to my own results . Hopefully someone reading can help!
    [QUOTE]
    Living DNA ALL Update.png

    I think this points to most if not all of my early US Ancestors coming from the South of England.. Jon Carrow in 1643 out of Bristol and others following the same path into Accomac VA.. so now that I DO See these regions I am exploring those I do not have origin places for..

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  9. #25
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    57CFB67D-2ECA-4B3B-8BE9-6D1EB1B3CA37.jpeg57CFB67D-2ECA-4B3B-8BE9-6D1EB1B3CA37.jpeg
    Quote Originally Posted by Kathlingram View Post
    Thanks for the reply.. AncestryDNA has not ignored my Welsh matches- I have 2 Geographic communities- Welsh Midlands and North Wales.. 23andme has a bit although they have refined things and also show Greater Manchester and Merseyside which I suspect can be my...
    Just to clarify then, the Welsh regions for Ancestry DNA are under Wales & the West Midlands. I get both North and South Wales, which is accurate for me. Do you get the West Midlands as well as North Wales?
    All 32 3xgreat grandparents were Welsh. Two 6xgreat grandparents from England and a few Irish or English surnames before 1800. Paper trail shows several C11th to C14th Anglo-Norman lines and C11th Norse-Irish lines.

  10. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phoebe Watts View Post
    57CFB67D-2ECA-4B3B-8BE9-6D1EB1B3CA37.jpeg57CFB67D-2ECA-4B3B-8BE9-6D1EB1B3CA37.jpeg

    Just to clarify then, the Welsh regions for Ancestry DNA are under Wales & the West Midlands. I get both North and South Wales, which is accurate for me. Do you get the West Midlands as well as North Wales?
    Phoebe,
    Yes I get West Midlands ( 304 matches they say) and North Wales (209 matches) .. I can't tie them to my Welsh ancestors because of surname changes in US I think..Standardization of Surnames.. Some closer matches who have good trees point to 3 generations of ancestral couples that they think we share but I still cannot connect them.. there was much marriage within cousin groups in the Delaware Welsh "Tracts" which were areas of land grants initiated by William Penn.. so they got land.. and Delaware was not then a "Primogeniture" State for property division so males and females inherited in some fashion..
    I can see my ancestors living on land owned by a cousin/sibling and getting moneys from that land..
    Neither 23andme nor Living DNA is specifying exactly where my Welsh matches are from but Caernarvon comes up often.. and a place called Pwelli.. the trees do help.

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  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kathlingram View Post
    Phoebe,
    Yes I get West Midlands ( 304 matches they say) and North Wales (209 matches) .. I can't tie them to my Welsh ancestors because of surname changes in US I think..Standardization of Surnames.. Some closer matches who have good trees point to 3 generations of ancestral couples that they think we share but I still cannot connect them.. there was much marriage within cousin groups in the Delaware Welsh "Tracts" which were areas of land grants initiated by William Penn.. so they got land.. and Delaware was not then a "Primogeniture" State for property division so males and females inherited in some fashion..
    I can see my ancestors living on land owned by a cousin/sibling and getting moneys from that land..
    Neither 23andme nor Living DNA is specifying exactly where my Welsh matches are from but Caernarvon comes up often.. and a place called Pwelli.. the trees do help.
    Here is my breakdown.. Ancestry Ethnicity %.png
    I see that you get 50-% and 50%.. a cousin match who lives in North Wales gets the same.. he is puzzled about that.. what do you think? He cannot Identify any Irish.. of course I can..my Irish are latecomers..after 1860 mostly and left siblings in the old country ..My grandfather born in US was 100% Irish and my father's grandmother was 100% Also.. It is my father's other 50% that I get most of my Wales from but SURELY a lot has to be my Irish who went into England with the Army and remained..

    and then I see that you said this:"Ancestry struggles with Welsh ancestry. A typical north-west Wales tester will be half Irish/Scottish and half Welsh etc. They will have the North wales region and probably a north-west England one (picking up migration of people from north Wales to Merseyside etc. in previous generations)".
    Last edited by Kathlingram; 04-03-2019 at 12:17 PM. Reason: quote

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by msmarjoribanks View Post
    The only reason I think it might help with the German is that more recent testers seem to be having much more German show up. I am curious how the Irish panel will affect everything else.

    For example, my Welsh looks about right (if anything, a bit low, as it's consistent with my more recent Welsh ancestry, including the specific locations, but I have other likely Welsh), but currently I get absolutely no Irish or Scottish. My Irish is all (so far as I can tell) probably Ulster, and some of the names seem more English, but I have enough (my mother is around 25%) that I find it odd that none shows up (I get around 25% on Ancestry, which is consistent with what I have on paper if you assume some of that is some of the Welsh).

    My mother is also about 25% German (1700s immigrants to America) and my dad a little bit too, and I only get 1.4% at LDNA, which is clearly wrong and probably throwing off my English regional results. I get around 15% at 23andMe.

    My Scandinavian shows up about right (12%, consistent with one great grandparent, which is correct), so will be curious if that stays as is once they have both the new panels working.
    You've got about the same amount of German as I do, my great grandmother on my fathers side was German and my mother has a bit of German/Dutch admixture from her Colonial line, yet I scored a whopping 0% on my bought test, they gave me about 2% French though but it disappeared after the application of the improved Irish panel. Sorry to be a bother but would you mind telling me where your German ancestors hail from? I have a consistent problem with very low German score across platforms, my father seems to fare a bit better but not by much. On his LDNA test he also gets 0% German, it's rolled into his Eastern Europe score (which is way too high at around 40%) and they give him about 10% Scandinavian (which is also way too high as I have zero Scandinavian ancestors in the past 200 years).

    I'm very curious to see what happens with your results when they are finally updated and what you think about them. I'm starting to think that maybe I'm the problem :/
    Y DNA E-V13>Z5018>S2979>Z16659>S2972* John Saunders unknown birthdate, died 1840 in Kings Bromley, Staffordshire, England.
    MtDNA U5a2c3a Betty Hallissy b.1801 Passage West, Cork, Ireland

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  15. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by BackToTheForests View Post
    You've got about the same amount of German as I do, my great grandmother on my fathers side was German and my mother has a bit of German/Dutch admixture from her Colonial line, yet I scored a whopping 0% on my bought test, they gave me about 2% French though but it disappeared after the application of the improved Irish panel. Sorry to be a bother but would you mind telling me where your German ancestors hail from? I have a consistent problem with very low German score across platforms, my father seems to fare a bit better but not by much. On his LDNA test he also gets 0% German, it's rolled into his Eastern Europe score (which is way too high at around 40%) and they give him about 10% Scandinavian (which is also way too high as I have zero Scandinavian ancestors in the past 200 years).

    I'm very curious to see what happens with your results when they are finally updated and what you think about them. I'm starting to think that maybe I'm the problem :/
    It's not just you: Dad's results from LivingDNA. He also scored about 10% Scandinavian/Finnish despite no Scandinavian ancestors within the last 300 years.
    livingdnamap.JPG

    Dad's results from Ancestry (and ancestry )

    England, Wales & Northwestern Europe 51%
    Germanic Europe 40%
    European Jewish 5%
    France 4%

    Dad was born in Germany to a German/Belgian/Ashkenazi father and an American BritishColonial/PADutch/Swiss(b. Zurich 1732) mother.
    Note LivingDNA's utter lack of any western/central euro...
    We'll see what the LivingDNA update will bring.


    Edit: Also Dad has no known Italian in at least the last 300 years, despite the 11%+ award by LivingDNA
    Last edited by Dewsloth; 04-03-2019 at 08:15 PM.
    R1b>M269>L23>L51>L11>P312>DF19>DF88>FGC11833 >S4281>S4268>Z17112 (S17075-)

    Y-cousin: 6DRIF-23 (DF19>>Z17112+, S17075+)

    Ancestors: Francis Cooke (M223/I2a2a) b1583; Hester Mahieu (Cooke) (J1c2 mtDNA) b.1584; Richard Warren (E-M35) b1578; Elizabeth Walker (Warren) (H1j mtDNA) b1583;
    John Mead (I2a1/P37.2) b1634; Rev. Joseph Hull (I1, L1301+ L1302-) b1595; Benjamin Harrington (M223/I2a2a-Y5729) b1618; Joshua Griffith (L21>DF13) b1593;
    John Wing (U106) b1584; Hermann Wilhelm (DF19) b1635

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  17. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dewsloth View Post
    It's not just you: Dad's results from LivingDNA. He also has about 10% Scandinavian/Finnish despite no Scandinavian ancestors within the last 300 years.
    livingdnamap.JPG

    Dad's results from Ancestry (and ancestry )

    England, Wales & Northwestern Europe 51%
    Germanic Europe 40%
    European Jewish 5%
    France 4%

    Dad was born in Germany to a German/Belgian/Ashkenazi father and an American BritishColonial/PADutch/Swiss(b. Zurich 1732) mother.
    Note LivingDNA's utter lack of any western/central euro...
    We'll see what the LivingDNA update will bring.
    Well a beta update in February brought my 1.3% Scandinavian down to zero which agrees with with my known ancestry but yeah let's get out the popcorn and see what happens!
     
    Estimated ancestry after reviewing Ancestry.com, 23&Me, FTDNA My Origins, Living DNA and known family history:
    33% English, 27% Scottish, 18% Welsh, 18% Irish, 4% German/Netherlands

    Y-DNA leads to Isle of Skye, Scottish Highlands: R1b>M343>L278>L754>L389>P297>M269>L23>L51>L151/L11>P312>Z290>L21/M529>DF13>L513/DF1>S5668>A7>Z21253> S7834 > S7828 > BY11203 > BY11186 (about 320-550 years old)

    MTDNA leads to Glamorgan, South Wales: K1a4a1f

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